Stimulants Hyperthermia and Meth

[GeekinB3AST]

I Tried searching for my title and didn't really find what I was looking for.

So here it goes, I'm sure most of us are aware of Vasoconstriction from amphetamines, Most notably meth. Now Would there be any truth to the statement that Said Vasoconstriction has an effect on the bodies ability to regulate temp, which would lead to Hyperthermia... Not good at all. Does anybody know of any Drugs to take that will Counter the Vasoconstriction without negatively affecting the Ice high and not putting Higher stress on Internal organs?

 

[CFC]

^ there you go mate, now you're a Bluelighter

Though vasoconstriction would certainly make it more difficult for the body to regulate temperature, that's not the reason you may experience hyperthermia on meth, and fixing that still wouldn't necessarily prevent the hyperthermia

As for controlling vasoconstriction, some have success with magnesium supplementation. Most other things are going to impact your high because they'll blunt the adrenergic effects of the meth.

 

[Tubbs]

I'll second the magnesium supplements, always felt like it helped.

 

[Tzcatlipoca]

^ there you go mate, now you're a Bluelighter

Though vasoconstriction would certainly make it more difficult for the body to regulate temperature, that's not the reason you may experience hyperthermia on meth, and fixing that still wouldn't necessarily prevent the hyperthermia

As for controlling vasoconstriction, some have success with magnesium supplementation. Most other things are going to impact your high because they'll blunt the adrenergic effects of the meth.

For this reason I've experimented with aspirin and figured through experience the most widely available and reliable acute vasodilator is none other than Ethanol, I prefer dry vodka.(and also cannabis)
Best,
Tez

 

[Scrofula]

The biggest danger to your brain with stims is from hyperthermia, and the best prevention is to stay hydrated.

If you aren't sweating, you aren't cooling your body. Since the cause is not inflammation from infection, drugs like aspirin shouldn't do much to help. Instead you just have to behave like you would on an excessive heat day, and avoid things like working on your roof at 3pm.

I don't know why stims users focus on vasoconstriction as a cause of so many maladies, and in this case, vasoconstriction doesn't play a role in overheating. In most cases, it's probably just exacerbated by dehydration.

Ethanol is an absolutely terrible option, and not a vasodilator anyway. Ethanol will only dehydrate you further and make your judgment worse.

 

[Tzcatlipoca]

The biggest danger to your brain with stims is from hyperthermia, and the best prevention is to stay hydrated.

If you aren't sweating, you aren't cooling your body. Since the cause is not inflammation from infection, drugs like aspirin shouldn't do much to help. Instead you just have to behave like you would on an excessive heat day, and avoid things like working on your roof at 3pm.

I don't know why stims users focus on vasoconstriction as a cause of so many maladies, and in this case, vasoconstriction doesn't play a role in overheating. In most cases, it's probably just exacerbated by dehydration.

Ethanol is an absolutely terrible option, and not a vasodilator anyway. Ethanol will only dehydrate you further and make your judgment worse.

It is absolutely correct that dehydration is the biggest danger and should be resolved first and foremost I cannot stress this enough.
However there are a few cases in point I would like to elaborate;

1-I was sincerely convinced of alcohol's efficacy against cold shivers
2-Two shot glasses (roughly 100ml) of dry vodka shouldn't be a serious threat to a healthy adult

Please correct me where I am wrong.
Love,
Tez

 

[Scrofula]

Alcohol is well known to help people tolerate cold temperatures, that much is true. But I think that action is due to its anesthetic effects and if anything, vasoconstriction, not dilation. Nope, looks like a vasodilator after all, Tez. And I meant, you just don't feel as cold. Cause you're drunk.

If a person is cold, those peripheral arteries would constrict to minimize blood flow and therefore heat loss. In hot temperatures, peripheral arteries would expand to allow more blood and heat to travel to your toes and radiate out.

So in that sense, I can see how constriction from meth might be thought to reduce heat loss. It probably makes shedding extra heat more difficult, but it's not the cause of the extra heat. That comes from increased movement and metabolism, and there's no real way to counter that without countering the meth itself.

Instead, you have to keep those fluids going, and maintain some awareness if you're overdoing it in a club or tweaking hard while you rummage around for scrap metal on a hot day.

It you know you're running a fever, go for a cold shower (and tweakers should always go for a shower anyway).

Two shots of vodka (why dry? flavored peach vodka would be the same) wouldn't do anything for keeping body temp down, might make you numb to any overheating, cause nausea if you haven't eaten, and just throw your water balance off further. If you've kept well-hydrated and fed and otherwise healthy, it wouldn't hurt you, don't get me wrong there. It's just an ingredient most tweakers want to avoid, for lots of reasons.

 

[Tubbs]

I agree with scrofula, water is a tweakers best friend, especially in shower form please. Ime alcohol makes me hoy like meth does, so that sounds like a recipe for disaster.

 

[betman]

Magnesium, potassium, sodium, chloride. Water!!!! Aspirin and ibuprofen are NSAIDs and will damage your stomach lining if you take it too much. You'll get stomach aches. Make sure to move, take a warm shower under 15 minutes.

 

[Slow_Mobius]

There seems to be a little confusion over ethanol's effect on body temperature. Ethanol is poikilothermic. It can make both hypothermia and hyperthermia worse. In general, it's bad for thermoregulation

 

[Phobos]

A man-dose B vitamins supplement helps with vasoconstriction and also takes some of the jitters away for me.

This kind of high dose B vitamins pills are found in bodybuilding/sports supplements shops, either high street or online.

You will see that the RDA% will be like 200%, 3000%, 9000%, for some of the single vitamins, but don't worry it's non toxic and water soluble any extra you won't need you'll pee within 12-16 hours.
Ah your pee will be very yellow that's the extra vitamins.

The specific B vitamin responsible for vasodilation is Niacin also called B3.

In my experience and that of everyone that tried this under my advice, vasoconstriction caused by amphetamine class drugs, simple, methylated or substituted, was either strogly reduced or gone.

 

[Scrofula]

When I said ethanol helps cold tolerance, I meant, it makes you drunk so you don't notice the cold. You will actually freeze to death a bit quicker.

Ethanol also causes dehydration, which in hot weather, means drunks will die faster.

It's really only a fair-weather friend, and not much of that either.

The specific B vitamin responsible for vasodilation is Niacin also called B3

Folks want to remember that high-dose niacin/B3 causes flushing, which is harmless and temporary, but some people find very uncomfortable. Probably not the best for tweakers.

And I don't see the benefit to high-doses of these, but do think a dehydrated tweaker (you're ALL dehydrated) might think twice, what with the work your kidneys are going through, with so little water to do it. Why not balanced, only 100X RDA vitamins?


*If you want vasodilation, the theobromine in chocolate does that. Eat one chocolate bar, you'll get sugar, antioxidants and a vasodilator, easy on your kidneys.

**The green color in your pee comes from the coordinated cobalt ion in vitamin B12. I think it's the only use of cobalt in biology.

 

[Phobos]

RDAs are pure BS.
B vitamins do not cause strain on the kidneys, dehydration does, and that is the issue to be addressed.
Some high strength vitamin supplement will add negligible effort compared to what normal food intake, especially proteins, will cause.
On the other hand, high blood pressure will damage kidneys directly.

As far as I am concerned, taking 300% the Niacin RDA doesn't cause flushing in me or anybody that I know, even when taken not under the influence of stimulants.
It's true that some people get that, but not all.

 

[Scrofula]

RDA's are highly educated bullshit, I agree.

But when you see your pee turn green from them, it means you took way more than you need.

And everyone who abuses amphetamines is dehydrated, and taxing their kidneys (it stimulates kidney function, making you pee). I'd think avoiding things for your kidneys to filter isn't a bad idea. Do B-vitamins cause a special burden to overtaxed kidneys? Maybe not, just something to remember.

Some people flush on niacin doses that don't cause flushing in others. But, niacin even at normal RDA's can cause flushing in some individuals, some find it uncomfortable, and might freak out if they were tweaked.

The More You Know,

(wasn't dissing your post, Phobos.)

 

[Phobos]

No offence, I think we have a similar view on this Scrofula, we just give different weight to each of the elements involved, and that makes us give a different answer to the OP regarding B Vitamins. We all have our own experiences and opinions and that is alright as discussion might stimulate me or you or someone else to do more research and knowledge is always a good thing.

GeekingB3ast will have to decide what he wants to do, the important thing is that the option has been brought to his attention.

Would you agree that dissolving a high strength tablet in water and keeping it around for when the effects are wearing off and some rehydration has hopefully occurred, and sipping on that during the course of a few hours (rather than ingesting all at once) will probably provide significant benefits without the drawbacks you mentioned.

And ofcourse, keeping hydrated should be attempted as much as possible when using stims.
I would suggest isotonic sport drinks as the flavour makes them more as attractive than water.
And the electrolytes are much needed as they help keep that water in.

 

[Scrofula]

I honestly don't know what a burden our kidneys go through, just that dopamine itself increases their filtration rate. It seems like that could be a problem if there wasn't enough water to aid them, but that could be a chuckle-inducing simplification for a physician.

Niacin is a good idea for people concerned about vasoconstriction (far as I know), since that flushing is caused by vasodilation. I wonder if someone who normally flushes would see a diminished response on meth? It is harmless in healthy people.

I think pounding the glass of water after your vitamin might work better, or here we go, getting it stuck on the bottom somehow, so you have to drink the water to get it or some strange thing. I think you'd have trouble dissolving it, and it would stink.

BUT, from back in my drunken glory days, you can buy Emergen-C powdered vitamins. I haven't seen B-specific, but multi and just-C varieties, and they don't come in mega doses. But they're great when you're dry heaving too much to handle a big pill. Something like that could work.

But countering vasoconstriction wouldn't help a whole lot with hyperthermia, probably. A little?

 

[Phobos]

The increase activity of the kidneys in itself is stressful for them on its own, but ofc their increased activity means losing lots of water and electrolytes so if one does not rehydrate that will add even more stress.

As far as dissolving B Vitamins, I just pop the pill and some water in the blender, doesn't dissolve 100% but most does, and then keep it in a small bottle so I can shake it before taking a sip, so I get some of the undissolved pieces.

I think reducing vasoconstriction is not going to do much regarding hypothermia, but at least it will make it easier to realize if one is too hot as the skin will get hot rather than feeling cold. I think sometimes it could be hard to realize it under strong vasoconstriction and if dehydration is reducing the amount of sweat produced.

 

[CFC]

I find raw cacao pretty effective (also for lowering BP quite a bit). Plus it's packed with other general goodness. Any excuse for some chocolate

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

If neuroprotection is your thing you could try Acetyl-L-Carnitine :

https://www.researchgate.net/public...e_on_Methamphetamine-Induced_Dopamine_Release