Heroin: Is it really that different from all the rest?

[CatcherInPopEfield]

Hi all, new to the board. So, I am a chronic pain patient and have been prescribed EVERYTHING under the sun regarding opiates and opioids. I've had everything from morphine, to original Oxycontin, to fentanyl and much, much more.

My question is, I don't understand why heroin is considered some king pin narcotic that trumps the rest? Heroin is actually a lot weaker than most of the meds I've been on. That warm rush heroin users speak of, the feeling of being covered in a warm blanket on a cold winters day and not having a care in the world (like blissful apathy) is EXACTLY the feeling that Oxycontin gave me. Yes, even swallowing it whole and taking it as prescribed I got that warm rush although it takes more time to kick in, but when it does it hits you the same way IV drugs do and I've had plenty of IV administered to me.

I hear that heroin is pretty similar to fentanyl and I don't get the big deal? I actually hated fentanyl. I was given it straight through IV not for pain (I wasn't having pain that day so I actually got the full effect of it) but for a medical procedure that was about to be done on me. All that IV fentanyl did was blur my vision and make me sleepy and if that what heroin feels like I don't get the appeal. I was also prescribed fentanyl patches and I am sure some members here will cry when they read this, but the patches sucked and I actually threw them in the garbage.

Oxy was a dangerous drug and I am glad to longer be on it, and if heroin feels like that than I definitely get why its so addictive. But anyway, in short, is heroin really that different from prescription painkillers? Even though I've never done heroin, just based off it's molecular structure and the meds I've been on, I don't think it's any better and is simply being romanticized especially if the people haven't been on a host of pain meds to know what all opiates/opioids feel like.

 

[burn out]

This has been discussed before. No, heroin is not that different from other strong opioids. What makes heroin king is the fact that it's cheap (compared to pharmaceuticals) , available on the street and good for IV use.

 

[tacodude]

It's just because it was made to get people off morphine... It's really not much different from morphine and is only noticeable used injected and really you don't want to get to that point. Honestly I hate heroin compared to others just as I do morphine for the intense painful pins and needle reaction that hurts the more used and starts occurring when the dose is right while any further is a waste only making side effects worse.

 

[Seattle_Stranger]

I've read that it lasts longer than most pharm opiates. I personally have never used heroin and probably never will, simply because I know it would be love at first dose and I'd be a goner. I have had plenty of IV dilaudid in the hospital on several occasions, and holy jesus effing christ I knew right away I had better neeeeeever hold that power in my own hands.

 

[tacodude]

It does not last longer people just tend to use higher doses as they buy bulk bags not standardized doses. The half life is the same as morphine plus maybe as minute or two to convert from heroin to morphine in vivo. Oxymorphone, methadone, and bupe are the more common ones with longer half life's therefore longer effect.

 

[DoctorMolecule]

Personally I'd take a shot of diloded over a shot of h any day.

 

[losangeles1993]

because those OXYs you love are around $20-$30 Each and soon you will need 5 of those pills to feel high $100-$150 compared to H which cost about $50 a gram(black tar heroin) and $10 will give you the same high as 5 of those oxys once you build a tolerance which happens very fucking quickly

 

[burn out]

It does not last longer people just tend to use higher doses as they buy bulk bags not standardized doses. The half life is the same as morphine plus maybe as minute or two to convert from heroin to morphine in vivo. Oxymorphone, methadone, and bupe are the more common ones with longer half life's therefore longer effect.

Well it depends what opiate, heroin lasts a lot longer than hydromorphone.

 

[dirzted]

This is very true that heroin is not much different relative to the array of prescription opiate medications.
However, it is also entirely dependent on the type of heroin you're ingesting, if you could magically get pharma grade diacetylmorphine, than it might be a different story, but that's most likely not possible and secondly wouldn't even make much of a difference.
I tell this to people all the time who act as though they are keeping it safe by only doing oxy/script opioids- when I was fiending I would almost always prefer oxy over any of the shit BTH i was getting... of course shits way cheaper though/more widely available and that's where its reputation comes in.

 

[Erikmen]

Hi all, new to the board. So, I am a chronic pain patient and have been prescribed EVERYTHING under the sun regarding opiates and opioids. I've had everything from morphine, to original Oxycontin, to fentanyl and much, much more.

My question is, I don't understand why heroin is considered some king pin narcotic that trumps the rest? Heroin is actually a lot weaker than most of the meds I've been on. That warm rush heroin users speak of, the feeling of being covered in a warm blanket on a cold winters day and not having a care in the world (like blissful apathy) is EXACTLY the feeling that Oxycontin gave me. Yes, even swallowing it whole and taking it as prescribed I got that warm rush although it takes more time to kick in, but when it does it hits you the same way IV drugs do and I've had plenty of IV administered to me.

I hear that heroin is pretty similar to fentanyl and I don't get the big deal? I actually hated fentanyl. I was given it straight through IV not for pain (I wasn't having pain that day so I actually got the full effect of it) but for a medical procedure that was about to be done on me. All that IV fentanyl did was blur my vision and make me sleepy and if that what heroin feels like I don't get the appeal. I was also prescribed fentanyl patches and I am sure some members here will cry when they read this, but the patches sucked and I actually threw them in the garbage.

Oxy was a dangerous drug and I am glad to longer be on it, and if heroin feels like that than I definitely get why its so addictive. But anyway, in short, is heroin really that different from prescription painkillers? Even though I've never done heroin, just based off it's molecular structure and the meds I've been on, I don't think it's any better and is simply being romanticized especially if the people haven't been on a host of pain meds to know what all opiates/opioids feel like.

After I a couple of minutes it feels pretty much the same as morphine after crossing the blood-brain barrier, heroin is metabolized into morphine. So yes, I do agree with you about heroin. Heroin has been romanticized for ages. In books, films all the way back to early 1900s.

About Fentanyl, no I don't think it's similar to heroin at all. It's much more strong sure but that doesn't mean it's better or similar. It can surely take the pain away and that feels good, obviously. You can also use patches for up to 3 days. But it's usually reported as a dirty high as you become too sleepy, and a bit lethargic. It doesn't make you as euphoric. I have used it after one major surgery and all I felt was pain relief and drowsiness for a whole day.

I'd choose medications over heroin any day. My point is that pharmaceutical opiates are safer and some of them stronger and it can make you feel as euphoric as if you had used heroin, depending what you have taken and at what dose. Whether it's IV or taken orally, etc. It's clean and considering we are talking about our lives I say it's worthy spending more. If you have pain issues, there are medications with a longer half-life so you use it only once a day. Not only extended release but others depending what sort of condition you have, if the pain is chronic or more acute, etc.

After being used to heroin you'll need to constantly increase the dose, there's no more rush or not at all as it used to be and of course that is also quite risky, especially nowadays. And it will take everything you have. If you are sick enough to be taking so much opiates I'd stay away of heroin.

Btw, I once saw I movie in English in another country and they have actually translated oxy as heroin which sort of proves your point. I think it was because of the context but I guess it didn't matter. Oxy has been known in some places as the equivalent to heroin.

 

[smallengine01]

dont need a script or see a doctor for H. Cheap, widely and easily available and addictive as FUCK. Yes its the king, and for good reason

 

[tacodude]

Well it depends what opiate, heroin lasts a lot longer than hydromorphone.

Of course.... Because it has a shorter half life just as I explained why the three examples I gave lasts longer....

Really why did you even post that? You didn't add any facts and seemed to just try to make me look wrong when I spoke more in depth about the subject than you.... Seriously while your post didn't cause harm it didn't reduce it either. Please post something for a HR or educational reason or to to the social forums to parrot facts or spout off topic opinions. It's such a disappointment to come up on a post and see it's just random babbling rather than an actual initiation or response to a conversation.

 

[Båtmannen]

Heroin crosses the BB quicker than other opioids, making the rush much more intense.

 

[burn out]

Of course.... Because it has a shorter half life just as I explained why the three examples I gave lasts longer....

Really why did you even post that? You didn't add any facts and seemed to just try to make me look wrong when I spoke more in depth about the subject than you.... Seriously while your post didn't cause harm it didn't reduce it either. Please post something for a HR or educational reason or to to the social forums to parrot facts or spout off topic opinions. It's such a disappointment to come up on a post and see it's just random babbling rather than an actual initiation or response to a conversation.

I am truly sorry, I can assure you it was not my intention to disappoint you with that post. I posted it because you said "It does not last longer" in response to the idea that heroin lasted longer than pharmy opiates. I didn't think your response was 100% clear, because heroin does in fact last significantly longer than some (obviously not all) pharmy opiates.

Also half life and duration of effect are not always directly related. For example cannabis has an extremely long half life but the high from cannabis tends to wear off much sooner than the half life would indicate. Another example the half life of valium is ten times that of xanax, and yet the buzz from popping a valium does not last anywhere near 10 times as long as the buzz from popping a xanax.

 

[Erikmen]

dont need a script or see a doctor for H. Cheap, widely and easily available and addictive as FUCK. Yes its the king, and for good reason

Yes, it has the power to kill you with a regular daily dose. And you'll be news to your local city for a couple of days before turning into statistics. Lots of people being killed daily, some using it for the first time - others, like it was reported in here, OD'ed and almost died and OP didn't even IV'ed. Yes the king of death and despair.

 

[Erikmen]

It does not last longer people just tend to use higher doses as they buy bulk bags not standardized doses. The half life is the same as morphine plus maybe as minute or two to convert from heroin to morphine in vivo. Oxymorphone, methadone, and bupe are the more common ones with longer half life's therefore longer effect.

Indeed. Summed up pretty well.

 

[burn out]

Yes, it has the power to kill you with a regular daily dose. And you'll be news to your local city for a couple of days before turning into statistics. Lots of people being killed daily, some using it for the first time - others, like it was reported in here, OD'ed and almost died and OP didn't even IV'ed. Yes the king of death and despair.

What do you mean it has the power to kill you with a regular daily dose? Does that normally happen? I used to shoot heroin every day for years and never had any problems with it. However more recently I find my body can no longer handle it. Ive gone on a few heroin binges in the last year I always find my breathing shutting down. I won't even feel high and yet I'm struggling to breathe. So I can't use it anymore.

 

[tacodude]

I am truly sorry, I can assure you it was not my intention to disappoint you with that post. I posted it because you said "It does not last longer" in response to the idea that heroin lasted longer than pharmy opiates. I didn't think your response was 100% clear, because heroin does in fact last significantly longer than some (obviously not all) pharmy opiates.

Also half life and duration of effect are not always directly related. For example cannabis has an extremely long half life but the high from cannabis tends to wear off much sooner than the half life would indicate. Another example the half life of valium is ten times that of xanax, and yet the buzz from popping a valium does not last anywhere near 10 times as long as the buzz from popping a xanax.

I get your point. Half life isn't just subjective effect, but metabolism too. That's why half life gives a good idea of duration of effect, but not necessarily. Also I know I'm riding on my high horse here and didn't want to make you feel bad burn_out as you've been a member probably longer than me including my abandoned accounts. I just wanted to discourage newer users from parroting facts. I understand you wanted to clarify just as there are longer acting compounds with longer half lives there are also faster acting compounds with shorter half-life. Sorry if I came off as a dick.... I mean I do have one

What do you mean it has the power to kill you with a regular daily dose? Does that normally happen? I used to shoot heroin every day for years and never had any problems with it. However more recently I find my body can no longer handle it. Ive gone on a few heroin binges in the last year I always find my breathing shutting down. I won't even feel high and yet I'm struggling to breathe. So I can't use it anymore.

what he means is the potency constantly changes as well as fentanyl gets mixed in so what you might use for weeks without issue might end up being a beyond lethal dose as what used to be 10% pure ends up changing to 50% or just a bag of fentanyl. You never know what you're getting even if you know your dealer.

 

[Slow_Mobius]

OD => DC

Sorry if this isn't the best place for this discussion DC mods, but it seemed like a DC topic to me.

 

[Pill2Chill]

Fentanyl does suck. Heroin is pretty good. It's somewhere inbetween morphine and oxycodone in terms of effects. (Sedating like morphine and euphoric like oxy. IME. That is, if the quality is good). It's a really nice opioid, but since it's a street-drug the quality fluctuates too hard to my liking. That's why I prefer oxy to heroin and don't bother with H anymore these days. I'm prescribed plenty of opioids though. Lots of oxy and methadone, enough for even me to get by. And mixing a medium dose of methadone (not too high cause it will block some euphoria IME) with a nice dose of oxy is just awesome. Makes it super sedating, while keeping the euphoria from the oxy intact.



Can't wait until tomorrow, gonna go see my doc for my oxy scripts then probably. (/edit: ) Or actually, I'm not in that big of a rush. Methadone is such a godsend.