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Quiting poppy tea

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williamsmark801

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Jun 29, 2017
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I had an injury a year and a half ago, and when the doc stopped prescribing pain killers I latched on to poppy tea to help with the pain; unfortunately I got hooked. I've tried quitting cold turkey, but the anxiety associated with the withdrawals are terrible - I can deal with everything else. I even had some old xanax left over from a couple years ago, and that helped a little bit but it was still difficult. I've been doing some research and found that phenibut and kratom can help a lot. I've never used either, so I'm hoping I can get some guidance with usage of these. I have on-purpose not tried either of these yet because I figure being new to it when I do quit the tea again will help me more.
 
You're certainly right--phenibut and kratom can definitely help alleviate opioids WDs.

The risk with both of these, however, is that each of them is havit-forming as well, so you'll need to be cautious to avoid that. The simplest approach to this would be to determine in advance a tapering schedule for whichever you go with. The start dose and the taper length will largely depend on how big your habit is and how long you've had it (sounds like roughly 1.5 years). Could you give us a bit more detail on these issues?

Personally, I'd choose kratom over phenibut. But so long as your using them on a short-term basis, neither one is terribly risky. (Assuming your doctor is ok with prescribing phenibut.)

I guess there is one other question: what about simply doing a taper on the poppy tea? That would be a pretty similar prospect to tapering using kratom.
 
I would pick Kratom over phenibut. The latter has too many horror stories attached to it. But neither one is ideal. The kick from poppy tea sucks but it'll be over in a week. I would hit it with traditional benzos.
 
Yeah... be careful with the kratom. It can be as good as weak opiates sometimes and it's more energizing. Honestly, it is it's own beast and I'm currently trying to hop off it, once I'm thru my opiate withdrawals, but I've been taking kratom 3 years with less breaks and opiates for 5 years with more breaks. Not sure which will be harder to quit. You shouldn't need much kratom to stop withdrawal symptoms. Keep going if it is what you really want, if you believe you can be happy without poppy tea, it is the way to go. You'll be more motivated, have more energy and be saving money and time in the process. Good luck, you got this and keep us updated. It may take a couple tries, but each bit of separation counts.
 
Is dosage guidance not allowed on these forums? If it is allowed, can anyone guide me?

I haven't attempted to quit yet because the timing isn't right, but it looks like I should be able to do so soon.

Also, I no longer have any xanax to help out. I took the last bit I had a while ago
 
Here is some advice about the anxiety. Regardless of how you choose to go (kratom, etc) you can simultaneously be researching how best to help yourself deal with anxiety. Anxiety is one of the most destructive forces for many people. Some of us are born with it (me included) and for some it is learned. But running from it, like running from a mountain lion turns out to be a very bad instinct that most of us insist on following. They say when confronted with a mountain lion that is coming at you, you need to stand as tall as possible, put another person on your shoulders (if there is another person with you) and wave your collective four arms menacingly and scream loudly and forcefully. In other words you need to pretend to be a bigger and more dangerous predator than the lion itself. And hopefully in so doing, you get into fight mode instead of flight mode because you will never outrun that lion. I think its a pretty good metaphor for anxiety. You need to turn and face the anxious thoughts. Instead of pushing them down or swatting them away or running for distraction of any kind, invite them in, question them, break them down. They usually turn out to be manageable fears. (The best way I have found for myself is to let my imagined disaster play out in my head and then to keep asking myself, "OK, and then what would happen?" Unbelievably, it usually winds from I would lose my job, I would lose my standing in the community, I would lose my friends or family to the final fear: it would be established that I am in fact, as Anxiety has always told me, unlovable and unworthy. At that point I am no longer feeling anxious, I am laughing at my own absurdity.) As far as the person that you could hopefully put on your shoulders in the face of a mountain lion attack, the metaphor there is that we are usually helped by sharing our fears with at least one person if not many people. Risk vulnerability. There is nothing so awful about you or so awful about your life that someone else cannot relate to. Whether they have anything wise to say or any good practical advice is often irrelevant--it's simply the trust that is born of sharing that ends up empowering you.

Anxiety is a fact of life; we cannot go through life without ever experiencing fear or doubt. But debilitating anxiety is learned and fed over a lifetime. You can choose to unlearn it. Tools are out there. Mindfulness is one of the best. Seek out these tools whether you choose to take another drug or just taper the poppy seed tea. You will never regret learning to have a different relationship with anxiety.<3
 
Thanks herbavore for the kind words on anxiety. For me the anxiety associated with w/d is just way too much. Thankfully kratom is working, it has kept my anxiety to a tolerable level - but I assure that anxiety is still there! Kratom seems to be working pretty well for me. Normally when I w/d I have pretty bad sniffles and sneezing which is almost completely gone. I feel as though the chills/sweats have been tempered down as well.

Today is day 5 of my withdrawals, waking up this morning I can feel that the restlessness and anxiety is slightly lower but I would have thought it's be less by now. I seem to remember the last time I w/d that I was in a better place by day 5 - its a little disconcerting. I'm wondering if maybe the kratom is extending my w/d symptoms? Is that normal? Does kratom help alleviate the w/d symptoms but extend the symptoms?

I can't wait to be clean again, I want to enjoy my life untethered. I want to be able to take a vacation and not have to worry how I'm going to bring poppy tea with me, or worry about going through w/d while on that vacation. I leave for a vacation this Monday, I should hopefully be feeling much better by then.
 
Hang in there, man. I'm coming off a poppy seed tea withdrawal and I started feeling mentally much better around day 7. There's still some pretty annoying lingering insomnia, even now after 2.5 weeks, but the mental stuff improved a lot during week 2. You're almost there.
 
Thanks MarginalProphet. The last time I had PST was on Sunday, so today is day 6 of the w/d. I didn't sleep well but I didn't feel as anxious / restless, mostly I couldn't get to sleep because my mind was preoccupied (something I haven't had happen to me in a long time, or if I did I didn't mind because I was high). So the anxiousness and restlessness is lower this morning, but still annoying enough to force me to take some more Kratom. I haven't had diarrhea at all which is amazing, in fact it's been quite firm and sparse - almost like I'm still on PST but I'm able to go each day; it's a black color too, I'm guessing that's the kratom. I've got to say, thank god for Kratom. If it weren't for it I don't think I would be able to handle the w/d symptoms this time around! I'm really hoping I'll be over the w/d symptoms tomorrow. From what I remember this is the longest these symptoms have lasted which really sucks! I can't relapse this time!! If anyone can point me in the direction of some information on how to handle the PAWS that'd be great! I want to keep clean. I'm lucky that I have a good life and I want to be able to live it and be happy like I was before the PST took hold of me.

EDIT: I wanted to add for anyone reading this that plans to drop PST, I HIGHLY recommend you taper it down as much as possible before you drop it. PST w/d is very tough, and the previous times I've gone through it I wasn't using as much as this time around. The first two times I quit PST I had been using it for 3 months, and after 3 or 4 days things started getting better. This time around I have been using it for 11 months and got up to about 1.5# a day because of tolerance. Not good, don't let yourself get too far on this stuff.
 
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Question: Should I be worrying about kratom dependency while I'm using it to kick the w/d symptoms? I really don't want to have another round of this
 
Well, day 7. The symptoms have lessened. I'm going to guess what I am feeling now is from the kratom and not from the PST WD. I just took the last I have capsuled, I'm out of capsules to make more and I can't stand the taste of the stuff so I won't be taking any more kratom. I hope tomorrow I will feel normal again - whatever that is. Not looking forward to the PAWS, the depression sucks. It makes me reminisce of a time in my life that I really miss, and I don't think I'll be able to live it again for logistical reasons. PST WD and PAWS sucks so bad.
 
I don't have any experience with kratom -- I managed the worst of the first week with very low doses of PST itself, and after about a week I started taking loperamide to control the shits. Your usage was a fair bit higher than mine, and for almost twice as long, so my amateur opinion is that you are almost out of the woods now. Maybe you should drop the kratom and just get by on lope. If your experience is anything like mine, you've got a week of rumbling bowels ahead of you that should be easy enough to control. The mental stuff was truly awful for me on week 1, and remarkably better week 2. Nearing three weeks now, and almost two weeks since my last micro-dose, besides insomnia I think it's over. Even the insomnia is starting to let up at this point.

You took the words right out of my mouth re: developing a PST habit. Several people here told me they'd rather WD from heroin or oxy than go through a PST WD. I'm trying my hardest to remember the pain I went though this month. I think keeping the journal here is very useful to go back and re-live this if things start to get out of control again.

Re: PAWS, I think staying active is the best advice I've gotten. Being busy is part of this, but strenuous exercise (to the extent that your body can tolerate it) has *always* been a beacon for me, and helps with sleep, engagement, mood, and all the rest.
 
Thanks MarginalProphet. Today is Day 8, and the symptoms are fairly mild. I think I'll be back to normal in a day or two. Insomnia still sucks - the tossing and turning, the hot and the cold. Luckily I found a couple pills of Xanax and I'm using them sparingly in this stage of my WD. Thanks to Kratom I never had to deal with the shits, that was also so bad the last couple times I quit PST.

Midday update: Depression is pretty bad, and I'm quite lethargic. Still have some RLS / restlessness even though I'm using low amounts of xanax. Need to pack for a week long trip today. It's going to be extremely tough. Everyday I feel cold in my house, still get some hot flashes. I really miss taking PST now because I never had to deal with all this BS. Today is tough
 
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The afternoons were always worse for me than the mornings. I think it has to do with when and how I ate, my general diet and my poor abused gut, which I've discovered plays a big role in determining my moods. I'd always feel fine before breakfast, then lethargic and uncomfortable after eating. Similar with lunch.
 
cj said:
I would pick Kratom over phenibut. The latter has too many horror stories attached to it. But neither one is ideal. The kick from poppy tea sucks but it'll be over in a week. I would hit it with traditional benzos.
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Strange many people who I know have used like poppy seed tea tell that they get even 3 months of WD's. One guy told that the WD's were just as worse like from heroin or oxys but lasted 2 months.

For me 2 year of daily use high doses of it, gave 1 month, after that still got some lesser WD's

Now I kicked 4 month of use where I dosed very often (every 2 hours in the last month every 1 hour), very high doses. Now 1 month is gone and its over already, I think wd's went away after 2 weeks.

So it all depends on how long you have used, 2 years, one month, 4 months, 2 weeks. This last time I first time got nausea from opioid WD. in past Ive quited 2 month of very heavy use of tramadol (first month used 2g, second sticked to daily 1g, always used valium), I quited 1 month of heavy use of tramadol around 4 times and one time 2 months, I quited most of the times could turkey, once used pregabalin for only 2 days (didnt have much of it), one time I used buprenorphine for 3 days to take tramadol wds off and no wds at all after that. The last time when I used tramadol because I was using poppy seed tea daily for 1 year already, and then couldn't get any opioid beside codeine and tramadol. I used 1,5g tramadol but still felt like shit, I this time I didn't use valium like the last times, but gabapentin for preventing seizures (as its used as epileptic medicine), I took 3,5 gabapentin every day, but I still got seizure. After that I went back to poppy seed tea when I came back- Tramadol use was all happening in Thailand.

I seem to have very quick metabolism for poppy products, because most addicts tell they take drink it only 3 times a day, but I used 17 times a day, before bed I always took big dose, but I always waked up after 4 hours in mild WD's.

Thanks to my quick metabolism, I've never had long WD's, tramadol wd's went away in 1 week, and 2 years of poppy tea Wd's went away in 1 month, after that 4 month use WD's went away in 2 weeks, but it was most intense WD I've got first week was all puking, didn't have any appetite even with things like pregabalin or GBL that normally makes you eat much. Also I felt so week that just walking 10m was so hard. I felt shit even when I was taking lisdexamphetamine, gbl, benzos, and pregabalin all the same time. Second week I already felt better, 3rd week I didn't felt any wd's even when sober, this is 4 week and after day of high dose of pregabalin I felt good.

Note that I never went cold turkey on poppy tea, when I quit 2 year use I remember one day when I was waking up and no drugs on my system, I felt like I was burning inside and outside, no position was good, it felt really like somebody was torturing me with nastiest ways, I had only phenibut left, so I took it little by little, first 2g, then 2g, then 2g, I waited it to work and it was horrible, 1 second felt like 1 hour, phenibut will start to work very, very slowly, like 5 hours, after taken 10g and phenibut fully working I felt like living again I felt great. Also notice that on that quitting, when using GBL I still felt terrible on body but great on mind. gabapentin helped also but still felt like my body was tortured little and that was 4rd week. After that hell I still was stupid enough to think that taking some other opiodi once month is not causing any problems, I always got 1 week WD's not so nasty, I could manage them could turkey, I continued that route, but I thought maybe 2 months break and then using one day wont give WDs', I was wrong every time. Then I had 3 month break and tried again once, still got WD's. After 4 month I tried poppy tea again, and this time I got mild wd's for 1 month, but went through them could turkey. Well then I thought I take poppuy tea for 4 days and then use pregabaling for wd's would help, it did work, but after 5 day binge one poppy I made decision that no more opioids anymore, so this time I pregablin on doses 600--3000mg for 2 month. Hot HORRRIBLE NASTY wd's like from poppy, methylphenidate took them all away. Well I ended up using poppy tea for pregabalin wd's, it took all WD's away. So now I'm here again quited opioids for good, I hate them I never will use any opioid again, never, I don't have even any kind of craving for any opioid, I wouldn't take oxy even if I got it free. Well after this week I stop using all these drugs that I used for wd's. I changed them constantly, so I didn't get any wd's when my 10day GBL ended. Now I take speed 2-3 days then pregabalin for 2 days, then speed. But speed is too hard for mind and body and makes me just doing really nothing but write on forums and listening music, and for 3 first weeks.

Well I know it will be hard to go totally sober after this week, but I much or I end up addicted to amphetamines totally.
 
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Damn Ne0, that's rough. I hope you can push through and get clean. Get professional help if needed!

Day 8. Got the best sleep yet, woke up with crazy RLS though and some mild anxiety. I leave for an 8 day vacation which involves driving 20 hours each way. The drive is going to be torturous I imagine. Luckily I'm driving my share (1/4 of the time), I downloaded some TV shows to watch to keep my mind busy but I still imagine hell. I won't be able to come here to update while I'm away. I hope the symptoms leave really soon. Depression still sucks. Each time I've gone through this I've had trouble with the recollection of a love I used to have that went bad, but it happened in such a wonderful time in my life (and my favorite place to live in the world) so I have trouble reconciling the difference. Even though I have a new love and am married (and that women in the past drove me so crazy I had developed a small dependency to xanax and alcohol - and ultimately caused me to go crazy and quit the best job of my life), each time I go through withdrawal she comes back to mind and it haunts me. The way the mind works after PST WD is crazy, insane, terrible...I need it over so I can think of wholey better times. It's almost like my mind wants to cause me harm when I'm going through the WD. So so so difficult. Thanks everyone for letting me vent here, it's certainly therapeutic (though maybe not what this forum is for - sorry).
 
williamsmark801 said:
Damn Ne0, that's rough. I hope you can push through and get clean. Get professional help if needed!

Day 8. Got the best sleep yet, woke up with crazy RLS though and some mild anxiety. I leave for an 8 day vacation which involves driving 20 hours each way. The drive is going to be torturous I imagine. Luckily I'm driving my share (1/4 of the time), I downloaded some TV shows to watch to keep my mind busy but I still imagine hell. I won't be able to come here to update while I'm away. I hope the symptoms leave really soon. Depression still sucks. Each time I've gone through this I've had trouble with the recollection of a love I used to have that went bad, but it happened in such a wonderful time in my life (and my favorite place to live in the world) so I have trouble reconciling the difference. Even though I have a new love and am married (and that women in the past drove me so crazy I had developed a small dependency to xanax and alcohol - and ultimately caused me to go crazy and quit the best job of my life), each time I go through withdrawal she comes back to mind and it haunts me. The way the mind works after PST WD is crazy, insane, terrible...I need it over so I can think of wholey better times. It's almost like my mind wants to cause me harm when I'm going through the WD. So so so difficult. Thanks everyone for letting me vent here, it's certainly therapeutic (though maybe not what this forum is for - sorry).
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Thanks! I try push through, just got more speed even that yesterday I promised no more. I think I've got hooked to it, now need to kick it, at least I haven't used it more than 1 month so I hope it won't be too bad. I used it over 10 years without problems every now and then like people use beer. But its all due to that I had to use so often for WD's, even that I don't have much of them left, just needed some excuses.

But keep going, I never could stop it without other drugs, but there are mentally much stronger people who can do just like you. respect.
 
Today is day 16. The bad wd symptoms stopped about 5 or 6 days ago. The chills went away only about 3 or 4 days ago. Now I'm just suffering from back pain for all the travel I've done (I have psoriatic arthritis and get occasional flair ups but never when using PST). The pain is rather severe, and I wish I could take something strong to help me with it. I'm using prednisone, aleve, tylenol, tiger balm, and lidocain patches at night. I sleep like total shit, and can't seem to have a solid BM. I've still got some of the "cold symptoms" associated with the WD - sneezing many times a day - though it's possible I could have an actual cold now. The good news is the RLS and anxiety is gone. Time still goes by rather slow, especially with the current pain I'm suffering. Depression is present but not so severe. Around day 8 or so I was able to get some good "feels" by listening to some of my favorite music I haven't heard in a lone time, but now I'm not getting the "feels" for it anymore. Seems like I haven't really had much pleasure in a while. I threw away all of my kratom and PST supplies - still in the garbage bin - I hope I don't get pain severe enough that I go digging for it. I still kept my phenibut, and I think I'm going to take some to see if I can get my mood up. I hope this thread helps others hooked on PST. I'll be back to post some more when I have the time.
 
Have you tried eating high fiber cereal for getting your bowls back to normal? I found a few weeks of that to be really helpful. Keep up the good will, doesn’t sound easy!
 
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