• H&R Moderators: VerbalTruist | cdin | Lil'LinaptkSix

When you use a lot of alcohol and drugs, and have seemingly no repercussions...

Seattle_Stranger

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 5, 2009
Messages
1,903
I am in no way justifying my lifestyle. I don't think I should continue living like this, but in the meantime, I have some questions for those possibly more experienced than I.

I am a generally healthy person, no health issues to speak of, no difficulties or problems with my body/mind outside of what seems like normal adult/human stuff. I have a very good diet, cook almost exclusively organic food at home, very little meat (my lady is a vegetarian), lots of vegetables, etc.. I take a good stack of vitamins and supplements every day, as well as varying nootropics. I have also severely reduced my sugar intake, caffeine intake, carb intake and fat intake, and my dentist tells me my teeth and gums, which used to be a disaster area, has improved 10 fold, which is a sign of good general health. I am very regular when it comes to bowel movement, I urinate frequently but not concerningly frequent, and it's always a nice light, clear yellow, not a dark dehydrated yellow. I am active, I NEVER "veg out", I don't even really watch TV or play video games at all. I'm always creatively challenging my mind and body, I do yoga daily, I jog/exercise somewhat regularly (~1-2x a week), I'm an avid musician in a band that I founded and lead, needless to say, I'm not a couch potato. Also, one last very important detail, I drink water like it's going out of style. I drink well over a liter during the work day, and then just as much at night.

Now for the questionable habits:

I drink alcohol daily. Usually just white wine (switched from red), and can be just a couple glasses in the evening to as much as an entire 1.5L bottle (over many, many hours, of course). I drink whiskey every weekend, and will finish the majority of a 750ml bottle over the course of those 3 days, with some help from my lady or friends. I don't drink much beer anymore, because of all things, THAT is what gives me shitty alcohol side effects and hangovers. However, with my current consumption habits, I never get hangovers, ever. There have been work nights where I drink wine all night, can't sleep for some reason, and I'll get up several times throughout the night and drink more wine, polishing off the whole bottle, and then get up for work the next day without issue, no headache, no stomach ache, no groggyness (not for long anyway), I'm just fine! Same for weekends, I'll drink copious amounts of whiskey and wine, and I'll wake up the next day bright eyed and bushy tailed.

I use kratom daily. Usually ~8g in the morning, followed by ~5g in the afternoon. I alternate strains as to not use the same one constantly, but my tolerance is pretty damn high. If I "feel" the kratom at all, it's usually a welcomed surprise. I have the intent to taper down simply for tolerance reasons, but again, this is something I seem to get no issues from. I have even stopped cold turkey in the past after an extended daily habit, and barely had some insomnia the next 2 days. I never experienced the "yellowing skin" myth, no typical opioid addict mental or physical stuff, my entire life is in order, my relationships are solid, my career is flourishing, my bank account is fatter than ever, etc.. Not bragging, seriously, I'm just really confused as to why I seem to be getting away with this.

I smoke weed daily. This, I know is no big deal, but it's still a factor. I smoke very little, usually just a bowl before bed, and I still get plenty high. Unless it's the weekend and we're hangin' out, then I'll smoke a bit more, but still not a ton. I never smoke before work as I used to, and I don't feel like weed has negatively impacted my life at all. My lungs feel mostly fine (unless I smoke a lot, then I feel it) and I don't have the typical "stoner stupor" where I can't think of words, bad short term memory, etc.. I used to suffer from those things when I smoked a lot, but in recent years I've been pretty sharp.

I use phenibut (1.3g) every 2-3 days, and drink alcohol. I was very cautious with this, but after a few times of testing the waters, I realized I wasn't getting any negative effects. It didn't bother my stomach, I don't black out, I don't feel like I get drunker/dizzier any worse than normal, I still don't get hangovers, if anything when phenibut is in my system I wake up the next day ready to run for president! This combo is one of the things thathonestly worries me a little, and I really try to be reasonable, but a habit is a habit. I rarely ever will have phenibut and then drink soon thereafter, it's usually phenibut in the morning, and then drinks in the evening, but still, phenibut has a very long half life. I will, however, admit that I noticed a bit of a pattern. Sometimes, day after phenibut, I was get some runny diarrhea. It's not consistent, doesn't come with any pains or cramps, doesn't burn, and doesn't last all day, but it was enough of a pattern to make me do a Google search, and whaddaya know, there's threads about it. This is something I will almost certainly stop doing.

I am able to mix things like kratom, phenibut, whiskey, weed and MDMA, have a fantastic time, stay perfectly coherent, alert and collected, sleep like a baby, and wake up feeling fantastic, and not really have any bad after effects in the following days. Why!?!? Why do I get away with this?? Again, I drink COPIOUS amounts of water every day, especially when "enhancing", I'm this helps tremendously. I also don't use MDMA often AT ALL, seriously maybe once or twice a year, it's tested, pure and coming right from the source, and I don't exceed ~130mg and I NEVER re-dose.


I don't really do anything else habitually, but I do have my fun. I like my psychedelics, but 90% of the time it's mushrooms, and rarely more than 2.5g, every couple of months. I don't really mess with psych/empath RC's, I don't trust them. Though I have tried some, but only the more popular ones like 2C-E and mephedrone, but this was years ago. I experiment with various nootropics almost daily, again only the popular, more researched ones. I understand noot's can have some neuro-protective and regeneration attributes, plus the expected focus/memory enhancement. I don't notice profound effects from them, but I definitely think they've played a role in my increasing mental sharpness over the past few years, and might be masking (or eliminating?) the negative mental effects from my lifestyle.



Again, I'm not justifying my lifestyle, nor am I bragging or trying to seem like a veteran or anything even close. I'm honestly concerned about the choices I've made, and I want to know what you guys might think about this. When I step back and think about everything I do and how often I do it, it seems like I should be in a world of hurt, but I'm not. If anything, I'm better off these days, and I feel like the substances I use are aides to my life, not crutches, if that makes sense. The enhance my life, as opposed to hold it up. If you were to ask me if I could just stop, the answer would be no. It's way too much of a habit for way too long, so it would be difficult for me to just quit everything, however, I do feel the need to reduce my intake of everything. When i do put effort into tapering down and using less of anything, I'm very disciplined about it, and I produce results very quickly, but I always end up coming back because I'm just not convinced enough to stop. If I was getting more bad side effects or negative impacts on my life, I'd feel more of a need to stop, but as you can see from above, I'm simply not, so it would be purely 100% a conscious decision to just stop for the sake of stopping.

Anyway, I've built enough of a wall of text. Looking forward to some of the opinions, if anyone has the energy to read through this swamp of sentences.

Thanks in advance!! :)
 
Last edited:
Oh, and before it is suggested, yes I've gone to the doctor for a checkup and was green across the board, and I have a liver test among other lab tests scheduled. I'll report the findings.
 
:) Hello Stranger...I'm having a particularly shitty day, wishing I live in a legal MMJ state. Maybe, just maybe, I could get some help/hope for life...rather than simply existing in pain until I die.

I enjoyed your read. Life doesn't often fit into a text limit for me, so no problem.
 
I actually steer clear of the legal stuff. Almost every time I smoke product bought in a store, including the top top top shelf stuff, advertised as "pesticide free", I almost always get lung pain in the day or so after. Product from my usual guy that I've bought from for years, good to go. Weed being legal here hasn't changed my life one bit, aside from maybe being even less paranoid about smoking in public (which never mattered to Seattle police in the first place).
 
The first thing that popped into my mind was "what is the underlying reason as to why you are doing so much drugs and alcohol?"

Why even bother with nootropics? I always dismiss these drugs as unnecessary and a waste of $. Who knows what the long term effects will be, I don't think there are any long term studies, only anecdotes.

There are enough negative stories about phenibut dependence and you don't claim to have anxiety, ditch this stuff. You're not supposed to mix this with alcohol either.

It also doesn't sound like you need kratom for pain relief, why even take this daily?

1.5L of wine in a night [on occasion] isn't good for your liver, daily weed smoking isn't great for your lungs.

I assume you're still young... eventually this is going to catch up to you. I would argue that you have an addictive personality. Stop this madness while you can... if you can. If not, consider getting help.

Here's some food for thought: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3604470/

Good luck
 
The first thing I'm wondering is how old you are. Younger people seem to be able to sustain bad habits without ill effects.

You're right, if nothing seems wrong then there is no incentive to change really... but just because your body isn't acting up doesn't mean there aren't opportunity costs involved.

A reason to investigate getting clean would be the expanding of your own self-knowledge and consciousness that would take place on such a journey. But if it's not being forced upon you through health or life circumstances, then at this point it would have to be a journey you'd undertake by choice.
 
Thanks for the replies.

I just turned 31. Other deets: ~5'10" ~175 lbs, average/borderline athletic build.

I suppose I should have included those details. As far as the doctor and psychiatrist say, I have GAD, SAD, ADHD, ABC, DEF, XYZ, etc.. The list they handed me was too long to remember, but the main reason I started seeing someone was due to my rampant anxiety and depression that began spinning out of control at about age 23. I don't throw those terms around because I believe a lot of it is subjective. I feel like everyone has anxiety and depression to some degree, it gets better and worse at different times in your life due to a million different factors, and some of us are better at dealing with it than others, and we deal in different ways. I know I'm definitely anxiety/depression prone, though, because I get those feelings when I look at other people and I wonder "How do they seem so content?". I look at "happy people" and wonder how the hell they're doing that. You can say my use of things like alcohol, kratom and phenibut is self medication for these conditions, and as I mentioned, I feel like I've maintained somewhat of a balance of not going completely overboard, not ruining my life, (hopefully) not fucking up my body, and actually producing results. I don't take kratom and sit there and nod out, I get shit done, I take care of life's chores, I use it's motivation to move forward, not backward. Same with phenibut, it helps me to curb my anxieties and focus on taking care of life's demands, almost a bit too well. Alcohol I use to unwind at night, it's something to look forward to after the long day, but even so, just because I'm drinking doesn't mean I'm just sitting there wasting life. Sometimes I get home just zonked from the day, mind going a mile a minute about things, I'll get home and have a little drink and a smoke, and suddenly I feel calmed enough to actually get some more chores done before I throw in the towel for the day, whereas I might have just went straight to bed after work.

I will say this. I've had insomnia my entire life, even as a baby. My parents brought me to the doctor because I was SO bad at falling and staying asleep that it was a legit health concern. It was a nightmare for all parties involved, and to this day I struggle. Yes I exercise, yes I stretch, yes I avoid devices and such, yes I block out all light, yes I abstain from caffeine after the morning, yes I've tried almost everything we can think of. Having a couple drinks before bed, as well as some weed has helped my sleeping more than any medication or "trick" that I've tried. Sure, you can say that an alcohol induced sleep is not a good sleep, but it's better than NO SLEEP AT ALL. I will lie there staring at the ceiling, bug eyed, mind racing until the sun comes up. I've spent more nights like that in my life than I've spent nights soundly sleeping. So, when something comes along that actually seems to help me fall asleep, it REALLY stands out and is almost certain to become an instant addiction. Ambien was that when I was scripted it, and I'm real glad I kicked that, it was getting ugly. The nights where I will polish off the whole 1.5L bottle are usually nights where I wake up several times during the night, for whatever reason, and I will have several more glasses trying to fall back asleep. THIS I know is probably the worst habit of my lifestyle, and I've been making strides to break it. Doing better so far, but it's still just stupidly easy for me to suck down gallons of wine without blinking, it's so tasty and easy. Insomnia is why I started smoking weed regularly in the first place, that's honestly where it started. I was always on the fence about weed, didn't love it but didn't hate it, but one night I took some puffs of a pipe with friends, then when I got home and had the best night's sleep of my entire life, it was instant obsession. Anyone who says weed isn't a gateway drug simply hasn't found the hole in their life that it fills, then it's all downhill from there...

To add to all this, I'm going through a particularly stressful time in my life, I won't even begin to list all the things that are riding on my back. No, they are not things that I have fucked up, but I honestly don't know where I'd begin explaining, so I won't bother. Just know that I cried to myself for a half hour on my kitchen floor the other morning because of being so barraged by stress and anxiety due to 100000 factors, that's where I'm at. After some kratom, and then when the phenibut kicked in, I suddenly had a clarity that I was able to use to figure some things out, settle some of those stresses, and move forward. Without the aides, I know I would have had a much harder time, and there's a good chance I would have broken off my marriage. Again, I'm not going to go into detail, but after the clarity set in, I was able to approach the situation more logically and level headed. Needless to say, these stresses are causing me to drink a lot more at night too. My tolerance is skyrocketing, and because I'm drinking super light white wine, I will keep sucking down glasses until I finally feel some anxiety relief, and then by that time I look at the bottle and it's half gone.

I should probably also include the fact that my family has a long, long history of alcohol over-use. I had my first taste of beer before I could complete sentences, my parents used to give me "sips" because they thought it was cute when I asked for it, as I sat on their knee at the neighborhood bar. I've been drinking my entire life, literally, and I'm sure this has resulted in some of the issues I have with anxiety and insomnia. Currently, my mom and dad are about ages 58 and 59, live at the Jersey Shore, spend every single waking hour at the bar drinking their freaking faces off. Even me, with all the above factors, I go there and try to hang out with my dad, and I end up getting so blacked out drunk because he just keeps shoving beers in your face faster than you can stomach them, and then have the worst mornings I ever have, even though I still don't really get hungover, I still feel rough for a few hours. They live like this every single day, and somehow, some way, they're still kickin', seemingly just fine. That too, looms in my mind, making me look at my own lifestyle and think hmm, maybe I'm not so bad, because if they can live like that at twice my age, I think I can handle this..


I hope I was clear enough when I said that the anxiety, depression and insomnia issues I face have ALWAYS been present, were not induced or made worse with my lifestyle choices, if anything, they've been helped/curbed/masked by my use of aides. I enjoy a good buzz as much as the next guy, and a lot of my use is simply because I just enjoy it, especially on weekends with friends. However, I realized how these fun weekend things can actually help me curb the every day issues I face, and actually helped me push those issues aside and focus on the real important stuff, which is why I started integrating these things into my daily life. My justification was that we use coffee every day to wake up and get shit done, some people pop all sorts of script meds for the same purpose, I personally use a couple particular things for the same reasons.


Thank you all for your replies.
 
If i could just give one piece of advice, it'd be to pump the brakes on the alcohol consumption just a bit....

Other than that it doesnt really sound like you're doing too bad for yourself...you're a recreational substance consumer but so what, lots of people are and do so responsibly. Weed and kratom in particular are pretty benign substances, in my very humble opinion
 
You don't sound like you're ready to give anything up. Maybe one day you'll be forced to out of health or will grow tired of it, hopefully the latter. All the best.
 
im not sure on the reason but from experience alcohol will negatively affect your sleep, in my opinion your not drinking that much but it will affect your sleep. natural sleep take a break youll feel alot better after a couple sober days even its just from the alcohol
 
sorry just to add if you get wds from just stopping get medical advice to detox
 
Heavy drinking takes a toll on the liver, and it often takes decades to manifest: fatty infiltration, and worse. For a very long time, you "feel fine". Then...
 
It does take its toll. On your off time are you pretty healthy? Some can just tolerate things better. And obviously being used to something makes it easier.
 
i want to know what supplements you take :) I think I need to get into them myself!
 
I have a lot of the same issues as the OP. I have depression, severe anxiety and panic disorder and I've been an insomniac as long as I can remember. I started binge drinking at 17 and then discovered in college that wine would "help" me sleep (someone else has already pointed out that it really doesn't). I started drinking alcoholically (daily, and in large amounts) around 2007 because of a stressful job situation. Drinking worked, until it didn't work anymore. Sooner or later your tolerance for alcohol is going to get to a point where you're going to feel so shitty when you wake up that the only thing that steadies you is another drink, or worse, waking up still wasted. It might take years, but it will catch up with you. I was around 40 when it finally caught up with me. Unless you're itching for trips to the ER, stints in rehab or possibly a DUI or two, I would follow the advice that's been presented here. I'd be the last person to tell someone they must be completely abstinent from all substances, but giving your body a break a few days a week is a good idea.
 
You will have repercussions if you continue for long enough. Once you get into your mid thirties or 40s you will see that the body can't handled drugs the way it used to and the health issues will begin to surface. Trust me, you are human just like everyone else and drugs are known to cause damage if used too much.
 
Also the only reason you don't have hangovers is due to the kratom. Try quitting kratom and drinking heavily
 
Top