• H&R Moderators: VerbalTruist | cdin | Lil'LinaptkSix

Recovery 16 years oxy user working up plan to get off for good please help have questions

BTW ive been lifting weights everyday and doing some cardio feeling pretty good now i lost around 10lbs during wd and i want to keep it off..

Ha! The opioid withdrawal diet. I lost some weight as well, which I am trying to put back on! I'm hoping genetics keeps me slim but oh man I am out of shape (from the taper and earlier health stuff!).
Exercise is great, especially cardio. Since opiates depress a number of hormones including testosterone, which women make a little bit of, it should all go back to normal!
I had to work so hard on opiates just to get muscle back and now when I'm swimming I can feel the extra boost.
Solidarity, CD
 
Early on we were talking of a taper method, but his mom insisted cold turkey, so all that changed. So if you were referring to the original posts, then yes, I was offering my meds to help taper down ... although I didn't realize it was fentanyl at the time and I doubt my 10mg percs were going to help wean off an i.v. half bag of fentanyl , multiple times a day habit. I'm glad he's off of that, just have to see how he decides to move forward with his life or if he would prefer to go backwards.

I'm suggesting he consider a good outpatient buprenorphine replacement therapy program, one where he prescribed buprenorphine, get drugs tested, goes to group counseling and individual psychotherapy for a length of time (6 months, for instance) on an outpatient basis.

Getting off opioids is a lot easier than staying off them. That kind of program would give him the support he needs to stay off them.
 
Hey guys n gals... dropped to the 50s here last night, starting to feel like December in Florida.

So far John is still right on track. He said he tried about 5 different times yesterday to get up and cook a dinner for me. Finally he made himself get out of bed, still so weak feeling....and the chainsaw accident on his arm drives gib crazy, says the nerves all firing at once. He made me and my boys some chicken cacciatore in the slow cooker. It was really delicious. Also, we took another music driving session and walked on the beach last night for about 2 minutes until a few rain drops fell from the sky. All in all, it was a good day ..... AND after I clock out today,I don't go back to work until next Thursday!!!! Mini staycay.
 
I'm suggesting he consider a good outpatient buprenorphine replacement therapy program, one where he prescribed buprenorphine, get drugs tested, goes to group counseling and individual psychotherapy for a length of time (6 months, for instance) on an outpatient basis.

Getting off opioids is a lot easier than staying off them. That kind of program would give him the support he needs to stay off them.

I wish there was a thumbs up button, ....so true!!!
 
Hi all, im doin alright just the insomnia thing is still kicking my ass im goin to doc thursday i want another bp med cause im taking clonindine .2mgs three times a day and its still high. I also read side effects of clonidine in forums are waking up after 2 or 3 hours sleep and not being able to fall back asleep, great so between that and insomnia after wd no wonder i have such bad insomnia. I might let him prescibe me something for sleep cause ive been taking a xan every other night. After i wake up with only two hours sleep i take a xan and get 2 or 3 more hours, xans short life only gives me two or three hours sleep. I want something else klonopin, valium, ativan, seroquel, any suggestions what is the least addictive and still works. I may not even need it if the clonidine is causing me to wake up after only a couple hours sleep then not fall back asleep. Hope everybody is doing well!
 
Good day all, I missed everyone. John is still going strong. He mainly hates mornings, says it feels like waking up with a hangover every day of life. We have been doing alot of relaxation activities, bonfires, fishing off the causeway, late night drives down the coast etc.....I think we have driven as much as over road delivery drivers. It's really good for us, like we are rebuilding our relationship. He asked me to marry him :)))) I think today we will go fishing off the skyway pier or possibly check out the archery store, want to take some archery lessons. It's like the story of the prodigal son, I'm just so happy to have him back.

Glad to see everyone still going strong ....lots of love n light to all of you!!!!!
 
Hi all, im doin alright just the insomnia thing is still kicking my ass im goin to doc thursday i want another bp med cause im taking clonindine .2mgs three times a day and its still high. I also read side effects of clonidine in forums are waking up after 2 or 3 hours sleep and not being able to fall back asleep, great so between that and insomnia after wd no wonder i have such bad insomnia. I might let him prescibe me something for sleep cause ive been taking a xan every other night. After i wake up with only two hours sleep i take a xan and get 2 or 3 more hours, xans short life only gives me two or three hours sleep. I want something else klonopin, valium, ativan, seroquel, any suggestions what is the least addictive and still works. I may not even need it if the clonidine is causing me to wake up after only a couple hours sleep then not fall back asleep. Hope everybody is doing well!

Hi tld,
Clonidine also reduces REM sleep as the dosage increases.
If you have an intelligent doctor, they could taper you off clonidine and put you on something for bp and sleep.
If your doctor is an idiot I would ask for Ativan. It will knock you out. Benzodiazepines aren't to my knowledge, unequally addictive. If you don't want a benzo, you could try Ambien, although it can have odd side effects.
 
Hey TLD hi there. Sorry to hear that you have insomnia. That is disappointing, considering how long and slowly you tapered... I was hoping that you would have avoided that symptom that is common for those on rapid tapers or cold turkey. I hope your doctor gets you fixed up with medications that work for you, and provide some type of regular sleep. Keep us posted, ok?
Hello to everyone else who are regular posters here.... I am getting busier the closer it gets to Christmas Day.
 
Tld, I should have added that you are using a very short-acting benzo. Xanax is prescribed for panic attacks because it works so quickly but has a short half-life.
Ativan has the longest and Valium is second.
Ativan will knock you out but you might want to try Valium instead. It's shorter acting but you have to be able to get up and go to work. So this way you won't have to play around with dosage or miss work.
 
The best advice I can give someone looking to wean down to a "Very Manageable Level" with NO Roller Coaster Effect, feeling better every hour of every day than when abusing the Highest Ammt of Oxycodone / Morphine / Phentnyl / Oxymorphone / Hydrocodone - Pretty Much Any and All of the Fast Acting OR Time Release Schedule II Narcotics... Is to find some Methadone. Whether u get your doctor to switch you, or you find a friend who you can percure some from on a monthly basis, or even going to mexico (I have recently gotten both 10mg Methadone and 40mg Methadone from Mexico and expecially the 40mg are strong as hell even when broken into quarters)...

The thing about Every Single OTHER Medication other than Methadone. Is that there is a High Incentive for Abuse. If 1 Feels Good, then 2 are going to feel better and after a while 4 will feel better than 2 and so on and so on.... The problem with this is that you build up such a tolerance to it that when you do not have any or require to "Wean Down" you will go into withdrawl. Not to mention Even if you Never Run Out - You are dealing (if Abusing Them) with Constipation and bowel issues that can criple you. You get the Roller Coaster Effect where u will feel Great for a While and then Horrible till you take more...

BUT, with Methadone - There is almost ZERO Incentive for Abuse. Doctors Know this and the only two reasons they do not prescribe Methadone as much as they should. Is #1 because of the Stigma it has received as being used for Methadone Maintenance for Heroine Users over Decades... and #2 because the pharmacuetical Companies are pushing them to prescribe the More Expensive Drugs. My Insurance Company pays my pharmacy $1600 for one prescription of 90ea 80mg Oxycontin (Extended Release) Tablets, And over $360 for 180ea 30mg Oxycodone (Immediate Release Tablets) EVERY MONTH... It is the same with Phentenyl Patches, Morphine Immediate Release and Extended Release, Hydromorphone and many other drugs that are Extremely Expensive and that the pharmaceutical companies make Billions of Dollars on. Yet One Prescriiption for 360ea 10mg Methadone (Extended Release) Tablets even without insurance only cost about $45.....

When I say that Methadone has almost ZERO Incentive for Abuse I assure u that you absolutely can not understand the Seriousness behind this statement. Honestly, You can only understand by experiencing it. One of the reasons that this is achieved is the WAY That Methadone is TIME Released in the body... Most other Medications are time released (Like Oxycontin and Morphine ER) by the Bonding Agents in the Tablet and set rate that it disolves at in the digestive tract.... Whereas Methadone is absorbed into the Fat Cells of the body and is released with help of your Metabolisim... Making it much harder to abuse (like u can crush up or chew up an Oxycontin or Morphine) plus this time release mechanisim runs so smoothly in Methadone that there is NO Roller Coaster Effect that can occur even Naturally in the Other meds simply due to differences of taking on an empty stomach or after eating so that they could be disolved faster or slower. All of this results in almost NO Incentive to Abuse the Methadone and makes it Completely Normal & Easy to take Barely Enuf to keep yourself out of pain and Functioning on a daily basis.

Let me throw you an example. When I get my prescriptions. I sell my 90ea 80mg Oxycontin outright to one person every month. And do not take even 1 tablet. Not for 15 years now... BUT, I have my 180qty of my 30mg Oxycodone Immediate Release Tablets to get me thru the month. This would be 6 a day if I Stayed on Track and did not abuse them (which would be plenty for me) But instead, because of the Immediate bioavailability and the fact that if 1 is good then 2 must be better. Coupled with the fact that I have for years now Crushed Them Up and Snorted Them. (Which at this point I am more addicted to the Physical Act of Crushing them Up and Snorting Them than I am the actual Medication) It caused me to go thru my entire prescription of 180 tablets in about TWO WEEKS. Sometimes Less.... Obviously, I can not go another 2 weeks with NOTHING before receiving my Refills. So I have a friend that I get around 20 methadone a month from. Now At FIRST, coming off of doing nearly 360mg of Immediate Release Oxycodone a day 1 Methadone a day will just not cut it. I end up taking 1 as soon as I start going into withdrawl, That lasts about 8 to 10 hours then I take another, and That lasts about 10 to 12 hours. After 3 days (of feeling pretty crappy and spending most of it in bed no doubt) I have weaned myself down to 1/2 a Methadone every 12 hours. (That is only 1 Methadone a Day) From 360mg of Oxy to only 10mg of Methadone a day in as little as 3 days. And for the next 3 days I Progressively Feel Better and Better on only the Half of 1 methadone every 12 hours. By the time I have about 8 days left before receiving my Refill on MY Medication I am wishing that I never gotten Oxycodone EVER. I am Feeling Better than I ever do on the High Doses of Oxycodone. My Testosterone Level starts to come back (Because when abusing the Opiates at a High Level it will litterally Completely STOP you body from producing Testosterone). MY Sleep paterns Normalize (I Go to bed earlier and wake up in the morning Feeling Refreshed and Feeling GREAT)... IF I Wanted to I could take this further and eventually cut it down to 1/3 of a Methadone every 12 hours and even further to 1/4 of a Methadone every 12 hours. This would give someone a very VERY reasonable and Easy way to eventually Wean Yourself Completely Off All Pain Meds.... Because as I mentioned Earlier. There is Absolutely NO Incentive to Abuse the Methadone. You will not Feel Better By Taking MORE You will only Feel More SEDATED. NOT BETTER Physically or Emotionally or even Euphorically.... There is just no reason or want to Abuse the Methadone and therefore is the PERFECT Vehicle to Wean Yourself Down as far as you want to go... If you want to get completely OFF the Opiates Then it will be easy. If you have legitimate Pain that you can not live with Then it will allow you to find that Perfect Dose that Relieves your Pain but still allows you the Energy to Get out of bed and be a productive citizen. Without the Roller Coaster Effect. Without the Up's & Down's of the other Opiates.... I Think it is a Travesty that more doctors do not embrace this fact... I go thru it every month... Every Month I prove how easy it is to wean myself down to very little methadone But then Because of my Addiction to the Physical Act of Grinding up / Crushing and Snorting the Oxycodone I end up back on it and abusing it for another 2 weeks. If a big portion of my income was not from selling my prescription of 80mg Oxycontin Then I would hav a talk to my doctor and get transferred str8 over to Methadone and eventually just Wean Myself Off Completely. But I Am Caught in a Cycle.... Nonetheless, My Monthly Cycle Proves how easy it is to do this. I have a Very Addictive Personality, and if abusing the methadone was a benefit I would end up abusing It As Well. But I Am Proof that Even the Most Addictive Personalities can Achieve a level of Normality on the Methadone for the simple fact that """""""THERE IS NO INCENTIVE TO ABUSE THE METHADONE""""""" NONE..... It is so easy to take as prescribed and even wean yourself down. Because """""THERE IS NO BENEFIT IN OVER DOING IT""""""

I Hope you take this to heart, and I hope that others read this and get help from it. I have been on pain meds for over 15 years but they have also been my main source of income for the last 15 years So I am Stuck getting these CERTAIN Meds and These ones happen to be Ones that I Love To Abuse.... For ppl out there who do not care about switching meds from One to Another. Talk to your doctor about Methadone I guarantee it will save your life....

Good Luck, thanks for your time and I wish you all the best.
God Bless.....
Skippy
 
Getting stopped is one thing. Staying stopped is another. There's gonna be some haters but NA kept me clean for 13 fucking years. Real talk.
 
The best advice I can give someone looking to wean down to a "Very Manageable Level" with NO Roller Coaster Effect, feeling better every hour of every day than when abusing the Highest Ammt of Oxycodone / Morphine / Phentnyl / Oxymorphone / Hydrocodone - Pretty Much Any and All of the Fast Acting OR Time Release Schedule II Narcotics... Is to find some Methadone. Whether u get your doctor to switch you, or you find a friend who you can percure some from on a monthly basis, or even going to mexico (I have recently gotten both 10mg Methadone and 40mg Methadone from Mexico and expecially the 40mg are strong as hell even when broken into quarters)...

The thing about Every Single OTHER Medication other than Methadone. Is that there is a High Incentive for Abuse. If 1 Feels Good, then 2 are going to feel better and after a while 4 will feel better than 2 and so on and so on.... The problem with this is that you build up such a tolerance to it that when you do not have any or require to "Wean Down" you will go into withdrawl. Not to mention Even if you Never Run Out - You are dealing (if Abusing Them) with Constipation and bowel issues that can criple you. You get the Roller Coaster Effect where u will feel Great for a While and then Horrible till you take more...

BUT, with Methadone - There is almost ZERO Incentive for Abuse. Doctors Know this and the only two reasons they do not prescribe Methadone as much as they should. Is #1 because of the Stigma it has received as being used for Methadone Maintenance for Heroine Users over Decades... and #2 because the pharmacuetical Companies are pushing them to prescribe the More Expensive Drugs. My Insurance Company pays my pharmacy $1600 for one prescription of 90ea 80mg Oxycontin (Extended Release) Tablets, And over $360 for 180ea 30mg Oxycodone (Immediate Release Tablets) EVERY MONTH... It is the same with Phentenyl Patches, Morphine Immediate Release and Extended Release, Hydromorphone and many other drugs that are Extremely Expensive and that the pharmaceutical companies make Billions of Dollars on. Yet One Prescriiption for 360ea 10mg Methadone (Extended Release) Tablets even without insurance only cost about $45.....

When I say that Methadone has almost ZERO Incentive for Abuse I assure u that you absolutely can not understand the Seriousness behind this statement. Honestly, You can only understand by experiencing it. One of the reasons that this is achieved is the WAY That Methadone is TIME Released in the body... Most other Medications are time released (Like Oxycontin and Morphine ER) by the Bonding Agents in the Tablet and set rate that it disolves at in the digestive tract.... Whereas Methadone is absorbed into the Fat Cells of the body and is released with help of your Metabolisim... Making it much harder to abuse (like u can crush up or chew up an Oxycontin or Morphine) plus this time release mechanisim runs so smoothly in Methadone that there is NO Roller Coaster Effect that can occur even Naturally in the Other meds simply due to differences of taking on an empty stomach or after eating so that they could be disolved faster or slower. All of this results in almost NO Incentive to Abuse the Methadone and makes it Completely Normal & Easy to take Barely Enuf to keep yourself out of pain and Functioning on a daily basis.

Let me throw you an example. When I get my prescriptions. I sell my 90ea 80mg Oxycontin outright to one person every month. And do not take even 1 tablet. Not for 15 years now... BUT, I have my 180qty of my 30mg Oxycodone Immediate Release Tablets to get me thru the month. This would be 6 a day if I Stayed on Track and did not abuse them (which would be plenty for me) But instead, because of the Immediate bioavailability and the fact that if 1 is good then 2 must be better. Coupled with the fact that I have for years now Crushed Them Up and Snorted Them. (Which at this point I am more addicted to the Physical Act of Crushing them Up and Snorting Them than I am the actual Medication) It caused me to go thru my entire prescription of 180 tablets in about TWO WEEKS. Sometimes Less.... Obviously, I can not go another 2 weeks with NOTHING before receiving my Refills. So I have a friend that I get around 20 methadone a month from. Now At FIRST, coming off of doing nearly 360mg of Immediate Release Oxycodone a day 1 Methadone a day will just not cut it. I end up taking 1 as soon as I start going into withdrawl, That lasts about 8 to 10 hours then I take another, and That lasts about 10 to 12 hours. After 3 days (of feeling pretty crappy and spending most of it in bed no doubt) I have weaned myself down to 1/2 a Methadone every 12 hours. (That is only 1 Methadone a Day) From 360mg of Oxy to only 10mg of Methadone a day in as little as 3 days. And for the next 3 days I Progressively Feel Better and Better on only the Half of 1 methadone every 12 hours. By the time I have about 8 days left before receiving my Refill on MY Medication I am wishing that I never gotten Oxycodone EVER. I am Feeling Better than I ever do on the High Doses of Oxycodone. My Testosterone Level starts to come back (Because when abusing the Opiates at a High Level it will litterally Completely STOP you body from producing Testosterone). MY Sleep paterns Normalize (I Go to bed earlier and wake up in the morning Feeling Refreshed and Feeling GREAT)... IF I Wanted to I could take this further and eventually cut it down to 1/3 of a Methadone every 12 hours and even further to 1/4 of a Methadone every 12 hours. This would give someone a very VERY reasonable and Easy way to eventually Wean Yourself Completely Off All Pain Meds.... Because as I mentioned Earlier. There is Absolutely NO Incentive to Abuse the Methadone. You will not Feel Better By Taking MORE You will only Feel More SEDATED. NOT BETTER Physically or Emotionally or even Euphorically.... There is just no reason or want to Abuse the Methadone and therefore is the PERFECT Vehicle to Wean Yourself Down as far as you want to go... If you want to get completely OFF the Opiates Then it will be easy. If you have legitimate Pain that you can not live with Then it will allow you to find that Perfect Dose that Relieves your Pain but still allows you the Energy to Get out of bed and be a productive citizen. Without the Roller Coaster Effect. Without the Up's & Down's of the other Opiates.... I Think it is a Travesty that more doctors do not embrace this fact... I go thru it every month... Every Month I prove how easy it is to wean myself down to very little methadone But then Because of my Addiction to the Physical Act of Grinding up / Crushing and Snorting the Oxycodone I end up back on it and abusing it for another 2 weeks. If a big portion of my income was not from selling my prescription of 80mg Oxycontin Then I would hav a talk to my doctor and get transferred str8 over to Methadone and eventually just Wean Myself Off Completely. But I Am Caught in a Cycle.... Nonetheless, My Monthly Cycle Proves how easy it is to do this. I have a Very Addictive Personality, and if abusing the methadone was a benefit I would end up abusing It As Well. But I Am Proof that Even the Most Addictive Personalities can Achieve a level of Normality on the Methadone for the simple fact that """""""THERE IS NO INCENTIVE TO ABUSE THE METHADONE""""""" NONE..... It is so easy to take as prescribed and even wean yourself down. Because """""THERE IS NO BENEFIT IN OVER DOING IT""""""

I Hope you take this to heart, and I hope that others read this and get help from it. I have been on pain meds for over 15 years but they have also been my main source of income for the last 15 years So I am Stuck getting these CERTAIN Meds and These ones happen to be Ones that I Love To Abuse.... For ppl out there who do not care about switching meds from One to Another. Talk to your doctor about Methadone I guarantee it will save your life....

Good Luck, thanks for your time and I wish you all the best.
God Bless.....
Skippy



John, Let me start by saying i was on opioids for two decades and dont kid yourself with methadone i use to be on two oxy 80s and 4 30 roxys ir a day and the couple times i tried methadone it felt stronger than my oxys. not as euphoric but long ass staying power which equals long half life and long ass wds. Methadone rots your teeth and bones, just a little advise if you ever wanna end the ops hell train instead of snorting the oxy irs save them stop the methadone and ween on the irs. I did a two and half month ween on my irs it sucked but i went to work everyday and in the end jumped at a low dose of irs and wds didnt have much for me. That is if you want to stop good luck bro!
 
Getting stopped is one thing. Staying stopped is another. There's gonna be some haters but NA kept me clean for 13 fucking years. Real talk.


I agree for some, but staying clean starts and ends in your own mind you can have all the meeting and family support in the world but if its not in your own head to leave it behind for good and i mean for good. And no cravings allowed because you wont allow cravings in your thought patterns anymore. It starts or ends in your own mind gotta be strong life isnt living from opioid dose to dose everyday fuck that i did it 20 years never again. Lots are fighting for their lives be strong!
 
Went to the doc last nite ive been eating clonidine like candy to control my bp he prescribed me starter dose before wds .1 twice daily i was up to .2 three times a day and more sometimes. I also read that clonidine causes you to wake up after a couple hours sleep then have trouble falling back asleep. So between clonidine and paws now affecting my sleep i asked to ween off clonidine so he gave me a calcium blocker for hypertension and trazodone for sleep. Anybody have experience with eiether drugs i read some interactions with alcohol and calcium blockers im a little worried im not a big drinker two or three beers. And how is trazodone for sleep he said its not addictive.
 
Hey LD!

You are doing SO awesome! Keep it up. About the trazadone - I have it prescribed but wasn't sure about the dosage so I posted a new thread titled "trazadone for sleep?" I got some great feedback about trazadone. I posted it in sober living but it got moved to basic drug discussion - let me know if you can't locate it and I'll post a link!

- VE
 
Went to the doc last nite ive been eating clonidine like candy to control my bp he prescribed me starter dose before wds .1 twice daily i was up to .2 three times a day and more sometimes. I also read that clonidine causes you to wake up after a couple hours sleep then have trouble falling back asleep. So between clonidine and paws now affecting my sleep i asked to ween off clonidine so he gave me a calcium blocker for hypertension and trazodone for sleep. Anybody have experience with eiether drugs i read some interactions with alcohol and calcium blockers im a little worried im not a big drinker two or three beers. And how is trazodone for sleep he said its not addictive.

I'm so glad you are tapering? off clonidine. They only use it short term for withdrawal because of rebound hypertension, which is serious in individuals with a high bp already. Plus the higher the dose, the less REM sleep you get. So what little sleep you were getting was likely not restful.
Light drinking with calcium channel blockers is fine. How frequently if you don't mind? It's important. You can PM me.
VE answered your question about traz and sleep.
Solidarity, CD
 
Hi everyone, it's been a minute. John is still doing well. He started back to work this past Thurs. My son is working with him now. Says he is sore as hell but that is a healthy sore. Has a complete hatred and distaste for the H and fentanyl. He has been doing great. I had some time off of work and thought I should go for a jog.....that proved dangerous. Ended up running face first into a piece of metal angle iron sick out of the back of a pickup,busted my nose and got a black eye. EMT came, said I need stitches so I went to the e.r. and the doc said he could use heart surgery glue instead. I look a bit silly but I found out I can take a hit. So the next 2 days of vacation, John babysat me instead of the other way around. He was watching for concussion, plus my bp spiked. Last night we had a few drinks, tonight is a xmas party. That's the latest here, need to get caught up on shopping now! Miss you all, glad to see everyone still sticking to their plans.
Love n light ~
Kim
 
Hi everyone, it's been a minute. John is still doing well. He started back to work this past Thurs. My son is working with him now. Says he is sore as hell but that is a healthy sore. Has a complete hatred and distaste for the H and fentanyl. He has been doing great. I had some time off of work and thought I should go for a jog.....that proved dangerous. Ended up running face first into a piece of metal angle iron sick out of the back of a pickup,busted my nose and got a black eye. EMT came, said I need stitches so I went to the e.r. and the doc said he could use heart surgery glue instead. I look a bit silly but I found out I can take a hit. So the next 2 days of vacation, John babysat me instead of the other way around. He was watching for concussion, plus my bp spiked. Last night we had a few drinks, tonight is a xmas party. That's the latest here, need to get caught up on shopping now! Miss you all, glad to see everyone still sticking to their plans.
Love n light ~
Kim

Kim thats is fn awesome to hear how john how feels about H and fentanyl thats the state of mind you need to stay away from it! But im very sorry to hear what happened to you that sucks sounds like the kinda luck around my house i hope you heal quickly. I had three blue moons watching my Rangers game last nite. Best of luck to you and john!! TLD
 
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