Getting off Oxycodone for good

[Blueballs69]

I know there are an infinite number of threads on this, but I thought I'd post my own experience for personalized responses / support during this time.

I have been addicted to opiates since 2010. I dabbled with percocets and OC's before 2010 but a few negative experiences occurred simultaneously that drove me to use opiates as an escape and to numb my emotional pain.

My initial descent comprised taking one large dose a few times a week. It topped out at 90mg Oxycodone snorted at once.

I then graduated to insufflated heroin. I never injected. This peaked at sniffing a bundle a day for a week straight before I finally said ENOUGH. This was in 2012/2013.

I then went on suboxone, which I easily acquired from one of the many people I knew who were prescribed. I took 4 mg daily for about 3 months, never veering from the path to take full agonist opiates.

I was young and naive and did not respect the power of sub. The withdrawal I experienced around day 4 was the worst I have ever experienced. I remember being on the floor of my bathroom in between vomiting praying to God to just take me or end this - that I would never touch another opiate again blah blah blah.

On day 4 of my withdrawal (day 8 no sub) and seeing no progress in my symptoms I went to the block and got dope. I sniffed a bag or two and all of my withdrawal went away. I used it semi-responsibly and ended up getting off sub but continuing my habit (albeit with much lower amounts than previously).

I stopped using dope when I moved away for law school. I had oxy connects in this town and would still sniff pills occasionally. There was another point that I went on sub (with much more respect for the drug - never went on more than 2mg and properly weaned) and successfully got off opiates completely.

My sobriety lasted about 3 months until me and a group of friends (all of us clean as we had weaned the last time together) decided to do "one blue." Fucking idiots.

That was in 2014. From there, not wanting to dig a hole for myself like I had before, I would only take a quarter pill (~7.5mg) whenever I wanted to get high. This worked for awhile.

In 2015, after graduating law school, I took 2 bar exams simultaneously. I used the non-stop studying as an excuse to take oxy (on top of the daily adderall I was taking). I told myself I was going to sacrifice my body to pass these exams, and oxy gave me the mood boost I needed to forge on and continue studying.

I ended up passing both bar exams, and am now an admitted attorney in 2 states. I also got hooked back on opiates so - a little give and take.

As of now, I take roughly 90mg of Oxycodone daily. At a point not long ago, I was taking 6-7 blues a day. I have leveled off at 3. I had 2 8mg subs and 2 2mg subs at my disposal.

Last week I inducted myself at 4mg, next day 2mg, third day 2mg. Third night I did a 30mg oxy. Fourth day I took around 75mg oxy, Fifth day 75-90mg oxy.

Today, with 1 8mg sub and 2 2mg subs remaining, I took 2mg of sub this morning at 8am. At 6pm I blew another 30mg oxy. Shortly after, and at my wits end, I created a BL account for help and advice. I have used the site for informational purposes many times over the years.

My question is - can I successfully get off this shit with the suboxone I have? 6mg + 2mg + 2mg. What about my self destructive and undisciplined tendencies to still take oxy? Can I potentially use both in smaller doses as a taper? I have successfully taken sub ~12 hours after an oxy dose with no precipitated withdrawals. Is my only option to get a sub doctor? I have no desire to go on long term sub maintenance, but a month or two on the stuff may be what is needed. I am also afraid of the repercussions of having a sub doc on my medical history.

Any thoughts / comments / advice, please let me know. I want to get off of opiates for good.

 

[starting_over]

First off congratulations on passing the bar exams! That's no easy feat!

I don't know anything about subs, and I'm not sure how to answer much of what you've asked. I think if you're able to dedicate yourself to be a lawyer, you can dedicate yourself to slowly tapering down your opiate use.

Personally, I don't know if I could ever get off opiates for good. The most I've ever done was like 30 or 35mg IR oxy (with alcohol) and I was able to chip away on weekends for years at 20mg. And then this slowly increased to every 3rd day... then every 2nd day... then I said enough was enough.

Sadly, I can't drink anymore... opiates are easy enough on my GI tract, and I'm able to do them... but I haven't chosen to actively seek them out on the street. Just whatever gets prescribed (dentist, doctor).

All I'm saying is that I promised myself up and down that I would never do opiates again. Then I broke this promise and was rewarded with lung irritation due to snorting hydromorph contin once.
Btw this is what's happening to your lungs, please be careful:
http://www.ajronline.org/doi/full/10.2214/AJR.14.12582

For me, I think there has to be some compromise... if you're able to just keep it to once a month or something I wouldn't beat yourself up over it. Of course for some people opiates are an all-or-nothing deal.

Best of luck.

 

[BigPoppaGoonie]

Hey Blue,

Ditto starting_over and congrats on passing the bar, but more importantly, congrats on reaching out for help. I joined a little less than a week ago because, like you, I was at my wits end. I was downing 3-4 blues a day. I havent tried subs but I was fortunate to get fentanyl patches which replaced my need for oxy and I am now weening myself off. Its tough but can be done. You need to have will power and support. The latter you will get from this site, but you will need to want it. Best of luck my friend!

 

[Blueballs69]

Thank you guys for your comments. I have been on oxy since I posted. Tomorrow I'm going to induct myself on sub again and hopefully get through the subs I have and see where I stand mentally. I don't know if it's enough though. I have been a daily user for a year and a half, with a much longer history of off-and-on use.

If anyone can help with my original questions, I would be extremely grateful. Should also mention I have a couple ounces of kratom. I am wary of the short half life though. I work 10-12 hour days and will have to redose a few times during that period. A couple ounces don't stretch very far when dosing 4-5 times a day. Either way I am planning on using that after I run out of suboxone (which will be in less than a week most likely). Ugh... Addiction is a funny (not funny at all) thing.

Edit: I should mention I literally have nobody I can talk to about this. I have hid this from everyone I know for almost the entire duration (at least from law school on). I'm sure a couple friends have their suspicions but I have not been open about it to anyone. It's good to have a place to talk about this stuff.

 

[Gunny]

BlueBalls huh? - LMFAO !!!!

Im pretty new here myself and have been more or less searching similar stuff as you man. However, there are two methods which I am researching now which are controversial in many ways , and I posted a thread to see if there are ANY members here who've gone thru these treatments themselves. I am NOT finding anyone who's had it done themselves, but some replies with good info none the less. If interested check out my thread.

http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/805234-Seeking-Those-Who-ve-Done-quot-Rapid-quot-or-quot-Ultra-Rapid-quot-Detox-Methods-Please!

Luckily I have an outstanding Pain Management Dr who has treated me w some of the best methods EVER which VA is light years behind on! Oh, btw - guess I should mention that i am a Disabled Marine Corps Vet with Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI) severe Cervical Spine damage, and PTSD, sustained from a massive IED Blast in iraq years ago! I tell ya BB, I wish I died in that explosion because these injuries have only gotten 10 times worse over time, and left me so dependent on opiates with a tolerance thats thru the roof man! You'll see more about ME and what Im taking if ya read that link. The best thing about this forum is that there are SO MANY people all going thru the same shit and know EXACTLY what it feels like to suffer thru WD and everything ya know>? For that Im thankful, so hang in there and try your best - its the only thing we can do right Blue Balls? (Man you absolutely need to tell the story behind that screen name too! ) LMAO !!!

 

[Blueballs69]

Hahaha thanks man... Massive IED blast in Iraq?? Jesus... You're fuckin badass dude. If I was a chick I'd sit on your face as soon as I heard that.

As far as the screen name... I think it speaks for itself lol. It literally popped in my head immediately when it asked for a username. Blue (slang term for oxy obv), blue balls cuz this shit is pleasure without any release, cuz this drug punked me out, cuz I feel like I'm wasting my life in this circle jerk that's going nowhere good, cuz this shit has become my priority even over sex, cuz when I do have sex I can't bust half the time if I'm on more than one... and even on one 30mg pill it can be tough. Can't wait til I get off this shit and I cum instantaneously for a couple months.. Lol ugh.

I responded immediately because I laughed at the end of reading your post and had to reply. I'll check that link out. Good luck to you too man. You seriously are a bad ass motherfucker no matter how shitty you may feel. Like seriously seriousssslyyy badass.

And to anyone who can provide insight on my original post... Pleaseee

 

[VastEmpty]

Jesus... You're fuckin badass dude. If I was a chick I'd sit on your face as soon as I heard that.

Hahahahaha. Thanks for saying the funniest thing I've read in a week at least - and I've logged a lot of BL hours over the last 11 days.

Gunny is indeed a badass. No arguments there.

Best of luck to the both of you.

- VE

 

[aplumgirl]

Well, I'm day 7 clean off a nearly 5 year opiate habit. My experience is different than yours, I was in pain mgmt. I have never tried subs, so I can't speak to your questions about using them to get off oxy.

I'm thinking the only one who really can tell if you have enough subs is you. You know your own limit, you know how you've felt quitting before. I know CT is the only way I've been able to quit. I'd rather just bunker down and deal til I got through it. Not everyone can for various reasons.

Good luck with your decision to quit! We are here to support any way we can!

 

[VeraEllenFirefly]

Congrats on the accomplishments! I don't have an answer for every question but what I can tell you is this, you do not want to be going back and fourth between using the oxy and using the subs. Everytime you go a day or so just using subs, not oxy you are making youe wat through the oxy withdrawals. Trying to go back and fourth is actually making thing's worse for you. My suggestion would be with the info you gave given that you take whatever oxy you have left and do some sort of short term taper. After you run out of oxy, I would use the Kratom you have as another short term taper. Spread it out over as many days as you can, using just enough to make the W/D more tolerable. Then once you have used all the oxy and kratom you have make a plan to use the subs you have at your disposal. Again, I suggest you spread it out as much as possible, only using enough to make the wd more bearable. Before starting the subs ensure you have waited enough time to ensure you don't end up in precipitated withdrawal. Good luck, I wish you all the best. It is not easy but it is beyond worth it. Very smart of you to get this addressed now. Let us know how it goes!

 

[Blueballs69]

Hey everyone... unfortunately I failed miserably at my last attempt lol and continued to use. I saved the subs though - and procured more.

It's been almost 24 hours since my last dose of oxy and I inducted on 8mg (which is high! I think anyway) because I took 4mg and the RLS was so bad I took the other half. I have about 6 8mg subs and a couple 4mg subs.

My boss is away on vacation this week so I figured this is the week to do it. That's the other issue - due to uncertainty how this sub wean and taper will affect my personality and drive I'm unsure how well I'll be able to function. Since the boss is away I have more leeway if I show up to work at like 40% function lol.

I am only taking sub this week - no oxy under any circumstance. This weekend I'm hoping to hunker down and continue sub and not go out - easier said than done as I'm a young man with a room mate who is a good friend and has an affinity for bringing females around. If I can keep this weekend low key and continue weaning sub through next week I may be able to get off this shit using a quick 2 week sub taper (though I have never before taken 8mg to induct - it is a scary testament to how my tolerance has raised). I was taking ~150mg daily for the past 6 months (up from ~90mg when I originally posted).

Wish me luck people. And advice. I really wanna stick with it this time. Work and social situations always seem to make me veer course, however.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I don't mean to be negative (just real), but do you honestly believe that two weeks of buprenorphine is enough to deal with your long history of substance use disorder? What other plans do you have in terms of getting the support you need to maintain momentum in early recovery?

You've been using for a long time. It is going to take a lot of time and effort, a lot of trying trying and trying again on your part, to really begin to get things under control. I highly suggest you plan out a long term strategy that you can honestly believe is realistic keeping in mind how much you have struggled in your efforts to achieve sobriety.

Perhaps it should start out imagining what you as an individual want your sobriety and recovery to look like. After all, the drug use itself is just the tip of the iceberg in terms of what you'll need to work on and address if you're to move beyond your struggles with drug use itself.

 

[Blueballs69]

I know exactly what I want my sobriety to look like. I understand all the underlying issues that led to my use and am at peace with them. I'm acutely aware of the fact that I have a wonderful life awaiting me when I finally stop with this bullshit. It's just not easy (as we all know too well)...

I just recently fell into a period where I had an excuse to use that morphed into a dependence and addiction that for the most part I was tolerating. Only once before (my original post) during this long binge have I seriously considered quitting. This is attempt number 2.

I just need to break the cycle and live a few weeks without compulsively doing another line. If I don't feel ready after two weeks I'll continue to take small doses of sub (1/2 mg or less). That's the plan right now. Flying by the seat of my pants as I'm sure almost everyone is who goes through this.

 

[Blueballs69]

I also want to add.. as far at support I'm relying on you guys lol. Sorry to shamelessly pass the onus onto others.

As stated above, I have hid this from literally everyone I know. Everyone. That's why it's so hard because I need to be on my game at work and in my social/family life. I saw my bosses vacation as an opportunity to try and handle this. It's all I can do. I want to be done. I'm tired of being a slave to an expensive and empty chemical. I've known for years like I've had this innate feeling my life begins the moment I leave this shit in the dust. And I still use! It's fuckin confounding to say the least...

But this thread does help... I promise! And I appreciate you all selflessly taking the time to weigh in and offer support. Truly! So thank you.. and please continue dropping wisdom on me

 

[KraziKat]

I was at 7 blues a day, and it was totally unsustainable. Now I'm on kratom, using as a form of ORT. I have no answers for you. But I will say, you should delete all of the phone numbers of your pill connects.

 

[Jabberwocky]

OP, if you feel your plans are right for you with buprenorphine, go for it! I highly recommend finding IRL support apart from BL. BL offers some phenomenal support, but getting sober in my case requires I put at least as much effort into what I'm doing IRL to promote my recovery (for me this means involvement in the secular mindfulness community and a therapist IRL).

Keep your head up and let us know how things progress. Have you chosen a quit date? Any chance you can get some other comfort meds like clonidine and gabapentin to help you through the acute withdrawal? Gabapentin can also be really useful during your first few months of sobriety.

 

[Blueballs69]

Can you please educate me about clonidine and gabapentin.. other than bupe I have Kratom (which I likely won't touch) and Xanax (which I use sparingly).

I'm still clean.. Day 2 going smooth but obviously not entirely comfortable. I still have my resolve though. I have blues in the next room and no desire to do them. I plan to stick with the bupe and taper.. I'm making an excuse to stay in this weekend and continue through next week. After next week I'm either going to continue the wean or make the jump. I'm scared I won't succeed but I'm hopeful I will. I've done this before.

It's gross how parasitic opiates are.. they've literally hijacked my brain. I've been wanting to be clean for years lol. It's pure absurdity. I feel like this is a now or never thing though. I'm getting my last licks of leeway career-wise and I want to move forward already. Be the person I'm supposed to be.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Clonidine is used to treat acute opioid withdrawal, high blood pressure (rarely) and diarrhea. Gabapentin is used primarily to treat acute opioid withdrawal, anxiety disorders, certain types of pain and RLS.

Clonidine will prevent the hot/cold flashes and intense sweating common with acute withdrawal, as well as helping people sleep and deal with RLS. Gapabentin is great as a general mood stabilizer and RLS treatment during withdrawal. Both medication are very safe, although gabapentin more so - with clonidine you need to make sure you only take it as prescribed and that your blood pressure is high enough to take it when you do (which generally isn't an issue during acute withdrawal, as it tends to raise the blood pressure).

Your experience of the classic acute symptoms of opioid withdrawal will be markedly reduced simply by your use of buprenorphine, so these other medications are more supportive in terms of what the buprenorphine is doing for you - although they may become more important after you stop using buprenorphine (particularly gabapentin, as clonidine isn't really useful post acute withdrawal).

There is another medicine, baclofen, that is used to treat muscle spasms, alcohol use disorder and certain types of pain. Gabapentin can be very effective (at least until you build a crazy tolerance to it, which happens rather quickly) at managing cravings, but I found baclofen to work even better. Basically does the same stuff gabapentin does, but is far more potent and a bit more effective as a mood stabalizer. Of course it also does wonders for killing cravings.

Kratom might be useful to deal with cravings once you run out of buprenorphine, but of course should be used very sparingly give the opioid like potential of stuff like 7-HMG in it. Sometimes using opioids or opioid like substances after detox can just be the kind of tease that leads to a lapse or relapse, but sometimes (certain ones at least, like buprenorphine, tramadol and kratom) can the right choice to dip into when the risk of relapse is exceptionally high. It just requires we keep a close eye on things and in no circumstances use it when not ABSOLUTELY necessary. It's a rather dangerous double edged blade though, if your goal is abstinence from all opioid use.

Drugs didn't hijack your brain, as popular as that trope is. Rather, for a number of largely environmental reason, your brain adapted to drug use. It can just as well adapt to life without them, if you put in the same amount of effort into your recovery (non-drug using related activities) as you did your using back in the day. Your body and your brain are incredibly adaptive, so if you put in the effort it's just a matter of time till you stop thinking about using drugs or craving opioids. Frankly the biggest challenge is keeping folks alive until that happens... but it will happen eventually if you just keep trying.

Do you close friends and family know about what you're going through, and are they supportive?

 

[Blueballs69]

They do hijack your brain though, specifically the reward pathway. My compulsion to use is because of the positive association my brain makes with another dose of the drug. My brain has also stopped making endorphins on its own due to my introduction and chronic use of oxycodone. The brain "heals" by re-learning to release appropriate amounts of enorphins since it hasn't had to do so in its own with the amount of foreign dopamine agonists I've introduced into my system... constantly.

As far as support, as I outlined above it is you guys. I have hidden this addiction from literally everyone. Even my connects don't understand the gravity of it lol. I am an extremely high functioning addict but I'm an addict nonetheless. My personality is better off of it - and it is draining my bank acct with the price surge over the past couple years. I'm tired of being reliant on this drug and want to reach my full potential - the sooner the better.

I looked up the drugs you mentioned and all require a prescription. How do I approach this? Especially if it'll help with cravings after I get off the sub.

 

[Jabberwocky]

If that language works for you, go for it. I like the more adaptive understanding as drugs don't have intent - they can be used for good and for ill. But that all really doesn't matter in terms of this discussion.

Clonidine and gapabentin are classic, basic medications to be prescribed during acute opioid withdrawal. If you have a GP or any doctor who knows what's going on with you, assuming they have the most basic understanding of treating opioid withdrawal, they should be happy to prescribe this stuff. There is no "abuse" potential, they just treat some very uncomfortable symptoms.

Sorry if I've been asking you questions you already answered - going back in forth between lots of different threads does a number of my memory sometimes.

I encourage you to do whatever you feel is right for you, what you need to do for yourself, regardless of what anyone else tells you. That all said, I still highly encourage you to find people IRL who accept and support you in what you're doing without judging you for it (so it's probably not going to be family, unfortunately - unless you have some exceptionally large minded family members that is...).

Your head is definitely in the right place with this though. I have no doubt you'll figure things out.

 

[Blueballs69]

I appreciate your continued support TPD.. lord knows I need it. And I agree that I will figure this out eventually - but the sooner the better. Ideally it happens now.

If I approach a doctor for these drugs I'm assuming it will go on my medical history. I am trying to avoid any evidence of this problem if at all possible. If I go to the doctor and get these drugs for this purpose will it put me on any sort of list that I'm prone to addiction and/or not allow me to get pain medication for a major surgery in 20 years? I am seriously considering going if the visit won't come back to haunt me one day (potentially far) in the future.