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Misc The (LOPERAMIDE) diaries...

skodeo

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 26, 2016
Messages
256
G'day ladies and gents,

Well, I took the initial dive and joined after years of scouring archives for various info. Now it's time for me to tell my story.
Where do I begin?

Well, I'm corresponding today in hopes of receiving some support for battling my Loperamide addiction. I started off many moons ago popping various pills which eventually lead to a full on methadone addiction (120mg) for a number of years which landed me in the 4 month treatment center just outside Austin, TX. After leaving there I entered a sober house in Austin and within two weeks I was popping about 30 capsules of headshop kratom at $40 each. After 3 months(late July 2012) I packed up my stuff and drove 2,000+ miles back to the Pacific Northwest to start anew eventually as a IV heroin user with a dash of meth on the side (never liked speed at first, but it went well with H).

Fast forward and I moved to the U.S. Virgin Islands (June-2014) in hopes of relocating to drop my dope habit. A couple months before this excursion I was browsing online (most likely this very site) and became introduced to the notion that Lope would help ease my heroin withdrawal. Upon primary experimentation with a dose of 100-150mg I came to find near relief from WDs. Anyway, while living in the USVI I picked up a mean coke/crack habit (while in the midst of WDs from H/Lope) and after 3 months I called my folks and broke down and gave them the gist of what had befallen me and begged for another chance at inpatient treatment. I then landed in Nor Cal for a month's stay in a Napa Valley rehab and when I got out I felt back to my normal self!

I entered a sober living house in Marin, just outside of San Fransico, and it wasn't long before I was walking to the store to snag some Loperamide(October-2014)....Hence, the true beginning to my tale of woe. This is when I began using solely Lope (occasionally alcohol) for fun. I quickly gained to normal dose of 400mg, taking it every other day.

To me, in the first few months while using every other day, I found that it would put my mind at ease. [[[I suffer horrible social anxiety which I can mask on my own without drugs, if that makes sense...I'll feel anxiety-ridden inside, but I won't project it on the outside. I may come across as this silly, confident, and outgoing guy, but inside I'm exacerbating ALL my energy to mirror the complete opposite. This is why I turned to drugs at 16.]]] Loperamide I DID INDEED find recreational! However, it feels like a crackheaded drunk of an opiate. When I megadose, the usual 400mg, made me feel warm, itchy, outgoing, inspired, energy boosted....BUT also weak in my extremities (to the point where when I started working I couldn't even lift heavier objects-anyone else have this??), I occasionally shake, and with one hell of a vision fuck that I really can't compare to anything else. During those "halcyon" days (if you could even call them that) when I started abusing Lope to get high and not at a little lower of a dose like I did to manage my WDs I would seriously find myself nodding out at certain times and waking up with a lovely itch constantly through my nights(these effects didn't last long). I kept my dosing regimen to every other day because I'd still be high the next morning with effects subsiding around late midday of day two and back to anxiety town by nightfall. I'd then wake on the second day in initial withdrawal (after a month or so which progressively got worse) and walk my ass to a store and jack another two 96 ct boxes or a 200 ct box to slam down with chocolate/strawberry milk or a smoothie from the produce department.

So, after 3 months in Marin in a sober house I moved in with my gf up north for another two months(late January-2015), continuing my cycle of 400mg every other day. At the end of those 2 months I still hadn't found a job and I bought some speed with my tax return and, in short, went psychotic for the first time without IV heroin to balance things like the old days. I am lucky I didn't get arrested while running all over town for 24 hrs thinking the cops were out to get me. I voluntarily committed myself in the psych ward for a few days to plan my next step...at this point my parents and my gf were done with me and not only was I coming down from meth, but I didn't have my Lope for days and was WDing.

I worked things out with my girl and had her come and get me, 6 days off Lope and not feeling all that bad considering I wanted to die a few days prior. I SHOULD have stopped with the Lope then, but NOPE! Same thing, 400mg every 2 days. I soon ended up in another sober house and quickly found a job(early April-2015). Here is where things changed. I worked as a cashier and stocker and of course I have to be social to do a good job. Now I found myself dosing EVERY DAY in excess of 600mg(rarely, usually the 400+ mg mark). This is when I noticed that my strength was severely hindered while lifting heavier objects. Sometimes it was a struggle to even walk. MY eyesight seemed constantly semi-bulred when I actually would focus to take note of it. Also, I began to have trouble sleeping. If I took the lope too late in the day I had an energy blast throughout the night even though I had a feeling of tiredness. I would only half sleep.

Ok, this is dragging on so let me get down to it (thanks to those who dared to read this far-you're my new friend forever and ever and I appreciate you-honestly, I do). I've had two more jobs since then, I'm still dosing every day....rarely every other day, but now the WDs seem to catch up at the 18-24 hr mark and my mindset refuses me to partake in such pain. At this new job(starting mid Feb. of 2016), in another grocery store, I first tried to make an attempt, cold turkey, to stop Lope before getting officially hired. I was planning to join this site then when I was 3 days into WDs and actually in pretty good spirits considering. However, I slipped. When I started I found that my megadose wouldn't cut it since I need my strength to lift shit all day long. Since the first few days of the job I've been sticking to a lower 200 to no more than 300 mg dose....Usually just a 96 ct bottle daily (192 mg) since I found that this range is the max I can take and expect my body to function normal enough when it comes to my strength issues.

I have a bad feeling that Lope is eventually going to catch up with me...I have been using it recreationally now for a good year and a half straight consistently, the last year of that being a daily occurrence. I am actually a pretty healthy individual, I eat decent enough and drink on average a good 3/4 gallon of water a day. I don't want my heart to stop or my kidneys to give out. Let me be the first to admit that I can't even use the toilet without fear of clogging it 99.869% of the time. My shit is so large I have to bag it and toss it in the trash!!! (Don't judge, being honest here and I'm kinda laughing to myself). I'm a skinny dude, but my belly is always bloated from, what I can only assume, is an excessively backed up digestive tract. Couple that with the fact that I steal my Lope which is risky as an every day occurrence and makes me feel guilty as fuck, just laying in wait for the ax to drop.

Moving forward, last week I made the decision to buy kratom to wean myself off this damn Lope-dope. I ordered 6 oz online from a reputable Reddit approved vendor which arrived two days ago and I began implementing. HOWEVER, WHAT THE FUCK???? This kratom wouldn't even remotely touch my withdrawal symptoms!!! I'm consuming about 5-12 grams at a time and I get relief for an hour, maybe two tops. Next thing I know it feels like I'm back in full on WDs. I redose kratom, redose, redose. I can barely stomach this shit. THIS IS ONLY MY SECOND DAY off Lope. I feel broken, helpless, bummed. So what did I do about 2 hours ago??? You guessed it, I went and got a box of 96 Lopes and down the hatch they went. I procured a second bottle for tomorrow as well since I work. I got up at 4am today for work and after the kratom I still couldn't manage to go in (plus, I walk two miles there and two miles home). I'm in a sober house still, this is all a big secret under wraps

....only you and I know my true story now. What say you??
 
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I appreciate the kind words! I know, it's funny cause I read all these posts about people debating whether or not Lope does cross the BBB and I can testify firsthand that it does indeed. I wouldn't be hooked on it if it wasn't! Either it's one big trolling operation of a conspiracy, mass placebo effect, or it works (perhaps selectively as some are more prone to it's effects than others). To the nonbelievers you simply need to try a high dose...or don't.

Straight from Wikipedia:
"It is an opioid with no significant absorption from the gut and does not cross the blood brain barrier when used at NORMAL doses."
"
In 2015 however, case reports of extremely high-dose loperamide resulting in opioid abuse were published.[28][29] It was referred to as "poor man's methadone".[29] Toxicity has been reported to include dependence, respiratory depression, and catatonia.[28][29] One individual who was referred to a drug detoxification clinic was taking 800 mg/day.[28]According to MacDonald, "Loperamide has potential for euphoric effects and information on how to facilitate such effects is easily available."

It's not the most pleasant high in terms of side effects, but I think what I enjoy about it is the fact that it's similar to methadone (my first full blown addiction). It has a long half life so one dose is sufficient for a day or more and I find it gives me a HUGE energy boost which powers me through work. Over time I've learned to neglect the bad side effects and embrace the positive aspects. It's what's keeping me away from other opiates, but, much like methadone, the withdrawals are hell thanks to its half life. I'd say they are just a single step down from methadone. I'd much rather be coming off of H right now.
 
Acquire a short acting opiod like dilaudid or IR oxy. Decrease the loperamide by 20mg in 48hr dosimg increments while moderately dosing other opiod. Better just stop the lope all together.

What you're doing almost equates to poisoning yourself. Megadoses of high dose lope are linked to what I believe is QT elongation. You're playing roussian roulette with a fatal cardiac arrhythmia on a daily basis. Loss of ability to lift heavy objects and other debilitating and dangerous side effects you listed are bad warning signs. Get off the high dose lope and get another potent opiod.
 
Thanks for the input, with my next paycheck I may do just that using a DNM since I have absolutely no hookups here. I honestly think I'd be healthier shooting heroin at this point. Kratom doesn't do anything, time to try a new route. In the meantime I suppose I'll attempt a taper...
 
Thanks for the input, with my next paycheck I may do just that using a DNM since I have absolutely no hookups here. I honestly think I'd be healthier shooting heroin at this point. Kratom doesn't do anything, time to try a new route. In the meantime I suppose I'll attempt a taper...
Hey man I hope you are doing well as can be. I have been there where you are now, I went from opiates to Kratom to Loperamide. I had similar side effects like my vision got blurry, my chest would feel constricted and really tight. Also my ears would ring a lot and I would get lightheaded. I know about all the "poison" stories and there actually have been some verified cases of people dying because of Lope. But I found something that instantly took all of the desire and WD's completely away, couldn't believe it. Have you heard of Tianeptine? Get a couple grams of that and do some consistent, moderate doses and you will be fine, you won't even be thinking about the Lope because the Tianeptine gives a nice euphoric buzz. It is addictive if you dose too high for too long. So give it some consideration if you want, I was surprised because I never thought I was going to be able to finally quit taking Lope but from the first time I tried Tianeptine, it was so refreshing and comforting, and it completely flipped a switch for me and I haven't taken any lope since. I did get a little crazy with it and if you really abuse it bad you will get the full boat of withdrawals so if you go that route as soon as you are ready just taper down from the Tianeptine and you will be back in business. So good luck to you and I hope everything will come together soon in the future.
 
Dude, high doses of lope are really dangerous.
It sounds like your habit is really tough to kick - so have you considered getting on a buprenorphine or methadone program?

Honestly, it could save your life.
 
I am a recovering heroin oxy lope addict. Guess which almost killed me. lope. It's messes up the time between beats of your heart. I took about 200mg a day for almost before the heart issues started. I thought it was amazing because it got me off dope. Instead I ended up with an opiate tolerance dope couldn't touch and a deadly heart problem. About a month ago I made the choice to go on Suboxone. I was over a year clean from other opiates other than once trying to get high off heroin (couldn't because lope fucks your tolerance) j was uncomfortable for days in 8mg of sub because the lope had raised my tolerance that much. Now I am happy and maintain on 4mg of sub a day. My heart problems resolved a week after stopping lope no more passing out and no more blue extremities. I beg you to stop. Lope kills people. It Is no better than dope. Get on maintainer the withdrawals are no joke but it will get better!
 
Be careful with this drug. It does pass into the brain but is thrown back out by the ABC transporters. Once the level is high enough, the sheer amount overpowers the body from removing it so the dose-response is biphasic. Up to a certain point, the dose-response has one curve and then, when you overpower the transporters, the curve becomes a lot steeper. I've read of people nearly dying from high doses. The exact figure varies from person to person but at least one person got Compartment syndrome. I realize that it's cheap and convenient but I've read at least 1 BLr died from it's effects. Similar compounds have been patented as peripheral opiate agonists but the LogP is already rather high so when you DO enter the second phase, it's dangerous.

Just a caution.
 
Thanks for the comments, everyone. Today I took my 96 ct bottle and brewed a tiny amount of kratom tea at 4:30 am before work. Just got home a bit ago. Taking 96 is a lower dose for me, so not much was felt and def' no negative side effects. Just enough to make me normal. I purchased some 00 size capsules and began to encapsulate my remaining 2 oz or so of kratom since I can't spend the time brewing or manage to choke down multiple grams at a time mixed in apple sauce or yogurt....what a pain it is to do it all by hand and the powered leaf got all over everything. I stopped after about 50 capsules. I don't know what I'll do about tomorrow. Perhaps just try and stick it out with the kratom, but I think my tolerance is so fucked that it can't really even touch it!
 
Also, keep in mind I do live in a sober house. I do get drug tested about every week or so. I can always cheat the test since they don't watch, but I'd prefer to not take anything that would show up in a UA. Plus, I don't have a vehicle right now so that negates a methadone clinic and subs would show up in my pee test since it's one of the more elaborate instant result UAs. I gotta get off this Lope, I came here for a little accountability and support...I know how horrible it is and I know what can happen. Sigh...
 
Just ordered 5 g's tianeptine which should be here by Friday...
 
Just ordered 5 g's tianeptine which should be here by Friday...
. Tianeptine won't show up on any tests. It's legal and all but I am on probation and get tested each month and that and kratom has never showed up. So you can put the Lope down for good when the Tianeptine comes if you want to. Just be careful with it.
 
I'm really interested in tianeptine as well, I don't know if I'm just still chasing a high or am just depressed and blaming it on the subs, but I sometimes feel like the effects of suboxone make me feel depressed. It's like I'm on an opiate, but somehow sad and empty, don't know if anyone can relate to that at all, but I've been researching kratom and tianeptine for the last few days. It's a shame it's not available for prescription here in the states (not that you can't just buy it online). What size dosages of tianeptine would one take to get a pleasant effect if their tolerance is 2mg of suboxone/day? Would it be basically useless? Also, what ROA is good (I have heard horror story's about IV'ing the COAXIL pills, but is that because the drug itself is damaging to tissue like how some antihistamines are, or is it because of the binder in Coaxil?), would plugging be a viable option, or is oral BA high enough?
 
Someone recently wrote a rather long post about Tianeptine, you should give it a read and be sure to read the comments. It's more sinister than it sounds. It is a decent option for the Lope WD but be careful because it does have anti-depressant properties. If you take it for a while, you're likely going to have rebound anxiety and depression and it does antagonize the opiate receptors so there will still be WDs. I would sooner recommend switching to a shorter-acting opiate and either weaning from there or getting into some type of maintenance therapy.

http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/778173-Tianeptine-Addiction-My-Story-Your-Story
 
Damn, that does sound incredibly unpleasant, It's strange because I never had problems stopping SSRI's (which I understand are different from SA's), but it seems that people struggle a lot with drugs like this and tramadol (and I imagine Nucynta too) because you're withdrawing from two forms of drugs, I guess some antidepressants are rougher to come off of than others, like I've heard vanafalaxin is a real bitch, similar to a tramadol kick.
 
I was actually just thinking about that. How similar it seems to be to Tramadol. The dual WDs have got to be a real bitch. Like the soul-crushing depression and anxiety from regular opiate withdrawals aren't bad enought, factor in the rebound depression and anxiety form the SSRI components and it's gotta be hell on earth. Sounds like kicking something as weak as Tram would be a lot easier than dope or some other opiate but damn....that's rough stuff.

As skidoo pointed out Tianeptine is an SSRE...not SSRI...my mistake. Still gotta be a bitch WDing from both simultaneously.

NAMASTE
 
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I'm really interested in tianeptine as well, I don't know if I'm just still chasing a high or am just depressed and blaming it on the subs, but I sometimes feel like the effects of suboxone make me feel depressed. It's like I'm on an opiate, but somehow sad and empty, don't know if anyone can relate to that at all, but I've been researching kratom and tianeptine for the last few days. It's a shame it's not available for prescription here in the states (not that you can't just buy it online). What size dosages of tianeptine would one take to get a pleasant effect if their tolerance is 2mg of suboxone/day? Would it be basically useless? Also, what ROA is good (I have heard horror story's about IV'ing the COAXIL pills, but is that because the drug itself is damaging to tissue like how some antihistamines are, or is it because of the binder in Coaxil?), would plugging be a viable option, or is oral BA high enough?
Tianeptine is the best anti-depressant I have ever taken. For me it works wonders. I just parachute with toilet paper, also it completely and quickly dissolves in water so you can just mix it with a drink. If you just put a few drops of water on a pile it forms a gel/paste. I think that is the problem for IV. There is also some kind of binder or something that clogs a rig. You could probably start off at 35-50 mgs and be good to go. But it's just like everything else in that its effect is different for different people. It's one of those things like for example, we could be the same drug wise and size wise but I might need twice as much as you or vice versa. Some people are good at the minimum and some need to start at 250 mgs. You have to be very careful in approaching a dose schedule. Start off slow and take your time going up. It does cause a physical addiction if it's abused, so again just start off slow and take days off.
 
Morning all, just before 5am here...today I downed 120 Lope pills, and about 4 g's of kratom. Off to work I go here soon. My tianeptine should arrive by Friday at the latest and I also ordered some phenibut for good measure which comes by the 4th. Seeing as the phenibut is structurally related to pregablin [Lyrica] (which helped ease WD in the past from methadone big time and enhanced my mood).

All I know is Lope is damaging my body and I'm playing with fire consuming it...coupled with the fact that I steal from the same handful of stores daily. For the longest time I was taking 200 or more (up to 300-600mg) of them and now I'm down to 100-130 at a time. Yesterday I took 96, made it through work OK, and woke up in WD this morning at 3am (23 hrs from my last dose of 96).

I'm planning to just keep this thread going with my advancements or setbacks. Feel free to chime in whenever. I'll def be documenting my attempted substitution with phenibut and tianeptine.

Have a great day, friends!
 
Tianeptine is an SSRE not an SSRI (which, I too, have had no problem coming off of in the past multiple times). I'll TRY to just use it short term and at doses that are as small as possible. I'm wondering how much it'll take to master my Lope WD though, should be interesting.
 
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