Is Kratom becoming too popular?

[DogLover123757]

It seems that Kratom has become extremely popular and there seems to be the beginnings of a response. Do you guys think that we are close to a ban because Big Pharma is starting to realize that certain financial gains are/could be in jeopardy soon?

 

[Mycophile]

It seems that Kratom has become extremely popular and there seems to be the beginnings of a response. Do you guys think that we are close to a ban because Big Pharma is starting to realize that certain financial gains are/could be in jeopardy soon?

Where did you hear this and what kind of response have you heard of??

I have also heard a bit about this and it is on the DEAs list of substances of concern.

I REALLY REALLY....REALLY hope that it stays legal because I fucking love it.

I'd be very upset if it became illegal, especially because it's not like if it became illegal you could easily find a Kratom dealer like there are dealers for other drugs.


But honestly, even though some posters on here think it will be banned really soon I am optimistic that it quite likely won't be banned or even if it is eventually it will take a while.

I mean look at Salvia Divinorum: while it has been banned in Australia, over there they are drug Nazis who seem to ban EVERYTHING.

But in the U.S., man, I was probably amongst the first several hundred kids in the U.S. to order Salvia online and try it back in the late 90s around 98/99.

There was talk even then of it becoming illegal and now about 17 years later it's STILL legal and IMO I doubt it will be illegal anytime soon.

The difference though is that Big Pharma isn't going to like Kratom because it is a SAFE alternative to their pain meds.


Still...I'm not sure the stir is big enough.

Like...you said "kratom has become EXTREMELY popular" and I think you need to use that word more carefully because honestly, I don't think it has reached "extreme" levels of popularity at all yet.

People on forums like this may know about it but it's still pretty underground.

For example: I bet if you go to a number of different parties with college kids who are smoking weed and using E and other drugs and ask them if they have heard of Kratom I bet that only a small percentage will have heard of it and fewer will have used it.

The few people I know who smoke weed and use other drugs that I've told about Kratom had NEVER heard of it before and your average person, even your average DRUG user who doesn't go on lots of forums will give you a blank expression if you mention Kratom.


It's becoming MORE popular...but NO...it's not EXTREMELY popular yet.

Lets hope it doesn't become that popular soon cause I love Kratom and don't want it taken away...

 

[SKL]

You don't need any Big Pharma conspiracy theories to know that kratom has a one way ticket to Schedule I. Please. Probably first at state level, like salvia, the feds move slower unless it's a veritable "epidemic" and even with that the SCB/beta-ketone bans have hardly been effective, but kratom, being a single plant, is less of a moving target. All it will take will be some negative attention and some pretty blond college girl who got started on kratom, wound up transitioning to heroin and dead in a ditch. Off to the races. It's an inevitability.

 

[Mycophile]

You don't need any Big Pharma conspiracy theories to know that kratom has a one way ticket to Schedule I. Please. Probably first at state level, like salvia, the feds move slower unless it's a veritable "epidemic" and even with that the SCB/beta-ketone bans have hardly been effective, but kratom, being a single plant, is less of a moving target. All it will take will be some negative attention and some pretty blond college girl who got started on kratom, wound up transitioning to heroin and dead in a ditch. Off to the races. It's an inevitability.

Even though you MIGHT end up being right, (and I REALLY hope you are wrong), I think it's not QUITE as much of an inevitability as you think.

I really don't think THAT many people are doing Kratom percentage wise across the U.S. and what you mentioned about Salvia...how many states is it even illegal in??

Just like a few.

It's going to take a LONG time before Salvia is actually illegal in all 50 states.

It MAY end up happening, but I've got my fingers crossed that IF it does it'll be at least a good 10 years or so for me to continue to have some fun with it.

Fucking government, they ruin everything.

Why can't they just leave it the fuck alone?!?!?!

 

[Burnt Offerings]

The only reason it's not already illegal is because they're aren't many reports of people running down the street naked after being up for 10 days on it (cathonine stimulants) or ending up in the ER after having some sort of terrible reaction to it (synthetic cannabinoids). It's difficult to stoke up hysteria about it because it's pretty benign.

However, it has one fatal flaw which I think will eventually lead to its criminality: it is an opioid drug. This country is fucking insane when it comes to anything even resembling an opioid analgesic. I can just imagine the "journalism" now: "addicts compare the high of kratom to the painkiller VICODIN!"

 

[DogLover123757]

Where did you hear this and what kind of response have you heard of??

I have also heard a bit about this and it is on the DEAs list of substances of concern.

I REALLY REALLY....REALLY hope that it stays legal because I fucking love it.

I'd be very upset if it became illegal, especially because it's not like if it became illegal you could easily find a Kratom dealer like there are dealers for other drugs.


But honestly, even though some posters on here think it will be banned really soon I am optimistic that it quite likely won't be banned or even if it is eventually it will take a while.

I mean look at Salvia Divinorum: while it has been banned in Australia, over there they are drug Nazis who seem to ban EVERYTHING.

But in the U.S., man, I was probably amongst the first several hundred kids in the U.S. to order Salvia online and try it back in the late 90s around 98/99.

There was talk even then of it becoming illegal and now about 17 years later it's STILL legal and IMO I doubt it will be illegal anytime soon.

The difference though is that Big Pharma isn't going to like Kratom because it is a SAFE alternative to their pain meds.


Still...I'm not sure the stir is big enough.

Like...you said "kratom has become EXTREMELY popular" and I think you need to use that word more carefully because honestly, I don't think it has reached "extreme" levels of popularity at all yet.

People on forums like this may know about it but it's still pretty underground.

For example: I bet if you go to a number of different parties with college kids who are smoking weed and using E and other drugs and ask them if they have heard of Kratom I bet that only a small percentage will have heard of it and fewer will have used it.

The few people I know who smoke weed and use other drugs that I've told about Kratom had NEVER heard of it before and your average person, even your average DRUG user who doesn't go on lots of forums will give you a blank expression if you mention Kratom.


It's becoming MORE popular...but NO...it's not EXTREMELY popular yet.

Lets hope it doesn't become that popular soon cause I love Kratom and don't want it taken away...

My apologies if I used the wrong term in your opinion. I used extremely based on my observations and experiences over the past couple of years. I am speaking on little actions such as liquid Kratom being banned in certain areas because it is marketed for consumption. I remember not long ago there were more brands than I could remember. It just seems that Kratom is garnering more attention from the government and that is bad news and it always starts with little steps. I am not a vendor but the few vendors I do business with all speak about a higher level of difficulty with customs. I don't have any contacts that are on the floor, I just have a feeling that the attention level towards Kratom is increasing and that is dangerous to those of us who enjoy the herb. It is only a matter of time until some analysts at Big Pharma put together a presentation about the financial threat that Kratom represents. That will solely be based on greed, it will have nothing to do with treating pain levels in human beings or a softer and cheaper treatment for opiate addiction. Just think of all the companies outside of Pharma that will lose money as well, and they are all well connected to the boys on the hill. We have already seen the example set over in Asia, the "official" reason Kratom was banned was pure bullshit and we all know it.

 

[manboychef]

It is already illegal in some states. As I have stated before, if we use prohibition as a model then it will become cheaper, more potent, and more prevalent. Look at heroin.

 

[Ninae]

This is now a reality in Europe. I was interrogated about it in May. The police officer hadn't heard about it before, had to look it up, and said "It says it's like Heroin?"

Then they stormed the apartment complex where I live and warned the office I was at risk even though I've been using it for 5 years. Good times.

 

[ForGreatScience]

Although "extremely popular" may be a little bit of a stretch, it does seem to be becoming extremely available in a way that it has not been before.

A couple of years ago the only way you might hear about it or obtain it was online, but now smoke shops seems to be selling it widely. They've put it into the sections of their displays where their "spice"(synthetic cannabinoid) blends used to be. I have seen big signs in windows saying "We Have Kratom" and they have it in various forms (capsules, extracts, and the "5-hour energy"-type shots). Basically what I'm saying is that more and more people are being exposed to it or have access to it than before. So relatively speaking I think it is extremely popular compared to a few years ago. And due to the way it's being sold/marketed people are bound to associate it with things like "spice" or "bath salts" and that could be a contributing factor towards a potential ban. Also there was just a Dr. Phil episode about a girl who was addicted to kava and kratom. The "expert" who they brought on supposedly to explain what kava and kratom were basically just tried to give the impression that they're really bad and they're probably going to kill you without really describing at all what they were. So basically the media outrage is already beginning. Hard to say how this will play out.

 

[Mycophile]

For the sake of argument IF it ever becomes illegal, do you guys think that Kratom will become more available illegally and sold by more dealers who sell your average illegal drugs like weed, coke, heroin, ecstasy etc???

As a fan of Kratom I wouldn't want to see it become unavailable, and I have NEVER heard of a dealer selling it.

My guess is it would become SOMEWHAT more prevalent as that is what often happens when drugs are made illegal, hence the fatal flaw in prohibition and illegalization etc.

 

[Mycophile]

This is now a reality in Europe. I was interrogated about it in May. The police officer hadn't heard about it before, had to look it up, and said "It says it's like Heroin?"

Then they stormed the apartment complex where I live and warned the office I was at risk even though I've been using it for 5 years. Good times.

Wait a minute...there AREN'T laws against it where you are but the cops raided your apartment for it?!??!

Or are there laws against it where you are??

What part of Europe are you in out of curiosity??

It doesn't surprise me that cops would be corrupt but raided someone's place for a drug that has NO laws against it would IMO probably be illegal...

 

[manboychef]

cops in the states routinely lie, and break the law. Corruption is rampant, and I for one do not trust them to have my best interest or safety in mind.

 

[cj]

I think it will be schedule 1 within 5 years. The snap back against the "opiate epidemic" is going to get it.

 

[Bagseed]

where I live (middle europe), hardly anybody knows it, in smartshops it's prohibitly expensive, and drug topics aren't very much a top media agenda. so I don't believe that it will become illegal here anytime soon.

 

[ForGreatScience]

For the sake of argument IF it ever becomes illegal, do you guys think that Kratom will become more available illegally and sold by more dealers who sell your average illegal drugs like weed, coke, heroin, ecstasy etc???

I could be wrong but I can't really picture it. I think if it becomes illegal I think there will be about as many kratom dealers as there are khat dealers.

 

[SKL]

When it becomes illegal it will be pretty unfortunate for the kratom heads, who will have to decide between going to "real" opiates or withdrawal. This had ought to be a worrisome thing for anyone who gets into exotic drugs obtained online or elsewhere, it's a precarious situation ... I feel particularly bad for people getting addicted to novel fentanyls and such.

 

[Burnt Offerings]

It seems like a REALLY bad idea to develop a serious addiction to anything you can't source locally...

(Of course developing an addiction to anything is a bad idea, but that sounds like an especially bad idea...)

 

[aerne210]

be prepared

well, totally be prepared, the use of kratom for certain medicinal recoveries is working well for addicts which obvi is causing a loss of profiting from drug addicts buying the generic/typical recovery drugs (suboxone, subutex, methadone, etc.) so when the loss becomes too big/noticeable for our government, that's when they step in with a ban. Which will, in turn, bring the addicts back to the doctor's office giving that money up for their products. Very very sad. I couldn't have quit opiates without it.

Where did you hear this and what kind of response have you heard of??

I have also heard a bit about this and it is on the DEAs list of substances of concern.

I REALLY REALLY....REALLY hope that it stays legal because I fucking love it.

I'd be very upset if it became illegal, especially because it's not like if it became illegal you could easily find a Kratom dealer like there are dealers for other drugs.


But honestly, even though some posters on here think it will be banned really soon I am optimistic that it quite likely won't be banned or even if it is eventually it will take a while.

I mean look at Salvia Divinorum: while it has been banned in Australia, over there they are drug Nazis who seem to ban EVERYTHING.

But in the U.S., man, I was probably amongst the first several hundred kids in the U.S. to order Salvia online and try it back in the late 90s around 98/99.

There was talk even then of it becoming illegal and now about 17 years later it's STILL legal and IMO I doubt it will be illegal anytime soon.

The difference though is that Big Pharma isn't going to like Kratom because it is a SAFE alternative to their pain meds.


Still...I'm not sure the stir is big enough.

Like...you said "kratom has become EXTREMELY popular" and I think you need to use that word more carefully because honestly, I don't think it has reached "extreme" levels of popularity at all yet.

People on forums like this may know about it but it's still pretty underground.

For example: I bet if you go to a number of different parties with college kids who are smoking weed and using E and other drugs and ask them if they have heard of Kratom I bet that only a small percentage will have heard of it and fewer will have used it.

The few people I know who smoke weed and use other drugs that I've told about Kratom had NEVER heard of it before and your average person, even your average DRUG user who doesn't go on lots of forums will give you a blank expression if you mention Kratom.


It's becoming MORE popular...but NO...it's not EXTREMELY popular yet.

Lets hope it doesn't become that popular soon cause I love Kratom and don't want it taken away...

 

[Mycophile]

It seems like a REALLY bad idea to develop a serious addiction to anything you can't source locally...

(Of course developing an addiction to anything is a bad idea, but that sounds like an especially bad idea...)

I'm not TRULY physically dependent (despite a couple days of mild WD here and there that was easily tolerable), I just love it.

I'm just going to keep my fingers crossed that it doesn't, or that if it does it takes a long time, and in the meantime enjoy it while it lasts.

 

[sekio]

I'm not TRULY physically dependent (despite a couple days of mild WD here and there that was easily tolerable)

Sorry, Myco, you're lying to yourself here... technically speaking if you have withdrawals upon discontnuation (esp. if they are aleviated with more opioids), then yeah, you are physically dependant. Just something to think about: opioid withdrawal/dependency doesn't mean you MUST be an immobilized, puking mess. There is a wide range of possible symptoms, but as long as you have some of them, you're dependent on opioids. Remind yourself often to keep your doses and frequency in check, give yourselves frequent tolerance breaks, and generally Keep It Real: it is way too easy for most people to find themelves justifying new spans of drug usage trying to get the last bit of dopamine out of the experience...

And to anyone worrying about kratom being on the DEA's Not-Illegal-Yet-But-We-Could-Make-It-Illegal-If-You-Guys-Would-Like list: it's been there for 5 years or more, so I hardly think they are goin gto make it illegal overnight. They have known about kratom for quite some time and I guess it's just too much of a hassle to police it like heroin for a drug used by a rather small segment of the population.