Mental Health Lithium first time user being scripted as add on to sodium valproate?

[Furry mouth]

hi, it's been a while since I posted. Things have been so so.
I'm BP1 with chronic pain from Ehlers Danlos syndrome, fibromyalgia and osteoarthritis.
Currently on for BP

Epilim 1400
Clonazepam
Benzodiazepam
Prozac

Then
Low dose Naltroxene (pain)
Ixprim (pain)
Nebilet (heart)

Shrink wants to put me on 200 increasing to 400mg of lithium. I've already stacked on a tonne of weight and feel resistant to my meds. Just wondering if anyone is on sodium valproate WITH lithium?

How do you find it?

Cheers
Fm8(

 

[herbavore]

I'm going to move this over to Mental Health as I think you might get more responses there.

 

[Furry mouth]

Thanks a mill

 

[paranoid android]

Well i have never been on Lithium before but i have been on Sodium Valproate before. Personally i never found it to work great at all so i ended up on Lamotrigine eventually instead. I don't actually know anyone who has been on both Sodium Valproate and Lithium at the same time but Lithium and Lamotrigine is a common combo for treating bipolar disorder. Lithium and Lamotrigine are the only 2 true mood stabilizers out there but Lithium helps mania more then depression while Lamictal helps the depression side of bipolar as well as the rapid cycling more then Lithium does.

I could see the Valproate and Lithium combo causing come stomach upset at first for sure as both Valproate and Lithium get a bad rep for it. You must also make sure that your doctor monitors the levels on both drugs very carefully which means regular blood tests. I was taking about 400mg's of Quetiapine with the 1000mg's of or so of Divalproex i was taking a day. As i found out it was the Seroquel that was helping my moods and not the Valproate when my doctor took me off the seroquel and i plunged into a awful mixed state as a result.

Depakote aka Epilem seems to either work really well for people or not at all as seemed to be the latter case for me. Thankfully i didn't get any nasty side effects from it. However it does work well for some people so if the Lithium and Divalproex combo works for you that's great just make sure your doctor keeps up to date with the blood work. Valproates are known for being hard on the liver where as Lithium is known for wrecking havoc on your kidneys so you will need blood tests for the drug levels of both drugs as well as to check liver and kidney function.

 

[Furry mouth]

Hi paranoid android,
Thanks so much for your reply.
I can't take Seroquel or lamictal, severe allergic reactions to both.
I have been on epilim for nearly 6 years and get bloodwork done regularly. My prob is that I don't rapid cycle but have mixed episodes for long periods of time and it's usually dysphoric and deep depression.
I'm expecting some tummy upset with lithium as I had at start of taking epilim and I know about the regular monitoring of blood for liver, kidneys and thyroid.

The other option my shrink offered was tegretol But ive read some bad side effects about it, but she changed her mind and said that lithium (if it works) is very good as an add on.

Thanks for your help.
Fm

 

[paranoid android]

I would recommend against Tegretol as it was possibly the harshest med i have ever been on. I was on it for about 2-3 weeks and got nothing but splitting headaches and puking even after i stopped taking the med.

 

[Smoky]

Hmm, Lithium is an older drug and needs to be monitored with blood work. He didn't offer a similar drug in the same class? Aside from the ones you are allergic to?
I'm allergic to Lamictal also.

 

[Furry mouth]

Smoky I'm allergic to most of the drugs I've been on over the last six years, anti-dep, anti-psychotics, etc. So far I'm getting usual listed side effects from lithium (which I can tolerate) and mood is improving slightly, although mania is still there. So far I don't seem to have the terrible swelling that I normally get when I increase Cymbalta dosage.

Paranoid Android Tegretol is prob only one I haven't been on and I think I mentioned to my shrink that there were lots of negative side effects that I had read up on and was not keen to go on it. It seems that my Cymbalta levels had fallen also this normally happens when I am under stress.

Thanks to you both for your help and advice much appreciated

Fm

 

[Smoky]

Absolutely!
Really glad to hear the swelling isn't happening so much and you are able to tolerate lithium well…

 

[Dresden]

I used to be bipolar and then I realized that depakote and lithium are essentially worthless in fighting manic depression, and lithium is actually worse than a sugar pill because it has bad side effects such as hand tremors and blunted emotions. No fun. Bipolar disorder, like ADD/ADHD, is a bullshit diagnosis anyway. I mean, who isn't ADD / bipolar a little bit. Jeesh.

 

[paranoid android]

I used to be bipolar and then I realized that depakote and lithium are essentially worthless in fighting manic depression, and lithium is actually worse than a sugar pill because it has bad side effects such as hand tremors and blunted emotions. No fun. Bipolar disorder, like ADD/ADHD, is a bullshit diagnosis anyway. I mean, who isn't ADD / bipolar a little bit. Jeesh.

Lithium and Valproate are far from sugar pills or worthless. They like Lamotrigine as well as anti-psychotics help people who have bipolar disorder cope with the hell that is that illness. If you think you didn't have it then maybe you didn't but that does not mean that Bipolar disorder or ADHD for that matter do not exist. That would be like me saying that since most of the anti-depressants except Wellbutrin and a few tricyclics don't help me and have a blunting effect that depression does not exist. Every medication effects everyone differently and Divalproex aka Epival aka depakote aka just another Valproate is no different. It didn't help me but i didn't get any negative side effects from it either. I never got any emotional blunting from it but then again i have never gotten any emotional blunting from Lamictal and Seroquel (the meds i am taking now for my bipolar disorder) or Zyprexa, Chlorpromazine aka Thorazine aka good ol Largactil, Prochlorperazine aka Stemetil aka Compazine or Methotrimeprazine aka Levomepromazine the latter of which is much the same as Thorazine except it's a weaker anti-psychotic and much more sedating. Most people would have to be held down in order to take say Thorazine but it helps the severe nausea and vomiting i get better then most drugs do and it also helps my Mania and mixed states with less side effects then many of the newer atypicals but try convincing a doctor of that

Also while everyone may have mood swings and may at times exhibit symptoms of ADHD that alone does not make either disease. When i was going through the worst years of my bipolar disorder i honestly thought i was going to kill myself and wanted to many times. Hell i even sat at the table with a loaded 12 gauge pump just drinking all night and thinking of reasons not to kill myself. Thankfully i did come up with a few reasons so i am still here today. On another occasion i came very close to hanging myself. Are you telling me those are normal mood swings? I think not

Sorry about the rant but i hate the whole Bipolar is a bullshit diagnosis or everyone has bipolar disorder argument because i think i don't have it or got misdiagnosed thing. I got misdiagnosed with Unipolar Major depressive disorder, anti-social personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder (the latter 2 was by a quack shrink who was nothing more then a useless pill pusher) but that does not mean they don't exist. Well Narcissistic personality disorder no longer exists in the DSM i don't think but that's another issue.

 

[Smoky]

Sometimes the side effects outweigh the benefits, sometimes the benefits can save someone's life. ime. I've been in both places, have had multiple diagnosis, and thinking of ways to kill myself in the past.
I didn't know npd was not in the current dsm any longer. interesting. i wonder if there are still 11 categories (pds), with specific cluster types.

 

[chantarr]

if ur worried about weight u could try wellbutrin. thats what the doc wanted to give me when i was woried about weight issues

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

Lithium and Valproate are far from sugar pills or worthless. They like Lamotrigine as well as anti-psychotics help people who have bipolar disorder cope with the hell that is that illness. If you think you didn't have it then maybe you didn't but that does not mean that Bipolar disorder or ADHD for that matter do not exist. That would be like me saying that since most of the anti-depressants except Wellbutrin and a few tricyclics don't help me and have a blunting effect that depression does not exist. Every medication effects everyone differently and Divalproex aka Epival aka depakote aka just another Valproate is no different. It didn't help me but i didn't get any negative side effects from it either. I never got any emotional blunting from it but then again i have never gotten any emotional blunting from Lamictal and Seroquel (the meds i am taking now for my bipolar disorder) or Zyprexa, Chlorpromazine aka Thorazine aka good ol Largactil, Prochlorperazine aka Stemetil aka Compazine or Methotrimeprazine aka Levomepromazine the latter of which is much the same as Thorazine except it's a weaker anti-psychotic and much more sedating. Most people would have to be held down in order to take say Thorazine but it helps the severe nausea and vomiting i get better then most drugs do and it also helps my Mania and mixed states with less side effects then many of the newer atypicals but try convincing a doctor of that

Also while everyone may have mood swings and may at times exhibit symptoms of ADHD that alone does not make either disease. When i was going through the worst years of my bipolar disorder i honestly thought i was going to kill myself and wanted to many times. Hell i even sat at the table with a loaded 12 gauge pump just drinking all night and thinking of reasons not to kill myself. Thankfully i did come up with a few reasons so i am still here today. On another occasion i came very close to hanging myself. Are you telling me those are normal mood swings? I think not

Sorry about the rant but i hate the whole Bipolar is a bullshit diagnosis or everyone has bipolar disorder argument because i think i don't have it or got misdiagnosed thing. I got misdiagnosed with Unipolar Major depressive disorder, anti-social personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder (the latter 2 was by a quack shrink who was nothing more then a useless pill pusher) but that does not mean they don't exist. Well Narcissistic personality disorder no longer exists in the DSM i don't think but that's another issue.

Glad you're still here!

Lithium is old and blood work eneds to be regularly done, but in my estimate and from personal experience it works really well as an anti-manic and anti-depressant agent. I had to get off it because of short-term memory loss though. And it can, can, destroy some organs in some individuals. I know that sounds very bad, but this doesn't happen regularly. And 400mg is not a large dose by my estimate. I was on 1800mg. Lamictal didn't work for me. Depakote made me really depressed. Wellbutrin is a good anti-manic imo but it lead to a weird stimulating feeling that I didn't get with classic stimulants. It also made me flat. But it worked for the good two or so years I was on it; when I got off it, then tried it again, it didn't work, and reduced my cognition.

 

[Furry mouth]

Paranoid Android, I agree it's great that you are here and you are such a great help to me personally and others. I'm glad that the drugs have helped you out. I'm glad you didn't go through with your plans. Then you wouldn't be here for the people that love you.
A friend shot herself in the face with a rifle. She BP and blind. She regrets that she didn't know more about the mixed episode she was experiencing.

Dresden you are entitled to your opinion and I have absolutely no intention of trying to change your mind.

Smoky, thanks for the good wishes. It's been so long I forget how to "quote" people. I am very happy that you are here with us.

Ho-Chi-min I am feeling really good (fingers crossed) on the 400mg. Tk heavens.

Chantarr, lol sorry no intention of being dismissive but Wellbutron was hell to take. Made me super hyper agitated so I had to stop taking it. Thanks anyway for suggestion, it all helps doesn't it?!!

 

[Furry mouth]

Well i have never been on Lithium before but i have been on Sodium Valproate before.

I could see the Valproate and Lithium combo causing come stomach upset at first for sure as both Valproate and Lithium get a bad rep for it.

Oops I found the quotation function again. Paranoid Android, the nausea is there alright but I think that being on the Sodium Valproate for so long has lessened the intensity of it which is good. I just feel so different than I did a month ago. Yep the down sides of the drugs can be horrendous but rather that than being miserable and alive or worse still, dead!!
Xxx
FM

 

[paranoid android]

Paranoid Android, I agree it's great that you are here and you are such a great help to me personally and others. I'm glad that the drugs have helped you out. I'm glad you didn't go through with your plans. Then you wouldn't be here for the people that love you.
A friend shot herself in the face with a rifle. She BP and blind. She regrets that she didn't know more about the mixed episode she was experiencing.

Dresden you are entitled to your opinion and I have absolutely no intention of trying to change your mind.

Smoky, thanks for the good wishes. It's been so long I forget how to "quote" people. I am very happy that you are here with us.

Ho-Chi-min I am feeling really good (fingers crossed) on the 400mg. Tk heavens.

Chantarr, lol sorry no intention of being dismissive but Wellbutron was hell to take. Made me super hyper agitated so I had to stop taking it. Thanks anyway for suggestion, it all helps doesn't it?!!

Jesus christ man i am sorry about your friend . Did they survive because if they did that would either be a miracle or a curse depending on the damage done but fuck i know way too many people who have gone out that way. Surviving a gun shot wound to the head is either due to blind luck or a low caliber that is more likely to fuck you up then kill you or both.

Recently my moms cousin who i didn't know at all and haven't seen in a good 15 years (he's been in Western Australia for ages i think) who had been drinking with his friends all night came home and shot himself in the same house his mom and sister where in. His mom heard the shot naturally and came running and tried to hold up his head to see if he was still alive in guess and his head fell apart in her hands. I can't imagine what his poor mom must be going through but i really hope she is getting counseling because that would fuck anyone up. Never mind that it was her own sons brains that fell apart in her hands! He had alot of guns and knew alot about them so i guess he grabbed 1 that would get the job done right. Still what a selfish cunt to do that in his moms house with her home! There are plenty of wooded areas where that prick lived so why not go up in the woods and let the cops find you? Jesus christ i mean i feel more sad for his mom and pissed off at him at this point then anything else.

I can honestly say that at this point in my life i am glad i am here despite the bullshit. Things are never as fucked as they seem and one thing i have learned is that your life can change for the better (and sometimes worse) in a instant. We put off everything else in our lives so why not death? Granted with this weird chest cold i have had lately mother nature seems intent on doing the job for me

 

[Furry mouth]

Did they survive?

Yes she survived. She is ok. However she is starting to make a life for herself and has a guide dog and is running in marathons which is really good for her.

I'm so sorry to hear about your cousin. What a truly dreadful thing to happen to his mum. There are no words.

After a great start to lithium im feeling like shite. Probably drinking last week didn't help. I'm doing nothing but chewing heads off people and sleeping. Sweet Jesus I hope it doesn't last.
?

 

[paranoid android]

^ Don't drink on Lithium! Lithium pretty much bypasses the liver altogether and goes straight to the kidneys hence why it can cause kidney damage if you don't keep up with the blood tests. Alcohol also is bad for the kidneys and dehydrates you and you need to drink alot more water then normal on Lithium anyway. Not to mention Lithium can lower the seizure threshold and alcohol does this as well when it's leaving your body. This combined with the fact that alcohol is one of the worst drugs to take if you are mentally ill makes this combo a bad idea. I feel like utter shit for a good few days atleast even after a moderate drinking session now so i hardly bother these days.

I am glad your friend is doing better. Thank fuck she seems to be making a go at life now so i wish her all the best.

 

[Furry mouth]

Thanks Paranoid Android. Will heed your warning. ?