My friend Jakob tested 5F-AMB last night. He's had a few years daily use of 5F-AKB48, 5F-PB22. He's also tried AB-CHMINACA and MMB-CHMINACA.
His rationale for testing 5F-AMB was to find out if it produced as much side-effects as 5F-AKB48 at equivalent doses.
It could be reasonably said that 1mg 5F-AMB = 10mg 5F-AKB48.
Theory is that the Fluorine atom might be causing toxic symptoms and even cumulative toxicity.
Since both these products have only one Fluorine atom attached to identical local structure, the logic is that ten times more potency will enable ten times lower doses meaning ten times less Fluorine atoms.
Yet, the arrangements of this Universe are cruel.
Despite using less than 1/10 the amount of 5F-AKB48, here are the succinct points of Jakob's report to me this morning:
0. The use was after 11:00P outside in the dark cool air.
1. The dose: a few nearly invisible grains were stirred onto the surface of some tobacco. Normal dose of 5F-AKB48 would be about 15mg. This was no more than 1mg.
2. The effect comes on fast but not overwhelmingly so. A bit slower than 5F-AKB48 and much faster than AB-FUBINACA.
3. The duration was shorter than 5F-AKB48 but longer than the 5-minute reports elsewhere on other forums.
4. The head-high is 'cleaner' and much stronger than 5F-AKB48, yet at the small dose tested it actually resembles 5F-AKB48 quite a bit. The quality factor is very high - higher than AB-FUBINACA. Far higher.
5. It seemed easy on the lungs during use (illusion).
6. The next morning, it was found that even though the weight dose was only 1/10 the usual amount of 5F-AKB48 to achieve slightly stronger effect, despite this much smaller consumption poor Jakob's lungs were nearly destroyed. Even after a day of nebulizing 3% H2O2 and taking exercise, it is now evening and my friend reports by messenger that his lungs are still in awful shape.
7. During the next day, the faint yet constant toxic stink on sweat was noticeable. It's a similar but less offensive odor as that left by pyrolized 5F-AKB48. It's now 9:34P and Jakob is reporting via messenger that he can still smell the stink on his sweat.
8. Jakob has a weak immune system and mild yet chronic Candida (yeast) infection - oral and intestinal. Up until now, older cannabinoids such as 5F-AKB48 used the previous night left an obviously thicker-coated white tongue in the morning due to yeast overgrowth. Yet that increased growth from night-before use of those old cannabinoids was mild. The morning after 5F-AMB, Jakob was shocked that his tongue had grown a thick white forest - never seen before at such a level of overgrowth.
From his experiences I must conclude that 5F-AMB is more than 10x as pulmotoxic as 5F-AKB48, yet it is only 10x more potent. Despite his history of 'noid use - even Fluorinated ones - my friend is shocked to report that pyrolized 5F-AMB reaches an exponentially higher level of destructiveness in the lungs than anything else. Its increased potency cannot begin to compensate. Yet it is peculiar because it reminds me that in the case of so many androgens - methylated especially - toxicity seems to rise not as a result of structural vagaries in the molecules but seems directly proportional to potency.
Further, 5F-AMB's pyrolysis products smell nearly as bad as 5F-AKB48's and leave a similar toxic feeling for at least 24 hours after a single dose.
It seems that replacement of Adamantanyl group didn't help. It is now obvious the toxicity comes from the Fluoropentyl group (pyrolysis).
Tonight my friend will do 'safer' testing of 5F-AMB: gently evaporated in a crack-pipe using a low-temperature regular yellow-flame Bic lighter.
If even that is too problematic he will buy a replacement nebulizer for his failed unit and test 5F-AMB dissolved in DMSO and nebulized - which he reported worked well with 5F-AKB48 in testing last week.
The case of 5F-AMB as super-replacement for the older, less-potent 5F-AKB48 reminds me of another case - this one in the steroid black-market: the introduction of Metribolone (Methyltrienolone, methyltrenbolone) as a hyperpotent (microgram to single milligram doses) replacement for Trenbolone. A good dose of Trenbolone is 100mg/day, and a good dose of Metribolone is 0.5mg - 1.0mg/day.
Yet even at 100x the potency and thus 1/100 the dose, at the equivalent effect Metribolone is still Hellishly more liver-toxic than Trenbolone or even methylated Dianabol.
So much more toxic that nobody can keep taking it regularly.
Trends like these do not bode well for the advancement of biochemical science.
The liver damage caused by strong steroids - methylateds in particular - is caused by them triggering excessive cell growth which causes bile duct occulsion, enzyme elevations, etc. No matter how the molcules are restructured, their anabolic potency correlates with this 'toxicity'. In this case, it is androgen-receptor-mediated-toxicity, so the both the wanted and unwanted effects are tied together.
Now it is time to talk about a new kind of toxicity: Hybrid Toxicity. I'm not talking about all the evils done to receptors and the symptoms of agonism and withdrawal produced by such strong drugs. I am also not talking about the non-receptor 'systemic' toxicity of these cannabinoids. It's the worst nightmare when just like steroids, the desired actions & effects (receptor agonism or other activities) cause a multiplicative increase in non-receptor (systemic) toxicity and vice-versa.
In addition, like the heavy metals it seems these 5F cannabinoids cause Cumulative Toxicity. It means that just like nuclear radiation, the victim won't necessarily notice toxicity in the first few doses or even hundred. But that after a limit is passed, toxic symptoms will get worse with each dose. That limit depends on the individual's genetics, diet, health and previous exposures. No matter how much time is left between doses - even years - for the body to recover. Jakob can't use 5F-AKB48 any more - now just one or a few once-a-day doses produce a level of toxic symptoms that last for days and whose magnitude equals the worst at the end of a long, heavy run.
Even just one dose does that now, no matter how long it has been since the last. Days or months.
Unfortunately, the 5F cannabinoids can cause all six toxicities:
1. Receptor Toxicity due to overdose/withdrawal; not dependent on Fluorination but Fluorination increases potency enough to make it much more likely. Receptors mostly recover after a few weeks of abstinence.
2. Systemic Toxicity due to non-target receptor [CB1 & CB2] interactions. 5F-UR144 shows this unreliably in the kidneys, yet UR-144 does not. Yet the tetramethylcyclopropane group is blamed despite the fact that UR-144 has it too. Maybe someone can find the plain UR-144 kidney-tox cases that I can't.
2.1 Pyrolytic Toxicity caused by the burning of these fluoronoids and affects the lungs worst. They are converted into many toxic chemicals when burned including Hydrofluoric Acid, Perfluoroisobutene and Fluorophosgene. These are chemical weapons - some worse than used in WWII. Many SCs have evaporation temperatures in air that are higher than their thermal decomp / pyrolytic temps.
2.2 Nonpyrolytic Toxicity caused by the unmangled drug. Even without pyrolytic degradation, some cannabinoids are systemically toxic.
3. Cumulative Toxicity caused by the total amount of drug consumed over any period of time. Nearly irreversible and becomes more irreversible with each dose. It's the increasing damages that can't be fixed, so they build up.
4. Hybrid Toxicity caused by the additive/multiplicative toxicity when two or more simple toxicities are affecting the body simultaneously. The results of Hybrid Toxicity are larger than the sum of all the concurrently-present simple toxicities.
5F Cannabinoids cause all six types of toxicity when smoked. When taken via some other route not involving degradation, receptor-tox can be expected at the least.
The unanswered question so far: if taken without degradation, do the 5F cannabinoids cause cumulative or hybrid toxicity?
Do not be fooled by forum reports from folks who claim to have used 5F or Fluorobenzyl cannabinoids all day every day for years with nothing but mostly-reversible receptor maladaptations to show for it at the end. Even individuals with pre-existing low-level sicknesses or weak constitutions can use 5Fs for a while without suffering the obvious cumulative symptoms because the immediate toxicity is low. It's what happens after the limit is passed where it gets ugly. No matter how healthy or sick the user was before starting, when the threshold limit is passed then toxic symptoms will worsen quickly after that.
As these toxicities accumulate, those who previously thought the 5Fs were mostly or completely 'OK' because they could use them often will change their tune. The peculiar thing is that despite the low acute toxicity - excepting CB-receptor effects - the long-term cumulative pyrolytic toxicity is horrendous. Even non-pyrolytic toxicities might become a problem with time but that needs testing.
Thanks to DuPont's Teflon cookware and the many animal and human tests, we know that fluorocarbon pyrolysis yields a vast array of toxic products. We also know that the toxicity of these Fluorocarbon thermal decomposition products is highly cumulative: "The cumulative effect of repeated exposures is much more toxic than a single equivalent exposure.". The first page of Google is full of hits. Of all the organs affected by these pyrolytic Fluorocarbon products, the lungs are destroyed quickest of all.
The World awaits a high-CB1 activator without the use of halogens in the molecule. ADAMANTYL-THPINACA is one of a few potentials.
Meanwhile, a vast number of people are adding cumulative Fluorotox doses to their totals.
Just like nuclear radiation: glowing with REMs, Sieverts, Grays which incidentally cause over 90% of tobacco-related cancers - mostly due to accumulated Polonium-210 and its beta rays in the lungs.
Once your badge turns black you're outta the plant - cumulative exposure.
One of 5F-AKB48's aliases is Fukushima and after the disaster at that plant, workers could only spend short times in the building due to cumulative radtox.