Is shutting down conversation really in the interest of harm minimisation?

[neka]

I asked a series of questions here about something I've seen MDMA users do recently because it didn't sit very well and I was interested in whether that feeling was justified or not and was quite interested if there was a better option if they were going to go ahead and do it anyway.

I may not have posed the question well, and maybe it was too descriptive. I was keen to make my questions clear.

Several people responded negatively, fair enough, my instinct says it may not be the best practise..

But I am curious. How is it not ok to ask what effect breathing techniques might have while on drugs but it is ok to ask what quantity of heroin to use for the first time?

The question I was asking was about something that's potentially harmful, possibly not. I guessed it may decrease oxygen flow to the brain to hyperventilate, but I don't know that, hence asking. We all know that deciding to start taking heroin is not a good idea either. People do things, whether safe or not. That's the whole point of harm minimization discussion is it not? To hash out the why's and make educated decisions.

I'm just genuinely confused why my thread was closed without any opportunity for discussion about WHY it's not ok to breath deeply or hyperventilate yet other threads remain, even though they also discuss the how's and why's of dangerous practices that people make an informed choice to engage in.

I'm completely open to being advised not to do something. I just prefer to know why rather than the standard, "because it's bad, m'kay?"

(For those who asked in the last thread and will probably ask again. I used to be a member and post almost a decade ago and my post history obviously doesn't show anymore. I've long since moved last my drug taking days and have recently had a family member tell me about this practice I was concerned about).

 

[Mysterie]

i guess it could be like having a discussion about weighing the pros and cons of plugging vodka or shooting pills without a filter, because there is a clear cut answer, which is that its unhealthy

im guessing your referring to deep breathing or something where you hold your breath in for 10 seconds and breath in and out slowly

i just would be skeptical that people who think its a good idea to do that on drugs, would know how to practice the technique properly, or do it on a regular enough basis for their lungs to have good oxygen capacity. i could just imagine people blacking out and turning blue trying something like that on mdma, it puts the heart on enough strain without restricting your body of oxygen

 

[neka]

Thanks, I appreciate your thoughtful input.

Do we have a set stance on taking nos while on MDMA these days? That was pretty commonplace 10yrs back. I'd imagine the techniques I was talking about would be pretty similar in stress factor on the body. They both involve an irregular breathing pattern with a view to achieve a similar outcome. I'm hesitant to post details again as I suspect that's why the last thread was shut down.

 

[painenduser]

You could also the moderator who shut you down to please explain the reasoning for closing your post. I would have to assume that for some reason your post had violated the code of conduct or gulidelines for that forum, or the site.

http://www.bluelight.org/vb/showthread.php?t=441015 <-- Forum Guidelines.

I am not a moderator and I do not know of which post you are speaking about, but usually the moderators are really good at allowing any post as long as it does not violate one of those, of course that can be subject to interpretation of your post since the Guidelines are pretty cut and dry. The moderators here as do mostly everyone take Harm Reduction very seriously and if the moderator felt that your post crossed the line, they should not have any issues with explaining to you why they felt yours crossed that line. They are good people and just trying to keep this place as one of the best if not the best Harm Reduction site on the net and everyone here is passionate about that. I am sure that they would be kind enough to help you understand why.

I hope that I understood your question and if so, I hope you find the answer your looking for! Wish I could help more..

 

[The Doc.]

Well the question wasn't harm reduction and you had it in a HR section of the site.
It was also by the sounds of it very dangerous I don't know why somebody who is high on MDMA(a stimulant) would want to intentionally hyperventilate then get the life squeezed out of them by somebody in order to pass out. Harm reduction is about reducing harm and frankly I would be worried about someone who decided hey that sounds like a good idea I'm going to cut off my breathing to fall asleep cause I'm strung out on stims! You may be on to something but I don't think people strung out on drugs are the best ones to be doing risky breathing activities like this to each other mabye if a medical professional was there to guide them/revive them if they cut off oxygen to the brain.

Bluelight isn't trying to screw with you or make you look like an idiot I'm sure your intention was good but still if someone did this and something happened to them Bluelight could run into legal trouble for promoting a dangerous breathing technique.

 

[Jagdfeld]

But I am curious. How is it not ok to ask what effect breathing techniques might have while on drugs but it is ok to ask what quantity of heroin to use for the first time?

The question I was asking was about something that's potentially harmful, possibly not. I guessed it may decrease oxygen flow to the brain to hyperventilate, but I don't know that, hence asking. We all know that deciding to start taking heroin is not a good idea either. People do things, whether safe or not. That's the whole point of harm minimization discussion is it not? To hash out the why's and make educated decisions.

Recreational heroin use, while carrying its own hazards, is relatively benign compared to forcibly cutting off air flow to the brain, causing someone to pass out. You could kill someone participating in such an activity on something like MDMA, but you could especially damage your brain in a way heroin could never do.

HR sites like this exist because it acknowledges things like heroin and other drugs will be apart of society no matter what is done, and the aim is to assist those who choose to participate in this subculture with as much practical and applicable advice as possible so as to ensure the safest possible administration of whatever substance is being discussed. The implicit understanding behind the advice given is that the substance being discussed can be used safely. If someone made a thread asking about how to dose PMMA safely, universally everyone would condemn the usage and warn the poster, perhaps dismissively, about the well known dangers, and a mod would close the thread as there is no safe way to consume something like that.

Similarly, there is no safe way to force hyperventilation and causing someone to pass out. It's nothing personal.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

I don't consider air to be a drug, so this question isn't suited for BDD. If you have a problem, PM someone on staff, don't make a thread like this in Basic.