I think that, getting away from advanced discussion here a bit, that we could honestly improve society by having a wider selection of stimulants for those who use them responsibly. Of course with more available there'll be more of a chance that we can idealize treatment. I'm sure at least some people would respond better to fenethylline than dextroamphetamine or dextromethamphetamine. I guess there just isn't enough formal research to know if its toxic though, but if those are the only two active metabolites I think the chance that its more toxic than methamphetamine is little to nill, but you're right, we don't know.
If there was a wider selection of stimulants available it would at least lead to more of a balance of power within the pharmaceutical industry. At best it could actually move thought itself into new directions, as the drugs have subtle distinctions in action for the most part. But when it comes to pro-drugs for amp I see a problem with just having one - monopoly. Looking at the list of most lucrative medications in the DITM section of bluelight I find vyvanse to be among the top fifty. I doubt it would cost nearly as much if clobenzorex was approved in many countries. Now I'm not necessarily for something like amfecloral, which splits into amp and chloral hydrate - the latter of which would just counter-act the improving-qualities of amp - but I think this is clear evidence that sometimes in big business the interests of the people get subverted by monetary incentive.
I'm also thinking about dextro- or racemic selegiline. It of course would have abuse potential but seems like a prominent candidate in substitution for people on a maoi and stimulant. The same goes for fenethylline when it comes to those who ingest caffeine with amp. Amfecloral might have use for people with terminal illnesses; might as well make them happy. I guess in some severe cases of whatever it could be useful. I guess I just overall don't see the point of making something schedule one just because pharmaceutical companies haven't developed them yet.
Also, though I appreciate government making substances which are blatant neurotoxins (at least in most cases) illegal, its not like people would be forced to ingest those substances if there were legal alternatives more readily available.
I know its more cost-efficient to manufacture adderall, vyvanse, dexedrine, and desoxyn instead of adding in ten more psychostimulants but is it really more cost-effective overall, as in after ten years will people just have put out a bunch of standardized thought or is there no real differential effect on quality and creativity of thought based on which stimulant (psychologically useful ones, not cocaine etc.) is used?
I think the practices of industry aren't horrible at the moment. I think that being more liberal when it comes to prescribing psychostimulants so long as there's no evidence of abuse and the person is using it to work, not masturbate and play video games and generally waste time is more beneficial than not; that is, so long as the dose is below that which causes known toxicity. I don't condone using it for anything but productivity, and these kind of habits keep one from increasing their dose and/or becoming addicted. I know in some countries use is severely limited; that's lead to a lot of illegal manufacture. It's a lot easier to ingest 200mg amp when you get .5g of power than if you get a prescription bottle of 20mg adderall. Not to mention the detrimental effects of all the fillers.
Benzphetamine and diethylpropion also come to mind, and perhaps phentermine. They aren't completely illegal and aren't schedule II substances as amp/meth are, and are used for weight management. Why not at least see if they're appropriate for adhd/narcolepsy/treatment-resistant depression? Bupropion, diethylpropions close cousin, is the closest thing to a "true" dopaminergic agent that's prescribed for depression. I've heard conflicting reports about is MOA, all agreeing that it is an NDRI, but one report I read said it decreases dopamine release while another stated that it pushes da out of the vesicle and into the synapse. It's also a nicotinic acetylcholline antagonist which definitely isn't good for cognition. Some find it good for attention, others don't. I didn't. In my case only a stim works. But why just one dopaminergic agent licensed for depression - notwithstanding moais and others such as venlafaxine which have weak dopaminergic effects at high doses?
I can't imagine giving up my cognition to chase a caustic high for five years.
As a caffeine addict I can honestly say that taking other xanthines has lead to an effect which felt as if I'd taken a few days off the coffee.
Benzphetamine was legal until not so long ago, Elvis dying on the toilet because he was taking too much Dilaudid and Demerol (along Benzphetamine and Dexedrine) kind of made the thing fade away, he died trying to crap, from all the opiates, I mean, god, it's when they used to make Dilaudid dosed higher than 8mg, I think the next step was 12 or 16?, I know I saw one of his prescription from a doctor which is legit circa 1975;is the truth..sorry for the loonies who think the "King" is alive...those who first said that said it as a way of saying, his music is still alive, so he's still alive, you know, like Kurt Cobain, who nevermind being a millionaire after forming a small band in a northern pacific redneck town 2 albums in only, and even richer with his band's third (and best by far) album, when the first PPI was invented, his started using a lot less, when Prilosec (we call it Losec here, but its so old, its rarely prescribed even in generic form here, most common PPI people get here as a generic is Pantoprazole (called Pantoloc in Canada, not sure about the US), then Nexium. As for myself I find Pantoprazole totally useless and once the pharmacist or the technician made an error on my first PPI script, which was Pantoprazole, of course, and there was Omeprazole in it, I called them to say, hmm, I got 30 purple and grey gelcaps that say omeprazole on them, and they said oh sorry it's an error, you can bring them back, but after trying it, I was like finally something that works, so I got Nexium prescribed and now Dexilant a little after generic Nexium showed up, I wanted to try the new kid on the block and my insurance paid for it...) Ahem, anyway, the guy was a millionaire, he could have had a doctor prescribe him mountains of oxycodone, morphine, whatever yet he was still staying in shitty hotels and using tar ffs smoking mostly (if you know enough about him, when his stomach problems were gone, he still had the scoliosis back pain, hence his stance when playing guitar where he was a bit of a hunchback). but he would still IV from time to time...I'm from eastern Canada, we barely get heroin at all here, and when its here, its so expensive, finding someone who sells brand name Dilaudid 4's or 8's to shoot up would be a lot more useful if you want something to shoot up, even HydromorphContins once processed, but the though of IV'ing tar is so disgusting to me, I know what it looks like thanks to places like here or similar, I'd smoke it like I'd smoke hash oil, but that'd be the end of it for me.
As for diethylproprion I never heard of it, I don't know if we ever had that in Canada, but as of now, we do not even have Xenecal anymore, all weight loss drugs are removed, we used to have Phentermine still not long ago, but it's gone, although it might reappear, there's this strange drug called Topamax that's got a multitude of approved uses, and it indeed made someone I know lose a lot of weight, fast, so they use that now sometimes, Health Canada is studying a Topamax/Phentermine combination pill that some giant pharma company is trying to push through, it would make Topiramate and phentermine bring them money again, I know 3 people who have taken Topamax, one for a prophylaxis for migraines and she said it helped (it's also her who lost what made her chubby to totally slim), 2 others were for seizures. It's got strange side effects, all 3 told me it made sodas taste awful, the regular ones with sugar, may it be cane sugar or the shit known as high fructose corn syrup.
I necro'd this to say, I don't think it's always bad to use amps in a recreational way, think of how it improved the performance of metal and punk bands in the 80's and early 90's, there's this show from Pantera in 1990 in Moscow where I mean, I see bands that exist since the 80's and not many have that stage charisma and energy they used to have, and a lot of it was because they were pumped on stimulants and alcohol at the same time. Even straight edge bands loved to see not-so straight edge bands like Bad Religion in the late 80's, of course they were friends with a ton of other bands, west or east coast, didn't matter, but Dr. Greg Graffin (vocals, songwriting) always was around to shoot their friends their dose of speed (amps not meth, apparently it was common in California to have powder d-amp or maybe racemic like they get in the UK) because of all the energy and knowing how to pump up a crowd was so easy in that 250 max occupancy showbar...well okay, show bar or a club,whatever, if you insist Firefox, I think it's an actual word.
Although I'd hate UK's street amps being 50-50. I already hate Adderal and it only comes as XR up here, because of the 23% levo-amphetamine that made my heart beat way way too fast and I had a script for the 25mg XR, I can't imagine what a 25mg IR does, let alone the 30mg XR...but that dose, 30mg XR a girl who was in the scene (punk/hardcore/metal scene) who partied a lot with me and our little group then, she was a bit of a dingbat, had only 6-7th grade education, I meet 4 years ago and she's on Adderal XR 30mg and she went through grade 7,8,9,10 french,math, english in under 2 years, I was surprised, she also had less of those stare at nothing stares she would have sometimes (she snorted a lot of PCP, it took a while for her to lose the side effects from that). So yeah, if it agrees with one's body, it does, for me, I had to change to Dexedrine, 2x10mg spansules in the morning, 2x5mg IR (too bad the yellow 10mg IR's do not exist anymore) and it was brand name Dexedrine, no generic company makes the stuff here, which I hear is good, on a forum with similar colours as here for people with ADD/ADHD and all its subdivisions, (I was clearly and likely am in need of Desoxyn but they don't allow it here, Canada's laws on amphetamines are really harsh, I lost my very last Dexedrine script because the renewing date was past a week or so so it was more than a year (and here scripts are good for a year, nevermind if you still have refills), told the technicians I'd call when an actual pharmacist was there(I didn't argue much because I was already stocking up on all my scripts since I'm done with college, my doctor renewed without even thinking for 12 months for 2 other years after that, so I got a lot in a stash leftover...don't PM me for any, LEO's, by the way),but they seemed to have fun telling me I could not renew my bad highly scheduled medicine. Well it's more like Health Canada changed the guidelines and any amphetamine related drug, generic or not (we do have generic adderal as "Mix of Amphetamine Salts", you can't have a script for a year anymore, you got to go see your doctor every 3 months now, same as they did with opiates in most cases where only 1 refill is possible with all opiates, exceptions are chronic pain patients, but they already go to the pain clinic every few month..so anyway coming back to amps, it seems that when I would "abuse" street meth pills like we have here, no crystal meth here, there's some out-west and a bit in Ontario I hear but that's it, I would usually eat a quarter of an illicit pill I knew had safe ingredients, solely d-meth, but I had to put a stop to that when my guy was always changing prints and when a certain batch seemed like it contained PMMA and almost killed me, I never touched stimulants again, and likely never will, the comedown is so harsh to me that even 1mg triazolam from just 20mg worth of 10mg spansules barely gets me rid of the extreme depression (which is why I stopped using it, even in my last year of my BSc., I started using it only to study long hours, not take it everyday. I think Dexedrine makes Vyvanse a superfluous medication even if it gets to 70mg, people into stimulants here drool a lot more for Biphentins 80mg (gelcaps with beads in them that contain MPH), these are Canada only I think, Concerta is not very popular here because Bipĥentin showed up a lot before. We don't have dex-mph (Focalin?) though...I had a ritalin and mortared & pestled Biphentin snorter turn down free 25 10mg Dexedrine Spansules. I'm not sure if he even knew legal speed existed, to most people that stops with Ritalin/Biphentin/Concerta, because they will try that first.
I was "lucky", Ritalin 10mg bid gave me seizures and a bout of psychosis, the only time in my life I felt like I was losing it, and I've dosed 300 times LSD in my life minimum, so the next thing in line was Dexedrine and I kept with that for 5 years more or less.
Although boy did they help make everything in life easier before my body became sick of stimulants, I already can't handle coffee. As for asthma, yeah, there is pills for asthma, they have theophyline in them and they work, I took them as a kid, didn't have a daily inhaler, just a rescue bronchodilatator, theophyline helped my baseball skills a lot I got to say ¬_¬
It's funny though how Gaddafi was right when he said the "rebels", the ones who were being given Captagon by the Qataris mostly, not a lot of indigenous Lybians wanted to revolt, they only started to go against their own interest when out of their minds on these. The media laughed at Gaddafi's assertions but he was completely right, I'm sure his country was completely drug free (as in, illicit ones) and if there was a spark of use of something, he would have known. Gaddafi was a false-boogeyman who did everything to please the US, which worked for a while, but Hitlery even put American lives in danger for those who had started businesses in Lybia. Just listen to a podcast by the Moriarty couple, this one is particularly good :
James and Joanne Moriarty : Lybia
Sorry to necro, but I just learned of Captagon from an interview that followed this one. Also the interviewer is a P.I./Digital Forensics Investigator, even if he thinks some of the people he talks to are claiming bullshit, he'll let em say it and it on record to haunt them forever if they lied. He's not some aggressive podcaster type of guy who would go "Wouldn't you think people would say you are domestic terrorists for trying to build a business that would profit Gaddafi even indirectly?" "I'm just asking questions here"
Can't say I blame you. Maybe the schedule 1 has something to do with the toxicity of theophylline? There was a big push to have it banned outright in the '90s.
