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Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine Mega Thread and FAQ v16.0

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Just got my subutex... seems to be the Roxane brand white ones.

I took half and am feeling alright! I don't know if it is placebo effect or not but this feels a lot cleaner then suboxone... kind of hard to explain.

I am not sure yet as I've dosed like 30-45 minutes ago but I'll be trying my best to compare this feeling to suboxone
 
God, I miss 'tex! (We only have access to 'xone in the UK. I personally felt subutex to be superior, and I've no idea why. The effects of suboxone just don't give me that feel good, energetic, and almost euphoric buzz I'd get from suboxone; with 'xone, I feel lethargic and dull. I'm not sick, but I'm sure as hell not enjoying myself. Does anyone know why this could be? Could it be that the naloxone is having an adverse effect on the bupe, somehow?

The crazy thing is that 'xone is significantly more expensive than subutex, for a drug I personally find inferior. I admit, I did use to inject subutex, but I'm past that for good; I strictly use my meds following directions now. If I had subutex again, I sure as hell wouldn't "abuse it".
 
Just got my subutex... seems to be the Roxane brand white ones.

I took half and am feeling alright! I don't know if it is placebo effect or not but this feels a lot cleaner then suboxone... kind of hard to explain.

I am not sure yet as I've dosed like 30-45 minutes ago but I'll be trying my best to compare this feeling to suboxone

God, I miss 'tex! (We only have access to 'xone in the UK. I personally felt subutex to be superior, and I've no idea why. The effects of suboxone just don't give me that feel good, energetic, and almost euphoric buzz I'd get from suboxone; with 'xone, I feel lethargic and dull. I'm not sick, but I'm sure as hell not enjoying myself. Does anyone know why this could be? Could it be that the naloxone is having an adverse effect on the bupe, somehow?

The crazy thing is that 'xone is significantly more expensive than subutex, for a drug I personally find inferior. I admit, I did use to inject subutex, but I'm past that for good; I strictly use my meds following directions now. If I had subutex again, I sure as hell wouldn't "abuse it".

I honestly believe that subutex is both stronger and slightly more euphoric than suboxone. I know people will say its the same drug and the nalox is inert, but IME there is a difference. I get more headaches on suboxone and mg vs mg, tex seems more potent. I understand med knowledge doesn't back this up, but considering many of us feel the same way I tend to think there is truth here.

I said the same thing about it feeling more clean before as well. Tex seems to produce a more clear euphoric feeling + less side effects. (headaches, upset stomach, lack of appetite)

The only reasonable explanation would be that the naloxone is having an effect.(regardless of roa)
 
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I saw a new doctor today for my subs, and he tried pushing that zubsolv crap onto me, said that it is better than everything else and it has a better taste. Too bad it's only $600 a MONTH. I told him I did not want to be a guinea pig for any new buprenorphine products and that everytime I take the strips (or any formulation with naloxone) I break out in a horrible sweat and have bad hot flashes, as well as bad headaches all day after I dose. It took a little convincing, but I finally got him to prescribe me subutex. Thank god. I don't know why, but subutex works way better for me than suboxone. I actually feel something from subutex and it actually helps with my cravings and pain, even though I understand that the naloxone is not supposed to have any effect in theory, but I belive it does. The doctor told me that the naloxone blocks the euphoria associated with straight bupe. I know alot of you are going to say bullshit, but most of the people who would say that have never tried subutex. I thought the same thing until I tried it at rehab, it was in a whole different class than suboxone to me, plus it is way cheaper.
 
I honestly believe that subutex is both stronger and slightly more euphoric than suboxone. I know people will say its the same drug and the nalox is inert, but IME there is a difference. I get more headaches on suboxone and mg vs mg, tex seems more potent. I understand med knowledge doesn't back this up, but considering many of us feel the same way I tend to think there is truth here.

I said the same thing about it feeling more clean before as well. Tex seems to produce a more clear euphoric feeling + less side effects. (headaches, upset stomach, lack of appetite)

The only reasonable explanation would be that the naloxone is having an effect.(regardless of roa)

I completely agree. I thought the same until I first tried subutex in rehab a month ago, it does have actual euphoria and pain control, plus there are no headaces or hot flashes like with the suboxone.
 
First off I just wanted to say thank you for putting this thread together, and to everyone who has contributed to it. It's filled with a ton of useful information and has answered a bunch of questions I had.

Today is my 1st day being on Suboxone, I've been on all types of prescription painkillers for the last 5/6 years. I finally got up enough courage to go through with it and get off my 300mg a day Oxy habit. I was actually really scared to take my 1st dose of the Subs (fear of P/W), cause yesterday at around 1 pm I took the last of some Tussionex I had, just to get everything opiate related out of my house. Tussionex has a half life of about 4-16 hours roughly and my doctors appointment was at 11 am this morning. I was freaking out about going into P/W because of the long half life of the Tussionex. When I got home it was around 1 pm, so I was right at the 24 hour mark after taking anything. I was already starting to feel pretty shitty, but I waited another 3 hours (total of 27 hours) then dosed my 1st 2mg strip. After a half an hour pasted I started to feel slightly better (no P/W's), which made some of my anxiety go away. I took another 2mg strip 1 hour after the first strip, which has subsided all of the opiate W/D symptoms I was having. I actually feel relatively normal now, it's kind of weird after being in a total fog for so long.

Thanks again to everyone who has contributed to this forum.
 
^^^
Just wanted to say, congrats on your decision!! It is an amazing experience to get your mind free of the fog for a bit and realize things will be ok. I wish you the best of luck! And remember when it gets tough, and it will at times, stay strong and know you don't have to feel like shit alone! We have all been there or will be there again shortly.

As far as this Subutex debate is going.
We have all obviously heard that the naloxone in Suboxone has little to no affect on the euphoria with Bupe. But where is there PROOF of this??? It only makes sense that the naloxone would have some effect!! After all, that's what naloxone and Narcan do, they diminish the effects of antagonists. So I'm wondering if anyone knows of any articles or charts or whatever that prove that naloxone does not or does effect the Bupe.
I'm so happy I asked this question, thanks for all the input everyone!!
 
I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly..
(when taken sublingually)( although I understand roa shouldn't tech matter)

The naloxone doesn't enter the bloodstream, or if it does the BA is like 0.5-2%.

Even if it does enter the bloodstream..

The bupe/norbupe reaches the receptors first, therefore making the naloxone ineffective. So, bupe wins the race to receptorville and builds a wall that the naloxone cannot penetrate.

correct?
 
Ya, naloxone really doesn't do shit regardless of ROA. You can IV it and the bupe reaches the receptors first. Naloxone is useless, therefore should GTFO of our pure buprenorphine! Stupid FDA thinking it actually helps, and stupid RB for discontinuing subutex since they make more money off suboxone. Fuck em.

Btw:was curious and snorted 1/5 of a subutex pill today.... was nice then horrible....not worth it.......
 
Got my hands on a TEENY little subutex with an arrow on it tonight. 8mg, size of a roxi or smaller.

2mg up the nose, after nothing today, feeling good. Anybody else get these? I seem to think subutex is better than suboxone. I would have to bang it to be sure though.
Some people are sensitive to naloxone, and it does have some effects. For example, it loosens the bowels causing suboxone to have less constipation in some people (when taken via mouth/sublingual). However hepatic metabolism destroys it quickly after so very little central effect.

Btw:was curious and snorted 1/5 of a subutex pill today.... was nice then horrible....not worth it.......

Why was it horrible? Just did 1/4 of one myself.. precip withdrawals?
 
^^^

Thank you, I really appreciate it. I know it's just the being for me with the Subs, but so far I'm happy with the results. 4mgs of subs turned out to be the perfect amount for me and didn't have to re-dose another 2mg strip. It actually got me up and out of he house, went grocery shopping and made myself a nice dinner. I think my goal is to start this process by taking as little as possible a day so when I start to taper the Subs (eventually) that I hopefully won't have as hard of a time. Thank you Scarlet for your kind words.
 
Dr Pepper yeah I get the teeny tiny little arrow subutex almost every month now, i like them, but due to their small size it makes it psychologically more difficult to cut down my dose. Other than that no complaints.
 
I personally dont feel any difference between xone and tex! I mean I'd buy tex anyday over xone but its the money issues :)
Now when im halfly insufflating halfly IV'ing. I gotta say I would snort tex if I could afford it.

Like someone said that other ppl react to naloxone differently, guess Im just one of them which it doesnt affect negatively.. dunno.
 
I took my next step down to 0.5 mg today. Will taking things like loperamide (just a few pills, im not taking 80mg) pregabalin and benzos delay my adjustment and recovery, or not have any effect on that ? They certainly seem to ease the w/d symptoms.
 
I started SMT at 16mg/daily & after 20 months have only gone down from 2 8mg strips daily, to 1.75 strips daily, to 1.5 strips daily! I've only gone down .5 of a strip in nearly 2 years. Doesn't this seem a little slow? I'm debating finding a new doc, I think mine wants to keep patients there longer to get more $$.. Kinda sad
 
^^^

I just started Suboxone 3 days ago. My doctor sent me home with 60 2mg strips and just basically told me to take 1 and wait 45 minutes and if I didn't feel better take another. I ended up just taking 2 of the 2mg strips to feel better. My doctor told me I could take up to 8mgs in the morning and 8mgs in the evening. I haven't needed to take anywhere close to 16mgs, and have just stuck to 4mg a day sense I started 3 days ago. I don't know what you were taking before you started the Subs but I just came off 300mgs of oxy a day. I would say after 2 years, you would think that your doctor would have tapered you further than that. Unless you've been having a hard time with it. I myself am already planning to drop my dose to 3mgs a day by next week. What were you taking before? I'm just curious sense my doctor said I could start by taking up to 16mgs a day.....but I'm glad 4mgs has been just fine for me so far. I don't know a lot sense I just started but maybe your doctor is in it for the $$, so maybe you should at least speak with another doctor to see what they say. It's probably worth a shot. Best of luck to you.
 
I started SMT at 16mg/daily & after 20 months have only gone down from 2 8mg strips daily, to 1.75 strips daily, to 1.5 strips daily! I've only gone down .5 of a strip in nearly 2 years. Doesn't this seem a little slow? I'm debating finding a new doc, I think mine wants to keep patients there longer to get more $$.. Kinda sad

Yeah I mean... slow tapers work well for a lot of people but .5mg's in 2 years...? That's a bit ridiculous. You're in control of your taper though. If you want to come off, tell the doctor you want to come down and how fast you'd prefer to do it, or just taper yourself.
 
Dr Pepper yeah I get the teeny tiny little arrow subutex almost every month now, i like them, but due to their small size it makes it psychologically more difficult to cut down my dose. Other than that no complaints.

I know what you mean... you wanna take 2mg and 4mg breaks off and is barely a line.. i can't imagine taking .5 or 1mg due to the tiny volume its strange..
Although i had about 1-2mg left and my freaking cleaning lady came today and wiped if off of my desk (it was hidden too) after i said don't clean there... damnit.

I started SMT at 16mg/daily & after 20 months have only gone down from 2 8mg strips daily, to 1.75 strips daily, to 1.5 strips daily! I've only gone down .5 of a strip in nearly 2 years. Doesn't this seem a little slow? I'm debating finding a new doc, I think mine wants to keep patients there longer to get more $$.. Kinda sad

When i did quit subs in the past, i didn't even mention it to my doctor.. just kept hoarding subs and tapering my dose haha.. you can do it! Sounds like you arent sure if you want to perhaps.
 
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