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Thread: Clonazepam and Valerian root together?

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    Clonazepam and Valerian root together? 
    #1
    Hey BL, Last night after a 300mg dxm dosage, I woke up this morning and took 2mg kpins. I don't really feel like adding more kpins, so what would happen if I took a light dose of Valerian root with it? Would it potentiate it?

    I guess so?
    Last edited by bronson; 12-02-2013 at 07:11. Reason: do NOT bump your own threads
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    #2
    Bluelighter RobotRipping's Avatar
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    i doubt it'd do anything at all. Not all that much is understood about how valerian root works but if you assume they hit gaba-a somehow then combining with a benzo may create an additive effect, not potentiation though. Valerian root is so much more weak than clonazepam that you won't even notice the valerian root, which on its own has about zero effect. You could try it and tell us how it goes, it's safe to take but IME it never did anything on its own or combined with a benzo.
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    #3
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    Technically they will potentiate eachother a bit, but considering valerian root doesnt have that much psychoactive action anyway it's barely (or not at all even imo) worth the trouble.
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    #4
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    I've done it loads of times, you really can't feel anything from the valerian.
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    #5
    Bluelighter ugly's Avatar
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    Is there anything, besides a long long break, that will activate, potentiate, the kpins...
    or otherwise defeat
    or at least compromise
    my tolerance?
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    #6
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    ^ To my knowledge, not substantially, no.

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    #7
    Bluelighter Swimmingdancer's Avatar
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    L-lysine appears to potentiate benzos. Certain other amino acids might help increase GABA. But lysine was found in a study to potentiate benzo receptors. IME it does work. There are certain foods & drugs that can affect metabolization of clonazepam as well. But a far better idea is to try to get your tolerance down by using it less often & in lower doses. Potentiators are just going to increase your tolerance if you use them with your normal dose.
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    #8
    Bluelighter ugly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swimmingdancer View Post
    L-lysine appears to potentiate benzos. Certain other amino acids might help increase GABA. But lysine was found in a study to potentiate benzo receptors. IME it does work. There are certain foods & drugs that can affect metabolization of clonazepam as well. But a far better idea is to try to get your tolerance down by using it less often & in lower doses. Potentiators are just going to increase your tolerance if you use them with your normal dose.
    Thank you for the helpful information. I have had to break from the kpins because I feel nothing from a regular dose. Eventually there's a point where its just a waste of money because I truly feel nothing on 4 mg.Not.a.fucking.thing. Perhaps I could have stretched the time I was able to use them a little while longer. I haven't had any in some time. I happened to find one 2 mg on the floor today so I just popped it in my mouth like a mint.

    Nothing happened whatsoever. I'm just fucked right now. That's all.
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    #9
    Bluelighter RobotRipping's Avatar
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    really not much you can do about the tolerance, takes forever to go down as well. Clonazepam doesn't hit hard so most people don't notice it working even at higher doses unless they have anxiety.

    are you using them recreationally or for therapeutic reasons? If it's for recreation, your tolerance will skyrocket and eventually no dose will get you where you want. Clonazepam is not a great benzo for recreational purposes anyway, takes too long to kick in, lasts too long and is not euphoric, for most people. Even after an 8 month break i got up to 10mg/day of clonazepam within a week or two, so tolerance returns quickly as well.

    if you're looking to get fucked up from benzos then add some gabapentin. tolerance builds fast but you can get pretttty pretty fucked up a few times a month from the combo without issue.
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    #10
    Bluelighter ugly's Avatar
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    That's interesting stuff. I take kpins to get to sleep because my legs thrash of their own accord as soon as I lay down at night.
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    #11
    Bluelighter Swimmingdancer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobotRipping View Post
    if you're looking to get fucked up from benzos then add some gabapentin. tolerance builds fast but you can get pretttty pretty fucked up a few times a month from the combo without issue.
    BDD is not really about offering suggestions of how people can get fucked up. Personally I don't find taking clonazepam on top of gabapentin to increase the effects of the clonazepam, I just feel the effects of the gabapentin and the effects of the cloanzepam. If anything I feel less from the clonazepam (meaning less anxiolysis, sedation, noticeable feeling of the drug being there, etc) than I would if I took it by itself. But maybe that's just me.
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    #12
    Bluelighter synthetix's Avatar
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    Theoretically valerian would add some potentiaton to the clonazepam, but as SD has mentioned l-lysine is a much better substitute and I can vouch for this 100%. I have used it as a potentiator in the past and oh boy does it do the trick. It really knocks me out when I add to my benzo dose. As for gabapentin I don't advocate the use of it neither lyrica as they are both (in my opinion) terrible drugs as the withdrawal from either of them is mind bending and frankly worse than benzos. They do potentiate, but in the end of the day they are not worth it whatsoever.
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    #13
    Bluelighter ugly's Avatar
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    I am off my kpins. I don't have money for a visit with my doctor and I am out of refills. I will be exploring herbs more fully.
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    #14
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    Valerian root is a very mild sedative. There isn't much research to support this, so I am speaking from experience. Most people would have to take a few thousand mg of valerian root to(possibly) feel any sedation. The problem is that much of the information I have read suggests that it is toxic to ones liver at high doses. I personally take it for stomach problems. Smells like death! I normally take 6 450mg tablets with no noticeable effects. Have you tried kava? It's a tad more potent, but a little more difficult to acquire.
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    #15
    Bluelighter Swimmingdancer's Avatar
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    I think kava is way more effective as a natural benzo replacement than valerian. It's easy to find in some places (or online), just depends where you live. I can easily find it at health food stores in the US, I'm surprised you say it's harder to find opiscope.


    There are some threads on herbs and supplements for anxiety and sleep etc if you want me to find some for you ugly. And/or I can tell you about my experiences. Are you physically dependent on benzos and going to be getting withdrawal symptoms?
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    #16
    Bluelighter ugly's Avatar
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    swimmingdancer,

    I have been prescribed different benzos over the last few decades. I have been through them all, more than once.

    kpins only, I've been on for several years.

    I ran out like last week I guess. I did not do anything about it. I just abandon the thought of using them. That's all.

    I am going to a few health food / supplement places tonight to look into kava because I've read some promising articles about it.

    I have suffered with my legs every night my last kpin dose. They torment me. I get very little real rest at night. I'm going to look into alternatives for the situations I am experiencing. I have tried muscle relaxers, and they make me feel a little relaxed but I still can't control the jerking that thrashes me around at night.

    Thank you for your generous offer to link me to additional information. I am happy to accept.
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    #17
    Administrator bronson's Avatar
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    Reading through this might offer some insights until SD gets back: Good, non-addictive anti-anxiety drugs.

    Hope that helps some.

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    #18
    Bluelighter RobotRipping's Avatar
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    @ugly: have you been dependent on kpins for over a year? if you ran out get yourself to a Dr or do something because you are risking a seizure, possibly a deadly one depending on your body/tolerance. The withdrawal from clonazepam is long and terrible, no herb will cut it IMO.
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    #19
    Bluelighter synthetix's Avatar
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    clonazepam is one of the most deadly to withdraw from too out of all the benzos if cold turkeyed. i still have NO IDEA why they are scribed for anxiety, but their role of use to begin with was for its potent anti-epilepic features. now all benzos have a risk of causing a seizure upon abrupt discontinuation, but, clonazepam is the most dangerous. - you NEED to get to a doc or emergency room now and explain your situation. if you've been dependant on it for the past year you are at a VERY high risk of having a seizure and dying/being disabled for the rest of your life.
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    #20
    Bluelighter Swimmingdancer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ugly View Post
    I ran out like last week I guess. I did not do anything about it. I just abandon the thought of using them. That's all.
    Abandoning all thought of using it is a great mind-set, and will help you psychologically and with any mental addiction, but unfortunately it's not enough to stave off physical withdrawal symptoms, so if you meant that you normally take clonazepam every day and you stopped abruptly I agree that you should definitely seek medical attention.

    Quote Originally Posted by synthetix View Post
    clonazepam is one of the most deadly to withdraw from too out of all the benzos if cold turkeyed.
    .... clonazepam is the most dangerous.
    Really? Do you have a source for this? This is contrary to everything I have heard or read on the subject. (Not meaning that it isn't dangerous, but that it isn't the most dangerous benzo to withdraw from).
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    #21
    Bluelighter ugly's Avatar
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    this thread

    Bronson, I'll be reading the thread you linked this evening. Thank you.

    I really appreciate the help.

    I also appreciate the concerned BLers who wrote to warn me of kpin withdrawals. I have gone though them more than once. I know I am at risk and I accept that because life is straight up risky. I went through withdrawals so many times that they became permanent instruments of my instincts.

    You are all so kind to advise me to get to the doctor, seek medical attention, so forth... I am doing well. Substances are not even the problem. I have been on benzos for years because of anxiety. I've had tranqs and psychotropics... a plethora of mood altering pills. I come off of all of them eventually, though.

    Withdrawals are dismal. Abysmal. But after all these years, I see that taking meds because my life sucks doesn't fix my life.

    I can't find a job and my unemployment benefits ran out a year ago. No pill for that crap.
    We are in foreclosure, our bankruptcy was revoked, and we feel helplessly thrown over a fiscal cliff. No pill for that crap.

    I have never had a seizure from quitting a drug, and I should have had at least one by now, I'm sure.
    I did faint after discontinuing a strong psychotropic... I can't think of the name. Fainting scared me to death. One minute I'm standing there talking, and in the wink of an eye I'd go unconscious and hit the ground. It scared the people around me, too.

    I'm alright with the kpin withdrawal. I haven't felt benzo activity in my brain for a long time, and I actually thought at one point that I had been given placebos for some reason because the klonopins were no longer effective and I couldn't believe it. I really couldn't.

    At night I am miserable. My legs kink up and spring out and jerk me around. It's the most unpleasant feeling I've ever known. When the kpins first kicked in and I had relief at night, it felt OH so GOOD.

    Little by little, the spasms returned. Now they are completely back and worse than ever. On top of that, my circumstances are worse than ever. If withdrawals from klonopin kills me, that's not the worst thing to die from.
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    #22
    Bluelighter Swimmingdancer's Avatar
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    I hope you're ok

    For the restless legs I would recommend kava, magnesium, L-lysine and potassium. Those things should help (to a point) with withdrawals in general (of course it's not going to be the same as taking a benzo but it should definitely be superior to nothing). I'm sorry to hear about your financial situation. Hopefully you can still afford some supplements? It sounds like you've been going through a lot lately. When it rains it pours, right?

    Please don't hesitate to go to the ER if your withdrawals get really severe though, there is no reason to let yourself have seizures etc.
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    #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swimmingdancer View Post
    Really? Do you have a source for this? This is contrary to everything I have heard or read on the subject. (Not meaning that it isn't dangerous, but that it isn't the most dangerous benzo to withdraw from).
    It's not by all means, I posted some links to studies a few months back about how clonazepam can be used to taper off other benzodiazepines to an extent which is just ass effective as diazepam. People always say diazepam because they conclude that diazepams long half life means it's the most ideal for tapering. Drugs are never active for their full half-life, so while diazepam may have a longer half life, it has a relatively short duration of action, as opposed to clonazepams long duration of action. Your spot on.
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    #24
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    ^ From my understanding however, diazepam breaks down into a metabolite with an extremely long HL and builds in the system. While it is not fully active, it eases withdrawal more than clonazepam which does not metabolize likewise.

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    #25
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    I went to my doctor today. I told him that the RLS has been making me genuinely insane at night and that I quit taking klonopins because they don't do anything anymore. He was surprised that I didn't have health issues from being off klonopins, like some of you were.

    At any rate, he put me on Gabapentin for restless legs. I really hope it works. It's a little after 7pm now. I took 100mg cap about half hour ago. My legs are just starting their bullshit with me. I hope the Gabapentin works.
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