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The Big & Dandy 4-AcO-DMT Thread - Act Four

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2c-b is 'entactogenic' meaning it's more about increasing sensory awareness of tactile sensations and stuff but that doesn't mean it can't be a very full, immersive, even 'deep' psychedelic.

4-aco is a form of DMT which is arguably the 'deepest' psychedelic so it's no surprise you have that reaction.

I'd agree that 4-aco is much more euphoric though. It stinks that 2c-b is rubbing you the wrong way, it's shulgin's favorite.
 
2c-b is 'entactogenic' meaning it's more about increasing sensory awareness of tactile sensations and stuff but that doesn't mean it can't be a very full, immersive, even 'deep' psychedelic.

4-aco is a form of DMT which is arguably the 'deepest' psychedelic so it's no surprise you have that reaction.

I'd agree that 4-aco is much more euphoric though. It stinks that 2c-b is rubbing you the wrong way, it's shulgin's favorite.

"Entactogenic" actually means "empathy producing" I'm fairly sure, but those drugs are often accompanied by sensory enhancement. I would say 2c-b is more sensory-enhancing than entactogenic, although it is also a bundle of giggles.
 
"Entactogenic" actually means "empathy producing" I'm fairly sure, but those drugs are often accompanied by sensory enhancement. I would say 2c-b is more sensory-enhancing than entactogenic, although it is also a bundle of giggles.

You've got it mixed up. Entactogenic means manifesting in the touch sense; same root as "tactile." Manifesting in empathy is empathogenic.
 
I'm assuming that when combining with MDMA, one would have better results if the MDMA is taken a little bit before, since the 4-Aco-DMT seems to "amplify" the emotional state?

I plan on trying my first "flip" with this in a few weeks (oral 120mg of MDMA--a bit lower than my usual 150mg) and plugging a small amount of 4-Aco-DMT about a half hour later...
 
^Actually, the accepted wisdom is to dose the MDMA after the psychedelic, because you don't want to be crashing whilst you're tripping.
 
Nasal used to be my favorite RoA for 4-aco, but the last time I tried it I almost puked from the drip. It likely had something to do with the fact that it was degraded into that gross brown sticky mess. Seemed to be just as effective, but the taste was more unbearable than I remember.
 
^Actually, the accepted wisdom is to dose the MDMA after the psychedelic, because you don't want to be crashing whilst you're tripping.

hmm, that's interesting! I've only used 4-Aco-DMT a couple times and in small doses and the experience didn't seem to last any longer than a typical MDMA--so maybe I should just take them at the same time? (plugging the 4-Aco-DMT would likely kick in maybe a half hour before the oral MDMA).
 
Wowowowowow! Yesterday was awesome. Had some K and decided to add some 4-AcO-DMT after the peak, and i've to say this was one hell of a good decision. Thought about having some tolerance from having my first trial with the 4-AcO just this monday so i decided to plug 20mgs this time, and what should i say? If there was a tolerance then it wasn't very noticeable, or the K potentiated the effects because i was SOOOO blazed. I never ever had such amazing visuals, sometimes i almost didn't see where i actually am. Everything was moving and alive and the craziest thing was, that it somehow looked like in the Movie "The Matrix", where everything is colored in this green letters/digits (you should know what i mean), but with the 4-AcO-DMT this patterns had mostly reddish tones...

Music appreciation was beyond amazing, even though at some points it was almost too overwhelming and had some disturbing moments, but with the right mindset this was successfully replaced by a feeling of euphoric bliss and happiness. Music played a large role in directing the trip so one should keep that in mind when choosing his/her soundtrack for tripping. I normally like "Sigur Rós" when tripping (for example), but "The Doors" suited this one much better, even though i never heard them before while having an excursion like this.

Like with my previous trial i've to say this has really not much in common with shrooms, but more with DMT. Even the DMT-buzz was there %)
 
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Had my 5th 4-aco-dmt trip last night (bright white fumarate powder, ended up doing 30mg) along with 40mg or so of MXE. This was easily my best trip yet...mind-blowing stuff. Lasted a good 6-8 hours too, for a time I just laid in bed with some Grateful Dead playing and just felt some of the most euphoric sensations of my life. Then I put some trance on and danced my ass off for hours. This chem is amazing :D
 
do you have a link or something to what Shulgin has to say about it? I searched but couldn't find; thanks!

PIHKAL quote:

Many of the reports that have come in over the years have mentioned the combination of MDMA and 2C-B. The most successful reports have followed a program in which the two drugs are not used at the same time, nor even too closely spaced. It appears that the optimum time for the 2C-B is at, or just before, the final baseline recovery of the MDMA. It is as if the mental and emotional discoveries can be mobilized, and something done about them. This combination has several enthusiastic advocates in the psychotherapy world, and should be the basis of careful research when these materials become legal, and accepted by the medical community.

As it happens, for me it turned out that I hade exceptional results with insufflation of MDMA crystal more than halfway in of a 2C-B trip. There were other minor drugs involved though, but I just mean to say that I disagree with Shulgin. MDMA insufflation is not something I generally rate above oral administration but there are some advantages that are useful in certain situations.

The topic is 4-AcO-DMT here though, not MDMA nor 2C-B. Can I ask that we return solely to 4-AcO-DMT?

@Escape20, I can't imagine how intense that would be, the compounds you took are certainly close relatives of drugs that are legendary to combine (DMT + K / psilocin + K, ..)
 
I found 4-aco-dmt to be quite a lot of fun, with almost no negative aspects of the trip. Here's me experience with it:

I'd been sitting on 30mg of 4-aco-dmt without any specific plans for taking it. A few weeks earlier, I had tried a 20mg dose with a friend and generally enjoyed it, but felt the experience to be milder than than I had expected (perhaps on par with 1.5g of mushrooms). During that trip I smoked a fair amount of marijuana and primarily felt stoned, which was nice enough but far short of what psychedelics can offer. This time the circumstances were different: I was by myself and had only the tiniest amount of marijuana, but my roommate was out of town and I didn't have much else to do so I figured I might as well just eat the 30mg and see what happens.

Around 7pm I took the pill and then immediately ran to the store to pick up some beer. The effects were essentially negligible until 30 minutes or so after taking it, by which point I felt somewhat lightheaded and became more aware of the relative size and configuration of objects in my apartment. The hallway looked bigger and my sofa looked smaller than I remembered, and I kept wondering whether the walls were really meeting at a right angle or not. Around this time I was also struck by just how *yellow* everything was; the only lighting I have is a few lamps and as the light diffused off the walls the whole place seemed to be a warm marigold. After about 50 minutes of my dose I was feeling somewhat more intense effects; there was no real physical anxiety but I did feel a bit giddy as I was beginning to come-up. The room was growing ever and ever more yellow and at this point I started having some difficulty distinguishing the edges of objects. I dimmed the lights and put on some music -- I was originally intending to play some through headphones on my laptop, but I convinced myself that my headphones were electrocuting me and so I instead listened to my roommate's CD of Mendelssohn's 3rd symphony over the stereo.

Wow! This was maybe the most engrossing musical experience I have ever had. The opening of the first movement is calm and relaxed; I laid on my sofa and let the warm sound wrap around me as the 4-aco-dmt kept me feeling a bit disoriented. But the peaceful atmosphere was quickly punctuated by intense bursts of sound and energy and vigor, and as the storm carried me along I couldn't lay down anymore. Up, up, up I must go! The music carried not just my mind but also my body, and by the fourth movement I was doing a wildly improvisational dance as the 4-aco-dmt peaked. It is difficult to describe the intensity of the experience: subjectively I was not at all aware of the drugs, or even of myself, but only of the symphony and the expression of life. I imagine I looked like a madman, but this is exactly the sort of thing one should embrace when the opportunity presents itself. The finale was a beautiful thing, a physical and emotional staircase which I climbed to the full height of ecstasy, and then, just as magnificently, I was released from the orchestra's hold and I plummeted back to earth. Once the symphony ended I laid down and revelled in the experience.

The rest of the evening was quite pleasant. I went for a brief walk, but it was cold and dark and the ground was littered with dog turds so I quickly returned home. For the most part I just listened to music, thought about my life and what I really want out of it. At some point I got hungry and heated up some leftover soup I had made. Eating the soup was a remarkably sensual experience. I do not mean this in an erotic way, but simply I felt much more acutely sensitive to the flavors and textures present -- particularly when eating kale (something about its frilly texture and slight crunch had me mesmerized). After about 5 1/2 hours I felt like I had for the most part come down.

While it is difficult for me to really distinguish the effects of a drug from the effects of the environment and my own attitude going into the experience, here's my rough sense of how 4-aco-dmt compares to others. It was not nearly as introspective of a trip as any of my LSD trips have been, and the duration was much shorter. There was still a fair amount of introspection going on, but I didn't feel anything close to what I imagine people would describe as 'ego death', for example. There was less physical anxiety with 4-aco-dmt than with mushrooms (probably in large part due to no nausea), and I also felt a bit 'lighter' and more capable of doing things than I have when I have done mushrooms. It was also a less visually intense experience than I have had with other psychedelics; at some point I went to the bathroom and watched my face in the mirror change texture, but for the most part I was not particularly captivated by the visual effects as I had been with LSD or 2c-i (a high dose of the latter gave me the most profound visuals I have ever had). Overall I had a fantastic time and would highly recommend 4-aco-dmt to others. Usual caveats apply: while 4-aco-dmt strikes me as being a calmer & perhaps more recreational psychedelic than the usual suspects, it is still a drug and it is extremely important to go into any trip with some amount of maturity re: set & setting, etc. I should remark also that I woke up the following day with a pretty rough headache, but after an hour or so it subsided and overall I felt very good.
 
wanted to ask your guys' opinions on the after effects/side effects of 4-aco. while being aware and having read up on the substance im aware that structurally it is just psylocin and that have read enough trip reports to have general feel for its effects but nowhere have i read a whole lot on any possible negative affects or side effects wether temporary or permanent. should i just treat with the same care i would any psychedelic or are there certain things like excessive looping or fried over feelings or etc.
 
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wanted to ask your guys' opinions on the after effects/side effects of 4-aco. while being aware and having read up on the substance im aware that structurally it is just psylocin and that have read enough trip reports to have general feel for its effects but nowhere have i read a whole lot on any possible negative affects or side effects wether temporary or permanent. should i just treat with the same care i would any psychedelic or are there certain things like excessive looping or fried over feelings or etc.

4aco dehydrates me so keep a lot of water around. i also piss a lot on it (probably causes dehydration). so have a steady supply of hydrating liquids and place to pee

i get some nausea on it sometimes also and light headedness


the come up is pretty annoying/anxiety inducing for me and i feel a little stimmeed out on the comedwn at times


the side effects aren't too bad really it's just a lot fo a mindfuck

treat it like you'd treat shrooms


it doesn't have a "fried" feeling in the same way 25inbome does or anything

it kinda has a bit of a "drunk" feeling tho
 
while being aware and having read up on the substance im aware that structurally it is just psylocin

Sort of, it's the acetate ester of Psilocin. It should break down mostly or entirely into Psilocin in the body but even if that's all it breaks down into the experience is a little different due to the drug having to be metabolised, and is more prolonged and drawn out, with a slower more gradual come up.

wanted to ask your guys' opinions on the after effects/side effects of 4-aco.

While under the influence, like some other tryptamines it can get a little dark or induce some anxiety if there's a lot on your mind. A lot of people seem to agree that it's easier-going in this respect than mushrooms or pure Psilocin itself though.

As for physical side effects, during the experience sometimes it can feel like you need to urinate when you don't, there's some light vasoconstriction, nothing unusual for a psychedelic.

When it comes to the after-effects, this one is a winner in my book, leaves me feeling absolutely amazing the next morning when I wake up, even if I had a particularly difficult trip. I'm short-sighted normally and my vision sees a noticeable improvement for the next few days after my experience.

I also notice a general sense of happiness and well-being that can persist anywhere from a few hours after the trip to weeks or months after it depending on how important the trip was to me.

Hope this helps :)
 
Threw away the remnants of my 4-AcO before my last trip earlier this week. It was so sticky and globular, so annoying to scale. Plus out of my many trips on the chem, this trip was the first time it made me vomit. It just didn't feel right, you know? The trips have certainly changed since it degraded. Faster come-up, shorter overall duration, and seemingly darker.

Well, the next batch I buy will definitely be fumarate. Not dealing with all this degradation again.
 
^ I think that fits with it degrading into Psilocin. I've noticed the same thing, my first few 4-AcO-DMT trips were very pleasant, long, relaxing, and tranquil, but over time the come ups became a lot quicker and more rough, I started getting some nausea throughout the experience, the trips took on a very dark and anxious edge..

It's worth noting that mine was the fumarate, but I'm rather lazy with my storage and keep my drugs sealed inside a baggy inside a baggy inside a baggy inside a box at room temperature, so after having the 4-AcO-DMT for 2.5 years there's definitely been some degradation (not that much, the powder is still an off-white, but starting to take on a tan colour - enough to change the trips though)

I still need to remember to try leaving some 4-AcO-DMT in water for a couple of days so the hydrolysis leads to most/all of it converting into Psilocin and see if the trend continues and the changes in duration etc *were* due to it breaking down, or simply due to me becoming more accustomed to the drug. I keep thinking I tried this before but I don't remember the results if I did, so I'll have to give it another go.
 
I'd love to hear the results of such an experiment! Also if I get my hands on another batch at some point, I will be able to compare that trip to my last one.
 
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