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  • EADD Moderators: axe battler

3,4-dichloro-methylphenidate (3,4-CTMP / 3,4-DCMP)

Have a few benzos lying around for such occasions Si, I rarely touch any kind of stimulant without them these days. They really are a life saver.
 
Yeah, indeed, I have very little of that sorta thing on-board at the mo... I attempted valium after a meph/ket binge one time many years ago before the ban but the Valium brought vast nausea & still no sleep. I have later found that only Etizolam can help to ease over-stimulatin caused by dissociative use.
 
i had high hopes for this but the only thing that is putting me off this is the apparent addiction profile of being more addicitve than cocaine.
 
So people tried snorting, iv tried vaping which was useless, anyone tried it oral? Got a bit of this still to test, and any of the guinea pigs got owt to add to the slow come up & long lasting stim effects which i found by accidentally doing a threshold dose and re-lapse concurs?, may try 5 or 10mg on its own and see if it works as a functional stim, like rit gets me motivated and proactive
 
Specialspack... relapse is speaking the truth when he says its not available to anyone and he tells us why in his trip report.

Whatever you think of him, at least he's proving a Harm Reduction message by recommending that this chemical isn't one that everyone should be able to get. With a name like Special Spack, maybe you ought to reevaluate some things about yourself!

Edit:
I understand you were probably saying taking 3,4-dichloro-methylphenidate in combination with other drugs is a bad idea,
and I agree, but (correct me if im wrong but) the addition of valium at the tail end of this trip report would only serve to reduce the which was already very high, so this is quite sensible HR along with a mention that it shouldnt be available to everyone because of the high potency. Ketamine may or may not have contributed to an overstimulation but I'm pretty sure these work on different neurochemical systems NMDA and Dopamine (Ketamine & 34DCMP Respectively)

I don't think there's a need to be so brash with relapse.. this is a relatively unknown chemical, and he offered some insight.

Bloody hell 8) - I was merely pointing out the irony inherent in someone castigating irresponsible drug users on the one hand, whilst on the other merrily sampling a barely-studied potent stimulant on a cocktail of subutex, pregabalin, ketamine and valium.

With all due respect, pharmacologically, you don't know what you're talking about. Just because the drugs have different primary CNS targets, doesn't mean that they won't have potential interactions. Armchair pharmacology is never a good idea when exploring new substances...

I'm not denying that this report offers some limited insight, but to call it harm reduction is a bit of a joke.
 
By the kindness of the Gods, a small sample of this has appeared amongst my pets mail in recent days & I have this morning weighed it & had a good look at it. Fine, fine chemicals, does not require grinding bu as has been pointed out, this product may sting a bit, I grinded it anyway. I then followed with a approx half a milligram-to-1milligram up the schnorfer, as an allergy test.

A line was then built upon the mirror, scraping up any left overs from the weighing process. I suspect the line may have reach the 4-6mg area but my guess would be 5mg. Since about an hour after no reaction test dose, I have been hoovering small, small bumps off the mirror at intervals of around half an hour.

After vaccing up about half of the line I suspected that I may be feeling some warm, comfortable but extremely subtle stimulation. Pleasant, clean headspace, no obvious increase in heart-rate, no anxiety as yet. I have absolutely no other psyhoactive compounds in the system, havent even had a spliff yet. One coffee, one slice of toast!

Now that an effect appears to have established I am going to bump up whats left on the mirror. I'm aware of the possible longevity of this stuff so I'll leave the rest in the bag, but as of, say 11am this morning, I have 5mg in the bloodstream. I shall update a little later, as I'd like to engage in some light musical work (tranferring DATs onto CDR) or I might fuck that & get straight back into Forza Horizon. Was gonna get Horizon for £45 before Xmas, but heyho, couldn't afford it & got Driver San Francisco instead, for £7. My gf say it in Game on Jan 1st for £25 so now I am a happytwat.

This post just keeps growing! Definite degree of awakings even from so small a dose! Very interesting.

PS I agree that in some cases, & where possible, ultra-powerful stims should be kept outta the hands of the less than cautious!

edit- My original pile of 25mg has been reweighed & now reckons 18mg, so my ingestion is of 5-7mg, to be as accurate as possible with a 1-2mg scale inaccuracy variation possibility considered.

I'm aware of the possible longevity of this stuff so I'll leave the rest in the bag, but as of, say 11am this morning, I have 5mg in the bloodstream. I shall update a little later, as I'd like to engage in some light musical work

Wow, well got LOADS of recording done yesterday, then fouled up my DAT machine, so won't get any further today :(

But that's not why I posted. The 3,4-dichloro-methylphenidate brought long-lasting, subtle stimulation, functional & side-effects free for most of the day. Appetite was suppressed, alertness & general energy was present. After dosing at around 10am I was still buzzing but feeling pretty crashed, weak, faint & pretty down by 5pm, but a trip out for pizza, although something of a physical struggle, brought much relief fom nausea, weakness & re-energised me for a few more hours. Post stim-stimulation WAS present for some hours into the evening & by midnight had become a slight drag & produced a little anxiety, so I killed it with increasing doses of Etizolam. I probably got up to about 3 or 4mg before I dosed off, perhaps twice or even 3 or 4 times more than I'd need if I wanted Eti after a normal day.

Despite the large, late Eti I awoke as usual at about 6am & was unable to return to sleep. It's possible yesterdays 10am dose of about 5-7mg 3,4-dichloro-methylphenidate may have outlasted Etizolam taken a mdnight, 14 hours later. Or maybe I had DAT's & music on my mind when I awoke?

Overall though, I'd say this is one fine stimulant at my relatively light dosage. Certainly better than MDPV & considerably less fiendy. There is SOME redose fiendishness to it but if you eat good food rather than redose, your effects may, as in my case, return.

Interesting stuff, long acting & probably quite powerful at higher doses, but I advise EXTREME caution, ACCURATE measuring & plenty antitode to stimulation/anxiety due to it's longevity.

Be very, very careful with this one folks, don't let me hear about anyone eyeballing it or I'll flame until I've burned up the atmosphere! Lol

PS No obvious hangover but I'll keep an eye out for it!
 
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Bloody hell 8) - I was merely pointing out the irony inherent in someone castigating irresponsible drug users on the one hand, whilst on the other merrily sampling a barely-studied potent stimulant on a cocktail of subutex, pregabalin, ketamine and valium.

With all due respect, pharmacologically, you don't know what you're talking about. Just because the drugs have different primary CNS targets, doesn't mean that they won't have potential interactions. Armchair pharmacology is never a good idea when exploring new substances...

I'm not denying that this report offers some limited insight, but to call it harm reduction is a bit of a joke.

Fair play. My point is, I'm viewing it from a different angle in that someone who is tackling their opiate addiction who is telling people this stuff might be too potent & addictive for some people, is something to be listened to. Ketamine in combination I fail to see how the Ketamine would have contributed massively to the stimulation overall, I'm happy to be informed however as to why this would be the case) but people combining benzos with stims goes hand in hand quite often.

I don't want to 'get off on the wrong foot' with you though mate. I just think you could of phrased it a bit more constructively. I know I'm probably equally guilty in being harsh with you, so for that I'm sorry pal.
 
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Si Ingwe -- thanks for the post. I'm surprised there aren't more anecdotes about this relatively novel stim. I quite like stims myself but I'm a little wary to try this one since it's so new. FWIW I quite like methylphenidate. I think ethylphenidate is decent in small amounts. But the 3,4-chloro in this RC makes me pause.
 
Bloody hell 8) - I was merely pointing out the irony inherent in someone castigating irresponsible drug users on the one hand, whilst on the other merrily sampling a barely-studied potent stimulant on a cocktail of subutex, pregabalin, ketamine and valium.

With all due respect, pharmacologically, you don't know what you're talking about. Just because the drugs have different primary CNS targets, doesn't mean that they won't have potential interactions. Armchair pharmacology is never a good idea when exploring new substances...

I'm not denying that this report offers some limited insight, but to call it harm reduction is a bit of a joke.

Why the hostility? I am on suboxone, pregabalin and valium daily - prescribed. You know nothing about me. I researched the limited info and decided that this new chemical would be safe to use with my 'cocktail' of drugs. I am not a fan of stimulants usually, but enjoy taking ketamine AFTER the peak - so I had a fairly good idea about what this new chemical brought to the table.

This is active from 5mg snorted but would advise 10-15mg to get a good feel for this stimulant. You will need something to help sleep aswell.

I never 'castigated' any one. I was just making clear that this should not be made available to people who are likely to sniff a 100mg+ line of it, having not researched it properly.

My (and I admit) slightly questionable report was possibly tainted by the drugs already in my system, but I don't believe they effected my experience. I have been prescribed those drugs for over a year and take them just to feel normal. The ketamine could have been left alone though, i agree.

Will get more soon and do another report.

Stay safe,

RL

p.s. Cheers for your back up 'scottishdnb', pm me if you need more info
 
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Kittens are dying from this low-level flame war. It would be nice if we could get back to the topic at-hand.
 
Im not stiring no chemiocal for 2 hours. If the purpose s to imngest it to the body, wht not bomb 10 mg or s, the body can then stir it for 2 hours ?
 
EzOTd.png

so, everyone happy to ingest this? *shakes head*
 
Ceres, it would be useful if you could provide us with the benefit of your biochemistry knowledge rather than just posting pictures of molecules with smart remarks and expecting everyone to know what you're on about.

You're a knowledgeable guy, bless us with your wisdom.
 
Indeed. That would be a boon, Ceres. Read some mutterings (I think in ADD?) about "iffy methyl groups" or some such tomfoolery but means nowt to us mere punters and ADD folk can be... well... a bit fannyish when it comes to risk-aversion ;)

Basically, is it one of those vague kindasorta possiblymaybe generic murmurs of less than ideal chemical sexiness or more the anyone who takes this will die a horrible slow painful death after years of frequent bouts of debilitating physical and mental torments kinda jobbies? Somewhere inbetween, perhaps? Specific problems looming or more generalised unease?
 
Thanks Mela. So 3,4 dichloro-methylphenidate is structurally closely related to a known neurotoxin, but it's not established that it is itself a neurotoxin.

To answer Ceres's question, if there's the slightest chance that it's not neurotoxic, then experience suggests some people will be happy to ingest this substance.

And even if it's definitely neurotoxic, then there will still be some people who won't think twice ;)

When I was a teenager, the word on the street was that every drink of alcohol killed braincells. Our response - fuck it, we've got billions!
 
How related is too related? Aren't plenty drugs but a small hop and a skip away from being seriously dodgy but in and of themselves perfectly servicable? Sometimes I wish I finished school so I'd maybe know some stuff... distant memories of middle school chemistry doesn't quite cut it.
 
Hmm, well another example is that brephedrone (4-bromo-methcathinone) is very analogous to 4-bromo-amphetamine which made me try to warn users and sources, for a moment appearing somewhat successful but in the end to no avail.

Now read this from the Rhodium archive, and bear with me, it won't all be technical jibber jabber and you may want to hear my actual argument:
An unusual aspect of 4-CA metabolism is the reported conversion of the drug to oxygen-containing products. A phenolic product was identified by Parli and Schmidt (1975) as being 3-chloro-4-hydroxyphenylisopropylamine. This would seem to invoke the NIH shift as an explanation for the migration of the chloro atom. Even more remarkable is the report (Sherman and Gal, 1976) of the isolation of 3,4-dimethoxyphenylisopropylamine following the intraventricular injection of 4-CA. This represents the formation in vivo of a weak but accepted pressor and psychotomimetic. When the mechanism of its formation is understood, a chemical link may be at hand tying the simpler phenylisopropylamine stimulants to the methoxylated psychotomimetics. There were no reports from the clinical studies of 4-CA that suggested any psychotomimetic action.

This suggests that given enough room, some hydroxylase apparently oxidizes the halogenated position transfering the Cl to the adjacent position on the phenyl (called NIH shift as mentioned).
In such a compound as DOC or 2C-C there may be too much steric hindrance or the different electronic distribution making it too hard for such an enzyme to gobble on the Chloro.
However if 3,4-dichloroamphetamine also shows toxicity we may want to suspect something similar happening since the 4-chloro can still be relocated to the 5-position and/or the 3-chloro to the 2-position.

I must admit I was skeptic at first of polymath concerns, focussing on the various structural differences rather than the commonalities, but I think the above suggests that we should avoid a compound like this because of the likelihood of shady metabolites by hydroxylase.
Because you really don't want phenolic metabolites, I seem to recall F&B also avoiding anything that might lead to that like the plague and rightly so.

Also I think one of the most similar compounds to this CTMP is dichloropane, I am surprised no one has mentioned it and am also curious if that compound was tested for Raphe nuclei dopaminergic toxicity and things like that.

Then there is also AH-7921 with the same dichlorophenyl pattern but that might be too far from dopaminergic to be relevant. Still if you are a user of that or considering it, this could deter you.

Anyway I saw this drug (CTMP) being offered and after having the thoughts I just expressed decided that it would almost be hubristic to proceed trying it. (Apart from the fact that stimulants have pretty much disappeared from my diet)

If I haven't made myself very clear, ask.
 
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