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Opioids Desomorphine (Krokodil) experiences?

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im surprised some eterprising russian chemist doesnt just somehow make a batch of some crazy potent fent analog, whack it down an obscene amount and sell it for dirt cheap. just from the vast size of russia alone id think getting the needed precursor chems would be easy if you had the money...probably super eassy if you had mob connecs.
 
Slum Survivor said:
all i know is the name of this grabbed my attention... There's a pretty wild sounding House/Dance/electronic song called "Krokobil" and in the chorus theres a guy saying "dill as in krokodil..." and the song is F'n nuts even for a drug theme house song. it appears to be a fairly popular song in europe too. perhaps mostly in russia? i dont even know what language it is... lol.

but i always wondered what the heck the guy was talking about in the song. i geuss it translates to "crocodile ass". i see... they are kinda saying "ass munchers" in a weird way. im sure there is some sort of influence from the drug thing in this song tho.

YELLOW CLAW Ft. SJAAK & MR. POLSKA - KROKOBIL
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eh...lol
it's Dutch. From the Netherlands.
...and has nothing to do with the drug krokodil.

he's 'singing' about a girl's big booty is like a crocodile bite.
he says he's a crocodile hunter as in, he can find big booty bitches.
one part says "your ass is not like Chewbacca because it's super smooth." LOL
 
'medicine cabinet' said:
im surprised some eterprising russian chemist doesnt just somehow make a batch of some crazy potent fent analog, whack it down an obscene amount and sell it for dirt cheap. just from the vast size of russia alone id think getting the needed precursor chems would be easy if you had the money...probably super eassy if you had mob connecs.
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St Petersburg. Lots of chemist. There you will find cut 3methylfentanyl, a dose sold for a fraction of a dime bag in east coast USA.
Apparently heroin is hard to find there as opposed to Moscow where it is the other way around.
The same 3MF makes its way to Tallinn, Estonia and we have a user here with lots of experience with it.

It think this 'krokodil' started in Siberia where chemists and opiates are rare. Perhaps some chemist devised a plan that got passed along like Chinese whispers and the synthesis got sloppier and sloppier as a result.

In Russia they have had methcathinone since the 60s and methamphetamine since the late 70s at least. This is illicit homemade production.
The methamphetamine is eph/pseudo reduced by RP/I2. The finished reaction mixture is diluted with water to about 100-150mg/ml, RP is filtered out, PH is corrected by baking soda and the liquid I'd shot up as is.
It is known as vint, from pervitin, which was scripted methamphetamine.
No attempt is made to a/b the methamphetamine (although commercial labs do). The rxn mixture contains MAmp, unreactted pseudo, iodometh and a whole host of by products, iodine etc. not very healthy but the Russians prefer the hit from this.

I imagine some bright sod decided to replace pseudo with codeine and inject what he got, in the hope it would be a stronger opiate. And guess what he was right. Although this is sloppy chemistry for opiates and the yield is terrible.

What would be wrong with doing the 'krokodil' simple synth like they do, clean up the rxn mixture, adjust ph and take it orally (BioAvailabilty?) or plug it?
 
Bill said:
I heard Russia banned all the ingredients used to make this in pharmacy's over there now
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In Russia you can buy pure RP and probably ephedrine and I2 as well from 'babushkas' standing on corners in subways. Literally little old ladies and grandmothers.
If they ban the codeine and shit from the pharmacies A) they will still be sold under the counter and B) pharmaceutical companies will be super pissed as codeine containing preparations have risen tenfold in the last decade.
 
For those with a genuine interest in Krokodil: here's an excellent review article paper that was recently published in the International Journal of Drug Policy. The full text is available online: http://www.ijdp.org/article/S0955-3959(13)00051-0/fulltext

Abstract

Background
Krokodil, a homemade injectable opioid, gained its moniker from the excessive harms associated with its use, such as ulcerations, amputations and discolored scale-like skin. While a relatively new phenomenon, krokodil use is prevalent in Russia and the Ukraine, with at least 100,000 and around 20,000 people respectively estimated to have injected the drug in 2011. In this paper we review the existing information on the production and use of krokodil, within the context of the region's recent social history.

Methods
We searched PubMed, Google Advanced Search, Google Scholar, YouTube and the media search engine www.Mool.com for peer reviewed or media reports, grey literature and video reports. Survey data from HIV prevention and treatment NGOs was consulted, as well as regional experts and NGO representatives.

Findings
Krokodil production emerged in an atypical homemade drug production and injecting risk environment that predates the fall of communism. Made from codeine, the active ingredient is reportedly desomorphine, but – given the rudimentary ‘laboratory’ conditions – the solution injected may include various opioid alkaloids as well as high concentrations of processing chemicals, responsible for the localized and systemic injuries reported here. Links between health care and law enforcement, stigma and maltreatment by medical providers are likely to thwart users seeking timely medical help.

Conclusion
A comprehensive response to the emergence of krokodil and associated harms should focus both on the substance itself and its rudimentary production methods, as well as on its micro and macro risk environments – that of the on-going syndemic of drug injecting, HIV, HCV, TB and STIs in the region and the recent upheaval in local and international heroin supply. The feasibility of harm reduction strategies for people who inject krokodil may depend more on political will than on the practical implementation of interventions. The legal status of opioid substitution treatment in Russia is a point in case.
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Surely filtering the solution to remove insolubles then evaporating it would remove a lot of the toxins, that should remove red phosphorous and iodine. then addition of water and base, then chloroform/dichloromethane washes to remove unracted codeine/dihydrocodeine then carefully adjusting ph down until desomorphine and any other opioids with a bare phenolic group precipitate out should result in a safer(but still reasonably toxic) product. This should not require any thing thats not easily available. might take too long however as desomorphine lasts about 3 hours right and most krokodil users apparent cook one dose at a time. purifying is not considered synthesis discution right if so sorry and please delete this.
 
reverend random, great find - fascinating article.

I see that a new synthesis (harm reducing way of cooking the drug) is likely to be the least difficult of the plethora of issues that surround this drug in Eurasia. It truly rattles me to the bone that the government there still projects and promotes such an incredibly outdated view on mental health and addiction/drug users. It's a classic Catch-22...you're fucked if you seek help for your addiction and it's heinous physical consequences, because you'll be flagged as a 'narkoman' - if you don't seek treatment, well...one's future appears to be looking pretty green....er, grim. :\

it is insanely depressing for one to realize that a solution to this problem is barely feasible at this point, and only because of social/government aspects. A solution to this problem (or, at the very least a suitable harm reduction availability) would require a complete upheaval of government policies, social stigmas and a discontinuation of the suppressive mindset from Soviet rule that seems to be continually passed on through the generations.

If no knowledge is made available to the people, they will learn little.
If there is a problem with the people, it needs to be fixed.
If there is no knowledge for the people, then there is no way to identify the problem.
If the people can't identify a problem, it is impossible to identify a solution.
 
Personal experiences of Desomorphine

Hi all. Does anybody have any personal experiences of Desomorphine use in the past? I know it is now exploding in the media as Krokodil, but i am asking about Desomorphine, correctly prepared and not the homemade Krokodil. Thanks in Advance :)
 
It's very hard to get pure desomorphine. Afaik, there's no pharmaceutical desomorphine. So the only way you're gonna get it is by making it.
 
Give us opies....

Well missbetty, i didn't have the pleasure to use it, and i guess that very few people here, or maybe none, have try it (and of course we talking about the correctly prepared desomorphine as you said, and not the super dirty Krokolid...which has take so many lives in Russia..:().

Allthough i haven't try it, i think it's a wonderfull opiate, better than heroin, and VERY addictive. But ok, this is just my thought, from some researchers i read. And the fact is that is very difficult to find it, unless you have a chemist friend who have access to the materials, and of course the knowledge to do it..You know what, there are a lot of opiates/opiods that there are super, but there are "under the sun", i don't know why, maybe it's the politic of the pharma companies, their interests, i don't fuckin know...
But the fact i know, is that all the pharma industry, could do much better for the patients with chronic pain, there are people that really suffer, and they need help,but..fuck, the most Drs treat them like junkies, and they don't give them the meds/drugs they need, not to "get high", just to stop or at least to fuckin reduce the fuckin pain...

Anyway, fortunatelly there are some Drs who understand the circumstances of these people, and treat them as they diserved...
Wow, i think that i've gone totally out of the topic, sorry...
And just to mention, some opiods that are wonderfull, (ok, for recreational use..;)), diconal, (it was released in the UK, but they took it off the market..), another one is dipipanone, it went off the market, too...i haven't try them, but people who have try them, says that they're great, better than heroin...
And zipeprol, a cough suryp, it's unbeliavable euphoric, circulating in Korea, but it's very dangerous, it can cause seizures, sometimes fatal...
Have a nice day, and be well and safe..:)




MartinFn
 
Ah thanks for ure insightful response. :) very interesting the opiate family really....:)
Have a fab day too
 
Yeah there was a pharmaceutical desomorphine; it was used in switzerland under the name permonid, (originally synthesised in the US) and proved to be an utter disaster. An opiate approx 15 times stronger than morphine, that wears off in 90 mins to 2 hours? That's a recipe for hard-core addiction.

Interestingly, considering it's effects are so short, it's said the WD's last up to a month, and are far more painful than heroin WD. I wonder why this is?

It sounds perfect: you can buy a few quids worth of codeine pills, and create a drug far stronger than morphine, or even heroin. Thing is, there are lots of desperate addicts out there, and it's unlikely the majority would have the training to create chemically pure desomorphine; it could be a disaster waiting to happen imo. This is one drug I would never be tempted to try; just look at russia.
 
missbetty2010 said:
Hi all. Does anybody have any personal experiences of Desomorphine use in the past? I know it is now exploding in the media as Krokodil, but i am asking about Desomorphine, correctly prepared and not the homemade Krokodil. Thanks in Advance :)
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I have prepared it in the past for myself and a few friends when I was a heroin addict and things were dry, all made possible by my knack for clandestine chemistry, my friends near unlimited supply of codiene tablets his mother hoarded, and the chemicals I could get my hands on at the job I had at the time. When synthesized correctly with proper equipment and purified correctly it doesn't cause any damage. To me the rush was on par with heroin although the high didn't last as long so you would have to boot up more often than you would with heroin.
 
At first, I thought this drug was an urban legend. I mean come on, a drug that turns you into a "zombie" and eats your flesh away, ala Cabin Fever? But no, this seems to be for real; it even led russia to ban otc codeine products. I guess it really proves the resourcefulness of desperate addicts. From what I gather, desomorphine would require some seriously advanced chemistry knowledge; I wonder how those russians turned codeine into an opiate x15 of morphine, with only the most rudimentary tools?!

Shit, I struggled with using water to extract codeine...these guys may be poor, but their sheer inventiveness really is impressive. That's not to say I would try pulling this krokodil shit off; I've seen some of the pictures. Not good.
 
I lived and studied in Russia, at Moscow State University. Yes, I have been in contact with it a few times, and one of the times I did try it. It was extremely stupid but I do not regret it.... not many Westerners can say that they have done it. It feels AMAZING...and it had me nodding off into oblivion. The high has no legs to it, kinda like hydromorph, but the initial bang is very overwhelming, but in a good way.
 
I had honestly never even heard of desomorphine until all these sensationalized media accounts of Krokodil surfaced. I didn't realize that it wasn't available at all - anywhere - as a pharmaceutical anymore... A good friend of mine (who I've encouraged to check out this feed as well) made a good point when we were talking about all of this: This just goes back to the entire FAILURE of the "war on drugs" (genocide of users)... If we had a truly effective approach to drug policy and didn't have draconian prohibitionary laws things like Krokodil would likely never even come around because they wouldn't be NECESSARY. The media has done a disservice to users - per usual - by sensationalizing all of this & only further stigmatizing us & our peers. 8(
 
Id be down to try the pure form, aka <<clean>> form, not the home made shit. Im russian and it saddens me to see what it does to people in my home country
 
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