Bluelight

Thread: 25F-NBOMe

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 28
  1. Collapse Details
    25F-NBOMe 
    #1
    There seems to be only 2 search results in google even mentioning this compound. This compound has to have been considered at one point or another and I am curious as to any information relating to it. While there is no great amount of data on 2C-F or DOF I would like to think that 25F-NBOMe could potentially be of interest.

    To quote wikipedia:

    "At a dose of 250 milligrams, 2C-F produces modest closed-eye visuals accompanied by lethargy [1]. The amphetamine analogue DOF is likely to be more active than the phenethylamine derivative 2C-F, and in animal trials DOF was found to be 1/6 the dosage of the potent hallucinogen DOI, which would make an active dose of DOF likely to be in the 6-18 milligram range, although it is not known to have been tested in humans."

    I would guess by the dosage trends of 2C vs NBOMe that 25F-NBOMe would be in the low milligram range for a dose. Seeing as how interesting the NBOMe family is revealing itself to be I am surprised that 25F hasn't shown up, especially considering all of the fluoro compounds out lately, this has to have crossed someones mind at one point.

    Any input at all would be nice, I know I will get some negative feedback for just bringing this up.
     

  2. Collapse Details
     
    #2
    Bluelighter FlippingTop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    -----
    Posts
    3,461
    never heard of 2c-f...

    Where have you seen it mentioned?
     

  3. Collapse Details
     
    #3
    Bluelighter Cortexiphan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Downtown
    Posts
    97
    2C-F is mentioned in PIHKAL #26. I speculate that the scarcity of this compound is proportional with the difficulty/yield in synthesis
     

  4. Collapse Details
     
    #4
    Senior Moderator
    Neuroscience and Pharmacology Discussion
    Philosophy and Spirituality
    ebola?'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    situated in space-time
    Posts
    20,248
    25F-NBMeo was detailed in the Nichols et al. article exploring the 25X-NBMeo series. I think that he too quickly dismissed the 25F variant due to the overwhelming binding affinities of the 25-halo variants as skewed comparisons. 25F-NBMeo could be an active, nice compound, but just more likely active at 2CX dosages.

    We'd see with more in vitro research.

    ebola

    Getting high? RTFM: Bluelight Drug FAQs | Bluelight WIKI
     

  5. Collapse Details
     
    #5
    If the trend towards higher electronegativity and smaller atomic radius -> higher activity were to continue, this one should be the most potent out of the bunch. The precursor is also unsuspicious as it has no activity.
     

  6. Collapse Details
     
    #6
    Bluelighter Nagelfar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, Washington USA
    Posts
    1,132
    Quote Originally Posted by nuke View Post
    If the trend towards higher electronegativity and smaller atomic radius -> higher activity were to continue, this one should be the most potent out of the bunch. The precursor is also unsuspicious as it has no activity.
    Doesn't lower electronegativity however create higher lipophilicity which increases activity, or am I mistaken here?
     

  7. Collapse Details
     
    #7
    I keep thinking of how 25E-NBOMe is regarded as a disappointment compared to 25D... these don't follow the 2C series with predictable activity, anyone else have a thought on this compound? I would love to hear more on either 25B and 25F.
     

  8. Collapse Details
     
    #8
    Senior Moderator
    Neuroscience and Pharmacology Discussion
    Philosophy and Spirituality
    ebola?'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    situated in space-time
    Posts
    20,248
    Quote Originally Posted by me
    [herp derp]
    Can someone explain to me why we're calling these n-benzoxy-methyl compounds, not n-benzyl-methoxies?

    ebola

    Getting high? RTFM: Bluelight Drug FAQs | Bluelight WIKI
     

  9. Collapse Details
     
    #9
    Moderator
    The Lounge
    Roger&Me's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    LoPro for DexBro
    Posts
    19,600
    I move to call them N-benzyldimethoxyphenethyl methyl ethers

    Has a nice ring to it
     

  10. Collapse Details
     
    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Nagelfar View Post
    Doesn't lower electronegativity however create higher lipophilicity which increases activity, or am I mistaken here?
    You would think, but this doesn't seem to be the case with this series of compounds. There are examples of where lower lipophilicity is offset by higher affinity, for instance nitrazepam is equipotent to diazepam.
     

  11. Collapse Details
    25F-NBOMe experiments so far... And continuing 
    #11
    Hi All,

    I have some 25F-NBOMe, verified as such by LC-MS.

    So far I have done two experiments with it... Once at 250 ug and once at 500 ug both with the liquid insufflation ROA.

    The effects of 25F-NBOMe are still indeterminate:

    * The 250 ug trial yielded not much effect, just a warming, slightly euphoric body feel paired with a slight head change that included increased clarity and some brightening of colors.

    * The 500 ug trial was unfortunately rushed; it was performed too soon after several days of 25E-NBOMe, 25D-NBOMe and 25C-NBOMe experimentation... Tolerance was a definite factor at the point fo the 500 ug 25F-NBOMe trial. The effects with this trial were basically the same as the 250 ug trial, with a slight euphoric push, mental clarity and interconnected thoughts and brightened colors. No real visuals appeared.

    I plan to revisit the 25F-NBOMe experiments when time permits, but it's hard to resist the other 25X-NBOMe species for long enough to reduce tolerance and give 25F-NBOMe a fair trial.

    Is there anyone else on BlueLight that can add their experience?? It's hard to imagine I'm the only person whose tried this!
     

  12. Collapse Details
     
    #12
    Greenlighter
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Valhala
    Posts
    18
    Quote Originally Posted by nuke View Post
    You would think, but this doesn't seem to be the case with this series of compounds. There are examples of where lower lipophilicity is offset by higher affinity, for instance nitrazepam is equipotent to diazepam.
    From what I understand this is the case with ritalin vs cocaine. Ritalin has a stronger binding affinity compared to cola, but cocaine's large clunky structure allows it to pass the BBB much easier.

    Can someone also clarify this for me. Off topic but small tangents are ok here and there if it has a purpose I say. Anywho, when I look at a chemical structure, psychoactive ones obviously, and I focus on what groups are attached to where, I have come to this very crude and probably wrong conclusion to how it actually is but I'll shoot and be informed.

    When I look at lets say amphetamine, the benzene ring is pointing left, the amine on the right, the electronegative cloud over the benzene isn't "concentrated" or instead a low density electronegative force spread thinly across this ring. The charge density over the benzene in my mind is what gives amphetamine/methamphetamine some, but minor effect on serotogenic systems. The star of the show is what's going on over on the amine side. I picture the Nitrogen's unpaired electrons as having a relatively good affinity for whatever binding sites are responsible for its dopamine/NE activity. The methylated version makes it so that instead of the two hydrogen atoms rotating about the N, the methyl group makes the amine group a little less prone to spinning around the nitrogen, causing the unpaired electrons to be a little more focused and directed electronegativity, as a result being more selective for that receptor. Would the methyl group make it more lipophilic to the same receptor, allowing it to penetrate a lipid more easily and reach/bind to its receptor? Or is the methyl group alone responsible for the increased potency? The methylated amine causes the compound to have a higher affinity for serotonin if I'm not mistaken, and I picture this as a result of the amine group on the other end being a little less mobile and stable, making the electron cloud around benzene more stable.

    Now when you look at MDMA/MDA, you have that dimethoxy bridge focusing a giant chunk of the structures electronegativity to the benzene end of the molecule. I imagine the bridge as being a sort of 'knife' or more like a better fitting ligand to serotogenic receptors, and as a result, the star of the show is now the empathogenic character brought on about the increased affinity to those receptors responsible. Is the dopamine receptor's affinity ofset by the heavy electronegative pull on the other end? Because although there is clearly dopamine acting its part in the show, I wonder if serotogenic activity overpowers the effects of the amine or if there is some loss of activity. I'd say its the latter considering getting to sleep after MDMA is worlds easier than it's base methamphetamine structure.
    Then with 4-fluoroamphetamine, there is a flourine attached to the benzene end, again causing a more dense concentration of electrons in that area. The effects then exhibit definite empathy/rolling feel due to a more electronegative benzene, should then cause the increased serotogenic effects, but slightly less dopamine activity was noticed compared to its amphetamine backbone, so again, putting the chemical into a new unique balance of activity. Now I go back and think, does that -CH2- in the dimethoxy add a lipophilic aspect to that electronegative knife provided by the oxygens, almost as a sort of sharper point to that knife, allowing for better cross into membranes or reaching its target receptors. And I'll end this with 5/6-APB. These two compounds replace either oxygen in MDA for a methylene group so it seems like it lost electronegativity, but it's much more lipohilic, perhaps accounting for the longer action than its illegal analogues, would the increase in lipohilic tendencies at that end contribute to the more obvious psychadelic qualities(because looking at the trptamines, theyre kinda bulky and less elegant looking than the PEA's but maybe the high concentration of lipohilic properties along with any -OH, -MeO, -AcO play the role of psychadelic effects? The nitrogen in the indole is also a lot more tensed or I'd say, less stable arrangement compared to the PEA's, hence little DA activity, but still some NE activity?
    Also look at the difference between 5-apb and 6-apb. The only difference between the two is where the oxygen was replaced my the methylene, so the action is still serotogenic but because it can linger around longer, the visuals and psychadelic headspace play a role. I've read that people mix 5/6-apb and are the first few RC's to come anywhere close to an MDxx replacement(a stupid notion or at least a wrongfully guided attempt to recreate an experience of one chemical by a different one, which by default sounds pointless) and are even showing to be on the same level as MDMA/MDA, some people preferring it. I personally prefer MDA over MDMA anyday, not that I dislike it but MDMA is a little too gentle for me, unless I most likely have just been getting crappy actual MDMA and decent MDA, or I just lucked out and got good MDMA when I thought it was MDA. Doubt its the case because whenever I seek out molly, I specifically ask if the roll feels more intense, sensual, euphoric, and a little more 'naughty' than whats usual, oh and the visuals are quite nice, infact a bonus. I started my drug use with psychadelia, weed for a few years before technically, and even if it has psy properties they're subtle at the most, but that's like the same reaction you get when you explain to some people that ethanol is a drug and the flip a shit.
    Last edited by FuriKuri06; 02-12-2011 at 00:25. Reason: I'll try to avoid posting when high ;]
     

  13. Collapse Details
     
    #13
    ^are you fucking kidding me
     

  14. Collapse Details
     
    #14
    Bluelighter Nagelfar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Vancouver, Washington USA
    Posts
    1,132
    Quote Originally Posted by danceofdays View Post
    ^are you fucking kidding me
    I believe it's called "posting under the influence"
     

  15. Collapse Details
     
    #15
    Senior Moderator
    Neuroscience and Pharmacology Discussion
    Other Drugs
    Philosophy & Spirituality
    sekio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    hhohho
    Posts
    14,204
    Haha, holy shit. Start off with SAR talk and then diverge into personal problems.

    Try reposting the last 2/3 of that in the Dark Side or a blog post?
    Guidelines for OD ||| OD Standards ||| OD Directory Read Me First! ||| NPD Rules
    Please read the links above or PM me if I lock your post. R.I.P. F28
     

  16. Collapse Details
     
    #16
    Did anyone else even notice that someone has come forward and said they have tried this? Very excited will check thread again soon.
     

  17. Collapse Details
     
    #17
    Bluelighter Thou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ex-staff Ex-crluelighter.
    Posts
    10,801
    Quote Originally Posted by FuriKuri06 View Post
    From what I understand this is the case with ritalin vs cocaine. Ritalin has a stronger binding affinity compared to cola, but cocaine's large clunky structure allows it to pass the BBB much easier.

    Can someone also clarify this for me. Off topic but small tangents are ok here and there if it has a purpose I say. Anywho, when I look at a chemical structure, psychoactive ones obviously, and I focus on what groups are attached to where, I have come to this very crude and probably wrong conclusion to how it actually is but I'll shoot and be informed.

    When I look at lets say amphetamine, the benzene ring is pointing left, the amine on the right, the electronegative cloud over the benzene isn't "concentrated" or instead a low density electronegative force spread thinly across this ring. The charge density over the benzene in my mind is what gives amphetamine/methamphetamine some, but minor effect on serotogenic systems. The star of the show is what's going on over on the amine side. I picture the Nitrogen's unpaired electrons as having a relatively good affinity for whatever binding sites are responsible for its dopamine/NE activity. The methylated version makes it so that instead of the two hydrogen atoms rotating about the N, the methyl group makes the amine group a little less prone to spinning around the nitrogen, causing the unpaired electrons to be a little more focused and directed electronegativity, as a result being more selective for that receptor. Would the methyl group make it more lipophilic to the same receptor, allowing it to penetrate a lipid more easily and reach/bind to its receptor? Or is the methyl group alone responsible for the increased potency? The methylated amine causes the compound to have a higher affinity for serotonin if I'm not mistaken, and I picture this as a result of the amine group on the other end being a little less mobile and stable, making the electron cloud around benzene more stable.

    Now when you look at MDMA/MDA, you have that dimethoxy bridge focusing a giant chunk of the structures electronegativity to the benzene end of the molecule. I imagine the bridge as being a sort of 'knife' or more like a better fitting ligand to serotogenic receptors, and as a result, the star of the show is now the empathogenic character brought on about the increased affinity to those receptors responsible. Is the dopamine receptor's affinity ofset by the heavy electronegative pull on the other end? Because although there is clearly dopamine acting its part in the show, I wonder if serotogenic activity overpowers the effects of the amine or if there is some loss of activity. I'd say its the latter considering getting to sleep after MDMA is worlds easier than it's base methamphetamine structure.
    Then with 4-fluoroamphetamine, there is a flourine attached to the benzene end, again causing a more dense concentration of electrons in that area. The effects then exhibit definite empathy/rolling feel due to a more electronegative benzene, should then cause the increased serotogenic effects, but slightly less dopamine activity was noticed compared to its amphetamine backbone, so again, putting the chemical into a new unique balance of activity. Now I go back and think, does that -CH2- in the dimethoxy add a lipophilic aspect to that electronegative knife provided by the oxygens, almost as a sort of sharper point to that knife, allowing for better cross into membranes or reaching its target receptors. And I'll end this with 5/6-APB. These two compounds replace either oxygen in MDA for a methylene group so it seems like it lost electronegativity, but it's much more lipohilic, perhaps accounting for the longer action than its illegal analogues, would the increase in lipohilic tendencies at that end contribute to the more obvious psychadelic qualities(because looking at the trptamines, theyre kinda bulky and less elegant looking than the PEA's but maybe the high concentration of lipohilic properties along with any -OH, -MeO, -AcO play the role of psychadelic effects? The nitrogen in the indole is also a lot more tensed or I'd say, less stable arrangement compared to the PEA's, hence little DA activity, but still some NE activity?
    Also look at the difference between 5-apb and 6-apb. The only difference between the two is where the oxygen was replaced my the methylene, so the action is still serotogenic but because it can linger around longer, the visuals and psychadelic headspace play a role. I've read that people mix 5/6-apb and are the first few RC's to come anywhere close to an MDxx replacement(a stupid notion or at least a wrongfully guided attempt to recreate an experience of one chemical by a different one, which by default sounds pointless) and are even showing to be on the same level as MDMA/MDA, some people preferring it. I personally prefer MDA over MDMA anyday, not that I dislike it but MDMA is a little too gentle for me, unless I most likely have just been getting crappy actual MDMA and decent MDA, or I just lucked out and got good MDMA when I thought it was MDA. Doubt its the case because whenever I seek out molly, I specifically ask if the roll feels more intense, sensual, euphoric, and a little more 'naughty' than whats usual, oh and the visuals are quite nice, infact a bonus. I started my drug use with psychadelia, weed for a few years before technically, and even if it has psy properties they're subtle at the most, but that's like the same reaction you get when you explain to some people that ethanol is a drug and the flip a shit.
    Have you experience with this chemical? We're a concerned family... We're interested.


    Please document this in detail.
     

  18. Collapse Details
     
    #18
    Greenlighter
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Valhala
    Posts
    18
    ^ Forgive me for this, but you're post is coming off as vague. Do you mean the thread title's chemical or one of the chems in my tangent story? I can comment to you about ritalin, coke, mdpv, and methylone(which although main effects are different, the cathionone structure seems to rear its ugly head in larger doses of either, small doses greatly reduce this effect), amphs, mdma and mda(yes I'm almost positive I can discern the two easily), 4-fa, these I'm familiar with. Got a few other chems, if again, this is what you're refering to, under my belt, plenty of various PEA and tryptamine psychadelics to compare effects and shit to.

    Oh and sorry about the parts after that tid bit, was a tad too open at the time ;]
     

  19. Collapse Details
     
    #19
    Having a, quote, large clunky structure, unquote, actually usually decreases BBB penetration
     

  20. Collapse Details
     
    #20
    Bluelighter LSDMDMA&AMP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    A petting zoo
    Posts
    11,685
    For what its wroth, teh diggity asked about methamphetamine, the methyl group makes it more lipid soluble and able to pass the BBB easier.
     

  21. Collapse Details
     
    #21
    Moderator
    The Lounge
    Roger&Me's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    LoPro for DexBro
    Posts
    19,600
    Quote Originally Posted by FuriKuri06 View Post
    [etc...etc...] Now when you look at MDMA/MDA, you have that dimethoxy bridge focusing a giant chunk of the structures electronegativity to the benzene end of the molecule. I imagine the bridge as being a sort of 'knife' or more like a better fitting ligand to serotogenic receptors, and as a result, the star of the show is now the empathogenic character brought on about the increased affinity to those receptors responsible. [etc...etc...]
    Not even trying to be rude at all, but your understanding of stimulant and entactogen SAR seems pretty half baked. Bridging the dimethoxy only serves to change the orientation of the m-oxygen's nonbonding electrons, so that they lie anti to the 4-pos. That, in turn, changes the binding profile from a 5-HT2A agonist (e.g. 3,4-DMA) to a substrate at SERT/DAT/NET (eg. MDA).
     

  22. Collapse Details
     
    #22
    Did anyone even notice reformers bioassay? Anyway, thanks for the datapoint, reformer
    People should spend less time theorising about pharmacology and/or chemistry and more time studying what's already known.
     

  23. Collapse Details
     
    #23
    Wish I could wipe this thread clean of the irrelevant posts, Erny where are you at and do you have anything to say about this one?
     

  24. Collapse Details
     
    #24
    Senior Moderator
    Neuroscience and Pharmacology Discussion
    Philosophy and Spirituality
    ebola?'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    situated in space-time
    Posts
    20,248
    Quote Originally Posted by reformer

    I plan to revisit the 25F-NBOMe experiments when time permits, but it's hard to resist the other 25X-NBOMe species for long enough to reduce tolerance and give 25F-NBOMe a fair trial.
    Intriguing data. Would you say that the effects, while subtle, proved clearly discernible from placebo or not?

    ebola

    Getting high? RTFM: Bluelight Drug FAQs | Bluelight WIKI
     

  25. Collapse Details
    Yes, but... 
    #25
    Quote Originally Posted by ebola? View Post
    Would you say that the effects, while subtle, proved clearly discernible from placebo or not?
    Yes, but my reason for saying so might sound odd. When it came down to it, I felt that there was a clear, although not very pronounced shift from baseline.

    But what makes me pretty sure that "something happened" was more that I experienced that weird in-between state where it feels like your starting to take off, but then you never quite get there. It's surely not baseline, but it doesn't manifest into fully discernible qualitative effects, let alone quantitative effects capable of comparison to previous experiences with other research tools.

    It just kept hanging around for a couple of hours, so I ended up deciding to give up on those experiments and add some 25C-NBOMe to the mix in order to properly "launch" and get out of the fugue that was keeping me in limbo.

    Now I'm fully intrigued that there aren't more reports on this molecule, and I've resolved to give it a fair go. I haven't touched a 5HT2A agonist for a couple of months, so it should be pretty soon.
     

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •