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Life exists so that the universe can observe itself

"dimensions of aliveness"
i mean that i believe that we live in infinity and life is just one option, one way that a observing observer could receive information about being observe by its own self
life being just one medium in a sea of infinity of other option ... What?

as for the universe being pointless without life
i dont see it as being anymore purposeful by being able to observe itself I never said that either
i think its a matter of transposition here where you yourself personify the universe with having human quality, human value (and doesnt that makes it closer to a deity?) lol, what? no.
arent you simply saying that you want to feel that the universe does have a purpose ? No. It might, though, who's to say?
and why would you want that ? I mean, I don't really care either way. I'm going to be dead long before that purpose is achieved anyhow.
because it makes life meaningful ? My life is meaningful because I am the one who is living it.
does anything need a purpose if you yourself can give it meaning Nothing needs a purpose. We give purpose and meaning to other things and ourselves in relevance to us humans.
and isnt that what you are doing here by saying : "and it might be so that the universe can self observe." No, I'm saying that life might exist so that the universe can self observe. What are you ... trying to get at?
you are giving meaning to the universe so that the universe can give meaning to your life personallyNo, I'm not, because I already give myself meaning, because I am me.
but you dont need the universe to have a purpose to you yourself give it whatever subjective meaning you care to give it, instead of the other way around
or else doesnt that share similarity to intelligent design No, it doesn't. I'm not saying there is a God. I'm not even saying we were intelligently designed. Where are you going with this?

and when you say : "Isn't that knowledge of life? "
i divide myself in 3, knowledge is in the head, understanding is in the heart and experience is in the animal body
so i would say they can experience fear, they are program to go towards the light, towards what feels good, and to avoid the darkness, what feels bad
doesnt mean that they know that they are alive, they are experiencing without knowing

Actually, blood flows in the heart. Everything that is you, all of the sums of experience and knowledge and personality that you call "ninjadanlarbretabar" is in your brain. That's why when it dies, you die.



how high are you?
 
lol

hes a ninja, dude.


life existing to only be an observer for the universe is pretty wild sounding too, though...
;-)
but, i love the thought, and believe in it to different extents.

the Ocean wouldnt exist, with out observation from the Moon, with out the Ocean neither would we exist, but what is more important?
the Ocean the Moon, or our existence among them?
 
lol

hes a ninja, dude.


life existing to only be an observer for the universe is pretty wild sounding too, though...
;-)
but, i love the thought, and believe in it to different extents.

the Ocean wouldnt exist, with out observation from the Moon, with out the Ocean neither would we exist, but what is more important?
the Ocean the Moon, or our existence among them?

well, the moon and the ocean are pretty important for life on earth. and do inanimate objects observe? or can they only be taken as reference points?
 
^alright, so maybe the moon observing the ocean, is a bit romantic.


seems we can give credit to inanimate objects, as being what is observing us, and giving us as individuals credit, and definition towards our own individuality, though. in this sense, what inanimate objects we gather, are the greater awareness of our reality. where we chose to live in nature, or urbanized areas, can be defining as well. what flowers we might grow, and which colors we want them to be, the geometric shape and structure of them, how those colors shapes and aromatic values effect us.

these things do not observe per say, but the unique attributes brought over-time effected and manipulated by us, in their presence of us, is in observation of us very telling.
 
"Actually, blood flows in the heart. Everything that is you, all of the sums of experience and knowledge and personality that you call "ninjadanlarbretabar" is in your brain. That's why when it dies, you die."

your brain is connected to your central nervous system + peripheral nervous system (which consist of your somatic nervous system + autonomic nervous system)
you aint simply a brain you are a organism

and when you say "That's why when it dies, you die." you could say the same thing about the heart
and btw the heart does have neurons and so does your lungs and your guts
(ever heard about cellular memory and how some people after getting a hearth transplant ended up with memory pattern from the donor)

as for memory there is suggestion saying that it might be stored in the body and outside the brain
and science still cant find where consciousness is produce

if you have a scientific link that says that its all in the brain please share
the idea that its all in the brain is pretty old and has being proven wrong
 
if you have a scientific link that says that its all in the brain please share
the idea that its all in the brain is pretty old and has being proven wrong

I would be careful about claiming that such a theory is outright refuted, just because the connection between the experience of consciousness and physical processes isn't well understood doesn't mean that it is impossible that there is such a connection
 
and btw the heart does have neurons and so does your lungs and your guts
(ever heard about cellular memory and how some people after getting a hearth transplant ended up with memory pattern from the donor)

as for memory there is suggestion saying that it might be stored in the body and outside the brain
and science still cant find where consciousness is produce


i have no interest in trying to jam up this thread
, i am fascinated...and apologize if i seem to be derailing or something --

but 'cellular-memory' is one of the most tangible useful possibilities we have to explore.

DNA/RNA is whats next for us to not fuck up...there is no scientific/religious institution or entity that is going to give the go-a-head, for this sort of concept of healing and life progression to be released as fact for humanity. by the time the technology existed for us to be able to prove this to us- we only believe what we are told as sheepie-sleepy followers -it will be far too late, for Christs sake, as the Bible reiterates over and over...we are the LORDS, not the FDA or some Ministry Dept. the Government or "Church" entity.

the dreamer craves the comfort of the bed made for him....


just do it
 
I would be careful about claiming that such a theory is outright refuted, just because the connection between the experience of consciousness and physical processes isn't well understood doesn't mean that it is impossible that there is such a connection

hehe yeah i almost added a imo at the end but went bah
the cns includes the spinal cord which isnt in the brain

and it wasnt in reference to only consciousness but to this :
"Everything that is you, all of the sums of experience and knowledge and personality that you call "ninjadanlarbretabar" is in your brain."
and that involved more than consciousness

and i would suggest this documentary about heart transplant memory: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5tBXE28pFY&feature=related
 
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^actually, the spinal chord has a lining of grey brain matter in its sheeting, that nerves run through...brain matter is developed during meditation in the left frontal lobe, i am curious if it is also in the spine, this would account for some strange happenings in some Spiritual beliefs, such as the Kundalini...which is recognized by Western and Eastern faiths in different forms of context.

what sort of consciousness, awareness, perception, 'common-sense' is in there?!?

also Melanin, runs up the spine, into the Medulla, where it is then funneled into 12 chambers of the brain, beofre it is finally realized in the Pineal Gland...


;)
 
You know, guys, both sides of the debate here are merely just trying to feed their own egos. JUST MERELY trying to elucidate on all the imperfections of the other, when it is the imperfections of the self that are causing the disagreements in the first place. And thus, the universe brings us into the world, and then kills us as it will, and it continues this onslaught against perfect stillness just the same.
This post brought to you by:
My imperfections. ;)
 
You know, guys, both sides of the debate here are merely just trying to feed their own egos.

it aint a matter of right or wrong its a matter of entertaining ourself by creating opposition for the sake of having a discussion
its mental masturbation and its fun time because it really doesnt matter where we are going with this
its about the road trip not the destination, but you do need a destination to have a road trip :)

this thread was about a quote followed by "think about it"
thats kinda worthless to think about it in a discussion board
the point is to talk about it
to talk about something and if there is no direction to the thread then you make one as you go along
the way you see it you seem to believe that we got caught up emotionally into it without realizing it
i would suggest otherwise (for my part)
tho i must admit i was playing with a blind guy for the sake seeing how he would react,
ive seen him post stuff against religion so i though it was funny how his quote was to me similar to how intelligent design view things
intelligent design dont want to mention god they imply it by saying what that bill oreilly meme says : "you cant explain that"
they imply a intelligent source as a purpose to the universe
which to me correlates with the feeling behind the universe evolving a brain so that it could observe (appreciate) itself
so if you change life for human, universe for god and observe for appreciate, and if you change the timeframe from the observer to the observed you get something like : god created human, so we have a purpose

because whats the meaning of life? to love god because he created us
why did he created us ? so that he could receive our appreciation
why do we appreciate him ? because he made it possible for us to observe him
why do we observe him ? because he created a universe where this is a possibility
why is this a possibility ? because life was created inside that universe
why was life created inside that universe ? so that it(you) can observe god
what is god ? he is a omnipotent being which means that he is everything, every human including you, you are part of god
so why did god created a universe where life can observe itself ? because this gives meaning to this life
the idea of a universe being able to observe itself is a idea of a universe self reflecting
we as human have this possibility
so why bring the idea that the universe having this possibility too makes life more meaningful ??
because it puts us in a relation with a greater being
because if the universe can self reflect then it is conscious
and the universe is omnipresent
so humans are in relation to an omnipresce that gives them meaning
so there is a god expect that the quote calls it a self aware universe instead of god
and if god is as much the observer than the observed then instead of calling it god or the universe it could simply call it you
because you are the one giving meaning to that quote using your feelings
why is there a thread about this quote ? because someone feel emotionally attache to that thread
why would someone get emotionally interested in that quote ? maybe because it feels good to "think about it"
because it connects you to a greater purpose where this whole life, this whole universe isnt pointless
if the universe has a reason to exist then it can give you a greater sense of reason to live this life
but then thats what religions are about
giving you a greater purpose by suggesting that there is something bigger than your own individuality, that there is a whole you are part of, there is greater meaning than your own, that your life has a greater meaning on a deeper level

so i see the op as someone who talks trash about religion because he is still emotionally hurt that he was force to believe in non sense stories that he had to leave behind at some point because his ability to apply logic and use reason pushed all that religion non sense off the door
but then that did left him in a situation where his brain has being wired to connect to a sense of greater belonging
why would the op post in a forum called Philosophy and Spirituality if not to find some sense that might be absent from science and technology
the quote doesnt talk about god or deity or religion but it does talk about philosophy
philosophy can lead you to finding sense in all of it, it can also do the opposite
but in this case the op didnt include anything more than "think about it" as to suggest a sense of wonder
so personally i though it would be fun to go against it for the sake of seeing where the op could go with it, how he would define it as to not be related to any similarity with religious idea about the universe having a reason why it came to be

its all in good fun %)
 
Existence just "is".. it is kinda pointless really in that it doesn't matter one way or the other. It is just infinity/a hall of mirrors, a mathematical transcendental number trailing off into the distance, a holograpic fractal.. we assign meaning to it as humans because that's our skill.. projection. If you investigate who you really are you'll find awareness underlies everything.. that at the deepest level you, me, everyone is that same awareness. We are infinity expressing itself, not because it has to or wants to, it just "does".
 
How can I observe the mental state of another entity?

Telepathic contact can allow you to be part of a shared experience.
Language & other media can sometimes give a reasonably accurate observation of part (maybe even a large part) of the mental state of other entities.
 
Language & other media can sometimes give a reasonably accurate observation of part (maybe even a large part) of the mental state of other entities.
I'm not sure that's true. We can agree on a common referent for language, but that doesn't mean that we experience that referent in the same way. We both agree that daffodils are yellow, but that doesn't mean that what you call "yellow" isn't actually the colour I call "purple", or indeed a colour that I've never seen. Of course, I can deduce that, given that our brains are very similar (well, pretty similar), that we are in fact seeing the same colour, but that's a conclusion arrived at through reasoning and assumption, not direct observation.
 
So this language, this might be off topic for some of you (let's call it a tangent), but how do psychedelics factor into this? I mean, are we losing the war on drugs? I'm hoping we bust this one ha.
 
I'm not sure that's true. We can agree on a common referent for language, but that doesn't mean that we experience that referent in the same way. We both agree that daffodils are yellow, but that doesn't mean that what you call "yellow" isn't actually the colour I call "purple", or indeed a colour that I've never seen. Of course, I can deduce that, given that our brains are very similar (well, pretty similar), that we are in fact seeing the same colour, but that's a conclusion arrived at through reasoning and assumption, not direct observation.


You're right we cannot "know" some things, but can reason the close similarities.
Telepathy is perhaps the only way to "know", then again is the experience changed because there's an external(?) connection ?

The war on drugs is being lost with both sides losing.

I don't know about the plants
 
Damn monkeys.. I am the horizon though, right?? (;

P.S. Thanks for the answer there you two. :)
 
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