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Opioids Cimetidine Habit

Tchort

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
Messages
2,392
I have noticed anecdotal evidence over the years of Methadone and Buprenorphine maintenance patients in the US who use/abuse Cimetidine (Tagamet) on a daily basis to increase the potency, duration, sedation, etc of either MMT or BMT. It is a commonly known fact, even among patients/users who do not know the specific activity of CYP450-CYP3A4-inhibition as well as typical anti-histaminic activity, that Tagamet will 'boost' their legal maintanence opioids. Sometimes this information is passed down through clinic patients to other clinic patients, or even from employees of clinics to patients (also anecdotal), as well as a plethora of internet resources on the subject including police reports of stolen OTC medications for these purposes to websites like this one giving out the information.

It has been demonstrated that daily administration of Cimetidine (or any active CYP3A4 inhibitor) before taking an opioid such as Methadone or Buprenorphine will alter the blood serum levels of said opioid, in a way creating a pseudo-dose increase. The body is 'tricked' into believing more Methadone or Buprenorphine is taken, and reacts accordingly through the effects received through combining Tagamet and an opioid (specifically legal maintanence opioid). Discontinuation of the Cimetidine/Tagamet by an MMT or BMT patient who has been taking specifically larger than recommended amounts of the OTC drug (400mg-2,000mg+) daily for a lengthy period of time ought to result in opioid withdrawal syndrome symptoms similar to having a dose reduction (severity dependant upon individual reaction and sensitivity to Cimetidine and the opioid in question, individual dose of opioid and Cimetidine, length of use and dose of Cimetidine and opioid, etc).

I have yet to find someone willing to admit to having a Tagamet habit- someone who has started a daily routine of taking Cimetidine/Tagamet before taking their daily dose of Methadone or Buprenorphine noticed this negative reaction when they stop taking the Cimetidine normally on a daily basis, for whom it has become a problem, or who has taken steps to taper their dose of Cimetidine/Tagamet to alleviate the problem.

Are there any BL members who have experienced this problem? While I am specifically interested in MMT or BMT patients and Cimetidine/Tagamet, which I think would be the most common CYP450 inhibition habit problem due to the widespread knowledge, are there any posters who are dependant opioid users who use potentiators (specifically CYP450 inhibitors such as GFJ, Ranitidine, etc) who have noticed and experienced this problem?
 
Discontinuation of the Cimetidine/Tagamet by an MMT or BMT patient who has been taking specifically larger than recommended amounts of the OTC drug (400mg-2,000mg+) daily for a lengthy period of time ought to result in opioid withdrawal syndrome symptoms similar to having a dose reduction (severity dependant upon individual reaction and sensitivity to Cimetidine and the opioid in question, individual dose of opioid and Cimetidine, length of use and dose of Cimetidine and opioid, etc).
I agree. Though I haven't heard of any accounts of it either, it would certainly happen like you said.

The body is 'tricked' into believing more Methadone or Buprenorphine is taken, and reacts accordingly through the effects received through combining Tagamet and an opioid
I'm not sure if you're just simplifying for the reader's benefit, but as you mentioned earlier the increased effects is due to enzyme inhibition. More of the physical opioid drug is actually getting into the blood stream and sticking around (no trickery at all :)). Removing the inhibition results in a decreased dose of opioids which could cause withdrawal.

The Ultimate Opiate Potentiation Thread v2.0
 
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I've used GFJ/Cimetidine to potentiate hydrocodone a bunch of times. After about a week or so of doing this every day, I noticed that I felt like I was cheating myself by not using either GFJ/Cimetidine.

I would assume for someone using methadone for maintanence that using potentiaters could really wreck your rhythm.
 
I'm not sure if you're just simplifying for the reader's benefit, but as you mentioned earlier the increased effects is due to enzyme inhibition. More of the physical opioid drug is actually getting into the blood stream and sticking around (no trickery at all ). Removing the inhibition results in a decreased dose of opioids which could cause withdrawal.

Simplifying :) Though I would argue that by causing more of a particular opioid to enter and stay longer in the bloodstream than it would under normal physiological circumstances for that individual is a 'trick' being played on the physiology; particularly for an MMT or BMT patient as Oxide states:

I would assume for someone using methadone for maintanence that using potentiaters could really wreck your rhythm.

For those who haven't run into such people or the incidence, I would quote the following as simply more anecdotal evidence of a problem with potentiators in general and MMT or BMT:

Prilosec the target of attempted theft
Drug boosts euphoria from methadone
December 26, 2007|By Lamaur Stancil Vero Beach Press Journal

A recent attempt to steal a large amount of Prilosec from a local store probably is not the beginning of long-term heartburn for local police or pharmacies.

Yet Prilosec is one of the medications illegal drug users and manufacturers look to for enhancing their high.

That could be why five people recently tried stealing more than 100 boxes of the over-the-counter heartburn pills from the Wal-Mart here.

Police spokesman said it was the second foiled attempt this year to steal a large quantity of the drug from the store.

The suspects were caught before they left the property, but didn't explain their motivations to Sebastian police. But according to the U.S. Justice Department, Prilosec is believed to increase or intensify the high when taken with methadone.

A Maryland drug task force noted an increase in thefts of Prilosec in Baltimore last year, federal officials said. But locally, no law enforcement agency in Indian River County had a report of the drug being stolen prior to the Wal-Mart incident.

http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2007-12-26/news/0712250091_1_prilosec-pharmacies-drug

The number of posts by MMT and BMT patients in potentiation (specifically American, involving OTC drugs) threads, as well as the number interested in such topics, here on BL lead me to suspect there is a small minority population of MMT & BMT patients who are dual-dependant on Methadone or Buprenorphine and an OTC potentiator (though Cimetidine would be my primary guess) for the reasons specified. And I'd imagine some lurk or post here on BL :)
 
I wouldn't see this as an addiction to cimetidine, but simply an opiate addiction, because these withdrawal symptoms could be alleviated by increasing the dose of the opiate.
 
i have stolen many times from stores to get my tagamet to increase my highs. if i have tagamet ill pop atleast 800-1000mgs before each dose, and i usually never run out of tagamet or grapefruit juice...:)
 
Definitely, I am taking tagamet since I am unable to get Dilaudid brand name pills to slam. So before I got on methadone and now suboxone, I was using 130mg Kadians with my trustworthy 600mg tagamets and 2 x 50mg hydroxyzine. It worked VERY well with methadone and is significant with bupe too, especially when a better ROA is used (snorted). I couldn't do without it. I got a one year script from my doctor simply asking for it saying I had it before and asked for the 600mg horsepills, heh, thinking asking the 800mg ones would be overkill.

My GP is old and old school and didn't raise an eyebrow, he has more problems scripting benzos than opiates too, so I think he is not a quack (benzo wd is way worse...).

Although in all honesty I think it's the synergy of it all that makes it close to a good M like nod.
 
Hey Oblivion,

I'm having a difficult time understanding your post. I think there's some very VALUABLE information in there but I want to mae sure I fully understand it.

I'm prescribed 120mg methadone daily. I've tried the Tagamet approach before, never with much success.

MY QUESTION IS, HOW LONG BEFORE YOU TAKE YOUR METHADONE/SUBOXONE/ETC ARE YOU TAKING 600 mg TAGAMET????

I keep reading reports that it's effective but I don't know if I'm waiting long enough to take the methadone after taking the cimetidine.

PLEASE HELP!

Thanks so much for reading and your consideration.
 
^^almost all things I've read on Tagamet for opioid potentiation say to take 45 mins to an hour before taking said opiate.
 
Bumping old post

but I believe I have a cimetidine habit, I've been taking cimetidine (followed by lope) everyday for the past month or so (about a gram a day) I am worried about what long term effects this could do, any comments?

Also I do feel weird if I do not take my cimetidine but if I don't take cimetidine I don't take lope and I usually have dope too so it's hard to say if one can become physically dependent on cimetidine to the point of withdrawal and discomfort from discontinuation. I'll account when the time comes but I do plan on tapering down with lope and tapering the cimetidine as well.
 
I always taper it or I get MAD heartburn.. Especially the dose recommended for potentiation. Somewhat unrelated but yea
 
I notice a decrease when i don't take my DXM with my sub dose, but not enough to get withdrawals, that may not be even relevant and DXM might not even work for any potentiation/tolerance change so it also could just be placebo

my 2 cents
 
Im trying the cimetidine before my second sub dosage of the day since I take my first sub in the a.m just 2mg off an N8strip. Well I just took 600mg of cimetidine and im going to wait an hour and then take my second dose of 2mg sublingually with an alcoholic solution. Ill let yall know the difference for me. Ive been in Suboxone for almost a month now at 12mgs a day but I only take 4 and just stock up ahahahsh so much Suboxone :)
But anyways I just took the cimetidine at 600mg dosage before my sub.
ill let yall know, my wife is also doing this with me so, ill tell you both are reports with this., just want to add we both popped them cimetidine pills and like 5mins later we were fucking lol, idk if theres a connection lol but thats another story, for another day.
 
I have noticed anecdotal evidence over the years of Methadone and Buprenorphine maintenance patients in the US who use/abuse Cimetidine (Tagamet) on a daily basis to increase the potency, duration, sedation, etc of either MMT or BMT. It is a commonly known fact, even among patients/users who do not know the specific activity of CYP450-CYP3A4-inhibition as well as typical anti-histaminic activity, that Tagamet will 'boost' their legal maintanence opioids. Sometimes this information is passed down through clinic patients to other clinic patients, or even from employees of clinics to patients (also anecdotal), as well as a plethora of internet resources on the subject including police reports of stolen OTC medications for these purposes to websites like this one giving out the information.

It has been demonstrated that daily administration of Cimetidine (or any active CYP3A4 inhibitor) before taking an opioid such as Methadone or Buprenorphine will alter the blood serum levels of said opioid, in a way creating a pseudo-dose increase. The body is 'tricked' into believing more Methadone or Buprenorphine is taken, and reacts accordingly through the effects received through combining Tagamet and an opioid (specifically legal maintanence opioid). Discontinuation of the Cimetidine/Tagamet by an MMT or BMT patient who has been taking specifically larger than recommended amounts of the OTC drug (400mg-2,000mg+) daily for a lengthy period of time ought to result in opioid withdrawal syndrome symptoms similar to having a dose reduction (severity dependant upon individual reaction and sensitivity to Cimetidine and the opioid in question, individual dose of opioid and Cimetidine, length of use and dose of Cimetidine and opioid, etc).

I have yet to find someone willing to admit to having a Tagamet habit- someone who has started a daily routine of taking Cimetidine/Tagamet before taking their daily dose of Methadone or Buprenorphine noticed this negative reaction when they stop taking the Cimetidine normally on a daily basis, for whom it has become a problem, or who has taken steps to taper their dose of Cimetidine/Tagamet to alleviate the problem.

Are there any BL members who have experienced this problem? While I am specifically interested in MMT or BMT patients and Cimetidine/Tagamet, which I think would be the most common CYP450 inhibition habit problem due to the widespread knowledge, are there any posters who are dependant opioid users who use potentiators (specifically CYP450 inhibitors such as GFJ, Ranitidine, etc) who have noticed and experienced this problem?


My Girl and I, had a cimetidine addiction and at first you don't even realize the cimetidine addiction. We both would take a good amount before our bupe maintenance. I also took it for my benzodiazepines :) Does cimetidine potentiate phenobarbital by chance.?? Please shed light on that subject anyone. I know cimetidine potentiates benzodiazepines and BMT. (BUPE)

BUT as for discussion about this does cimetidine heighten the high or lengthen the duration?

If im not mistaken it effects the liver enzyme CYP3A4 and *I think CYP450*

FILL ME IN ON ANY AND ALL INFORMATION ABOUT THESE SUBJECTS THANK YOU!!!!

As for the cimetidine addiction it creates IBS and a lot of stomach issues. Do not recommend!.

Maybe everynow and then or if your stash is low but that is it. Trust me you dont want to add another addiction along with w.e your currently using.

Peace n Love
Keep in Touch
James?
 
How could you possibly be addicted to the non-psychoactive antacid cimetidine? Overuse will cause problems, that's true.

Now, here's the thing. You need the liver enzyme cytochrome P450 monooxygenase also known as CYP3A4 to turn your buprenorphine into norbuprenorphine, which is 10x more potent at the receptor that opioid users on bluelight are usually after. Sadly, it doesn't get into your brain as easily.

So taking cimetidine before that would mean buprenorphine might linger in your blood a little longer, or it might just get flagged and turned to pee at the same rate. But, you're not doing yourself a lot of favors by doing this.

James, with your crippling cimetidine addiction, have you considered loperamide to help you get through withdrawals?

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