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Thread: Why is there fluoride in SSRIs

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    Why is there fluoride in SSRIs 
    #1
    Capsule
    I came across a thread about someone wanting to discontinue their Celexa because it had fluoride in it. which led me to look it up and find that most common SSRI's nowdays have fluoride in them. I thought ingesting this was dangerous, hence why we are not supposed to swallow toothpaste. Can anyone tell me why fluoride is in most common SSRIs today? including celexa, paxil, and prozac? wouldnt the fluoride be ingested with the pill and wouldnt that be bad for ones body? does anyone have and answer? I found this on a website

    "Selective serotonin re-uptake inhibitor (SSRI) drugs are commonly prescribed to treat depression.

    These drugs incorporate fluorine into their chemical structure.


    Brand Name Generic Name
    Celexa ‣ citalopram
    Lexapro ‣ escitalopram oxalate
    Luvox ‣ fluvoxamine maleate
    Paxil ‣ paroxetine
    Prozac ‣ fluoxetine
    Zoloft ‣ sertraline (chlorine instead of fluorine)


    The drugs are designed to block metabolism of the neurotransmitter serotonin. The result is increased serotonin.

    It appears this may not be a good approach. Excess of a neurotransmitter makes it excitotoxic.

    This is significant because depression is an excitotoxic condition -- it is the result of excess glutamate activation in the frontal cortex of the brain (basis here and here). Manipulating the level of serotonin does not address the underlying problem of excess glutamate. Instead it simply adds burden to the degenerative condition already underway. Recent research indicates that genetic variability in glutamate activity can make a significant number of people more sensitive to SSRI effects, including a much higher likelihood of expressing suicidal thoughts.

    Serotonin receptors exist throughout the body. Altering the level of serotonin affects the entire body, not just the brain. Elevated serotonin is associated with

    Agitation
    Altered REM sleep behavior
    Alzheimer's
    Anxiety
    Autism spectrum disorders
    Depression
    Exhibitionism
    Hostility
    Impulsive behavior
    Insomnia
    Mental retardation
    Mood disorders (wild mood swings)
    Nightmares
    Organic brain disease
    Psychosis
    Reckless driving
    Schizophrenia
    Substance abuse
    Suicide
    Violence


    Several things happen as the SSRI forces a constant excitotoxic state -- serotonin receptors die off, serotonin levels become depleted, and a cascade of metabolic disruption takes place. The person becomes acutely worse. Additional conditions SSRI's have been shown to directly trigger include

    Angina pectoris
    Atrial fibrillation
    Bone fractures
    Cardiac arrhythmia
    Congestive heart failure
    Diarrhea
    Dystonia
    Gastrointestinal distress
    Hemorrhages
    Hypertension
    Hypotension
    Migraine syncope
    Mood swings
    Myocardial infarction
    Nausea
    Obesity
    Osteoporosis
    Seizures
    Sexual dysfunction
    Tachycardia
    Trigeminy
    Vascular headache
    Vomiting


    Also, any SSRI crosses the placenta and exposes the fetus to its effects.


    There are hundreds of high-profile cases of murders, suicides, school shootings, incidents of workplace violence, road rage and other events -- all tied to the use of prescription SSRI drugs. "

    Source ( http://www.sailhome.org/Concerns/Bod.../Fluoride.html )
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    #2
    http://www.fluoridealert.org/health/brain/

    Nazi's used flouride to keep jewish prisoners "dumbed down" and "complacent" apparently..

    Since world war 2 finished (and Nazi research had been handed over / stolen) we have had flouride put in our water supply. Go figure.

    I don't disbelieve http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_f...iracy_theories <-this. (Not saying thats 100% right.. there are other things that could be going on or other reasons for it but i think the overall reason for flouridation of water is to control the masses (or atleast keep them more complacent))

    Government: It helps fight cavities. Research: No it doesn't.
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    #3
    ^government: fluoride replaces hydroxide in apatite increasing hardness of teeth
    its true

    and they do not contain "fluoride"
    they have covalently bonded fluorines in their structure.
    several also have cyano groups, but it doesn't mean they have the same effect as hydrogen cyanide.

    those conspiracy theories are ill informed and unfounded.
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    #4
    nice response. thats the kind of responses im looking for on here. and with 27 million people taking SSRIs in 2005, that number has probably gone up exponentially by now. It really makes you wonder. Why put a poison in something thats supposed to make you less depressed when it can do all these things listed above? Im going to talk to my pyschiatrist and see what he says the reason for all the fluoride based antidepressants are. but I dont see him again until jan 2011 so i wont get an answer from him for some time. maybe someone on here can find out sooner. hopefully people will read this thread and really think
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    #5
    Bluelighter hamhurricane's Avatar
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    I assume this is your first time looking at a molecular diagram?

    I am going to let you know about an even more diabolical government conspiracy - look again at the citalopram molecule - it contains BENZENE one of the most carcinogenic mind controlling chemicals known!
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    #6
    Bluelighter ikkyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HT harm redux View Post
    depression is an excitotoxic condition -- it is the result of excess glutamate activation in the frontal cortex of the brain (basis here and here).
    Care to link me to a source that supports this?
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    #7
    Bluelighter MeDieViL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ikkyu View Post
    Care to link me to a source that supports this?
    I doubt he can, NMDA receptors have been associated with depression but this is far from evidence that depression is a exitoxic condition, but this thread is full of nonesense anyway.
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    #8
    Yeah i thought the flouride in SSRI's would simply be a part of the overal chemical..

    But flouride's health issues have been documented time and time again. It slowly builds up in bodies with ill effects. Did anyone ask the government for mass medication? Nazies used it in concentration camps to keep inmates docile and then post WW2 it's being put into our water supply.. makes sense. You know, calcium, iron, etc all have health benefits too..
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    #9
    ^ point to one study that shows that fluoride makes people complacent
    I imagine that the lack of food, water, shelter, possessions, family, freedom, and dignity contributed to complacency in concentration camps
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    #10
    Capsule
    Quote Originally Posted by stormyweathers View Post
    ^ point to one study that shows that fluoride makes people complacent
    I imagine that the lack of food, water, shelter, possessions, family, freedom, and dignity contributed to complacency in concentration camps
    i agree with you there. im not trying to start a conspiracy thing here , im just wondering why most SSRIs are fluoride based when we were taught and a very young age not to ingest them
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    #11
    ^ It's well known that Stalin and Hitler used flouride on inmates for that reason..
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    #12
    Bluelight Crew paranoid android's Avatar
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    This thread reminds me of the movie Dr.strangelove alot. Have you ever seen a commie drink water? No and not without good reason either
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    #13
    so some people think that the gov. is trying to control the population with our water supply and antidepressants? i had no idea that that was even a conspiracy until today. i was just wondering why a harmful substance was in antidepressants.
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    #14
    ^ Probably not anti-depressants.. they're good for big pharmaceutical companies to make more moneys :P
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    #15
    gotta love the pharmaceutical companies. they make what we need (sometimes) then charge millions to people who may or may not need certain things. but we play along
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    #16
    Bluelighter /navarone/'s Avatar
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    I agree with you, my grandpa was given nitroglycerine for stroke prevention and as you can imagine the next day his heart exploded out of his chest, and the woman standing next to him suddenly had an abortion.
    Man, those evil evil governments...

    Pharms are evil, and as an act of self-humanity we should all rebel to the system and go eat whatever kinds of plants or funghi given to us by mother nature to cure ourselves.
    It's naaaaaatureeeeeeewl!!!
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    #17
    i wouldnt mind making some poppy tea here and there . that always settled my nerves and relieved my pain. The pharm. companies definitely dont have our best interest at their heart of our money. thats why we will never cure cancer our alzheimers or aids. because there is more money in treating the symptoms than finding a cure. sadly thats how the world works
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    #18
    Bluelighter /navarone/'s Avatar
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    please go study some chemestry and pharmacology before precipitously making naive assumptions similar to the following:

    "Vitamin C is a name for ascorbic ACID, acid dissolves things, therefore vitamin C is harmfull"

    Certainly the farm advertizing is over the top sometimes and in some occasions they failed to report the relative risk of some substances on certain individuals but thinking they are just there to poison and scam us is a pretty unintelligent statement.
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    #19
    Bluelighter dread's Avatar
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    Ugh. This thread is so full of pseudoscientific nonsense...

    It's well known that Stalin and Hitler used flouride on inmates for that reason..
    Source? And no, a conspiracy site doesn't count.


    Ok, to clear things up, there are 3 concepts that need to be separated here:

    1) Elemental fluorine, F2, a very very toxic gas. This is not included in antidepressants, nor is it in drinking water or toothpaste.

    2) Fluoride ion, F-, a water-soluble compound - in small concentrations is not harmful in any way, and is beneficial for teeth: it converts the outer layer of tooth enamel to fluoroapatite which forms a protective layer for teeth. Is added to toothpaste & tap water for this reason, not for any kind of mind control bs...

    3) Organofluorides, ie. organic compounds that include fluoride: there are many, many, many pharmaceuticals that contain a fluorine atom in their structure. It is usually attached to an aromatic ring, in which it stays very tightly, aromatic fluorine compounds do not release any elemental fluorine nor fluoride ions to the body.
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    #20
    Bluelight Crew indelibleface's Avatar
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    I didn`t think I even needed to explain this, but the fact that a particular atom or chemical moiety exists within a larger molecule does not mean that the larger molecule adopts the properties of said atom or moiety. Sometimes, it does. Most of the time, it doesn`t.

    If a fluorine atom is not released during metabolism and stays locked up within the molecule, there is no danger of fluoride toxicity. This is why (as aforementioned) a benzene ring exists within countless thousands of pharmaceuticals taken daily by people without any danger of cancer or bone marrow toxicity. The benzene ring is never released. Naproxen (Aleve) contains a napthalene moiety, but no free napthalene is released into the body.

    Similarly, no fluoride is released into the body when one takes these SSRI drugs. This doesn`t happen.
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    #21
    ^ Bird flu vaccine.

    Cancer drugs being so expensive / never put on the market.

    Edit: that was to naverone..
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    #22
    Bluelighter dread's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickolasnice View Post
    ^ Bird flu vaccine.

    Cancer drugs being so expensive / never put on the market.

    Bird flu vaccine, what about it?

    Source for the latter please.
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    #23
    I see. I am no chemist ill be the first to admit that. Thats why i started this thread was to get the facts. all i had were conspiracies and things that looked like facts, i didnt know the fluorine in the SSRIs was not introduced into the body because of a benzene ring. Thank you for this useful information. the conspiracy convo was semi fun while it lasted
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    #24
    Does not matter much WHAT fluorine is bonded to, metabolically speaking. There ARE a few things that release the toxic fluoride ion, such as the inhalational anaesthetic halothane, where it can end up causing kidney damage if prolonged use is required.

    But fluorine is a vicious bastard as far as elements go, in the elemental state, once it bonds, it really doesn't like to let go, highest electronegativity of any element, and just hungers for those valence bonding electrons, even in the case of otherwise near enough inert atoms with full valence shells, the autistic atoms out there, who really do not feel the need to bond with others, as their capacity for 'wanting' to form covalent bonds with another atom, is all but full, such as the noble gases, argon, krypton, neon, xenon, etc, not sure if a helium fluoride, or compound of any kind yet exists, but usually, those inert last period gases, the first compounds known of them, were fluorides, occasionally oxides, but usually no, it is usually the fluorinated derivatives of various kinds and made through exotic modes of synthesis, that is all due to the tremendous reactivity of fluorine.

    (and in the elemental state, extreme toxicity, gaseous F2 in even extremely dilute concentrations will literally ignite flesh, and burn right through it thermally, not just corrosively, the corresponding hydrohalic acid, HF, is a weak acid, in the sense of PKa, as the reactivity of F means it doesn't dissociate nearly as well into its ionic species, in aqueous solution as does HCl, HBr, and HI, which get less electronegative as you move down the halogens, it stays tightly bound to its counterpart atom, H, shielding the acidic proton from being able to exist out in the open, so to speak, and lessening acidity.

    That, results in something much much nastier than HCl, I have spilled concentrated HCl on me a good few times, and the absolute worst thing I have ever felt, is a little stinging, as it was promptly noticed and removed, and that is if it gets to sit on you, without being noticed for a few, although it will bleach and ruin your favourite clothes just perfectly, it doesn't cause severe burning easily via skin contact.

    Contrast with an HF burn, which I have never experienced, but which is apparently incredibly painful, as whilst a weak acid, it gets to travel easily right through the skin, where it begins to react, and sequester calcium, mainly, but to a lesser degree other electrolytes, both from the blood, tissue and bones, yup, thats right, HF will seep through you, and leach the Ca2+ from your bones, causing an immense amount of pain in the process, causing the sludging out of the formed CaF2, which is quite insoluable in water and all the problems attending the sudden massive drop in serum calcium levels.

    Working with HF in anything but the most diluted solutions, one must have intravenous and IM injectable forms of calcium gluconate, alongside a topical wash solution of the same, to be used if contact occurs, to provide a source of Ca2+ cation for the hydrofluoric acid to react with, that isn't the calcium in your blood and bones, and thus mitigate the toxicity by ensuring that less HF is left un-sated, to chew on one's tender, delicious bones

    The carbon-fluorine bond is very, very strong however, and presents no such risks as attended by F2, or HF, the F in a fluorocarbon has sunk its teeth right in, and like a pitbull, won't let go, and it sure as hell isn't coming off as HF/fluoride ion in vivo.
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    #25
    Bluelighter /navarone/'s Avatar
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    I wanted to apolagize for my first post above, it might have been intended as personal to the author of the thread but sincerely I was sarcastically pointing out how some naive minded uneducated people make foolish assumptions on random similiarities. Also i was pointing out this weird 'fad' about "all natural", "natures loves us" when in reality every living being struggles to survive to a naturally hostile world and that what evolution is all about, survival.

    There are thousands of nature made poisons and dangers out there that most uneducate people do not..actually cannot consider and just because of the instrinct greedy nature of the market along with many scientific mistakes done in the past, are not a valid reason to mystify some sorrt of evil conspiracy of government, pharmaceutical companies ect....

    It is easy to point finges unconsiderably when not motivated enough to do reasearch yourself because "everything is a lie" kind of approach.
    We as evolved beings are adapted to a wide range of substances that might prove toxic or fatal to others (eg.chocolate for dogs and cats due to their caffeine content) but that does not mean that the world was put here for us to be happy and nature itself is undoubtably hostile and what keeps us alive is survival hand in hand with research and ways to live healthier and better, sadly though the capitalistic market has driven it's individuals to sometimes give more value to income rather than moral and that is why information is the only way to 'get to the truth'.

    It just bugs the fuck out of me seeing people making conspiracy assumptions on things they do not have the slightest knowledge of just for their somehow pleasure of blaming all authorities and such.
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