Opioids The Kratom Thread

[Wolfmans_BrothEr]

I have something called "Kratom Zone" Mitragyna Speciosa 15:1 extract powder & its been sitting in my closet for 7 months, still have not tried Kratom yet. One of these days I will.............I just hope im not disappointed........I think that is one of the reasons why I havent tried it yet.

I googled it and multiple sources say it has a fairly long shelf life under the right conditions...meaning a cool, dry, dark place

 

[iamnotsam]

I've tried just about every extract on the market within the last 6 years, including 15x mitragynine extract which I find to be crap from any source, and have to say they're a waste of money and time. They do not even compete with a good micronized powder, specifically Maeng Da. The ONLY exception was the Maeng Da extract (a dark rust color) that I located from one vendor, but I won't mess with it anymore. I've tried other MD extracts, but they did nothing. This specific extract is very expensive, but very effective. I would say almost identical to some good quality pharmy products and it produces pretty severe nods. However, upon discontinuation, even with continued kratom powder use, I experienced a slight W/D that really f'd up my week. Now with that said, I did not toss it straight and only used it to potentiates other powders. It does work. Just my $0.02.

 

[iamnotsam]

This gives you an audio example, http://www.howjsay.com/index.php?word=kratom&submit=Submit

 

[iamnotsam]

So I am learning it doesn't matter if I hit reply to a specific post or not within this thread, it will just post my statements only. My apologies for any confusion.

I have a question for those with the Kratom know...why is it that the micronized powder is so potent and the ONLY form of Kratom that I feel any effects from? I've noted absolutely no happy feelings, or anything for that matter, if I consume Kratom in any of the following forms: tea (with and without plant matter; with and without lemon; freezing first and/or double boiling, a variation of the aforementioned, etc), chewing the plant matter (yes, the taste does not bother me), fine coffee grind or snuff grind of the whole plant matter, and/or capsules. The product is from the same vendor that I've used for over six years, so it isn't the quality that is of concern. I order the micronized powder and it's like holy fuck, I love you. However, when I tried to save some dollars and grind it myself using a snuff grinder and/or another vendors finely ground plant, it was like WTF did I waste my money on? Why is this? Same dose and I've even upped the quantity when it's not in micronized form. Still, nothing works. P.S. I always consume on a totally empty stomach b/c it's the only way I feel the effects with the powder form.

In addition, just as a precaution for the frequent Kratom connoisseurs, get regular blood work done. I was perfectly healthy prior to frequent use. Six months in and my potassium levels were very depleted, which was only found after I started having severe heart problems (palpitations, tachycardia, and erratic BP). I was found to be severely dehydrated with deficient potassium levels. Diet and water did not reverse the problems and I required supplementation. Just a heads-up.

 

[Lazyscience]

i ordered my first kratom today. i gotto say, im pretty apprehensive about the addiction potential, especially because i dont want to mess up my university course.

any advice to stop from getting addicted?

 

[King Hop Head]

i ordered my first kratom today. i gotto say, im pretty apprehensive about the addiction potential, especially because i dont want to mess up my university course.

any advice to stop from getting addicted?

To avois addiction avois using more than one a week.

 

[Pegasus]

^Hey, the reply button doesn't actually reply directly to the post; you have to quote or mention the post you're replying to for people to know what you're talking about. Sorry, I know it's confusing.

 

[Pegasus]

So I am learning it doesn't matter if I hit reply to a specific post or not within this thread, it will just post my statements only. My apologies for any confusion.

I have a question for those with the Kratom know...why is it that the micronized powder is so potent and the ONLY form of Kratom that I feel any effects from? I've noted absolutely no happy feelings, or anything for that matter, if I consume Kratom in any of the following forms: tea (with and without plant matter; with and without lemon; freezing first and/or double boiling, a variation of the aforementioned, etc), chewing the plant matter (yes, the taste does not bother me), fine coffee grind or snuff grind of the whole plant matter, and/or capsules. The product is from the same vendor that I've used for over six years, so it isn't the quality that is of concern. I order the micronized powder and it's like holy fuck, I love you. However, when I tried to save some dollars and grind it myself using a snuff grinder and/or another vendors finely ground plant, it was like WTF did I waste my money on? Why is this? Same dose and I've even upped the quantity when it's not in micronized form. Still, nothing works. P.S. I always consume on a totally empty stomach b/c it's the only way I feel the effects with the powder form.

In addition, just as a precaution for the frequent Kratom connoisseurs, get regular blood work done. I was perfectly healthy prior to frequent use. Six months in and my potassium levels were very depleted, which was only found after I started having severe heart problems (palpitations, tachycardia, and erratic BP). I was found to be severely dehydrated with deficient potassium levels. Diet and water did not reverse the problems and I required supplementation. Just a heads-up.

Thanks for the info on the blood tests. I can see problems like this potentially happening regularly.

As for the difference in micronized, my guess is that the strains are different between different grades/ in capsules/ etc. "Micronized" just means ground up finely. If you're swallowing the fine powder with an empty stomach, you could potentially be absorbing it a bit faster resulting in different effects, but I don't know to what degree this happens. I never had a problem getting good effects from capsules though...

 

[HdoubleODeezy]

^ IMO capsules are deff. the way to go.. i bought a kg of kratom once and bought 1000 capsules and a filler machine and went to work for a few hours capping almost all of it up and i still have some capsules to this day in a big empty pill bottle. Much easier to store as capsules i think, and deff much easier to take.

 

[bliz62]

I like the powder, but don't love having to take it...so I'm trying some capsules, and so far so good. Felt some good effects w/ plant matter too, just like the quick fix of pills so if the high stays the the same, that'll be my new preferred method. I had been mixing the powder (still am with what's left) with applesauce, it still was gross lol.
Not getting addicted...yeah don't do it everyday like I do, once or twice a week max, and make sure you stick to that. Once you're doing it every day, nothing to stop you from all day, right? Be careful!

 

[Lazyscience]

so today i got my first kratom 100 grams of 'super green indo. im not impressed at all. i started off with 5 grams which happened to be 1 teaspoon full. although i could feel a slight opiated feeling, it wasnt enough so i took another spoon and that wasnt enough either. now ive had like 10 spoonfulls and im definitely feeling it but its so mild. maybe im expecting too muh i dont know but somethings wrong. maybe its just crap kratom.

 

[muskolo]

so today i got my first kratom 100 grams of 'super green indo. im not impressed at all. i started off with 5 grams which happened to be 1 teaspoon full. although i could feel a slight opiated feeling, it wasnt enough so i took another spoon and that wasnt enough either. now ive had like 10 spoonfulls and im definitely feeling it but its so mild. maybe im expecting too muh i dont know but somethings wrong. maybe its just crap kratom.

Yeah I'd say you got a bad batch. I mean, I've been taking kratom a couple times a week for a few months and I only get a slight buzz. It's still good but nothing compared to pharms. Unfortunately, you see a lot of information out there that says it's just like oxy or vicodin and for me at least, it's really not at all. The buzz from kratom is an entirely different type even if it does operate on some of the same receptors and traditional opioids. No matter what though, you should of felt something from 5 grams unless you have a high tolerance from other opiates.

 

[in128770]

I decided to knock the Kratom on the head for a morning. BIG MISTAKE.

Basically, what happened was severe stomach cramps, (PAINFUL!), followed by nausea. I vomited three times, and this is the first time I've vomited from pain since the heroin days. I could not stomach any more Kratom tea, so I had 36 hours of these cramps. Then, after throwing up a lot of juice, I felt well enough to dose again. And the symptoms just faded away.

I'm in a lot of intermittant pain right now, and having to travel 6 miles a day to collect my Subutex is turning into a costly thing with £30 taxi daily. I do not feel fit enough to make the trip on the bus today, so it means another £30 taxi money. My intestines are in shards! Really tender. I keep getting this gurgling noise, and pain when I get that noise as liquid passes thru the system.

This might be related to my pre-existing stomach complaint, but I doubt it. The Subutex alone is strong enough to take care of that complaint, so I'm assuming its Kratom wd. Shit, I never thought it'd be sooo painful!

Damn, now in the past 12 hours I've drank roughly a cup to two cups every 2 hours. Just to take the pain away.

Its helping for sure. I am also severely constipated.

I wish I never dosed Kratom! Buyer beware...

Pretty new to Kratom, but not to Subutex. So, if I'm reading your post correctly, you were experiencing Kratom WD's as strong as your past heroin wd's, and you had Subutex in your system during this herendous Kratom wd experience???

 

[Pegasus]

^No, I'm pretty sure he took a large dose of kratom and was vomiting because of it. The kratom nausea is pretty intense if you take enough to get it.

 

[bliz62]

Hmmm not sure if it was a bad batch you got or not. I usually take 15 grams or so to feel something, and it's WAY more mild than a pharm; you may have a high tolerance too, if you use opiates regularly.

 

[King Hop Head]

High Kratom dose plus high dose of Phenibut to potentiate= projectile vomiting.

Personally I find putting capsules prolongs the onset, and is less effective.

 

[iamnotsam]

Thanks for the info on the blood tests. I can see problems like this potentially happening regularly.

As for the difference in micronized, my guess is that the strains are different between different grades/ in capsules/ etc. "Micronized" just means ground up finely. If you're swallowing the fine powder with an empty stomach, you could potentially be absorbing it a bit faster resulting in different effects, but I don't know to what degree this happens. I never had a problem getting good effects from capsules though...

By grades, do you mean strains? It's the exact same strain, from the exact same vendor, purchased at the same time. He offers the Maeng Da in crushed leaf matter and micronized powder. I typically mix the powder in some water and chug. I don't play or waste time trying to make it pleasant. It's like trying to find a way to make moonshine taste good, just not gonna happen. However, I wanted to save some bucks and so I bought crushed lead matter, at the same time I got some more powder (so same batch). I tried just mixing the plant matter with water, like I do with powder, and chugging. Nothing. Absolutely NADA and WD even started kicking in a bit when. So then I bought a snuff grinder and tried grinding the same leaf matter myself into a fine, but not micronized, powder. Prepared and chugged in the same manner and NOTHING again. However, I then chug the micronized powder and eureka, I had it. I'm wondering if there is an enzyme required to break down the plant material that maybe I am lacking and/or fucked up from chronic consumption? Or if in the process of grinding it into a micronized powder there is a change in the potency? I am honestly baffled, as this product is not bunk. The powder is the ONLY stuff in 6 years I've found, from numerous vendors, to actually work at low doses. There's one other vendor that sells the only extract that's ever been effective too, but I don't buy from him anymore b/c of a serious malfunction in customer service. Anyways, I have a shit ton of leaf product that I need to figure out how to get some use out of. Like a drawer full. It's annoying. Anyone have experimentation suggestions on how to get the leaf matter to be effective?

 

[iamnotsam]

so today i got my first kratom 100 grams of 'super green indo. im not impressed at all. i started off with 5 grams which happened to be 1 teaspoon full. although i could feel a slight opiated feeling, it wasnt enough so i took another spoon and that wasnt enough either. now ive had like 10 spoonfulls and im definitely feeling it but its so mild. maybe im expecting too muh i dont know but somethings wrong. maybe its just crap kratom.

I've had some crap Kratom. There are only two vendors I will purchase from and each for different products. Honestly, once you find the vendor that works for you, quality stops being a problem. I've noticed the type of grind greatly affects how much I need and the effects. I just posted about this. I have no idea what causes it, but I can only feel the Kratom if I consume it in a micronized powder form on an empty stomach. In fact, the guy I buy from I only buy his deveined Thai or Maeng Da and with both I only require 1.5 tsp (yes that's tsp.) to get a mild effect ad 2 tsp for a moderate. I've been a kratom connoisseur consistently for over 6 months too and off and on for 6 years. However, if I try any other form, even just a fine powder, it has nearly zero effect, unless I take super high doses and even then it's miniscule. Was the grind micronized? Believe it or not? Also, I haven't felt the effects of an Indo in over 4 years from one of my first vendors I tried. Recently, none have been potent enough for me to waste money buying more. Stick with Maeng Da. You can almost never go wrong with that strain. Super potent.

Pretty new to Kratom, but not to Subutex. So, if I'm reading your post correctly, you were experiencing Kratom WD's as strong as your past heroin wd's, and you had Subutex in your system during this herendous Kratom wd experience???

I can attest to kratom WD symptoms while still taking a script, not Subutex though. I thought my oxy script would stop the kratom WD's, but it didn't. Something I've picked up on over the years of reading about kratom is that people that use kratom to detox from scripts and then CT kratom later, STILL end up going through severe WD's very similar to their opioid pills. However, folks that never used kratom to discontinue a pill have minimal WD when they CT. Not that they are non-existent, but they are minimal and short lived. One thing I do know for sure, if someone uses kratom to discontinue a script (cannot claim a natural opiate, as I've read few stories about this and haven't personally experienced it) they should not CT the kratom, unless they like pain. It's best to taper slow and using only the amount daily necessary to keep WD's at bay. I also know firsthand that taking calcium, magnesium, and potassium supplements (minimum RDA value daily and then eat large quantities of potassium containing foods, b/c you cannot consume too much from a food source like you can from a supplement) during WD, that this will GREATLY reduce WD symptoms. I believe WD symptoms are magnified due to an electrolyte imbalance and dehydration that is very common in kratom consumers. The aforementioned supplement regimen has also been helpful combatting tolerance issues as a result of frequent kratom consumption too. I don't know why, but I know it's worked on two separate occasions. I can consume 1.5 TSP, not TBSP, per serving and receive benefits.

 

[llamer]

Anyone ever combine kratom with GBL? Like all opiates, I find kratom to be stimulating enough to keep me from getting to sleep, and I almost always take a light muscle relaxant (carisoprodol 400-600mg) and gabapentin to get some sleep. I've never combined GBL with anything (a little afraid of over-synergizing the depressant effects), but kratom to me seems relatively safe to do so. Anyone ever try this combo?

 

[in128770]

I've had some crap Kratom. There are only two vendors I will purchase from and each for different products. Honestly, once you find the vendor that works for you, quality stops being a problem. I've noticed the type of grind greatly affects how much I need and the effects. I just posted about this. I have no idea what causes it, but I can only feel the Kratom if I consume it in a micronized powder form on an empty stomach. In fact, the guy I buy from I only buy his deveined Thai or Maeng Da and with both I only require 1.5 tsp (yes that's tsp.) to get a mild effect ad 2 tsp for a moderate. I've been a kratom connoisseur consistently for over 6 months too and off and on for 6 years. However, if I try any other form, even just a fine powder, it has nearly zero effect, unless I take super high doses and even then it's miniscule. Was the grind micronized? Believe it or not? Also, I haven't felt the effects of an Indo in over 4 years from one of my first vendors I tried. Recently, none have been potent enough for me to waste money buying more. Stick with Maeng Da. You can almost never go wrong with that strain. Super potent.



I can attest to kratom WD symptoms while still taking a script, not Subutex though. I thought my oxy script would stop the kratom WD's, but it didn't. Something I've picked up on over the years of reading about kratom is that people that use kratom to detox from scripts and then CT kratom later, STILL end up going through severe WD's very similar to their opioid pills. However, folks that never used kratom to discontinue a pill have minimal WD when they CT. Not that they are non-existent, but they are minimal and short lived. One thing I do know for sure, if someone uses kratom to discontinue a script (cannot claim a natural opiate, as I've read few stories about this and haven't personally experienced it) they should not CT the kratom, unless they like pain. It's best to taper slow and using only the amount daily necessary to keep WD's at bay. I also know firsthand that taking calcium, magnesium, and potassium supplements (minimum RDA value daily and then eat large quantities of potassium containing foods, b/c you cannot consume too much from a food source like you can from a supplement) during WD, that this will GREATLY reduce WD symptoms. I believe WD symptoms are magnified due to an electrolyte imbalance and dehydration that is very common in kratom consumers. The aforementioned supplement regimen has also been helpful combatting tolerance issues as a result of frequent kratom consumption too. I don't know why, but I know it's worked on two separate occasions. I can consume 1.5 TSP, not TBSP, per serving and receive benefits.

Thanks for the info. I really appreciate it. To clarify on electrolytes, for WD's or for potentiation, take the RDA of the ones you mentioned via supplements, and then eat foods rich in those electrolytes in addition to the dietary supplement?

So, for example, on those occasions where you took 1.5 tsp, did you take a CAL/MAG/POT supp, then eat/drink bananas, milk, etc. and achieved more of your desired results with less Kratom?

And lastly, do you think potentiators (Gfruit Juice, DXM, Cimetidine) for oxycodone and the like would also potentiate Kratom?