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Opioids The Kratom Thread

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Before I was looking for a replacement for pt, but I realize kratom is a diff high. I think once I embrace that it will be easier.
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This is very true. So many people, both users of heavy opiates and even the opiate naive, dismiss kratom after trying it because it doesn't knock their socks off their first time. Or if it did, they try to double the dose and end up puking for half the day. Kratom is so clean that the effects can be subtle and sometimes it's hard to tell that you just feel so energetic and relaxed and loved and awesome.

Unfortunately a lot of people are looking for something messier and more in your face. The whole if you can stand up on a downer or sit down on an upper then it isn't working well enough mentality just doesn't work with kratom.
 
amapola said:
This is very true. So many people, both users of heavy opiates and even the opiate naive, dismiss kratom after trying it because it doesn't knock their socks off their first time. Or if it did, they try to double the dose and end up puking for half the day. Kratom is so clean that the effects can be subtle and sometimes it's hard to tell that you just feel so energetic and relaxed and loved and awesome.

Unfortunately a lot of people are looking for something messier and more in your face. The whole if you can stand up on a downer or sit down on an upper then it isn't working well enough mentality just doesn't work with kratom.
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Well said! That's where I went wrong with the kratom too long, long before I was familiar with opioids and their effects, not to mention drugs in general. After re-visiting, not only did I have a tolerance, but I can very distinctly decipher the effects of kratom, and it is the subtle effects of it that make it so great.

I'm also inclined to believe kratom has some kind of reverse tolerance effect as well, which would not be surprising seeing as there's a ton of alkaloids in there. As you become more sensitive and aware of the effects, it becomes more and more enjoyable and the effects seem to 'strengthen' as you become more experienced with it. I've been dosing on 10g every couple of days for several months now, and am yet to see a significant jump in tolerance. I haven't had to increase my dosage yet. I actually decreased it for better effects as I stated in my last post.

I hope this info helps!! :)
 
I agree with you guys, the first time I took it about 10 days ago I was expecting the high to be over powering like a normal opiate high.

However I quickly fell in love with the subtleness of the kratom high. I've been making tea with 20x and normal tea for about 5 days now and it taste fucking great! I'm one happy camper.

The only thing I dont like about kratom vs normal opiates is the "eye wiggles". It makes it hard to read or notice things when i'm working. But either then that it's some good ish.
 
i have pretty much switched from kratom over to opiates (heroin) now. my main reason for switching was that i seem to get a headache the next day after i take kratom, which doesn't happen with opiates. i also find that kratom causes unpleasant visions when i try to go to sleep more than opiates and of course the taste.

the high from kratom was really inconsistent for me, and it is with opiates too but at least if i don't get a good euphoria i don't have to deal with a headache the whole next day with opiates.
 
Eye wiggles? Like MDMA eye wiggles? That's not supposed to happen.... :\

Kratom has a very subtle effect on my peripheral vision, but definitely not any distortions, eye wiggles or anything of the sort. I compare it to the visuals on alcohol.
 
Unfortunately, some batches of kratom are pretty poor. I've had pretty good stuff just about every time, but at least twice I've gotten some much less effective stuff. This is from a reputable vendor that has a number of strains from different locations.
 
Rapid lateral eye oscillation lasting half a second or so has indeed been associated as a side effect with kratom usage. Usually I only get it when trying to type on the computer but of course some people experience it more/less than others.
 
^I remember reading that kratom has effects on serotonin, I wonder if this comes into play...
 
I think i'm going to try the high content7-Mitragynine powers, they seem to be the best from what i've heard.

Pegasus that's interesting if kratom has effects on serotonin. I've had some nice after glows the day after taking some. But today I actually feel like some 5htp could benefit my mood. Maybe it's just in my head? haha.
 
Then how do they come up with the figure that 7-Mitragynine is more powerfull then morphine? Is that only if it's isolated?
 
^They have isolated 7-OH-mitragynine and found it to be 20 some odd times better than morphine at reducing reactions to pain in mice and guinea pigs.
 
^So then it's not 20 some odd times more potent at stimulating the opiate receptors..Very intesesting..

Todays the first day I didn't take any after trying it out for about a week and I felt pretty slow. It's probably best to utilize once or twice a week in the long run.
 
I've heard this mentioned many times, that kratom has some kind of serotonin activity. This both intrigues me and scares me at the same time. I use kratom rather often, and I don't know what kind of affect that's having on my serotonin system. I searched on Google, and not much comes up about it.

I wonder if it has some kind of serotonin releasing property, which would explain the empathy you get with kratom and not other opiates.
 
bump

Potency by weight compared to morphine is generally the standard test for any opioid...
 
I know that morphine's the golden standard and it's what every opiate is compared to. So that's my question, is 7-OH-mitragynine considered a full agonist opiod? Or is it a partial opiod?
 
it's a full agonist and i found this from wiki:
The O-acetyl ester, 7-acetoxymitragynine has also been reported and found to be an active μ-opioid agonist.
 
Competition binding assays revealed that 7-hydroxymitragynine bound to opioid receptors in homogenates of guinea-pig brain membrane. Its affinities for three opioid receptor types were determined by evaluating the inhibition of binding of ligands to µ-, δ- and κ-opioid receptors. As a result, 7-hydroxymitragynine interacted with all three opioid sites, but bound preferentially to µ-opioid receptors. Taken together, the in vitro results demonstrated that 7-hydroxymitragynine is a full agonist for µ-opioid receptors.
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Matsumoto, 2006
Pharmacological Studies on 7-Hydroxymitragynine, Isolated from the Thai Herbal Medicine Mitragyna speciosa: Discovery of an Orally Active Opioid Analgesic
http://www.scribd.com/doc/32951422/...sa-Discovery-of-an-Orally-Active-Opioid-Analg
 
Question for all of you who take kratom regularly.. can you get effects day after day like with oxy or hydo or something or does it stop like buprenorphine does?
Cuz i am not dependent on opiates anymore 8o and i take sometimes kratom which i have an abundance of mixed with an abundance of 100X powdered extract and it even smells potent.. its a mix of green, red, and white vein indo powder plus the 100x extract.. 5 grams is effective for me as i think my tolerance has dropped since i came of subs.. and some times i take 200mg tramadol and sometimes .5-1mg sub. All legit for back pain that i've had since i was 15 (so 7-8 years) doctors think im lying about being in pain (because of my history) even though they say my backs fucked on the MRI's bone scans and x rays. Any ways, so i need to self medicate and i just came off of kpins and am in w/d from that and my back kills so i have been doing 1 on 1day than switch for the next and again for the next and i've tested it by taking a few days off and no opiate w/d's so im glad about that even tho if i did get re addicted i would immediately CT all opiate type substances and be fine in a week.. but i was just wondering on you guys' take on all that and my question i asked in the beginning (that i almost forgot about lol).
 
You can build up a tolerance to kratom like any opioid, and although there is no hard ceiling like bupe, due to the complex alkaloid profile of kratom higher doses result in nausea and uncomfortable feelings more so then a pure opiate like oxycodone where you just get higher.
 
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