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Opioids Kratom Capsules

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weekend addiction......i have zero hands on experience with kratom...

....would you say the beneficial, euphorical, effects you can get from kratom are worth the price, in comparison to the highs you can get from oxy?

Of course take into consideration the risk of using oxy as compared to using kratom(overdose/addiction-wise).
 
Well if you have a large opiate tolerance then kratom will only ease or remove w\d symptoms. But if you don't munch down percs all day then you can feel good with a cup of premium commercial bali (the cheapest leaves). The key is where you get the kratom from but I cant mention sources.

Compared to OC: The high is a fraction of the cost of OC. With OC there isn't much overdose risk so I would say they are almost equally safe. OC is a better high but more expensive and much more addicting. Kratom is cheap but the high can have more side effects and accurate dosing is more difficult.
 
Thats interesting because from what I have heard, kratom is somewhat expensive. I know I cannot discuss exact prices but from what ive been told by people....an average dose of (atleast) decent quality kratom that would make an average person with a mild opiate tolerance high.....would be about the same price it took for that person to get REALLY high on OC.
 
Im confused about "kratom 15x" or "kratom 20x" products - surely this doesnt mean than 1 cap of 20 x is like 20 caps of regular? 20 caps of regular would affect someone ultra-intensely and not be anywhere near 1 cap of 20x. isnt 20x more like 4x?
 
Kratom extracts are nothing like commercial bali. Extracts often taste bad and don't give the full kratom experience according to many experienced users including myself. Your best off buying kratom kratom by the pound. 484 grams = atleast 50 doses... and cost less than a couple OC 80's... Just don't use other opiates cause that will fuck up your tolerance...
 
i just ordered some Maeng Da Kratom Capsules i got an ounce of it for pretty cheap. i havent taken a real opiate in awhile except for some codeine a couple weeks ago so tolerance should be non existance. I will let you all know how it goes once the shipment comes in. Im pretty excited from the reviews ive read!
 
I've heard anecdotal evidence suggesting kratom is phsyicaly addictive, although there is very little empirical data supporting this. You'd probably have to be consuming large enough doses to achieve any kind of analgesic-opiate effect to become addicted to it, and I mean LARGE doses. This opiate state is fairly hard to attain by all accounts.

Regarding buying it in capsules, you'll almost certainly be paying a damn sight more than it's worth. I'm always very dubious of these "super enhanced 15x mega capsules" or whatever the hell they're called. Even a lot of these "extracts" they're selling are not much stronger than the plain leaf, if anecdotal reports are to be believed. IMO opinion, you should just buy a powder that works for you; don't fall for the sales patter- then cap them yourself, trust me, you'll save a lot. I use a blend of white and red veined sumatra from a reputable company ie not a shady headshop with shoddy product. The stuff I buy is almost half the price of this Maeng da pimp blend or whatever it's called. Again-kratom is kratom; don't fall for the marketing gimmicks. Just my 2 cents.
 
^There are a lot of reports regarding addiction and withdrawls with Kratom. The active ingredients are opioids and with regular potent Kratom you don't have to consume especially large doses to experience recreational effects. The physical addiction may take longer to develop compared to lower potent pharmaceutical Opioids but the potential is very real.
Just for example:

http://www.erowid.org/experiences/subs/exp_Kratom_Addiction_Habituation.shtml
 
^absolutely right.I did at first think these reports of addiction were psychosomatic nature, but after reading the sheer quantity of reports, it'd be stupid for me to discount them, and kratom does indeed act as an opioid in the right doses. As a suboxone user, it's unlikely I would achieve these anelgesic effects, though.

It's a very interesting plant to me, I find it fascinating.
 
How is the Kratom supposed to smell/taste. Is it better to be smoked or drank? I got my Kratom tablets last night 100x 500mg. I think I got scam. I took almost the half of the bottle today (about 25g ???) and I didn't feel ANYTHING. Currently I have low opioid tolerance since I am on 150-200mg tramadol daily. I am new to this alternative/herbal pain management so there is a possibility I am doing it wrong.
I got the Kratom over the internet, to be honest it smells like ... tea? I know it's a herb but I am not familiar with its smell/taste.

What I know is people taking 8-10g of it (which should be 15-20 capsules) and experience nausea at first but after that they feel it's calm and relaxing effects. Some even describe it like hydro effects. I don't have really big expectations but I expected to feel warm/relaxed at least. Like I said I got 45-50 capsules in the past 6 hours and I don't feel anything. No nausea, no calm or relaxation, no mood improvement.

Am I doing it wrong or should I smoke it? Maybe it's an old bottle or maybe it's not Kratom at all ???
 
Can u tell me what a good dose of the capsules are for a high opiate user? I'm new to the site, and not sure who to ask. Thanks
 
What does a 'high opiate user' mean? can you give us a bit of information on what opiates you use and at what dosages, and how you administer them (IV, oral, rectal, intranasal etc.)?

It also depends on the capsule size, but it seems most of them contain either .5g or .6g. For me, when I first started using kratom to get off suboxone, I only had to take 10-15 of the .6g to get a very noticeable effect. I should mention I was taking 2-3mg of suboxone, usually sublingually or plugging. IDK if my receptors are just weird, but I don't find kratom to be a 'weak' substance. Maybe on a mg/mg basis, then yeah, but with kratom the threshold dosages are usually 1-3g's. If you're coming off subs like I was, 7.5-9g's worked perfectly fine for me. For some reason the buprenorphine doesn't seem to block suboxone (at least at those dosages) at all for me. I've heard other people have experienced the same thing. I'm not sure about how mitragyne and other alkaloids in kratom interact with opiate receptors, 7-hydroxymitragynine I read (somewhere 'scholarly', now I can only find posts on BL with no sources to back them up) has a binding affinity of somewhere between 15-34x that of morphine (I got both those numbers from two different posts on BL, maybe someone can find a source for them as I'm having trouble), whereas Buprenorphine has a binding affinity 20-40x that of morphine. I don't know about the other alkaloids, and 7-hydroxymitragynine 4% of what is in kratom, but it may be true that some of the alkaloids in kratom have a binding affinity that is close to or higher than buprenorphine. All I can say is that for me, 9g of kratom most definitely not only takes away my withdrawal symptoms, but it puts me in a good relaxed mood too.

Also, another weird thing I've experienced with kratom. I had been taking it by just putting my dose in a piece of tissue and bombing it, and due to daily use, I obviously started to become tolerant to the point where I basically got no effect from taking the kratom, other than it just taking me out of withdrawal. However, a few days ago I was bored and decided to try making kratom tea, as I thought I might get something more out of that due to the fact that the alkaloids are already extracted and ready to be absorbed, rather than having my stomach break down all that plant matter. To my astonishment, I got a much more potent effect out of making the tea. It's weird because I feel like making the tea must be way more wasteful than bombing it, but I get not only stronger effects, but a different type of effect too.

When I was just consuming the kratom in tissue paper, I more often than not got a more stimulant experience (btw, I've been using Bali), and in higher dosages, just the mildest feelings of relaxation/sedation. Now with the tea, the onset of effects start within 5 minutes, and peak after about 30, and the experience is totally different. There is a feeling of 'stimulation' but it's more along the lines of tradition opioid stimulation (like oxy or something) than say, amphetamine. It's the type of stimulation that were you to sit down and watch a movie, would turn into relaxation. After 30-45 minutes, when I peak, the effects become more sedative/anxiolytic. Since then, I've only been making the tea. I find the best way to 'brew' it, is to let it soak in lemon or lime juice for a good 20 minutes, then bring it to a boil, lower the heat down so that it's simmering, and let it simmer for about 20-30 minutes, then strain it, throw the plant matter back in the pot with some added water, bring that to a simmer, strain it a second time and add the second extraction to the first one. Another interesting thing I read on DF, which was quoted from some scholarly anecdote, was that (the author-who was testing out extraction methods and their efficacy) found that making kratom tea, using the water extraction method, at best yielded only 36% of the active compounds in kratom, and that was after letting it boil for 2 hours.

I imagine that some of the alkaloids are more soluble than others, which would explain for the difference in subjective effects in terms of tea v. bombing, but it still kind of shocked me that only 36% was extracted through water boiling. (The author also found that boiling it for longer did not yield more goods, though boiling it for less time reduced that percentage). It makes me wonder the absorption of the different alkaloids through toss n' wash/bombing as well.

Also, don't smoke kratom. From what I've heard all that will do is give you a head ache, even if you have it in a resin form. Just take it orally, no matter what it has a fast onset, but if you want the fastest, drink the tea. The effects are similar in a way to hydrocodone but it obviously has a more organic feel to it. It's a cool plant, in lower dosages it acts as a stimulant, not as intense as amphetamine, but the effects are definitely closer to amps then to opiates (at low dosages), the higher dosages create an opiate effect.
 
Can u tell me what a good dose of the capsules are for a high opiate user? I'm new to the site, and not sure who to ask. Thanks

There is a lot of helpful information here. As far as dosing etc.



Thanks
 
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