Xanax the worst drug to quit?

[MeddieFrac]

Is Xanax the worst drug to quit, or is this what withdrawl is like for every drug?

You see, last year I had a really bad xanax addiction (and perhaps a death wish.) I took, at minimum, 5mg a day, and often upwards of 10mg a day, with gallons of grapefruit juice and alcohol. I was also taking large amounts of Klonopin. I was prescribed, and also bought extra, Xanax, but I happened to get a prescription to Klonopin as well. Sometimes I would just down literally 15-20 Klonopin along with the Xanax, as I found the Klonopin had no effect for me unless taken in huge doses. Needless to say, there were many days/nights that I don't remember (my friends always filled me in on the details of what happened.) I just couldn't control myself, because I had such bad anxiety and depression for so long that I was just sick of life, and as soon as I was given access to such large amounts of drugs that would make the pain stop I couldn't help myself.

Well, there came a time when I had to quit cold turkey. I remember clearly, taking my last 2 pills as I went to bed, hoping to God that withdrawl won't be too bad. Looking back, I was very foolish to not taper off, but I didn't want to reveal to the doctor how much more I was taking than prescribed, and after running out of my pills WAY too early I was unable to get ANY xanax AT ALL from the doctor or from my friends who usually had them. (Even though I was taking many more pills than I was given each months, by buying extra from friends I made sure that I NEVER ran out, lest I should suffer from withdrawl which I knew would happen when taking such massive amounts of benzo's.)

So, I foolishly thought I could quit cold turkey.

The next day, I didn't feel bad at all. I was amazed; perhaps Xanax withdrawl isn't as bad as I had heard (what I didn't know at the time, is that it can take a day or more to fully leave your system, so I was still feeling Xanax from the prior day.)

Strange things started to happen on the second day. When I used my peripheral vision, everything started shaking. When I looked at lights, they seemed to be pulsing and vibrating. I also started to feel a bit dizzy, but all in all I was really glad that the withdrawl wasn't as bad as they say.

However, on the evening of the third day, standing in the hallway of my apartment as I adjusted the temperature of the A/C, there was a complete upheaval in my brain. Everything started to violently spin around; I had the sensation of standing on a cliff and feeling dizzy as though I were about to fall over. I thought I was about to die. I called one of my friends, but strangely I couldn't talk--the words just barely came out of my mouth. I hung up the phone and lay down on the floor. I felt like I was falling through the floor into an abyss. I sent a text to a few friends and told them to check on me tomorrow because I might be dead. They said okay. (Good friends, huh? Hah.)

The next day I was alive, but the withdrawl symptoms were worse. I felt like every cell in my body was tearing away from one another, like my mind was falling apart. I couldn't sleep, I couldn't eat, I couldn't talk, I could barely walk, light hurt my eyes, and I developed a bad stutter (which, thankfully, has since gone away.)

The symptoms progressively worsened over the next day. I remember laying in the shower for hours, contemplating killing myself. However, in the state I was in, I doubt I could have handled ending my own life. That night I managed to sleep fitfully.

The withdrawl hit its peak that next day when the shit really hit the fan. I was in the middle of a conversation (I was stuttering the whole time, and it was hard to think straight, let alone form coherent ideas,) when I had a grand mal seizure. The conversation is the last thing I remember, and then I came to in a hospital. I didn't tell the doctors about the Xanax, so they had no idea why I had the seizure. I was also severely dehydrated they told me.

So a few weeks later I started to feel better again, but it took longer to heal emotionally. It was the single most horrific and terrible experience of my life. I'm such an idiot for subjecting myself to such high amounts of Xanax and then try to quit cold turkey (keep in mind that drinking grapefruit juice essentially doubles the amount of Xanax in your blood stream, and I was drinking lots of grapefruit juice; I was basically taking 10-20 mg's a day with alcohol every other day, and 120mg of Klonopin per month.)

 

[J@germe1ster]

Welcome to BL MeddieFac!

Yeah the benzo wd can be one that you wont forget thats for sure. What you described sounds like vertigo which in a few cases I have heard of people getting when they come off cold turkey from benzos. But the seizure and what not really sucks man glad to hear you made it through that ok. How you feeling emotionally these days? For me it took about a month before I would consider myself "better". What are you doing for fun? Working out, journaling, meditation/ deep breathing, dirt biking, rock climbing are all the things I have to do to keep my mind happy and off dope.

Hope you stick with it man sounds like your doing pretty good with the cravings though.


And no it's not IMO it's up there but meth and trams are pretty horrible things to come off of as well. It all depends though everyone reacts differently...

 

[Orangutangpsychopa]

Few things are absolutely sure about benzo with alcohol abuse. That how long been on benzos, and rising tolerance with taking "pleasure" doses, exactly those 10-20mg alprazolam type of amounts, to get benzo-high. And same time going on with the daily amount but having another benzo script too. Totally is memory erasing with alcohol and it's exactly that thing that alcohol starts to go with them.

I also used to mess with grape fruit juice because it should be liver enzyme CYP thing, but only thing is sure about benzo addiction is being few years on them daily to know withdrawal. Getting besides possibly seizuring, irrational fear and confusion, shaking and looking for safety from girlfriend, it can be a long time of total chaos and unable to handle normal daily things as shoe strings knots, dishwashing is very difficult, cleaning is very difficult and so-on.

One positive point is that panic disorder and shyness can pass if been on benzos and getting life experience. After abusing cycle brains aren't the same anymore, also plain hard boozing can do the same, that capabilities of living get more sure and neurotism also disappears.

And exactly all kind of sports, hobbies and other clear head activities can became realisticly interesting after being on some drug or medicine spiral.

What i mean is, is there any real guidelines what benzos are the more difficult to withdrawal. Half-life, active metabolites, how euphoric or how effective, or how strong on milligram amount. Valium is very euphoric if without tolerance , but so are other relaxing benzos too, xanax then very powerfull pill compared to valium but short half-life and so-on...In Finland detox is done very often / or always with valium, it's basic hospital tranguiliser, never xanax from public healthcare, but klonopin can be. Does that make clear any, because healthcare people are aware of the problems. From other hand, to valium it gets to some about 300mg quite fast and doesn't pleasure even then. But xanaxes give relief / keeping in relief for long, months and years with those doses, you op explained, but combining benzos did make my way to normal little bit too hard. Valium is shit after being on xanax and isn't powerfull enough.

 

[MagickalKat777]

Sorry to hear about your experience OP but quite frankly you were VERY lucky.

Those doses with a cold turkey would cause seizures and death within two days for most people.

And no, Xanax is not the worst. Out of all the benzos, Klonopin is the worst to get off of because it has a dual action on GABA A and GABA B receptor subtypes, unlike other benzos. This is primarily why it is so effective in management of panic disorder and doesn't have the rapid dosage escalation of other benzos (I, too, was on Xanax at one point. Went from .5mg every few weeks to 5-8mg a day within 2 years which is when we cut me straight to Klonopin at 3mg a day and I cut it to 2mg a day in December) but it also makes it harder to get off of. The longer half life of Klonopin people say is valuable - but really what it means is that by the time your blood levels decrease to the point where you go into withdrawal, it is too late to get them back up to effective levels.

I feel for you though. When I cut to Klonopin, it was sheer hell. I had to stop my Xanax cold turkey and start taking the Klonopin. It takes 5-7 days for Klonopin to peak in blood concentration and I went through so much hell, I don't even remember it - only my grandmother's tale of my misery is what remains of my memory of that experience. And I'm thankful for that because I'm about to start getting off of my Klonopin.

It really sounds like you got lucky though. Considering the doses you were taking - and then mixing it with a metabolic inhibitor - it could have been FAR worse than it was.

Are you mostly recovered now? Most people go into a long and protracted withdrawal after stopping benzos, even on low doses...

As for the worst drug to quit - I've heard that quaaludes were the worst, though obviously not available anymore, followed by barbs, then benzos and alcohol (they're about the same level), then meth, then opiates, and down from there... Although I can say I kicked everything except benzos and nicotine (including c/t from daily massive consumption of alcohol) so I would put nicotine up there as well.

 

[Orangutangpsychopa]

That's not funny how detailed information that is. Nicotine surely is psychologically maybe worst, i don't know about heroin or opiates but benzos aren't so much psychological dependence after being so long that needs for real bad withdrawal. They don't, what's the word, creep that way that need-need, but complete fear and afraid of all kind of shit, and can't behave or think but shake and feel very ill.

I think too it's kind of bad mistake to keep two, or many scripts and be daily on them but still rise tolerance and seek enjoynment, feeling emotionally exceptionally good. Few years ago It took for me 4 months of hospital and then, didn't get help there except quick tapering down to zero with diazepam, long after staying on own, before it started to ease on me. I'm not kidding but i couldn't fix shoe ties very easily. And it was just xanax and valium normal levels for few years.

Mistake because it ends on many people, the benzo use, it's not never ending or until death in many cases if i'm not wrong.

 

[STEROIDS4kids]

I've been on xanax for about 8-years now and i can't even imagine what would it be to withdraw from it. Year ago i went through a minor WD with Tramadols and that was pure hell too, still nothing compared to benzo WD. Thankfully during all these years i've been able to keep my Xanax dosages the same 2-4 mg, otherwise i'd be fucked. Also because of my severe anxiety i don't have any desire to ever come off it... All the best to you MF and hopefully you don't have to ever go through that again...

 

[UnSquare]

Xchange

Is Xanax the worst drug to quit,

It's the most difficult drug-related experience I've had.

I was on xanax (8mg/day) for 7 years
and withdrawal has been a challenging experience
to put it mildly......

it's really hard to see how much benzo's change your
developmental processes from the inside
but I could say its been one of the most rewarding
things I've ever done.

In terms of actual symptoms,
I don't think there really is a w/d effect that
can't be generated by benzo w/d.

From facial paralysis to abject terror
to months (all day-every day) of suicidal ideation ,
sever cognitive impairment,
dangerously high blood pressure,
complete anterograde amnesia
to the point of not remembering my own name,
nervous ticks tremor + mini seizures,
inability to match up spatial perception + motor skills
(couldn't drive a car for six+ months),
delusions, hallucinations + madcrazy paranoia,
NO SLEEP (oh THE definition of INSOMNIA),
extreme sensitivity to EVERYTHING
(chemical/light/sound/emotional/stimulation),
mass weakness + evil fatigue,
bleeding, sickness + sweating.

+ it goes forever.
+ ever.
+ it seems like its going for longer because
it leaves you with absolutely no reference point
apart from repeated physical, mental + emotional collapse.

Scary indeed.

V. rewarding.
Caus after experiencing such extended hell
one can be forced to harbour a healthy sense of detachment.

 

[rollingstoned!]

Alcohol is worse. Benzo WD is underactivation of the GABA system. Alcohol WD is said underactivation of the GABA system PLUS overactivation of the glutamate system. fun fun fun!!!!!


The higher you go, the deeper you fall. And we all fall.

 

[UnSquare]

Alcohol is worse. Benzo WD is underactivation of the GABA system. Alcohol WD is said underactivation of the GABA system PLUS overactivation of the glutamate system. fun fun fun!!!!!

Yo I've withdrawn short-term + long-term from both,
separately + together, and I'll tell you benzo's are worse.

Actually, its not even a competition.

DTs suck
+ alcohol withdrawal is the pits
but your up over it in about a week or two.

Serious protracted benzo withdrawal
is 100% life involving for months + months (sometimes years).
I mean cognitive/emotional/physical problems that
make it VERY difficult to operate in the world
around for extended periods.

 

[MeddieFrac]

J@germi1ster, I am not currently doing anything for fun. I have actually been really depressed ever since the withdrawl, with some suicidal ideation and general lack of interest in life. Also, do you think it is possible I damaged my liver from drinking with the medication? The reason I ask is because for awhile now I have been dealing with nausea. Sometimes it's hard to eat without feeling kinda sick, and what's really weird is that I'm just now able to smoke cigarettes again, because I couldn't even take a drag without getting real nauseous.

Orangutangpsychopa, I know exactly what you mean about not being able to do normal, daily, routine type stuff during/for awhile after benzo withdrawl. After I got out of the hospital for the seizure I literally laid in my bed for 3 weeks straight, only getting up to go to the bathroom and try to eat a few bites without getting nauseous. Just had no motivation or willpower to be a living, functioning person. But the real strange part is, I went for about 2 months where I couldn't/wouldn't talk to anyone. I felt like I wasn't even a person anymore. I tried to interact with people and talk, but I just like lost my willpower to talk, like I lost my ability to socially interact. Took me awhile to get over that, and I'm just now talking to my family again and coming out of my shell.

MagickalKat777, even though I didn't die, I may have really messed up my body because I suffer from being nauseous alot, and I just feel real sickly. Or I could just be suffering from depression or something. Hope nothing bad happened to liver or kidneys or whatnot. I am mostly recovered now, but I'm still not the same person. It's like I'm lame, because I just don't feel like a functioning member of society anymore. I just feel different, ya know? Sounds like you had a similar experience as me, so maybe you understand a bit of what I'm saying. I mean I have lost my girlfriend, all my friends, I just isolated myself and never fully re-socialized.

UnSquare, are you saying that taking Xanax has been the most rewarding thing you've done, or quitting them was? I wish I had never taken them, but I guess when you are anxious and depressed you will take whatever you can to stop the pain, so I would have just taken something else if not benzo's. Sounds like your withdrawl might have been even worse than mine in some ways, hope you're feeling good now. You hit the nail right on the head with everything you said, I feel like I am a completely different person, like I'm not even a person really. Just can't function right. Lost my girlfriend, friends. Family thinks I'm totally fucked up. I feel like a lame duck now. And I used to be real full of vigor and fun. Wish I had never touched drugs.

 

[MeddieFrac]

There are more bad experiences in my life than just the withdrawl I mentioned in the first post, and although it was the worst withdrawl I have ever experienced, it wasn't the first. I am just sick of failure after failure; life is just pain after pain after more pain, ya know? I go for years where I am doing great, headed in the right direction, and then I just go crazy, head into a spiral. On top of it I got all this anxiety and depression that I've been dealing with since fucking middle school, and that I will probably have the rest of my life. I just want all the pain and craziness to end, and I don't mean that in a suicidal way. It's just been so long since I've been genuinely happy. Can anyone relate to this?

 

[Cyc]

To give this a bit of a point of reference, I've been taking Valium (2mg) once a day for about a year.

A couple weeks ago I tried to taper my dose to 1mg a day, and for the first time I got a taste of what benzo withdrawal was. I can't even imagine what higher doses of stronger meds would feel like.

The worst part was the vertigo, which causes panic spikes. The derealization (which is why I started taking the valium to begin with) comes back, and I just feel awful.

Now I started taking 2mg again, and I feel better, but I'd like to eventually get on the lowest maintenance dose possible. Valium has helped incredibly over the past year. I've been better able to focus and keep stable.

What would be a good plan going forward?

 

[unsettled]

I agree benzo withdrawal is the worst withdrawal I've ever experienced, opiates are tough but seem much more manageable than benzos. I feel I've been seriously emotionally traumatized by benzo wd because of the way it amplifies every emotion and makes you so sensitive to everything that goes on around you.

I've told this story numerous times here but I'll summarize it briefly again because it's relevant: I went off of 2mgs of xanax a day cold turkey after being on the same dose for a couple years and on day three had a grand mal seizure while driving, everything leading up to it and after it until I was put back on my meds was hell. It's traumatizing enough to be in an accident, but every little thing is amplified during withdrawal, I remember feeling like I was on the brink of the worst panic attack ever before I blacked out and woke up in my wrecked car with ambulance lights flashing and people gathered around.... it was hell, just thinking about it brings back horrible flashbacks of terror.

Needless to say I'm still on benzos, Klonopin now. The thing I really hate about them is that even when you take them as prescribed your tolerance still increases and doctors are always hesitant to raise the dose or refill early... I don't take my klonopin recreationally but when I'm struggling with anxiety I have to slightly raise my dose, and even when I don't raise my dose I notice withdrawals come on quicker after a while on the same dose. Just the thought of running out causes me to have a panic attack sometimes.

That being said overall I still think they're helping more than hurting at this time because my anxiety gets pretty bad at times and I function better with it, at least I think I do. I'm seeing my psychiatrist tomorrow and I'm going to see if she'll switch me over to valium and allow me to taper, even if I don't taper all the way off I don't want to increase my dose anymore. I'm at about 2.5mgs of Klonopin a day and I want to get down at least a milligram because I do think they're dulling my emotions a bit more than I'd like.

Benzo wd sucks, I also hate that alot of doctors who prescribe them don't fully understand the effects of the drug and also don't realize how dangerous it is to go off them cold turkey. It's completely irresponsible for a physician to take some one who has been on them long term off of them cold turkey. I hate being dependent on benzos, I know they are effective and lifesaving for some people but I think they are over prescribed and extremely dangerous to abuse.

I have extreme empathy for anyone going through benzo wd, if you've been on them for a long period of time make sure and taper at a safe pace, remember you're not just putting yourself at risk especially if you are driving while in wd. Be careful all you people wd'ing from benzos, benzo withdrawal almost took my life.

 

[MagickalKat777]

OP and others, you may find some help at www.benzobuddies.org - they're a support site for those withdrawing from benzos.

I've decided to stay on mine. I've been on them since 2004 - worst habit was 6-8mg a day of Xanax at which point I cold turkeyed over to 3mg of Klonopin, dropped a milligram in December... but I can't cut any lower than that... so whatever. Just sucks because I miss my psychedelics!

Anyway if you find yourself in protracted benzo withdrawal, seriously, 150-200mg 3x a day of 5-HTP will help with a lot of the symptoms and lithium orotate/aspartate at 10mg 2x a day will calm down the glutamate response a bit.

 

[MeddieFrac]

As bad as it all was, I know if I just asked my doc I could get another Klonopin script, and I am seriously contemplating going to see him tomorrow morning to get back on 3mgxdaily. It would be just so easy. I would probably pop about 10mg in the pharmacy parking lot for a nice buzz (Klonopin never got me high like I felt off Xanax,) and then try to stick to the 3mg a day and not go overboard like I did before. (Don't know if I have the self-control though.)

Shit, I'm just now starting to feel good but I still just get these urges for any type of benzo. And although my oxy habit wasn't as bad I still get cravings for those too.

 

[bagochina]

Dont do it Meddievac. I almost broke down [well I did] many times and just said fuck it and hop back on a benzo script. I am SO glad I haven't. I think I am over 1.5 years clean from a high dose/long duration klonopin/ativan habit [minus the 2 months I went back on to get off bupe easier] and holy fuck. Absolutely the most horrible w/d I have ever had to deal with. It made iv heroin kicks look like nothing. I still get urges to take xanax occasionally but its pretty fleeting.

Serious protracted benzo withdrawal
is 100% life involving for months + months (sometimes years).
I mean cognitive/emotional/physical problems that
make it VERY difficult to operate in the world
around for extended periods.

^ couldn't agree more

peace.
seedless

 

[MeddieFrac]

Yeah I think you are right. It would be real nice for a few months, but eventually I would want to go off them again and then I'd be fucked with another soul-crushing withdrawal. FUCK. If it wasn't for withdrawal they would be the perfect medication. Good job stay off of them for so long bagochina. So you just sort of ignore the urges, even though you know deep down it would be great to have a few xanies? Sort of like after you quit smoking, you know you are going to have those urges but they only last a few minutes and it's done. Well I mean xanny urges are worse but same principle I think.

 

[ChickenScratch]

thanks for the post OP.

so what is the solution for those of us that have an actual panic disorder?

i've posted my situation before but a quick recap:

- i take .5 - 1 mg of xanax daily. i never abuse them to get high and RARELY ever go over 1 mg of xanax. i've been using this formula for a little over a year. it works for me but i can't imagine life without my script.

i know that i'm not nearly as deep as the OP was but i still feel like it's a crutch.

most of the benzo addiction stories i hear start with people that actually have a panic disorder, then get deep into benzos, go through wd, quit and then have anxiety all over again because they stopped using benzos.

so really - what do people like us do? if i can keep my benzo use to no more than 1 mg per day i think i'll probably stay on them for the rest of my life.

i can't imagine going through the hell that OP and other's have been through.

 

[Cyc]

^ It's tough to find support for people who use benzos as prescribed. I checked out that benzobuddies site, and I couldn't find a post that helped my situation. They seem to think that 1mg of valium a day is the same as 20mg of xanax a day, in terms of severity of withdrawal. Now I know that's not true, because the tapering program these people swear by, uses valium as the tapering drug of choice.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

GABAergics like barbiturates, benzodiazepines, alcohol, GBL/GHB/etc, all tend to have the worst WD, typically due to the physical dependency and how long it takes to recover.

To give this a bit of a point of reference, I've been taking Valium (2mg) once a day for about a year.

A couple weeks ago I tried to taper my dose to 1mg a day, and for the first time I got a taste of what benzo withdrawal was. I can't even imagine what higher doses of stronger meds would feel like.

The worst part was the vertigo, which causes panic spikes. The derealization (which is why I started taking the valium to begin with) comes back, and I just feel awful.

Now I started taking 2mg again, and I feel better, but I'd like to eventually get on the lowest maintenance dose possible. Valium has helped incredibly over the past year. I've been better able to focus and keep stable.

What would be a good plan going forward?

You can dissolve 2mg of diazepam into 40 mL of water. This way you can liquid-measure out your dose and ever so slowly titrate it by 0.05mg to 0.1mg per day.

Or, if you simply just want to cut your pills into quarters, you could go from 2mg to 1.5mg for a week or two, then down to 1mg for a week, then 0.5mg for another week.

If you are experiencing a lot of negative symptoms due to the effects, you can help mediate that through other CNS depressants (like an antihistamine, for instance).