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NMDA antagonists for tolerance, a collection of the evidence and anecdotal reports

Bump!=D I would like to get a few things discussed in the advanced section=D
 
I've got 240 pills of "Namenda" (memantine) on the way... going to start with 10mg for 2 days to see how the brain fog is, then bump it to 20mg for a week - I have a feeling that is all that I'm going to need. Then when my valium suddenly knocks me on my ass I'm going to drop the dose by 10mg and see how I feel... if I'm still getting knocked out after a few days, I'm going to drop it again - by 5mg this time... even a 15mg cut in 2 weeks would make me supremely happy.

I can do DXM too - it seems like people are using 60mg of Delsym? Would this be favorable as well? Or just do ONE NMDA antagonist? lol. I really want off of these fucking benzos!
 
Well my mate only noticed a reversal of benzo tolerance after he went up to 30-40mg of memantine, you can augment mem with some DXM to get the same results of a lower dose.
 
Updating. I ended up taking 60mg Delsym at 2PM yesterday, 60mg at 4:30AM or so this morning.

I ended up passing out some time around midnight and didn't take my valium. Upon waking at 4:30 I would normally be in mild withdrawal (half-life means nothing with my body - my metabolism is ridiculously fast) but I actually wasn't and I didn't take any valium until about 30 minutes ago when I took 10mg instead of my usual 20mg.

My morning cigarette really hit me hard too. Like I smoked half of it and when I went back in the house, I was quite dizzy and had a huge nicotine rush but ironically I didn't have my heart rate start pounding like it normally would if I had such a rush.

The NMDA antagonism is already starting to work its magic. The valium is kicking in faster and I've actually got some euphoria creeping in from it and its making me tired. This is astonishing - I've never gotten euphoria from any benzo except Xanax before - and I only got that when I first started to take it. The valium at half the dose is making me want to take a nap - and I just woke up - there really is a lot more than placebo to this!
 
Awesome news, indeed NMDA antagonists are very promosing for drug tolerance, please keep the updates coming!
 
thanks Magicalkat for the polistyrex dosing suggestion. I'll try this myself with my 2 physical dependencies: alprazolam and amphetamine

any data on how chronic DXM affects testosterone production?
 
seep said:
thanks Magicalkat for the polistyrex dosing suggestion. I'll try this myself with my 2 physical dependencies: alprazolam and amphetamine

any data on how chronic DXM affects testosterone production?
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I don't know about actual scientific studies but I used this stuff daily in 2nd and 3rd, sometimes 4th plateau doses for over a year (I was quite addicted) and never had any issues with testosterone levels during the 2 physicals that I had.

The doses for NMDA antagonism are obviously much lower than those required for recreation so I wouldn't be terribly concerned about it.

I ended up taking yet another nap today. I'm going to stay on the 30mg of Valium for a week though and see how I feel. It definitely looks like Delsym will help me get my tolerance down, if not kick the benzos entirely.

The interesting thing is that NMDA antagonists prevent seizures as well so even if I start having nasty withdrawals (which I'm highly doubting at this point), I don't have to worry about having seizures.

Once I've been on the 60mg twice a day for a week or so I'm going to knock it down to 45mg twice a day and see how that goes. I've heard that 60-80mg a day should be plenty sufficient for NMDA antagonism but would rather start off high and move down slowly, especially given the large safety profile of DXM.

The big key thing for me is going to be staying sober during this period - that's easier said than done when you have penis envy mushrooms lying about as well as moon rocks, MDA, and research chemicals... But in order for this to work, I'm going to have to abstain (plus I don't want to tempt the serotonin syndrome gods - even with such a low dose of DXM I would rather not risk it).
 
i've obtained memantine overseas, [NOT ASKING FOR SOURCE], do you have an rx or obtai them domestically (assuming you are usa)
 
Thanks for the posts, everyone.

I just purchased some Delsym today (12 hour Extended). I took a 5ML dose about 5 min. ago and plan on dosing my Dex in about 45. Is 5ML once or twice a day sufficient, or, would it be advised to take a larger dose? Please advise.

Cheers
 
Last winter I consumed a few grams of K over about 2-3 week period. At the same time I was taking tramadol practically everyday, or every other day for 3 weeks. During that period I did have to increase the dosage a little bit, but I never felt like i had to go over 500mg (I would have a benzo on hand or have consumed a light dose before taking the tramadol) during that whole period. I started dosing 200mg from the get go, but probably could have hit 300mg at the time to get a decent nod. What was most noticeable about the experience was the lack of any sort of physical or mental reaction from stopping the tramadol use.
 
seep said:
um, the locomotor, stereotypical and convulsant effects are reversed but not the euphoric effects? That is sorta what I'm experiencing (to varying degrees)
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Reverse tolerance is sensitization, the first time you take a substance tolerance occurs normally, however after stopping the substance a few days sensitization kicks in causing craving and also increased sensivity to the drug mediated by a CREB related mechanism (if i remember correctly something like dopamine in the nulceus accumbens --> NMDA --> CREB), after witch tolerance occurs normally again, but with craving "implanted" in the brain, not really related to normal tolerance we experience, i didnt find any references regarding tolerance itself to amphetamine (except one to cocaine) however many anecdotal reports confirm it works for amp tolerance.

Personally i noticed that 20mg of memantine does very little for tolerance, 40mg works great with 60mg being optimal (in my case, high dose tough and may cause bad brainfog for some, that dose also isnt actively used so be aware of that).

In case of memantine you need to take a break before reversal to the euphoric effects occurs and then readd amphetamine or it isnt capable of reversing tolerance, i would assume its the same with DXM, anecdotally it appears that NMDA antagonists make the withdrawal a ton easier, making it much easier to take a break.
 
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I'm gonna switch to DXM tomorrow myself untill i got memantine again, my dex pooped out within a few days.
 
Medievel either I'm severely dyslexic or that study says that MK-801 blocked sensitization (or caused "desensitization" if there is such a thing).
 
seep said:
Medievel either I'm severely dyslexic or that study says that MK-801 blocked sensitization (or caused "desensitization" if there is such a thing).
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Yes i know thats what i ment, sensitization occurs before tolerance occurs but its not really relevant, the fact they block sensitization doesnt mean they wont work against tolerance to the the euphoric effects.

Read this for more information behind the dynamics of sensitization, tolerance and addiction:
http://www.mesolimbic.com/article/addiction.html
http://www.nature.com/embor/journal/v7/n2/full/7400635.html
http://neuro.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/20/1/23
 
Prof. Dr. K. Kuschinsky said:
After repeated administration of psychostimulant drugs, a sensitization rather than a tolerance to the behavioral effects can be observed.
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Oh.
 
seep said:
Oh.
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That doesnt really occur in humans tough, there's definatly tolerance going on rather then sensitisation, i beleive it may have to do with the dosing regime in rodents or differences btw humans and rodents, i'm not sure about it.
 
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