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Thread: Benzodiazepines' Solubilities in Water

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    Benzodiazepines' Solubilities in Water 
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    BL Ambassador Captain.Heroin's Avatar
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    I created this thread so you all know how much water to use to dissolve benzodiazepines for injection. It's come to my attention people are still going to try shooting benzos, even those that aren't as feasible to inject in water only, so I want to help you all instead of leaving you all in the dark.

    Hopefully these statistics should reflect water solubility at a pH of 7. If the pH fluctuates, the solubility may increase or decrease. You don't want to inject highly acidic or basic water, so I'm going to list statistics for pH of 7.

    Alprazolam (Xanax) - 0.04 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00404[/cite]
    Chlordiazepoxide (Librium) - 2 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00475[/cite]
    Clonazepam (Klonopin) - < 0.1 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB01068[/cite]
    Diazepam (Valium) - 0.05 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00829[/cite]
    Estazolam (ProSom) - 0.0015 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB01215[/cite]
    Flurazepam (Dalmane) - 500 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00690[/cite]
    Loprazolam (Dormonoct) - 10mg/mL [cite]http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost.php?p=8116127&postcount=2[/cite]
    Lorazepam (Ativan) - 0.08 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00186[/cite]
    Midazolam (Dormicum) - 0.024 mg/mL [cite]http://www.drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00683[/cite]
    Oxazepam (Serax) - 0.179 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00842[/cite]
    Temazepam (Restoril) - 0.164 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00231[/cite]
    Triazolam (Halcion) - 0.00453 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00897[/cite]

    Zolpidem (Ambien) - 23 mg/mL [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB00425[/cite]
    Zopiclone (Imovane) - 0.151 mg/mL at 25C ** [cite]http://drugbank.ca/drugs/DB01198[/cite]

    As you can see, only flurazepam and midazolam are feasible for shooting in just water. Loprazolam is too, but I was unable to find information on it. If you can cite a source, please submit it so I can add it to this list. Any information on any other related drugs, or any other benzos of any kind are welcome as well.

    For most other benzodiazepines, without having to use a vastly huge volume of water, you would want to use a safe, USP grade solvent, or you would want to avoid taking it IV.

    There are many reasons not to inject benzodiazepines. For one, they seem to work better orally. Other than triazolam and midazolam, most benzodiazepines have at least 80% oral BA. Flurazepam is the one closest to 80%, and even then, I would personally prefer taking flurazepam orally over IV. Most benzodiazepines are going to last longer when taken orally. For the most part, they don't take too long to kick in either.

    Furthermore, not filtering IV solutions with benzodiazepines with a micron filter may lead to complications, or at least be bad for your lungs and or other bodily organs. Please read the Case Studies thread for more about this.

    ** 25C = 77F
    Last edited by Captain.Heroin; 05-06-2011 at 03:16. Reason: added Zolpidem (Ambien) and Zopiclone (Imovane)
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    Benzodiazepine Oral BA | Please read before posting 
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    Capsule
    A final word on injecting benzodiazepines. It's not worth it. Please take them orally (other than midazolam). Also, please read up on how IVing can go horribly wrong in the Case Studies thread, especially when it comes to shooting pills.

    Midazolam and benzos within its classes (like loprazolam), and flurazepam (in the 1,4-benzo category) are the only benzodiazepines that you can feasibly fit into 1mL of water for a solid recreational effect. There is a reason why benzodiazepines were designed to be taken orally. It's a solid route of administration. The only benzos I would bother taking sublingually are lorazepam, and triazolam.

    Most benzos (except for triazolam and midazolam) have relatively very high oral BA's. There's really no need to IV common benzodiazepines (valium, klonopin, xanax, ativan, librium, etc) and it's essentially not feasible unless you get the right solvent.

    Either way, shoot at your own risk. This information is being provided to you so that you at least will have numbers, and an example of how to do the math to make sure you will at least get to ingest the drug. If you are going to inject benzodiazepines anyways, and do not have a sterile ampule to inject from: then you are going to need to figure out what volume syringe you need (or at least, what solvent you will need) and you will also need to micron filter.

    Please feel free to add in sourced facts if you have any additional ones.

    Let's keep this conversation civil. Just as much as some people choose to IV meth, cocaine, or opiates, others will choose to IV benzodiazepines. We all have our reasons for doing what we do, let's not question them here. I want this thread specifically for math, for questions related to benzodiazepine solubility in water, and the like. Please note off topic comments, or any negative comments at all, will be removed.

    Friendly, fair, harm reduction based warnings are welcome though! Just keep in mind there's a right and wrong way to go about this (right - friendly, wrong - insulting and demeaning).

    Thank you JC for specifically helping me find the site I used to source all the sources I have linked to the first post, other than the midazolam statistics.
    Last edited by Captain.Heroin; 19-02-2010 at 09:51.
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    An example of how to utilize these facts... 
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    Here's an example.

    I have a large, 25cc syringe. I would like to IV triazolam, but not use anything but water because I'm cheap like that. I only need to IV 0.25mg (that may be too much for my taste, I don't know, only one way to find out am I right? ). Let's do the math - can I fit 0.25mg triazolam in 25cc?

    We are given...
    Triazolam (Halcion) - 0.00453 mg/mL
    (0.25mg)/(0.00453mg/mL) = 55.187...mL

    I cannot fit 0.25mg of triazolam in a 25CC syringe. I could into a 60cc syringe, but I do not have one that large.

    How about the equivalent of alprazolam? They're in the same family of benzos (triazolobenzodiazepines). Can I fit 0.5mg of alprazolam into a 25cc syringe, or will I need a 60cc syringe like I would triazolam?

    We are given...
    Alprazolam (Xanax) - 0.04 mg/mL
    (0.5mg)/(0.04mg/mL) = 12.5 mL

    I can fit 0.5mg of alprazolam into a 25CC syringe. In fact, I can fit up to 1mg of it into a 25cc syringe.
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    Corrections... 
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    Midazolam, a water soluble benzo.

    The issue with it being water soluble is that it isn't very water soluble at 7.0 pH.

    At 7.0 pH, you can only get 0.024mg per mL of water. This is pretty bad.

    At 5.0 pH, you can get 1mg/mL of water. This is better but pretty bad, considering people like to shoot more than 1mg generally speaking.

    At < 3.0 pH, you can get a considerably larger amount of the drug in a single mL of water, as the drug will then switch over to the open-ring form.

    Most other benzodiazepines will increase solubility at a lower pH. The problem is that a 3.0 pH or lower solution will burn when injected so feasibly, 5.0 pH is the lowest you will want to go.

    I normally inject with a solution with a 5.0 pH.

    For instance, alprazolam has 0.04mg / mL at 7.0 pH but increases to 0.1mg / mL at 5.0 pH.
    Last edited by Captain.Heroin; 05-06-2011 at 03:19.
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    #5
    ugh, i couldn't imagine trying to boot up with a 25cc rig on the end of a needle. it would take a fair amount of control to be able to shoot steadily and not slip out at all and all for what? a couple minutes quicker onset.

    it just reinstates why people should stick to orally consuming benzos as they're designed
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    Bluelighter NCUK's Avatar
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    im with u capt. dont know why these kids insist on snorting an shooting benzos.... they need to do a little research.
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftwing View Post
    ugh, i couldn't imagine trying to boot up with a 25cc rig on the end of a needle. it would take a fair amount of control to be able to shoot steadily and not slip out at all and all for what? a couple minutes quicker onset.

    it just reinstates why people should stick to orally consuming benzos as they're designed
    Exactly. This is why using a better solvent dissolved into a safe proportion of water would be much easier and more feasible.

    I use 3/10 CC syringes. I wouldn't want to use 25cc in a shot, that'd be such a waste IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by NCUK View Post
    im with u capt. dont know why these kids insist on snorting an shooting benzos.... they need to do a little research.
    IMO I can see the idea why you'd want to IV flurazepam (the insanely long duration is shortened when IV'd) but I would still like flurazepam oral just as much. Only midazolam (and probably loprazolam) are really worth shooting anways. And if you get something so nice like that, and plan on using it more than once, use a micron filter.

    Triazolam and lorazepam: take sublingually.

    Any other benzo, orally.
    Last edited by Captain.Heroin; 19-02-2010 at 10:06.
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    #8
    ^even with the solvent and a decent amount of solution, it's still not worth the hassle imo.

    it would probably take the same amount of time to swallow a benzo pill and wait for it's effects then it would to finish off a 25cc shot. i never use over a 5mL barrel and that's only when i'm shooting MsContins (morphine), everything else is 1cc or smaller.
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    BL Ambassador Captain.Heroin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftwing View Post
    ^even with the solvent and a decent amount of solution, it's still not worth the hassle imo.

    it would probably take the same amount of time to swallow a benzo pill and wait for it's effects then it would to finish off a 25cc shot. i never use over a 5mL barrel and that's only when i'm shooting MsContins (morphine), everything else is 1cc or smaller.
    Yeah I would have qualms about using 25cc. That's ridiculous. I would rather add in the solvent, and micron filter. I would only do that for one benzo in mind, but I like it so much orally as is that I don't know if I would even go through with it.

    I might be able to conserve what I have this way but I would hate for it to be a "waste" IMO - I want it to work 110% and if I know orally works why fuck with that?
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    #10
    its a sad day when the fun ones shouldnt be injected.. Great thread(A), props to OP!
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    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMcFailure View Post
    Great thread(A), props to OP!
    Thanks Frosty!
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    Bluelighter OpiYum's Avatar
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    So, could you refer to me somewhere to learn how to make an injectable form of a benzo, i.e. xanax or valium or triazolam? What solvents are best? Process to extract the benzo from the fillers/binders?

    I just am curious and bc of my non existent chemistry knowledge, wouldn't attempt anything on my own in any time soon.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OpiYum View Post
    So, could you refer to me somewhere to learn how to make an injectable form of a benzo, i.e. xanax or valium or triazolam? What solvents are best? Process to extract the benzo from the fillers/binders?

    I just am curious and bc of my non existent chemistry knowledge, wouldn't attempt anything on my own in any time soon.
    The only benzos I have attempted to inject are the ones that are plenty water soluble (midazolam and flurazepam). I don't imagine most other benzos would have an advantage injected.

    Propylene glycol is most likely going to be the solvent you will need to dilute with water. You might want to check though.

    Micron filtering will probably be ideal.
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    #14
    i was just thinking you could use a butterly needle for those larger water based solutions but it's still not worth the trouble.
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    would ethanol be effective to extract and evaporate diazepem? i have a friend who says he washed out a bottle with ethanol, let it evap, and had a little clump off smokable diazepam.. could he have also mixed this with water and shot it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawndoctor View Post
    would ethanol be effective to extract and evaporate diazepem? i have a friend who says he washed out a bottle with ethanol, let it evap, and had a little clump off smokable diazepam.. could he have also mixed this with water and shot it?
    I am not sure. I wouldn't smoke diazepam. You cannot mix the result of the extraction with water and shoot it; diazepam is poorly water soluble. It would take 100ml to dissolve 5mg of diazepam.

    Unless you want to use propylene glycol or ethanol diluted in water, you cannot shoot diazepam.

    Just take diazepam orally.

    To boost the effects, take 200mg cimetidine about 30 minutes before dosing diazepam.
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    #17
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    cheers, i have no plans to try shooting my benzo's, i find just crushing them up into fine powder and swallowing with heaps off water gives me as fast an onset as i need. i just wanted to check out about wat my friend said about the ethanol.
    from what you said, does this mean ethanol would be good to extract xanax or valium?
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawndoctor View Post
    cheers, i have no plans to try shooting my benzo's, i find just crushing them up into fine powder and swallowing with heaps off water gives me as fast an onset as i need. i just wanted to check out about wat my friend said about the ethanol.
    from what you said, does this mean ethanol would be good to extract xanax or valium?
    Technically yes, I believe. Diazepam is Valium.

    I know Xanax is also ethanol soluble, I just don't know to what degree.

    Glad to hear I could help.
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    Triazolam and lorazepam: take sublingually
    Does anyone know the bioavalibility on Triazolam? I've searched and came up short. I'm guessing sublingually is higher than oral ROA. Sorry if it a little off topic but i was just curious when i was reading.
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    Quote Originally Posted by xorcistxx View Post
    Does anyone know the bioavalibility on Triazolam? I've searched and came up short. I'm guessing sublingually is higher than oral ROA. Sorry if it a little off topic but i was just curious when i was reading.
    Bioavailability / Half Life Mega Thread
    http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost....&postcount=222

    Did you search that thread?

    Triazolam has 9% higher sublingual BA when compared to oral.
    oral: 44%
    sublingual: 53%
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    #21
    Bluelighter xorcistxx's Avatar
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    Lol, yeah..... just didnt see that part thank you!

    edit: forgot i was searching the name Halcion not triazolam
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    #22
    BL Ambassador Captain.Heroin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xorcistxx View Post
    Lol, yeah..... just didnt see that part thank you!

    edit: forgot i was searching the name Halcion not triazolam
    It's OK. Yeah it would only show up since the user did not enter the brand names.

    I've only tried halcion once, and it was 0.25mg sublingually. I liked it a lot, but not as much as my longer lasting hypnotics (temazepam, loprazolam, midazolam, flurazepam).
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    #23
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    I have a long/hate relationship with benzos. Temazepam/ Halcion were my favorite.I Take .25 mg everyday, sometimes a lil more. I just tried sublingual and it seems pretty nice. It feels alot less hardcore hypnotic and more euphoric, like 60 to 90 mgs of restoril.

    But xanax... one night took 12mgs of xanax er and a 10 mg valium.... i was supposed to be spending the night at my friends dad's house across town..... i woke up at my huge crush's(currently my girlfriend) house with her dad hovering over me at 8am asking me where is your car, how did you get her, who are you....... haha i miss being in high school
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    Found this in an article that was really hard to get, may be of some use to you guys:



    I have some Lormetazepam, please help me work out how many mg/ml I would need to make a solution.

    Oli

    Also this will be useful for some:



    Oli

    EDIT: Full PDF: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=L4ORNDK6
    Last edited by oliphill; 08-04-2010 at 14:40.
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    triazolam/halcion 
    #25
    so what's the best way to take halcion? sublingual, or up the ol nose????
    i just got some and oraly was a disappointment.

    testo
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