Bluelight

Thread: Extracting fentanyl from polymer-matrix patches

Page 1 of 9 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 215
  1. Collapse Details
    Extracting fentanyl from polymer-matrix patches 
    #1
    MODS NOTE

    now, we've established that this extraction, in the wrong hands, can lead to death no matter how the user decides to use the end product.

    we're here to provide unbiased and accurate information to you guys. BL is about harm reduction and while this is a controvesial thread, censoring this information to you guys isn't what we're about.

    so let's keep this thread on topic and keep our personal opinions to ourselves about whether this should or shouldn't be allowed, because it is.

    if you see something that needs correcting then say something about it, don't just let it go unnoticed.

    thanks guys




    There seems to be huge stigma and a battle on bluelight and elsewhere about fentanyl (patch) use and safety in general. The safest way to use a fentanyl patch is by wearing it on your skin as they are designed. This thread is about all other methods of fentanyl use and extraction and does not advocate such practices, rather provides information on how to do it in the safest manner possible if you are going to.

    This thread outlines in detail methods to extract fentanyl from the newer more popular polymer matrix patches. In a subsequent post below I have outlined some concepts for gel-reservoir patch extraction where similar techniques may apply.

    Disclaimer: Fentanyl is the most potent available opioid in existence for human use with a strength 100 times that of morphine. Using fentanyl in any form/ROA can be extremely dangerous. You should not think about using fentanyl in any way unless you already have an opiate tolerance and are experienced with potent opiates. Fentanyl has been the cause of many ODs and deaths from people worldwide including experienced bluelighters. When using fentanyl you are playing with fire and should take as many precautions as possible. Have someone ready with a shot of naloxone the first time you try it and experiment with doses, and ideally always have someone with you.

    Problems: The main issue with fentanyl is that it is extremely potent and should not be consumed by anyone who isn't opioid experienced and tolerant. There have been many deaths and ODs around fentanyl and aside from the high potency I believe the route cause is the inability to accurately measure doses which I present a solution for.

    Smoking gel from the older patches or powdered versions of fentanyl are extremely dangerous because it is difficult to even get a ballpark estimate of how much you are taking. In the case of fentanyl, doses are in mcg that can't be eyeballed, weighed on consumer scales, or estimated with drops of gel due to the non homogeneous distribution of fentanyl within it. A drop of gel or speck of powder could contain 50 mcg or several thousand mcg which can be the difference between life and death.

    Misconceptions: as far as polymer matrix patches go they will work extremely poorly if you try to take pieces of a patch and use it bucally or in any way in your mouth. It simply doesn't work or is such a poor ROA the effects are negligible or placebo.

    The safest way to use any fentanyl patch is to wear it transdermally as indicated.
    You can apply heat or take a hot bath to speed up the release if desired. You still need to be careful and opiate tolerant when using fentanyl in any way.


    All right, here are step by step instruction on how to extract fentanyl from the modern polymer matrix patches like Mylan brand and other non gel-reservoir patches (which all use this polymer matrix).


    Don't let the length of this post intimidate you or stop you from using this process, I wrote it out in detail to explain the reasoning for how I chose each step and so it is extremely clear. My intention was to use this for IV use but as outlined it can apply for accurate dosing with several ROAs you previously and otherwise couldn't use or achieve. It is very simple and takes an hour or two to prepare. I suppose I can go back and write the step by step cliff notes instructions and add them at the end.

    Basically the key here is the extraction process and this only works for the Mylan matrix type patches which are what are on the market now since the gel patches are being phased out by doctors. They are thought to be much harder to abuse but the reality is you can do a much more efficient and easier extraction on them, since this can lend itself to some safer practices it is probably is for the better that these patches are dominating the market now.

    The basic principle for using alcohol for extraction came from a medical journal article where they did exactly that to test the abuse potential of these patches. I used to be able to read the article in whole but now it seems you need a subscription everywhere to access the entire thing. I believe it is this one. If someone has access to this journal article in full it would be great if you could share it.

    They took matrix type patches like the Mylan and soaked them in methanol, ethanol (using normal 40% rum liquor), and I believe isopropyl alcohol. The results were that in an hour with no heat over 97% (I forget the exact figure, I think it was higher around 99% ) of fentanyl was extracted with methanol and over 90% with rum, and the other alcohol used was somewhere in the middle.

    For my method I use 70% or 91% isopropyl alcohol for the actual extraction process then 40% vodka (Svedka in my case) to prepare the end solution. The reason for using vodka for the end solution is because it is readily available, decent vodka is well filtered and has relatively minimal other ingredients aside from ethanol and water and anything else isn't particulate matter and doesn't pose a significant risk for IV use, ethanol is proven to be safe to IV when diluted, and perhaps most importantly it will keep the solution sterile and prevent bacterial growth and other contamination allowing it to be stored over an extended period.

    So for my method I first rubbed the lettering off the top of the patch with a drop of iso alcohol then dropped the entire patch in a metal measuring cup filled with isopropyl. For my first preparation I just let it sit then evaporated the alcohol and subsequently I used a double boiler configuration to heat the alcohol/patch and later evaporate it quickly. I found this to be extremely effective. I basically just filled a pot with water, put it on the stove then let the measuring cup float on top with the measuring cup handle secured to the pot handle with a zip tie or paperclip.

    I experimented with just letting the patch soak like this and found it left some glue residue to be filtered out and then i tried stretching the patches out to allow more surface area which worked but made it more difficult since it was hard to control in the solution and kept getting tangled.

    Eventually what I found best was to remove the patch after a few minutes while it was warm sitting in the alcohol and start rubbing the glue side with my fingers. It becomes extremely quick and easy to separate and peel all of the glue off the patch without tearing or warping it with a little practice. it is similar to removing the glue off a notebook label or similar price tag.
    MOD NOTE: PLEASE READ THE ENTIRE THREAD BEFORE ATTEMPTING THIS PROCEDURE. SOME PEOPLE BELIEVE THAT THE GLUE CONTAINS A LARGE PORTION OF THE DRUG AND REMOVAL OF IT IS NOT EFFECTIVE
    Now with the glue removed put the patch back in the alcohol (with no heat if you prefer which is proven to be very effective), and in my case I used heat to get the most out of the patch. Do not directly heat the alcohol and be careful with it or you will end up with a fiery mess of flaming alcohol solution (I'm sure you've experienced some accidents with lighting high proof alcohol before while drunk- same sort of thing ). That's why I use a double boiler and am careful not to let anything splash out.

    I added more iso during the process a couple times as it started to vaporize and the level would lower in the cup so I refilled it. I would let the patch stay heated in the solution for about an hour. This is probably overkill but guarantees you are getting close to 100% of the fentanyl out of the patch. Half an hour with heat should do it or maybe two hours just letting it sit cold would be very effective (over 95% ).

    Then remove the patch and if it is already in a double boiler it makes evaporating the rest of the alcohol/water extremely easy since you just keep it going. If you are doing it cold you will want to set up a double boiler to evaporate the alcohol quickly or if you have a lot of time and patience just let it sit out with a piece of paper on top so dust doesn't fall in but it can still evaporate.

    Now you have a cup with a barely noticeable dried film, this is how it should be since it is either 2.5, 5, or 10 mg of fent left over (there might be a 75 mcg/hr 7.5mg patch, I forget). If you removed all the glue it is much better and more pure and requires less filtering.

    I would next use a 3ml syringe to draw up 2ml of vodka and squirt it in the cup. Using the plunger you can rub it against the surface to get all of the fentanyl residue dissolved. Next I had another 3ml syringe with a micron filter attached (when I wasn't removing the glue I was afraid of it getting in there so I used a micron) and later just a 3ml syringe with the barrel stuffed with cotton. It is always best to use a micron filter if it is available to you but if you remove the glue there should be very little contaminants or anything to worry about and a syringe stuffed with cotton dose a great job. If you are not planning to IV the solution then you definitely don't need to bother with a micron. So after you mix around the 2ml of vodka in the cup dissolving nearly all of the residue, draw it up through a syringe and run it through the filter syringe and into a sterilized cap, cup, or shot glass.

    Repeat this process again with another 2ml of vodka to be sure to get everything out of the cup. If using cotton you can run an extra 1/2ml through the syringe to clear it so you end up with close to exactly 4ml of vodka/fentanyl solution.

    Edit: After some thinking I realized you can use a lower concentration of vodka while still maintaining the same benefits allowing for more dilution. Instead of using 4ml of vodka, you can mix 1ml of vodka with 3ml of sterile water for a 10% ethanol solution and follow the process exactly as otherwise stated except substitute vodka with this diluted solution. So instead of using 2ml of vodka in each stage, use 2ml of this diluted vodka to achieve the same 4ml of solution with a lesser ethanol concentration which is easier on your body, requires less dilution, and allows you to dilute it even further more easily. End Edit

    I chose 4ml because it is then easy to calculate the concentration of fentanyl and easily draw out dosages. If using a 5mg patch like I was then 10 units is close to 50 mcg which makes dosing easy. There is obviously room for error in this process so the 10 units = 50 mcg is a conservative estimate and could be 30-40 mcg. This is a good thing in terms of harm reduction since it is better to over estimate the dose and have a good idea of how much you're taking than underestimate or have very little clue at all if you didn't do this method. 4ml works for all patches since 10 units = 50 mcg for a 50 mcg/hr patch, 10 units = 100 mcg for a 100 mcg/hr patch, and 10 units = 25 mcg for a 25 mcg/hr patch. I like this method since it is simple and easy to remember and 10 units is approximately however many micrograms the original patch dispensed per hour.

    If you wish you can filter the 4ml of solution again to be sure it is clear of any dust or particles that may have gotten in or just go straight to storing it. I used 4ml rubber topped vials that I emptied Narcan from (and sterilized thoroughly with alcohol/bleach) which were perfect for this. You can get 10ml vials, micron filters, and any syringes you might need for this from gpzservices.com. Aside from the micron which I later didn't use I got everything I needed from my needle exchange program (including the small vials). You can store the solution in another small container or vial but a sealed one with rubber top to insert needles is ideal.

    Intravenous Use: this one is longer since the other ROA methods are based upon the dosing concept here

    To dose for IV use simply take a 1ml syringe and draw out however many micrograms you wish, it's best to start with whatever the patch would release in an hour to get a feel for it IVed, so 10 units for 50 mcg or 20 for 100 mcg of fentanyl (from a 50 mcg/hr patch). Then draw up sterile water for IV use to fill the remainder of the syringe and mix it around. To mix I found it easiest to have an air bubble in the barrel then rotate it from one end to the other tapping the air bubble to go from top to bottom. You can also sandwich the ethanol solution for easier mixing by drawing up sterile water first, then the fentanyl solution, then more sterile water and mixing in the syringe as described above.

    Then it is time to inject and just prepare for injection as you would anything else. Once you register and release the tourniquet it is advisable to slowly push the plunger down, say 10 units at a time, let the drug hit you and check how you are feeling overall. Be aware of you breathing in particular since fentanyl is very respiratory depressant and that effect can come in before experiencing significant euphoria, relaxation, and other normal opiate effects. Once you feel comfortable and good push the plunger down a bit more and repeat until you finish dosing and stop immediately if you get to a point where you feel your breathing slowing and you think you might have taken too much. If you are ok at that point it may be adequate to stop or if you feel you may ne on the verge of an OD you or a friend can administer naloxone or buprenorphine to throw you out of it. This applies to all ROAs.

    This is the main reason I think IV use using this method is a very safe way to use fentanyl. With other ROAs you do not have the ability to gradually dose as well and get instant feedback which can easily prevent an OD. It also allows you to measure conservative doses that are in a safe range, i.e. start with what a patch would deliver in an hour or two transdermally, and repeat and adjust them with accuracy while being able to monitor your body throughout the whole process. You can be as careful as you can smoking some gel or powder but you have no idea how much is in that hit (it could be 2000 mcg+) and you can only take it in all at once. Even if you were able to slowly vaporize/smoke it there is a significant delay between when it hits you that wouldn't allow you to react or stop like you can by IVing it.


    Now onto other potential ways to use this solution for other ROAs. These are all ideas that I am confident would be very effective and safer than the typical way fentanyl is [ab]used. If anyone tries these please report back.

    IM: Just don't. There is no advantage here and unless you micron filtered the solution it would be inadvisable and in any case there is no good reason to.

    Plugging: Prepare the dosage with a syringe the same way you would for IV and dilute it. I don't know how ethanol feels in your ass so you may wish to dilute it more. As always be careful dosing here, I guess you could gradually push the plunger in to spray a small amount of solution at a time then waiting to feel the effects, however that sounds uncomfortable and I have an image in my head of someone bent over with a syringe in their ass for 20 minutes. Seriously, be careful and start small and slow if you can, as goes with inserting anything into your ass.

    Intranasal: follow the same procedure for plugging except spray it up your nose.

    Sublingual:Draw out a dose with a syringe like you would for IV except you can skip the dilution part. spray the solution onto a cotton ball and stick it under your tongue- similar idea to 6/7's alcohol and buprenorphine sublingual method.

    Oral?: I'm not sure how effective this would be and the previous three ROAs seem like great options but I'll throw it out there. Measure a dose with the syringe then spray it in a shot glass and mix with water. I suppose you could just mix with more vodka until you have a normal sized shot of vodka with a kick of fentanyl but I don't advocate mixing alcohol and opiates, especially fentanyl and that sounds like a horrible idea. Imagine people doing repeated shots like that or slipping fentanyl into someone else's shot without them knowing, that's a recipe for disaster. I should stop giving date-rapists and suicidal people ideas. So just mix with water and take the shot.

    In summary, the extraction method is nearly 100% efficient and by preparing the fentanyl solution as I described it allows you to accurately measure doses in the double digit microgram range and take them by a variety of ROAs as I have outlined. I believe this is the absolute safest way to dose fentanyl and be sure of how much you are taking. It opens up doors for new safer methods of consumption rather than smoking or taking unknown potentially high doses of fentanyl by other ROAs that have proven to be extremely dangerous and the cause of many ODs and deaths.

    I hope this is beneficial to people and they see its value as much as I do and it saves some lives. As always be safe.

    I'll edit this if anything is not clear or anyone has any further input. I gladly welcome rational feedback that actually addresses the points in this posts.

    Please post any feedback, criticism, ideas, or comments in reaction to this post. Stay safe!

    Edit:
    Thank you everyone, especially the bluelight staff/OD mod team, for your support, thoughtfulness, feedback, and patience regarding this sensitive thread and helping to make it better. It will continue to be updated and improved and I appreciate people having an open mind about the topic, those of you who have defended the thread, and the people who have come to appreciate its value who were originally vehemently against the idea.
    Last edited by amapola; 09-06-2011 at 21:33. Reason: added mod note
    Reply With Quote
     

  2. Collapse Details
     
    #2
    Bluelight Crew sixpartseven's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Detroit
    Posts
    11,303
    Ok, I'm going to have to take a few minutes to read over all this, but I can tell you right now, we generally do not allow extraction threads like this, especially with fentanyl patches because of the extreme dangers involved.

    This will probably be closed, but I'll discuss it with the rest of the Mods first to see what they think. I'm just giving you a heads up.
    Reply With Quote
     

  3. Collapse Details
     
    #3
    Quote Originally Posted by sixpartseven View Post
    Ok, I'm going to have to take a few minutes to read over all this, but I can tell you right now, we generally do not allow extraction threads like this, especially with fentanyl patches because of the extreme dangers involved.

    This will probably be closed, but I'll discuss it with the rest of the Mods first to see what they think. I'm just giving you a heads up.
    this is really in the interest of harm reduction since it offers much safers ways to use fentanyl if people are going to abuse it

    An admin literally approved this exact type of thread/discussion regarding fentanyl extraction a month or so back when people were touchy about posting the extraction method. I'll find the post and edit this with it.

    Edit:
    Quote Originally Posted by phrozen View Post
    I don't get the whole "i won't post it here" mindset. If it's not against the rules, it's fine. Dangerous or not to shoot fent, people are going to try to do it. They'll try whatever extraction they think will work, alcohol based, water based, other solvent etc. So, it is in our interest to post such things and discuss the potential negative ramifications of fucking up the extraction and of using that substance. Censorship and banned topics are not conducive to harm reduction.
    http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost....0&postcount=31
    Reply With Quote
     

  4. Collapse Details
     
    #4
    Bluelighter PureLife's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    2,693
    So what your saying is let a mylan fentanyl patch sit in a cup of ethanol for an hour, and literally of the fentanyl will have been released into the alcohol? Then evaporate the alcohol ?
    Reply With Quote
     

  5. Collapse Details
     
    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by PureLife View Post
    So what your saying is let a mylan fentanyl patch sit in a cup of ethanol for an hour, and literally of the fentanyl will have been released into the alcohol? Then evaporate the alcohol ?
    Basically.

    That would be one simple way to extract it with 90% efficiency, yes. I would just remove the glue after it is soaking in the alcohol for a bit if you go down this route. The next thing would be to measure a known amount of water, vodka, or whatever you choose so you can have a known concentration that you can accurately dose- 4ml for a final solution seems to be a good all around volume for patch extraction that allows easy dosing where 10 units = close to however many mcg the original patch released per hour where it is safe to assume it is that amount (since you can only be over estimating slightly which is good in terms of harm reduction).

    The method I used was a bit more involved and complicated but was overall quicker and nearly 100% effective.
    Reply With Quote
     

  6. Collapse Details
     
    #6
    Bluelighter
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    durham, nc
    Posts
    82
    great job oxymorphone
    Reply With Quote
     

  7. Collapse Details
     
    #7
    Quote Originally Posted by wook View Post
    great job oxymorphone
    Thanks, I'm glad you appreciate it.
    Reply With Quote
     

  8. Collapse Details
     
    #8
    Bluelight Crew sixpartseven's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Detroit
    Posts
    11,303
    It shall stay.

    I'm going to write a disclaimer that will be placed at the top of your original post, though.
    Reply With Quote
     

  9. Collapse Details
     
    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by sixpartseven View Post
    It shall stay.

    I'm going to write a disclaimer that will be placed at the top of your original post, though.
    Great. Any extra disclaimers regarding fentanyl dangers/safety can't hurt.
    Reply With Quote
     

  10. Collapse Details
     
    #10
    yeah, she's all kosher. we're just going to have to finely comb over your instructions to make sure everything is legit
    Reply With Quote
     

  11. Collapse Details
     
    #11
    I made some edits for clarity and to fix some typos. It's hard and time consuming to do while drunk
    Reply With Quote
     

  12. Collapse Details
     
    #12
    Bluelighter Drench's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Behind my decks
    Posts
    192
    Nice post, very helpful. Well done
    Reply With Quote
     

  13. Collapse Details
     
    #13
    Bluelighter Cloud_9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Ganymede orbitting Jupiter
    Posts
    575
    Oh awsome, this would have come in handy when I was able to get off from fentanyl and had about 20 extra patches as my PCP was prescribing them to me for chronic pain, and stupid me, I "didn't like them!" I ended up giving them away and kept about 5 for myself, and when I got into the habit that I was starting to like opiates about 3 years later I found absolutely nothing in like the 25 pages of search results I ducked through seeing how it could be done, and searched on BL and erowid and all the other drug-conscious sites, but nothing. Kudos to you my friend, you are a great man in drug history! I just hope some dope won't be a moron and decide to take a glob of 5mg of fent IV like I have seen idiots about to do before I tell them its about 60-120 times more powerful then morphine mg for mg and to be careful. I forced the grudgingly non-cooperating fuck to first at least shoot a half syringe and wait about 5m to make sure he was ok. Needless to say... he faceplanted the second he pushed down +/- about 25 seconds and I was stuck monitoring the idiot's breathing when I was in priority to get high myself. vOv Shit happens I guess.... you can only be accountable for the shit your stupid ass pulls, and so far, ONLY ONE COMA! o/\o YOU PROUD OF ME MOMMY!

    PS: Don't do fent IV in case you are dumb enough to try, not to mention the ugly plastic binders that may be left in the fent preparation. What I mentioned above was using a mylan(?) drug-reservoir type fentanyl trans-dermal system that was just ran through with a syringe and had about half the clear gel sucked out. Don't be an heroic idiot like my friend, no one cares you could slam all 10mg of your fent, no one cares, er on the side of caution, always. PERIOD. . .

    EDIT: Just for the OP, perhaps you would get more people that actually post shit instead of run away at your (I bet amphetamine induced) brick text chunk you have and separate what is the minimum you need to do this in a section at the bottom, or top, and in bold.... because bold is idiot proof~!

    EDIT ROUND DVA: Didn't mean to challenge your authority with "BOLD IT TO FUCK AND BACK".... I do know at least the methods (different ROAs) you would use to take advantage of this are in bold, I just said that you should bold something quick and painless with just what you need for plugging and intra-nasal, as I am sure someone who will take the time to learn about IV will be reading most the OP post...at least I hope to god, or else we will have a slur of ODs and nobody on a harm-reduction site wants that, no matter HOW loosely the mission statement of this website is!

    EDIT ROUND THREE....FIGHT!: Just my two cents, but I am someone who will close up a thread unless its short and sweet, or if its just something fan-fucking-tastic like this one was! Once again, KUDOS! o/\o
    Last edited by Cloud_9; 10-02-2010 at 14:37.
    Reply With Quote
     

  14. Collapse Details
     
    #14
    In the name of harm reduction, can a disclaimer about the benzodiazepine effect be added? If anyone mixes benzos with the fentanyl it increases chances of OD by a lot

    Great thread, though I refuse to touch the stuff after my brush with death
    Reply With Quote
     

  15. Collapse Details
     
    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud_9 View Post
    Oh awsome, this would have come in handy when I was able to get off from fentanyl and had about 20 extra patches as my PCP was prescribing them to me for chronic pain, and stupid me, I "didn't like them!" I ended up giving them away and kept about 5 for myself, and when I got into the habit that I was starting to like opiates about 3 years later I found absolutely nothing in like the 25 pages of search results I ducked through seeing how it could be done, and searched on BL and erowid and all the other drug-conscious sites, but nothing. Kudos to you my friend, you are a great man in drug history! I just hope some dope won't be a moron and decide to take a glob of 5mg of fent IV like I have seen idiots about to do before I tell them its about 60-120 times more powerful then morphine mg for mg and to be careful. I forced the grudgingly non-cooperating fuck to first at least shoot a half syringe and wait about 5m to make sure he was ok. Needless to say... he faceplanted the second he pushed down +/- about 25 seconds and I was stuck monitoring the idiot's breathing when I was in priority to get high myself. vOv Shit happens I guess.... you can only be accountable for the shit your stupid ass pulls, and so far, ONLY ONE COMA! o/\o YOU PROUD OF ME MOMMY!

    PS: Don't do fent IV in case you are dumb enough to try, not to mention the ugly plastic binders that may be left in the fent preparation. What I mentioned above was using a mylan(?) drug-reservoir type fentanyl trans-dermal system that was just ran through with a syringe and had about half the clear gel sucked out. Don't be an heroic idiot like my friend, no one cares you could slam all 10mg of your fent, no one cares, er on the side of caution, always. PERIOD. . .

    EDIT: Just for the OP, perhaps you would get more people that actually post shit instead of run away at your (I bet amphetamine induced) brick text chunk you have and separate what is the minimum you need to do this in a section at the bottom, or top, and in bold.... because bold is idiot proof~!

    EDIT ROUND DVA: Didn't mean to challenge your authority with "BOLD IT TO FUCK AND BACK".... I do know at least the methods (different ROAs) you would use to take advantage of this are in bold, I just said that you should bold something quick and painless with just what you need for plugging and intra-nasal, as I am sure someone who will take the time to learn about IV will be reading most the OP post...at least I hope to god, or else we will have a slur of ODs and nobody on a harm-reduction site wants that, no matter HOW loosely the mission statement of this website is!

    EDIT ROUND THREE....FIGHT!: Just my two cents, but I am someone who will close up a thread unless its short and sweet, or if its just something fan-fucking-tastic like this one was! Once again, KUDOS! o/\o
    Surprisingly not amphetamine/mephedrone induced at all, I was completely sober and am on that path right now. The urge to write everything out in detail came from my frustration in another thread and I had started and planned to post a thread like this before while I was using heroin and fentanyl IV heavily when I came up with this method, but those projects get quickly abandoned when you can just get high and watch TV and would rather not stare at a a computer screen cross eyed.

    What you mentioned about people just mixing some gel with water and IVing it is the reason there is a huge stigma around shooting fentanyl since that's really all the average person could do with the knowledge that was out there, it was stupid, and the source for nearly all the fent IV deaths. The gel patches are less common now which is a good thing but people still have and get them so I would like to add a similar extraction process for them- I just don't have that experience and never had them myself. If anyone else has ideas that would be another good procedure to add.

    Anyway thanks for your response, if people are going to do this they should really read ALL OF IT so it might be better to leave out the quick instructions so people don't run into trouble taking shortcuts not knowing the reasoning behind the steps and fuck it up. The last thing I what is for someone to use the bare essentials to extract fentanyl from a patch then make a quick unknown solution they can't dose or dose wrong and end up hurting or killing themselves. If you are using fentanyl and taking that amount of risk and you care about your life you can take several minutes and read the whole thing.


    To the other guy above saying there should be a benzo disclaimer: to use fentanyl you should already be extremely opiate experienced and tolerant and not mixing benzos and alcohol with opiates is pretty basic safety. I guess it can't hurt to be said, however I think anyone who reads this and follows it should already be experienced enough to know the risks about mixing other depressants/sedatives with opioids.

    I can write as big of a disclaimer as I want but there will always be more that can said about safety and the same people will ignore it so the best disclaimer is to leave fentanyl alone unless you are knowledgeable, experienced, and tolerant of opioids. Fentanyl is playing with fire and gasoline- if you follow the above method and use it to dose reasonable amounts while following other standard good safety practices you greatly reduce your chance of getting fatally burned.
    Reply With Quote
     

  16. Collapse Details
     
    #16
    Greenlighter
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    11
    one hell of a harm reduction thread, thanks for looking out for everybody. threads like this on bluelight always make me think of those kids in plano in the late 90's. they had the highest heroine death/ high school student in the country.
    Reply With Quote
     

  17. Collapse Details
     
    #17
    Bluelighter Kenaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    The Dirty Jerz, Yo...
    Posts
    662
    Oxymorphone: excellent job! I've only used fentanyl in Actiq "cancer pops" but if someone insists on shooting or smoking it this is an excellent guide to doing it in the safest possible way. (And I agree 100% that the safety disclaimer is needed: there's no "safe" way of using this stuff, merely ways that are less dangerous than others).
    Reply With Quote
     

  18. Collapse Details
     
    #18
    Bluelighter Cloud_9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Ganymede orbitting Jupiter
    Posts
    575
    Quote Originally Posted by Oxymorphone View Post
    ... BLAH BLAH BLAH STUFF BEFORE before while I was using heroin and fentanyl IV heavily when I came up with this method, but those projects get quickly abandoned when you can just get high and watch TV and would rather not stare at a a computer screen cross eyed. YADDA YADDA YADDA STUFF AFTER...
    fatally burned.
    Well I totally know how that feeling can get under your skin and before you know it you are repeating classes and blew $2500 on classes you just bombed because you just don't have the willpower or drive to go for fucks sake (this is just my background) and I absolutely commend that you had this planned up, and as it seems, planned to do a little bit at a time when you could while you kept it on a word pad document not in a huge rush to post, but this is just too great. Bordering on captain's micron filter mega thread in my book, though laughably different spectrum's of the harm scale (microns vs fent which is safer!?) xD.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxymorphone View Post
    What you mentioned about people just mixing some gel with water and IVing it is the reason there is a huge stigma around shooting fentanyl since that's really all the average person could do with the knowledge that was out there, it was stupid, and the source for nearly all the fent IV deaths. The gel patches are less common now which is a good thing but people still have and get them so I would like to add a similar extraction process for them- I just don't have that experience and never had them myself. If anyone else has ideas that would be another good procedure to add.
    Yeah, at least at the Kaiser Permanente pharmacies that exist all up and down the west coast from northern-california to about the edges of where seatle starts to flow into the puget sound but I guess (as a BC buddy told me) that it ends at Canada, but yeah, those pharmacies only stock fentanyl transdermals as the gel resevoir types the dosens of times I have been able to pick them up, though since "debt restructuring" (only in america for a hospital) they may have switched brands, as alot of the other generics have been switched for cheaper ones they can buy 100 counts of in the palate versus the 100 tablet 24 count plastic wrapped shit, or what I was told by a few pharm-techs, though as you probably know, they are usually not rocket scientists on how medicine gets compounded and anything more complicated than "NEXT PLEASE!!!!" and smiling when they yank the money from your hand as soon as they see green. Just making the case that as few as 2 months ago I was still seeing the gel types being handed out at the home pharamcy I frequent most often; and if its the same at one it is usually going to be the same at all of the hospital or clinic pharmacies in range of the distribution centers which they use for the hundreds within its geographic confines, as the livermore "stocking" center in the bay area is able to cover from at least from SF - Sacremento that I have found out through my mother who works for them as a nurse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxymorphone View Post
    ALL OF IT YOU DUMB PUBBIE FUCKS NEW TO BL!@!@!
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ DO THIS DO THIS DO THIS (NOW BOLD) DO THIS DO THIS DO THIS!$%^&*( anyone who doesnt read through a thread that is something so awsome as this and picks and chooses what he wants to see in it is lost beyond all hope.... even if you bold it to hell and back and even redact it down to like the 3 IV/intra-nasal/plugging segments you had bolded at the end. You still always hav e that proper douch-bag (forgive french ) who just either doexsnt read the instructions or is trying to be a hero like my friend who only grudgingly accepted to push 5mg halfway before he found himself in a situation i'de need to break out the nalaxone/naltrexone and the epinephrine on top of that if he was on any type of benso to bring him back from the brink and deal with his bitching at me once the super hardcore withdrawal stopped kicking his ass. None of those people actually care that they were blue for well over 10 minutes in most cases, and at best you'll get a thank-you as they walk out the door pissed you "BLEW THIER LOAD!" as someone I know who has idiotically rammed that dumb idea down my dense skull.


    EDIT: By the way.... sorry if it wasn't said before.....but A+ super awesome job....your mom should be proud!1!
    Last edited by Cloud_9; 10-02-2010 at 20:46.
    Reply With Quote
     

  19. Collapse Details
     
    #19
    Bluelighter
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Norcal
    Posts
    2,273
    Quote Originally Posted by sixpartseven View Post
    Ok, I'm going to have to take a few minutes to read over all this, but I can tell you right now, we generally do not allow extraction threads like this, especially with fentanyl patches because of the extreme dangers involved.

    This will probably be closed, but I'll discuss it with the rest of the Mods first to see what they think. I'm just giving you a heads up.

    i posted information like this also awhile ago and deleted/asked for it to be closed. i agree with six. this kind of information should be given out on a person by person basis. you have no idea what kind of 14 yr old idiot is reading this
    Reply With Quote
     

  20. Collapse Details
     
    #20
    Great. Now I'd like to see an oxymorphone extraction for Opana ER that allows you at least 70% BA. mg for mg oxymorphone is 14 times stronger than oxycodone. If oxycodone solution was made for injection, and you shot 14mg of it IV in a hospital setting, assuming 99% BA, you would only need 1mg of oxymorphone IV assuming 99% BA to get an equipotent dose.

    It shouldn't be hard to break the timerx release, it's just xanthan and locust bean gum which can be "fractured" (thus lowering viscosity to almost 0) using citric acid, sodium percarbonate, ammonium persulfate, ferrous ammonium sulfate and EDTA (ethylene diamine tetracetic acid, found in lots of foods as a preservative). Simply suspend the opana ER in water to let it become a viscous gel, then add the oxidizers (sodium percarbonate, ammonium persulfate), and a bunch of citric acid to make sure the time it takes to completely "break" the viscosity of the gel isn't more than an hour, and then add the two catalysts (ferrous ammonium sulfate and EDTA), stir around and you should have successfully broken the opana ER cross-linked gum matrix time-release. Now I have no idea what you would have to do to get rid of all those excess chemicals, but that's up to you guys to figure out.

    If you don't have citric acid, use acetic acid, if you don't have ferrous ammonium sulfate on hand, use any other soluble iron salt like ferrous chlorate, ferrous acetic, ferrous bromide, ferrous perchlorate, ferrous formate, ferrous iodide, ferrous nitrate and ferrous tartarate, and if you don't have a bunch of EDTA (a tertiary amine), use another one like triethanolamine, dimehylaminopropionitrile, phenanthroline, N-methylmorpholine, N,N dimethylbenzylamine or pyridine.

    There's no reason the time release for opana ER shouldn't have been broken already. A quick search on fracturing aqueous solutions comprised of xanthan and locust bean gum reveals that it's very easy to change the viscosity of this gel and release all of the particulate matter that the gel is enveloping. People have been doing this in the drilling industry for many years.
    Reply With Quote
     

  21. Collapse Details
     
    #21
    Bluelighter morphonorconic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Mississippi
    Posts
    1,453
    Right on, well written Oxymorphone.
    Reply With Quote
     

  22. Collapse Details
     
    #22
    Bluelighter Cloud_9's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Ganymede orbitting Jupiter
    Posts
    575
    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeTrails View Post
    i posted information like this also awhile ago and deleted/asked for it to be closed. i agree with six. this kind of information should be given out on a person by person basis. you have no idea what kind of 14 yr old idiot is reading this
    Well that is just positively no fun! Though I pretty much agree with what you are saying and looking back; this probably should be something where it would be given out on a PM request basis if necessary I suppose if a thread proliferates about including fentanyl in the OP and discussion takes off I guess, but I have never seen any of those that has been suitable for a frontpage-ing and are exclusive to fentanyl that wasn't just a simple open-answer-close type dealing with simple questions that usually are best in basic drug discussion compared to OD. Hopefully the mods wont slam down on you with something akin to how I mentioned how laughable that this could even be close to harm reduction for the vast majority of people that pop in and go "fentanyl.... for real, I can have it all at once without a gel system! JEE WIS!" and then 2 days later you have another account closed by someone that notifies bluelight about the status and how could we possibly tell him/her how to maximize the way to use drugs in a safe way! I can see where this goes, hopefully someone has an open mind.

    Quote Originally Posted by morphonorconic View Post
    Right on, well written Oxymorphone.
    Seconded (for the second time) because I can and its so awsome for someone like me who would have been much better off with something like this about 3 years ago before my opiate tolerance went sky-high and dependency set in. Oh my.... miss those first couple glowing experiences like a lost limb. vOv No way to grab it now!
    Last edited by Cloud_9; 10-02-2010 at 21:37.
    Reply With Quote
     

  23. Collapse Details
     
    #23
    Bluelighter Kenaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    The Dirty Jerz, Yo...
    Posts
    662
    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeTrails View Post
    i posted information like this also awhile ago and deleted/asked for it to be closed. i agree with six. this kind of information should be given out on a person by person basis. you have no idea what kind of 14 yr old idiot is reading this
    If the 14 year old idiot has access to fentanyl patches and is reading this thread, chances are he has already decided to use them. At least with this information available there is a chance he will do it in the safest possible way. I understand everyone's concern about encouraging people to use an opiate that has killed a lot of people. OTOH, I doubt very much that anyone with two functioning brain cells to rub together is going to read this and think "Gee, I never considered shooting fentanyl before - but now that I've seen this I'm going to run down to the drugstore and pick up some syringes!"
    Reply With Quote
     

  24. Collapse Details
    Gel patch extraction thoughts and ideas... 
    #24
    Flask
    ^Thank you to everyone who appreciates this thread and for the compliments! I'm really glad my time developing this method more importantly typing everything out here is not in vain and can help others.

    I have a decent idea of how a similar extraction could be done with the gel patches. I read over that journal article abstract again and found some interesting stuff. I'm just going to post the entire abstract since it is all interesting and underline the key points of where I see potential for gel patch extraction. I recommend reading it all.

    Abstract

    The method development and validation characteristics are described of a simple gas chromatographic–mass spectrometric (GC–MS) analytical procedure to determine residual fentanyl in used Durogesic® reservoir patches and Durogesic® D-Trans® matrix technology based systems to estimate the actual rate of transdermal fentanyl delivered in individual patients. The sample preparation protocol constituting a saline based extraction of sets of new patches of each nominal dose available, resulted in fentanyl extraction recoveries to increase steadily as a function of increasing extraction time. For the reservoir type transdermal therapeutic system (TTS), fentanyl extraction efficiencies at equilibrium (16 h) ranged from approximately 60% (100-μg/h TTS) to 95% (25-μg/h TTS), whereas for the matrix type system considerable lower recoveries were demonstrated for the highest nominal dose rates (35%–52, while reaching 90% for the 25-μg/h system. For the latter type of fentanyl TTS, an optimized methanol based extraction protocol yielded virtually quantitative fentanyl recoveries for each matrix patch nominal dose level at substantially shorter extraction periods (15 min). The GC–MS analytical method using selected ion monitoring (SIM) and deuterated fentanyl as internal standard was shown to be adequately selective with regard to the presence of other compounds in the Durogesic® patches. It was further demonstrated that the developed analytical protocols provided highly reproducible and accurate estimates of the initial fentanyl content of each patch type at all available nominal doses, with coefficients of variation and relative errors generally below 10%. These advantageous assay validation characteristics can be further transposed to the application of residual fentanyl level estimates in used patches, provided that with each batch of samples also a set of new TTSs with equal dose is assayed to perfectly mimic extraction phenomena. Finally, the presented GC–MS analytical protocol was successfully applied for the determination of residual fentanyl in a subset of 57 reservoir type patches obtained from four palliative patients.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    On the topic of how to potentially extract fentanyl from gel reservoir patches using a similar technique as above

    Disclaimer: The following is all educated conjecture about how fentanyl could be extracted from gel patches. I have not done it and if you attempt this use more caution than ever and please do it for experimentation purposes to find a safe procedure for extraction that yields an accurate solution for dosing fentanyl. Attempt this in the name of harm reduction and the future benefit of everyone and please don't hurt yourself. Do not attempt any gel extraction methods if you are just looking for a quick way to recklessly get high and abuse some patches you have sitting around. This has not been attempted or verified safe yet. Onwards...

    In the study they basically first extracted the gel reservoir patches by letting them sit in a saline solution and the longer they were in the solution the more fentanyl was recovered. It also goes on to say saline wasn't effective for the matrix patches whereas an alcohol extraction yielded nearly complete extraction of fentanyl hence the process I described.

    Now first let me say I have never seen a gel patch in person let alone used one or attempted extraction. My main concern and potential problem I see is isolating and not getting any of the gel into the final extraction. From what i read above it sounds like they just dropped unaltered gel patches in saline solution and were able to extract a significant amount of fentanyl. It doesn't say if anything else from the gel leaked into the extraction or if it was purely the fentanyl. I would think that if you don't alter the transdermal delivery mechanism or alter the patch at all then by letting it sit in the saline the fentanyl would be extracted leaving the inert gel with minimal leftover fentanyl inside the reservoir just as it works when you wear them.

    I can't be sure if and what else would be extracted from the gel in the saline from this method. For that reason I would not advise any IV use from gel patches until there is more information, research, and experimenting from experienced bluelighters about what else actually gets extracted and if it is harmful and can be filtered out through a micron or other methods.

    So basically you would soak a non tampered with patch (aside from removing any protective film) in saline solution and let it sit. After letting it sit for several hours I would expect there could be 80% or more fentanyl extraction, perhaps 90%+ which would make it easy to adapt the matrix solution prepping/dosing method for gel patches. After soaking it for a while you would remove the patch and evaporate the saline. This would leave behind some salt that probably can't be filtered out but it shouldn't be a major problem. I would not apply any heat while soaking the patches in saline since I wouldn't want to increase the chance of other/more stuff from the gel being extracted.

    Now evaporate the saline solution. After you have the fentanyl, salt, and whatever else came out of the patch residue, follow the same procedure I outlined for creating an accurate dosing solution. If the extraction can get up to 90%+ efficient then dosing should be nearly the same, perhaps the actual dose is slightly lower here but as always it is safer to overestimate.. I would strongly advocate more filtering with the gel patches and using a micron since there is the potential for there to be a lot more crap than with the polymer patches. It also might not be as big of a concern since I would definitely advise not attempting to IV the extraction from these but it can never hurt to have a more pure solution. With plugging, intranasal, and sublingual methods it should be less of an issue. That's it for now.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    This is a related topic I've been thinking about. the only part of my original process for preparing the end solution I think could be changed is using vodka and the amount of vodka. I am thinking you could use 2 ml or 1ml of vodka then 2 or 3ml of sterile water to get a final 4ml solution without losing any of the benefits of ethanol keeping the solution sterile at 20% or 10%. It would definitely be more pleasant to take with all ROAs and require less dilution. I will probably edit this into my original post.

    I should also mention it is important to keep the solution in a small sealed container so nothing evaporates which would change the concentration of the solution potentially making it more concentrated over time leading to higher than expected dosing which could be dangerous. That is why I really like and recommend the small 4-5ml sealed vials with rubber tops for inserting needles while still keeping everything sealed.
    Last edited by Oxymorphone; 10-02-2010 at 21:49.
    Reply With Quote
     

  25. Collapse Details
     
    #25
    Bluelighter
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Norcal
    Posts
    2,273
    look i understand where a bunch of you guys are coming from. yes a bunch of people are on here could handle themselves with a extraction method. yes you guys do deserve to know the most effective/cost effective way to abuse whatever you want safely. the information is out there. you can findd it with some digging/asking around.

    i just dont feel this kind of information should be blasted across the front page/given to everyone. i cant imagine the amount of stupid uneducated kids read this forum. the countless "am i going to be ok?" and "is it ok if i take _____, _____, and ______?" threads we get every day just proves that. look at how many guests view this forum guys. it really concerns me

    sorry if i rained on yalls party. i just dont want to see people get burnt.
    Reply With Quote
     

Page 1 of 9 12345 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •