Opioids Dilaudid/hydromorphone MEGA THREAD and FAQ

[MemphisX3]

it's not the best idea to mix the two butnyou should be fine...

 

[Jabberwocky]

merged

oxymorphone - some suggestions for your OP

different BA's of hydromorphone of different ROA
different preps for plugging, etc
some pharmacological information on it
interactions/contrindications
maybe some simple dosing guides

 

[Oxymorphone]

merged

oxymorphone - some suggestions for your OP

different BA's of hydromorphone of different ROA
different preps for plugging, etc
some pharmacological information on it
interactions/contrindications
maybe some simple dosing guides

Thanks, I started working on a draft that contains some of this and more and I'll look into and add some things you mentioned that I didn't think of and do an update tomorrow. %)

For general dosing I found 6mg to give a great rush better than the dope I get which is amazing, I would say better than anything I've ever gotten from Jersey (the DC stamp thread is Jersey and Pittburgh biased and if they rate some of that stuff as 7s and 8s this is a 20) and a couple BLers can vouch for that. Also I must note that comment is not meant as a pissing contest or to brag about my source just for context on how strong of a rush Dilaudid gives since it is the best I can do for comparison.

have a sliding tolerance that ranges from mild to being able to handle moderate to high doses, it's odd and hard to describe so I'm not the best test subject o base things off of.

I have tried up to 16mg IV in one shot and after pushing the plunger 1/3 the wy down I felt a huge rush and after that it didn't intensify the first rush. It is also important to note that when I IVed any hydromorphone while pretty high on another opiate to try to get a big rush, heroin or fentanyl in my case, it didn't give much effect.

For HR I don't recommend mixing opiates in general and would say to only consider it if you are experienced with both separately and have a huge tolerance. I found a bag of heroin mixed with 4mg hydromorphone gave an incredible rush that heroin alone can't give with the lasting after euphoria hydromorphone doesn't give me. Again I don't advocate mixing unless you know your tolerance well enough to know you can handle at least several times that dose.


Dilaudid really is not very effective unless IVed- sorry for the needleless crowd, it can be used but it's not the same, there are other drugs out there for you not suited for the IV crowd like oxycodone so it's fair we each get one of the big pharms. For serious users Captain heroin's micron filtering thread may be of use and with his permission I'll repost some of the info here. More to come.

 

[Cloud_9]

Anybody know whether it is safe(ish) to IV the generic mallinckrodt type pills? Does anybody know if they lack the infamous talc and micro-crystalline cellulose preparations that make IVing brand name Dilaudid so much more user friendly?

If they do have talc and/or micro-crystalline cellulose, would using a 0.5um micron filter get most of the hazardous materials out, or will you have to go down to 0.2um? Is talc so small nothing can effectively filter it?

Stuff about tolerance/dose etc...

How much would you reckon a person with a tolerance/dependency on 100mg of methadone a day would need to get that amazing rush assuming he didn't take his methadone for however long it takes for methadone to not has as much of a profound dampening ability on other opioids? I put it into a calculator not too long ago and it said that if I were IVing hydromorphone that I would need an equivalent of 18.75mg a day to just sustain myself. I think that seems excessively high compared to what I have heard from the experience I have heard from people IVing hydromorphone on bluelight. As a frame of reference when I was last in the ER I needed 6mg of hydromorphone administered in (3) 2mg pushes to feel "regular" comparatively to my daily methadone, but of course hydromorphone doesn't last long, and this was given over the course of maybe an hour and a half, so perhaps 5mg all at once could knock me over with a feather.

Edit: This is the calculator that I am using to get that number of 18.75mg [http://www.globalrph.com/narcotic.cgi] I have no idea what the cross-tolerance would be compared between the two, but often one opioid will require the same amount (analgesically) when switching, unlike these people tend to think that when you change opioids you magically need to use less.

 

[Cloud_9]

For HR I don't recommend mixing opiates in general and would say to only consider it if you are experienced with both separately and have a huge tolerance. I found a bag of heroin mixed with 4mg hydromorphone gave an incredible rush that heroin alone can't give with the lasting after euphoria hydromorphone doesn't give me. Again I don't advocate mixing unless you know your tolerance well enough to know you can handle at least several times that dose.

So if I were to setup 6mg of hydromorphone [all I have for now] it would be best to wait until I am almost completely in withdrawal to even try to IV it?

Edit: Quote not equal too edit

 

[MemphisX3]

A+ idea was wondering if you were going to merge the recent ones.

 

[edarrin]

the rush is fantastic its just that the high afterwards leaves it a less desired drug than most other opiates

I think that is the general concensus (sp?). I have been prescribed this drug for the last 5 years or so (can't remember exactly), but anyways, I have tried every ROA there is (except snorting because I know it is a waste).

IV is obviously hands down the best (only ROA I use other than oral for the contins) but 2nd best is plugging. It actually isn't bad but you don't get that rush that makes the stuff soooo damned addicting (at least to me). I use plugging when I run out of IR's and can't afford H. (when I'm desperate in otherwords).

It doesn't have the after effects of H (although the rush is better than H IMO) but I find if you have enough to do several shots (in the beginning 24mg's used to get me absolutely wasted with a bit of weed and perhaps a benzo or 2....not for beginners...I've been using for a long time....unfortunetly).

The best advice I can give is run. Run far.


Now I find I can sit in my 'spot' and IV one shot after the other and believe me, if you have enough you will get just as wasted as H eventually. I've been nodding so hard I cut my forehead on the corner of the table and still was shooting. I is a bit like the crack of opiates because of that rush. Of course there is only a certain 'window of opportunity' to get the rush. You need to wait until you are in w/d and shoot and you will get the most incredible whole body rush (like described earlier in the thread.....the legs and everywhere)....amazing.

Just this am I slept in and woke up in w/d. I shot and said to myself 'nothing should feel that good'.

In short , on the other end of addiction, it is no joke. Opiate addiction is not fun and sooner or later the enevitable happens and you will need to stop.

That is when one will realize what a mistake it was.

Be safe with the stuff. As a side note, I've been filtering just with a cotton filter we can get at the needle exchanges up here in the great white north and so far I'm fine. I have hep c (from the 70's when we didn't have needle exchanges..yes I'm old) and my liver has been apparently unaffected by this. I just had a biopsy done and it is the same as it was 6 years ago...what a relief, as I was expecting the worst.

Therefore I draw the conclusion that dillies are one of the 'safest' pills to IV.

 

[LonE1]

UPDATE: okay so yesterday I wound up snorting the 4mg. I cut it into two lines and within 15 min I started feeling a bit of a head high. Nothing too crazy at all, but I noticed it. It was more apparent when I was walking around. Anyway, I kept getting tired, then having energy, over and over. Weird, but enjoyable.

Well by 4 I was extremely tired, so I noded off, when something crazy happened; i started having closed eye visuals. Very very strange...I litterally could picture something going on like I were there, while being awake, and knowing I was laying down to go to sleep, if that makes any sense. It was very crazy; I lasted about 20 min, litterally opening my eyes and closing them to have some other story unfold.

Anywho very weird and has this happened to anyone else?? Feedback would be great.

Thanks again.

 

[jay22]

so is this stuff basically exactly the same as morphine, just a lot stronger?

 

[Oxymorphone]

so is this stuff basically exactly the same as morphine, just a lot stronger?

No, not really. It is stronger than morphine but the effects and experience is different, especially depending on the ROA.

This reminds me I should update this thread.

 

[oliphill]

Can I just add a bit about the Jurnista (OPOS Push Pull Time Release) Hydromorphone pills mostly found in the EU and sometimes Australia. These are pretty much UN-ABUSABLE. I have searched and searched online for a way to defeat the time mechanism. The only info I found was from a Serbian dude, quote:

There is no way to directly defeat time release in Jurnista pills.
They are made in notorious OROS Push-Pull technology.
The only way is to leave the tablet in some clean water for like 30 hours, and then you'll be left with the water which is full of only Hydromorphone, and you'll have the empty pill shell.
You then can evaporate the water to the lower amount and that's it, you can inject.
But there is no other way except that by which you can defeat OROS Push-Pull technology.
They are even impossible to crush to powder for snorting.

 

[Oxymorphone]

Can I just add a bit about the Jurnista (OPOS Push Pull Time Release) Hydromorphone pills mostly found in the EU and sometimes Australia. These are pretty much UN-ABUSABLE. I have searched and searched online for a way to defeat the time mechanism. The only info I found was from a Serbian dude, quote:

Un-abusable? Hah, I think we've all heard that before.

They use the 5th system here http://www.pharmainfo.net/reviews/r...rolled-sustained-release-drug-delivery-system

that doesn't look so difficult, and the diagram implies the drug is in a liquid form in the center of the capsule. I'm sure if you were careful you could poke or 'drill' a hole in the outer membrane and stick a syringe in and extract the liquid hydromorphone solution from the center...or something. I don't know what these actually look like but it doesn't sound hard.

Anyway you already said letting them sit in water for a little over a day allows you to extract everything. That doesn't sound at all un-abuseable. I'm sure if you used an acid or alcohol it could be done quicker, and it seems pretty simple you just have to have a little patience.

 

[sarsXdave]

Right, it's not a hugely different system than Concerta. Crack the shit open and you have your drug and the push, and you don't take the push, obviously.

"Unabuseable" drug formulations are like trying to make copyright protection on any given media.

 

[Oxymorphone]

Right, it's not a hugely different system than Concerta. Crack the shit open and you have your drug and the push, and you don't take the push, obviously.

"Unabuseable" drug formulations are like trying to make copyright protection on any given media.

The most difficult thing I've encountered is this hydrocodone/homatropine (Hydromet, Hydocan) syrup. So far I haven't found any way to get rid of the homatropine in the stuff so if you take a good recreational dose you feel real sick and nasty, for people with no tolerance it isn't an issue. I've never encountered a pill you can't abuse unless it is mixed with some nasty shit that you can't separate without chemistry experience and a lab.

 

[oliphill]

The drug layer contains the poorly soluble drugs, Osmotic agents and suspending agent.

It appears that the liquid drug is found in L-OROS technology, not OROS push pull.

So, if the 'drug layer' was accessed how would one prepare that for injection?

It is apparently the same as Concerta. So how can you tell which is the drug which is the push? I currently have one in some water, and you can see the two halves. One dark greenish and one white. I've heard people say attempting to crush it will just resort in a plasticy sort of mess.

Sorry, my chemistry skills are very basic, I'm sick and got a couple of these 16mg Jurnistas in front of me. Can anyone help?

 

[Jabberwocky]

Un-abusable? Hah, I think we've all heard that before.

They use the 5th system here http://www.pharmainfo.net/reviews/r...rolled-sustained-release-drug-delivery-system

.

thank you for that man, that's exactly what i wanted! i heard about these in AusDD but i didn't look any further into the time release mechanism until i just stumbled in here. that will help dispell a lot of myths i've read and different theories people have about this time release.

i've just double checked mims then to make sure it was the same system but it doesn't say, though their brand name is Jurnista so it's pretty safe to assume it is.

 

[oliphill]

Correct me if I'm wrong but it's not the 5th system on there, that's L-Oros technology. Jurnista uses OROS Push-Pull technology.

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&so...kuyJAg&usg=AFQjCNFZ7-WUsGXPmxXaAPKamFLn7CxP8w

Each tablet also contains the
following other ingredients:
* Coated tablet core:
polyethylene oxide, povidone,
magnesium stearate,
butylhydroxytoluene (E321),
sodium chloride, hypromellose,
iron oxide black (E172), lactose
anhydrous, cellulose acetate,
macrogol 3350 and iron oxide
yellow (E172) (32 mg tablet
only).
* Colour overcoat:
lactose monohydrate,
hypromellose, titanium dioxide
(E171), glycerol triacetate, iron
oxide red (E172) (4 mg & 8 mg
tablet)/iron oxide black (4 mg
tablet)/iron oxide yellow (E172)
(4 mg & 16 mg tablet)/indigo
carmine lake (E132) (64 mg
tablet).
* Clear overcoat:
hypromellose and macrogol 400.
* Printing ink:
iron oxide black (E172),
propylene glycol and
hypromellose.

Can someone help me determine which part of the 16mg pills contains the hydromorphone?

EDIT: After seeing whats happened when I've left it in water (with some citric acid) its the white layer that contains the drug, squeezed out through the little hole. I took it out of the water and within a few minutes little blobs of white stuff started to be pushed out of the hole! So I've put it back in the water, going to stir it every few hours, then hopfully all the 'white stuff' (hydromorphone!) will be pushed out into the water.

Anyone suggest an easy way to evaporate off some of the water, with no lab materials?

 

[Oxymorphone]

It appears that the liquid drug is found in L-OROS technology, not OROS push pull.

So, if the 'drug layer' was accessed how would one prepare that for injection?

It is apparently the same as Concerta. So how can you tell which is the drug which is the push? I currently have one in some water, and you can see the two halves. One dark greenish and one white. I've heard people say attempting to crush it will just resort in a plasticy sort of mess.

Sorry, my chemistry skills are very basic, I'm sick and got a couple of these 16mg Jurnistas in front of me. Can anyone help?

Oh yeah that's correct. In any case you can extract the drug by soaking in water and maybe quicker using alcohol or an acid. Looking at that diagram it still doesn't seem too crazy if you cut it open or something. If they are hard cylinders like that I would try taking an exacto knife and rolling the blade along the center on a table creating a score line then try snapping them open and getting to the drug layer.

thank you for that man, that's exactly what i wanted! i heard about these in AusDD but i didn't look any further into the time release mechanism until i just stumbled in here. that will help dispell a lot of myths i've read and different theories people have about this time release.

i've just double checked mims then to make sure it was the same system but it doesn't say, though their brand name is Jurnista so it's pretty safe to assume it is.

You're welcome, and as I was corrected it is the diagram before the 5th one which is L-ORIS not ORIS push pull

 

[jay22]

so i got a bunch of jurnista 16 milligram hydromorphones today, they're yellow tablets. i was gonna chew half a one so i cut it and all this yellow stuff oozes out, wtf. i see the top half of the pill is black and the bottom half is white which i presume is the hydromorphone, but maybe someone smart can help me out. do i just chew the white part? is there an easier way of doing this? thanks.

 

[Oxymorphone]

so i got a bunch of jurnista 16 milligram hydromorphones today, they're yellow tablets. i was gonna chew half a one so i cut it and all this yellow stuff oozes out, wtf. i see the top half of the pill is black and the bottom half is white which i presume is the hydromorphone, but maybe someone smart can help me out. do i just chew the white part? is there an easier way of doing this? thanks.

Can you take a picture of them whole and cut open? The stuff that oozed out is probably the 'push' mechanism or hydro. See my post above about these pills.

The white part is the drug. I would dissolve it in water and plug it. Oral hydromorphone sucks.