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    Ambien and opiate withdrawal 
    #1
    Peace
    Does anyone have first hand xp with using ambien as a sleep aid to combat opiate-based detox insomnia? I'm about to start detoxing soon. I have only been using 60-80 mg snorted OC for 3-4 weeks. I know this isnt a "serious" addiction compared to what a lot of you guys have dealt with, but Im still pretty concerned with losing a shitload of sleep....Im a horrible sleeper to begin with (which is why I have an ambien script). Im in really intensive classes as school right now and absolutely cant afford to live like the dead. What Im concerned with is taking ambien and not sleeping , Id rather not sleep than walk around with an ambien trip all day. Anyway, guess i could have left out everything after my first sentence, str. Anyone who has tried this PLEASE let me know. I will NOT be on any other medication.

    Also, if you have any insight as to what I will probably experience from a detox off a one month daily 60-80mg use period...Id be grateful.

    Thanks,
    ME
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    #2
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    I've never tried ambien so can't answer you there.

    As for the withdrawal part, it's hard to say exactly b/c everyone's chemistry is different. If this is your first opiate withdrawal, I'd have to say it won't be too, too bad. That is- I think you'll be able to function, albeit you'll be spaced out for like a week. Also, sleep will indeed be hard to come by for awhile and you'll likely get restless leg syndrome at night. Fucking annoying and I hope the ambien knocks you out. I'd guess that even with the ambien, you'll only get a few hrs sleep for a few days.

    Could you try to taper yourself off the OC's?
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    #3
    spaceman,

    maybe you don't have a serious addiction, but don't underestimate the potential for your habit to become more serious. it's very tricky and, speaking from experience using VERY similar doses for only a few months at a time (at first), overwhelming.

    done ranting...for me, ambien did NOT help with sleeping during acute oxycodone withdrawal. during that week or so, the only thing that got me to sleep at night was 2mg of clonazepam (klonopin). i was prescribed it by a Doctor just for sleep and the scrip was not refilled (didn't want to get addicted to benzos).

    ambien, it seems, was just too weak to counter the insomnia from the opiate withdrawal.

    now, after a few weeks, i was able to come off the klonopin and slowly added ambien in every few nights. i have a history of sleeplessness, so this was a better option on those nights when i just couldn't sleep than relapsing with a sweet, sweet OC.

    good to hear you're getting off the pillz tho. they're a bitch and no fun at all.

    good luck,

    chairmanMAO
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    #4
    Quote Originally Posted by theseeker View Post

    Could you try to taper yourself off the OC's?
    No...all I have readily available are 80's...too hard for me to have one and not do it.

    I did get 3 10mg methadones. Ill be on my third day of no OC starting in about an hour from now. So far the dones are making it very bearable, but i dont see how with only three of them its going to keep me from going into further w/d once i take my last one tomorrow. After I took them I realized that methadone is probably used only as a tapering drug and really serves no other purpose. So basically all i have done by taking them is prolong my hell for three days...i guess this is giving me a small 3 day taper, which should help atleast a little bit.

    Even on the dones the mental urge to use is extremely high...had no idea how hard that aspect would be. When i quit I felt I was ready to quit, but now god i just want to feel happy. Whats making it so hard is that I never had a real negative experience or anything that made me want to quit. Basically I am quitting because I see people around me with far worse habits and I dont want to be there. But shit, i really loved it i mean everything was going good for the month. My room was always clean, school was going great, my relationships were even getting better...and now im like shit...why did i stop this? But i know what it can become and i want to stop so here i am
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    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by chairmanma084 View Post

    during that week or so, the only thing that got me to sleep at night was 2mg of clonazepam (klonopin).

    I have two xanax 1mg tabs. Was going to save that to take when I had no more methadone and before I resorted to trying ambien for sleep. Do you (or anyone else who reads this) know if thats comparable to the klonopin? Is it the same type of drug or what-not?
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    #6
    Bluelight Crew paranoid android's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceman Spiff View Post
    I have two xanax 1mg tabs. Was going to save that to take when I had no more methadone and before I resorted to trying ambien for sleep. Do you (or anyone else who reads this) know if thats comparable to the klonopin? Is it the same type of drug or what-not?
    Xanax and klonopin are both benzodiazepines so they are in the same group of drugs. Neither are that great for sleep compared to the benzodiazepines used for sleep such as temazepam, nitrazepam or even diazepam but anything will do in a pinch.

    Since i already take clonazepam i don't find it to be good for sleep on it's own. During opiate withdrawals i take the clonazepam with zopiclone (imovane, lunesta) which is another Z drug like ambien. It works rather well for me and even if it doesent put me right to sleep it relaxes me. I have never taken ambien because it's not available here in canada.

    Xanaz (alprazolam) is much much shorter acting then klonopin/rivotril (clonazepam) so the effects won't last nearly as long. It might help you sleep though and if you take some diphenhydramine or dimenhydrinate with it that will increase the drowsiness.
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    #7
    if the Z-drug doesnt knock you out, be prepared for the most uncomfortable hallucinations of your life...when ambien's trip is already not up to par..add withdrawing to the mix..

    but ive never taken it before
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    #8
    try taking xanax an hour before bed. follow this by a quick, very hot soak in an epsom salt bath. this will ease the RLS while you're trying to fall asleep. after a while, u should be able to at least fall asleep. i did and i was taking almost exactly the same dosage as OP but for 5 months longer.

    the problem was that i couldn't remain asleep all night. this is where the ambien comes in handy. a few weeks ago, in anticipation for this withdrawal session, i read about low-dose ambien administration for mid-night awakenings. so i bit off a little under half of a 10mg zolpidem pill and before i knew it i was back to snoozing. in fact, i actually got about 8 hours of sleep last night.

    during previous WDs ambien never helped b/c i tried to use it for the initial fall to sleep. i think b/c of how I used (20 mg oxy right before bed usually) my sleep got way fucked up. but, for whatever reasons, this method worked for me, a guy about 165lbs, 25 years old.

    now i'm just trying to cope with these bad feelings. and actually, however selfish this may be, i keep thinking of my friend who was recently diagnosed with cancer. i think how insignificant my problems are compared to his. it makes me feel better emotionally and therefore physically. so to all those out there wrestling with these same symptoms, i suggest a small cocktail of pharmaceuticals and some selfish, in-perspective motivation.

    hope this helps somebody...

    little
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    #9
    Bluelighter BlueberryfishY's Avatar
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    ambien does nothing to me anymore but give me a sick feeling even befor i take it, when i first took it tho for a week it worked good.
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    #10
    Bump
    Sorry, hope I'm not bumping an old thread, but it has never been resolved.
    I currently moved out to South Korea just to get away from opiates. I had way too many connections back home and I knew I didn't have the willpower.
    Benzos are easy to come by in Korea and so are Z-drugs. I've been using 10mg Zolpidem (ambien) or up to 20mg (two 10 mg tablets) as needed. It doesn't actually make you hallucinate. That is so preposterous.
    It actually feels very similar to benzodiazapines but a bit milder. If anything, it helped with RLS and just mellowed me out. Definitely helps during withdrawals.
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    #11
    Bluelighter SideOrderOfOpiates's Avatar
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    Spaceman Spiff, I definitely know firsthand that Ambien can be a literal lifesaver during opiate withdrawals!

    You did not post how many milligrams of Ambien you were scripted, so it is a bit hard for me to say how much I assume it will help you. I am not saying that just to be a precise bitch, but merely because I've noticed the dosage can be a contributing factor in the effectiveness of the drug during withdrawals. For example, someone who has always had problems sleeping, is obviously most likely going to have a tougher time beating the insomnia. If you have a tougher time beating insomnia, a higher dosage will be far more helpful in alleviating the insomnia. You may 'trip' a bit initially while feeling like you're crawling out of your skin. When I say 'trip', I am not saying you'll be seeing pink fucking elephants, haha. When first using Ambien, I did see some very mild trail type hallucinations, though. Nothing that made me feel as though I was experiencing something otherworldly, but definitely enough to make you feel 'out of it'. Personally, Ambien initially always made the light fixture above my bed look as though it was coming closer to me, haha.

    Also, the longer you are awake after the Ambien kicks in, the more you'll feel both 'mildly tripped out' and just plain uncomfortable. Everyone's body works differently, but I tend to go through a period of hypersomnia while on Ambien. After taking it, I will sleep for 15 hours like nothing if I have really been binging on opiates. Without it, I can't sleep at all, unless I'm on high doses of NyQuil. I have been taking 10mgs of Ambien for about one year.

    To give you a bit of a brief background, I would say that I definitely became addicted to opiates about three years ago (with experience dabbling in them for years prior). About two years ago, I had an opiate habit so bad that I didn't (and couldn't) even keep track of how many pills and milligrams I was consuming on a daily basis. Anyway, with that said, I too have experience taking 60-80mgs of Oxycontin a day. The good news for you, is that you weren't using for long!

    The area where it becomes difficult for me to advise you, is the one previously stated. You haven't been using long at all in comparison to my history. My body is used to being fed opiates for so long that I get extremely ill whenever I detox. For me to be able to tell you what you are about to experience is hard for me. I've been so caught up in my addiction for years (up until recently), that what I thought of as a 'detox' is seriously a walk in the park now in comparison.

    Basically, prepare to feel as though you have a horrible case of the flu and you are having a nervous breakdown all at the same time.

    Best of luck, and congratulations on your decision to detox!
    Last edited by SideOrderOfOpiates; 11-01-2011 at 09:36.
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    #12
    Maybe it was the brand (stilnox) that I've been receiving in korea, but uncomfortable is not how I would describe. I'm usually against taking any sort of Benzos but the zolpidem (ambien) has really been a lifesaver for me. I've been taking it during the day to battle some of the withdrawal symptoms which are a lot milder now (day 5).

    I would not recommend taking more than 20 mg's at a time. Like suboxone, it seems to have a bit of a ceiling effect. For instance, this morning, after tossing and turning and getting about 30 minutes of total sleep time, I popped two and hopped in the shower. I felt the effects within 10 minutes and I was pretty disoriented, but not to the point where I wasn't able to function.

    I've read a lot of reports on erowid and a lot of people apparently have hallucinations and blackouts, but trust me, when you're withdrawaling and your skin has that "crawling" feeling, you will not be able to go to bed. If you have access to klonopins I would recommend that for sleep. Kpins > Valiums > Xanax when it comes to withdrawals. If you want to pass out and your benzo tolerance is low, pop a bar. But I warn you, ALCOHOL IS NOT YOUR FRIEND. I made the huge mistake of getting shwasted on day 2 of CT and man...the next day was not pretty. I was bedridden for about 20 hours. Not fun. Anyone here will tell you, DO NOT MIX BENZOS WITH ALCOHOL.

    If Ambien is the only thing you have access to, try taking 10 mg's, and proceed to take another 5 to 10 minutes every 30 minutes. I'm not too sure yet what "too much" ambien is, but I've taken a total of 50 mg's within a 15 hour period and I haven't been able to get a wink of sleep. Helps with RLS though.
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    #13
    Ive read so much on methadone and suboxone, yet I"m still concerned about going to a methadone clinic for oxycodone addiction. I need roughly about, now that I cut back my use drastically with the help of methadone 10mgs using roughly 20-25mgs to get me threw the day. The clinic wants to start you off at a higher dose, and a detox program for 6 months is such a hassel and expensive. $300 for the first 3 weeks then a hundred bucks after with 2 psychotherapy sessions a week, and if you miss a meeting or what not they cut you. I've tried immodium which works but leaves me constipated for a few days, same as using oxycodone. This is really scaring me and starting to bother me. I've read that methadone is needed for the addicts brain to heal and it takes 1-2 years on methadone to achieve this, then doing a medical taper. My mother has ambien prescribed and also has xanax in case of emergency and she is well aware of my situation and wants to help me. I've been abusing oxy for over 3 years give or take. I understand my brain has changed and that it will take indeed a year or more to get somewhat back to normal. A friend of mine had a bad methadone addiction and checked himself into a detox. He came out on lexapro and detoxed off the methadone which he said was really hard but he wanted it really bad and he's been clean for over a few years now. He takes the lexapro daily at 10mgs and is doing well. God I want this for myself, I have no insurance, can't get state coverage because of a sanction..... long story. But its only for year, and I"m currently on a sliding scale at my current hospital that I go for therapy at. My oxy use in the past day has been 60-80 mgs of roxicodone which is a big jump back, but my body still needs it and lets me know when it does. Opioid use was so great the first year or 2 but after that its so hard to stop. I'm seriously considering going to the methadone clinic at my hospital, I want my bowel's to start working in somewhat normal order and want my brain to heal. Gotta be the most fustrating thing I have had to deal with....... I hope I can get insurance so i can indeed go away to a detox. Time to start coming back to how things used to be, gona be really tough....
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    #14
    If you have been okay with 20-30 mgs of Methadone and the clinic wants to start you off on a higher dose, they are trying to fuck you over. Think about it...why the hell would you ever take more? If anything they should try to start and taper you down or start using suboxone to get off the methadone. I've been in your shoes, and I would recommend getting health insurance and getting them to pay for your Suboxone prescription.

    Try to find a good clinic, one that actually seems to want to help you. Tell them you want to get off pills asap. Methadone is really hard to get off of, and so is Suboxone, but from personal experience, I think it goes Full Agonist Opiates, then methadone then short tapered suboxone.

    I may be wrong, there are a lot more experienced users on this website. I was unable to stand the suboxone withdrawals and relapsed, so I have no room to talk. But I went back to methadone, and for me, the withdrawals were more severe and longer.
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    #15
    one big bottle imodium ad, one ambion, drink all at 3 pm take ambien at 8pm at bed side and good night.you will sleep and feel good in morning. do this 3 night in a row. but small bottles next to days.
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    #16
    Thats exactly what I thought. Like wtf do they wana get you up to an 80 mg does of methadone, and then your only option is to go to a detox clinic for 6 months that costs a fortune, well due to the mandatory 2 psychotherapy visits, all the gas to get there everyday, and they make it almost impossible for a working man to maintain a scheduel. Then there is the methadone clinic which I was about to be taken into and approved because of my consistant positive opiate drug tests for a week. I told the intake counseler that I don't need such a high does in my situation and he said that they will start me off at roughly 30mgs or 40mgs, and although that sounds like a good dose for me, I declined because I was scared of getting really hooked on methadone, yet now when I look at it clearer its like "wtf is the difference anyway, I can save money, not use and allow my brain to heal for 6 months to a year if needed." Eh... its so fustrating... I wish they can just perscribe you methadone 5mgs or 10 mg pills and go home, yet I completely understand why they do not do this, yet would be so much easier for a lot of us. Its not easy being an addict, it soooooo is like the most difficult thing, and yet America is the drug capital of the world in terms of users. We buy all the drugs from all over the world and have the most users, yet we have no sensable options to turn too. THey make it really difficult for a user to heal......
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    #17
    Greenlighter knothing's Avatar
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    I'm about to quit black tar here soon and have 3 - 10mg ambien pills. ill post here and let you know how it went
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    #18
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    ^^ You'll need like, 2 a night.

    Ambien and benzos helped me out a lot with heroin/methadone WD. 'A lot' really translates into helping me sleep a few precious hours, maybe 2 or 3.

    Even if you can't sleep, you will relax quite a bit and it wll be the weak highlight of your shitty ass day.

    Side note... I am absolutely convinced my brain was damaged by the 6 weeks straight of sleepless nights (with a heavily medication induced hour here and there) I was barely human by the end of it, just completely lost touch with reality. Good luck, lol stick with it and don't relapse like so many have or it won't be worth it.
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    #19
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    you really think 2 night? i was W/Ding a little bit the other night and snorted just half a pill. it knocked me out for about 3 hours. but then again i wasnt in full W/Ds
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    #20
    Pffftttt when you're in full-blown withdrawals, Ambien won't even phase you. The first FEW days during my Methdaone/Suboxone withdrawals (I'm not sure which one I'm withdrawaling from lol), 50 mgs of that shit would make me feel like I had taken a 1mg xanax. If not weaker. It only "induces" sleep, doesn't actually make you pass out. When you're all cold and in pain, trust me, you're going to need something a bit stronger than that. If you can, get your hands on some Klonopins or Valiums (xanax and ativan if you don't have access to the other two). Don't take too much though for too long, Benzo withdrawals are worse....And no alcohol. Ever.
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    #21
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    I have 7 blue footballs (1mg alprazolam each) aswell. you think i should mix the benzos with the ambien or is that too risky?
    Last edited by knothing; 13-01-2011 at 02:14.
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    #22
    I'm pretty sure Ambien is a z-drug, meaning it's kind of in the benzo family. How much ambien are you going to be taking with the alprazolam?
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    #23
    Bluelight Crew paranoid android's Avatar
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    ^^^ Ambien is a z drug so it's a hypnotic and the z drugs sort of act like benzodiazepines but they are not benzodiazepines. There are a few differences in effects and how they act and whatnot.

    As for mixing xanax with ambien it will increase the drowsiness as well as the amnesia effects that both drugs can cause.
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    #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindOverMethadone View Post
    I'm pretty sure Ambien is a z-drug, meaning it's kind of in the benzo family. How much ambien are you going to be taking with the alprazolam?
    I usually only take like one ambien (10mg) and that usually does the trick when im not in W/Ds. but if i need more ill probably only take half (5mg), or one more TOPS (so 20mg total of ambien). you think mixing like 1.5mg or 2mg of alprazolam with 15mg or 20mg of ambien is a bad idea? no alcohol of course or any other drugs (maybe some herbage)
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    #25
    Are the benzos themselves not cutting it? I just got through the worst of my withdrawals with alprazolam (about 1.5mgs) to induce sleep. I would try that first with some herb and if that doesn't work, THEN start with 10 mgs of Ambien. You should be alright though be sleeping like a bebe.
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