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Misc The Wellbutrin (Bupropion) Negative Side Effects Thread!

That's a very unusual experience, i've never heard of it happening with wellbutrin, nor any of the typical antidepressants (though ive seen a number of reports of lasting negative effects not resolved by resuming treatment after withdrawing from some TCAs, which act through means still not fully understood, and behave much more strangely).

It's also really strange that you've on several occasions noted improvement, followed by waking up in a state of confusion. One wonders if those waking up in state of confusion occasions were preceeded by undetected seizures as well. Wellbutrin is known to tend to cause seizures.

Yes, the most confusing thing has been the days of improvement followed by worsening when I went to sleep and woke up. Let me try to explain in more detail exactly what happened.

After 4 months off the drug, I was noticing a severe lack of emotion, although the core of my being was still intact. When I reinstated in March of 2010, things started to really go downhill. I didn't understand because I had been on this drug for 5 years and was stable and pretty productive. But when I reinstated I started losing deep parts of myself. Not just emotions, but connections and feelings that were always there that defined me. I thought this was "depression" so I kept taking it for a month. When I wasn't improving, but just getting worse I stopped taking it again. I started to think maybe the drug was making me worse instead of better.

I stopped taking it April 1st. After a further month of the nothingness inside I really didn't know what to do. I thought maybe I hadn't given it enough of a chance to start working again, so I reinstated again on May 10th. After 2 days of taking the drug at 300mg (the high dosage I'd been on for the 5 years) I experienced a gradual returning of my feelings. I couldn't believe it, it felt like a miraculous change. I wasn't only feeling like myself again, but like a new person. Before that day I had intense social anxiety, and was uncomfortable in social situations. That day the social anxiety was COMPLETELY gone, and I felt like I knew exactly the right things to say to everyone. My thoughts were constantly racing and I was making plans for the future, it felt like the sky was the limit. In a way it felt scary, because it didn't feel like me, I felt like someone else and almost outside myself. But it was an amazing day.

I should mention that this "episode" was preceded by insomnia. When it was over I'd been up for 2 days straight. I finally got to sleep, but when I woke up the nightmare began. I found myself staring into space for no reason for 15 minutes in bed. When I realized I was awake, I knew something was very wrong. My tongue was swollen and my heart was beating faster than it ever had in my life. When I stood up my brain completely "zoned out" and my entire consciousness shifted into a state of depersonalization and confusion. I felt electrical currents coarse throughout my brain and entire body, and my extremities began twitching rapidly. I did not lose consciousness, but it felt like I was going to. My heartbeat starting getting very weak and beating irregularly, and I thought I was dying.

Mentally, I had devolved back into the state of nothingness. Long story short, I was taken to the hospital via ambulance. They did a CT scan and it was negative. I ended up in the psych ward because of my mental state. My self and emotions gradually returned while I was in the hospital for 2 days waiting to be transferred to a mental hospital. I actually felt good again. Once again I thought the ordeal was over. Wrong again. I'd been up for 2 days again, I finally got to sleep at the mental hospital. Woke up confused, and eventually I realized all my feelings were gone again. But this time it felt like they had been erased more fully than ever. After this, all I did was stay in bed.

They put me back on Wellbutrin and Abilify. They had no effect. I stayed there for a week then came home. I stopped taking all meds in late May. I remained at home for 4 more months of nothingness, and spending most of the time in bed. Then September 6th I finally felt some feelings of myself return. It was nowhere near the improvement of May, there was still a lot missing, but I felt like I could live for the first time in months. I left the house for the first time in 4 months and did things I finally felt like doing. After this long off the drug, I thought the brain was finally rewiring and allowing me to get on with my life. Wrong for the third (and final) time.

Again, the improvement occurred with insomnia. I was wary to fall asleep. For good reason - "it" happened again. When I regained awareness, I got up and I felt completely dead inside again. I did not want to admit that the positive changes from the previous day had been erased, so I tried to go back to sleep. While my eyes were closed, I began to realize that not only had everything inside me died again, but I literally felt dead, in a way I'd never thought possible. Like I'd ceased to exist.

I got up, but I no longer felt like a person in a body existing. There were no sensations inside me associated with getting up and walking. The images changed, but it's like there was no self there to get feedback from the environment. The perception of the senses (i.e. touch, smell) was greatly diminished. All the emotions and feelings of being an alive human being and having a self were gone, and now the physical sensations were going as well. I literally felt like I ceased to exist in every way but physically.

I had the MRI done shortly after this final change, and it was negative. This state has persisted for 11 months, unchanging. I've literally spent the last 11 months in bed and have gained ridiculous amounts of weight. However, I don't feel fat. I don't feel myself at the deepest level imaginable, and I don't care. I can't feel the days pass, every second is complete nothingness, but the part that cares is gone too. I feel no relation to the person who lived the 31 years before this. My soul has been erased, and I don't see a dignified way out. I have no life, my life is already over. I have nothing to show for it, and no answers. I wish this was a tumor or organic brain disease because at least then I'd have an answer. It's hard to think something as benign as an antidepressant could do this.

The state you describe does sound very strange.

Are you taking, or were you taking, any other perscription medications?
Are you taking, or were you taking, at any point in this, any recreational drugs?
If yes to either, describe your usage.

No on both counts. I had been on antidepressants (and occasionally antipsychotics) off and on since I was 14, however. Sometimes I think maybe the cumulative usage of these drugs has caused this. It's too late to change this now, though.
 
This sounds a lot to me like bipolar disorder (cycles of mania followed by crushing depression), you may want to consult a psych.

If both CT and MRI scans show no gross pathological changes, there's nothing more than cycling meds and lifestyle changes availiable to you.
 
Well, i'd pick a different doctor, obviously - and in any case, one can't really blame him, as Wellbutrin has helped a lot of people, and to say that your response is abnormal is an understatement. Wellbutrin is, as I said, not known to produce severe, persistent, negative effects afterwards.

I'm also having a hard time really understanding the state that you're in - you've given a lot of metaphorical description of it, which is probably the most natural way to describe it, but I think a more concrete description might help some of us get a handle on what you're experiencing... Maybe even describe a situation and how you previously would have felt in that, and how you feel in it now?

It's very hard to describe, because it involves the complete loss of basic inner emotional constructs and a sense of being alive and conscious that most humans take for granted. I used to as well, until these constructs were suddenly gone.... there is no reference in most people's experience for it, so you would likely find it impossible to understand or relate to. I'm not saying I am different than all other humans, but I'm sure this is an extremely rare case.
The only thing I've found online close to this is Cotard's Syndrome, in which people feel dead as a result of a disconnection between emotional pathways and sensory input.

Trying to explain this is basically like trying to define what consciousness is, or human feelings, emotions, or motivation. Who are "you" (really), what defines your sense of "inner being" and motivates you to do the things you do and make the decisions you make? I can't really tell you what a human feeling is, but I know I had hundreds or thousands of them in regard to all people, places, and things in life. Consciousness for me was being in touch with those feelings on a visceral level and being naturally motivated to move through life based on what I "felt", which was constantly changing. I could find things humorous, things could cause me to feel pleasure, pain, frustration, relief, sadness, pride, envy, hope.

This new consciousness never changes, and it consists of exactly nothing. I am no longer motivated, or indeed able, to move through life since all of those innate feelings I had about everything (including myself) are missing. Missing on a level you would not be able to comprehend unless you experienced it for yourself. Since laying in bed "feels" exactly the same as going outside, or reading, playing a game, or doing anything (which is nothing), I don't do anything. It's not that I don't want to do anything, I no longer have the inner construct that makes it possible to want or not want.

I don't even perceive time as really passing, as morning is the same as afternoon, is the same as evening. Without the emotional connections to the outside world, it feels like nothing exists beyond this room. Without my inner universe of emotions, desires, and thoughts that defined everything that was "me", it's as if I don't exist. You can't get much closer to nonexistence, short of death.

That's about the best I can do to describe it.
 
If you have been on various antipsychotic and antidepressant medications for many years, how are you so convinced bupropion is doing this to you?

Do you smoke tobacco? If so I am not surprised you feel this way. Bupropion is an antagonist for the nicotinic acetylcholine receptor which nicotine binds to. Think of it as the naloxone for smoking cigarettes.
 
i think you need to get off the wellbutrin first of all. I recommend amino acid therapy instead of drugs for treatment of depression/anxiety. Amino acids like l-tyrosine, l-lysine, l-cysteine, and 5-htp can help a lot. Personally, my doc recommends this program called NeuroReplete by CHK nutrition inc. I was going to post a link but their site is down ATM. Sorry if I sound like I'm trying to push a product; I am only doing so because it is the only thing that has helped in both the short term and long term with minimal side effects.
 
If you have been on various antipsychotic and antidepressant medications for many years, how are you so convinced bupropion is doing this to you?

I think it may have been the straw that broke the camel's back. I'd never experienced a seizure before in my life before last year, clearly a result of the stopping and starting of the bupropion (admittedly it was a poor decision, but I was confused and was unsure of what to do). Things started to go quite wrong after the seizure activity, which the drug has been known to produce. Somehow it changed my consciousness to erase all traces of my inner life (the emotional landscape creating the core of who I was, my "essence") including all feelings and motivations about life. It's really unlivable.


Do you smoke tobacco? If so I am not surprised you feel this way. Bupropion is an antagonist for the nicotinic acetylcholine receptor which nicotine binds to. Think of it as the naloxone for smoking cigarettes.

No, I don't. But bupropion is far more than that, as its wikipedia page shows. It is also a norepinephrine-dopamine reuptake inhibitor, and god knows what else (because the drug company surely doesn't). Like all antidepressants, its method of action is unknown. Those who take them are all guinea pigs in a sense. Well this little piggy had his soul erased, and there appears to be no going back. Thank you psychiatry, thank you GlaxoSmithKline.
 
My boyfriend experienced something similar when taking wellbutrin. I'd talk to your doctor and see if there's something else they can try you on or something they can do to help.
 
Taking psychedelics to "find oneself" is a very viable option. Keep your dose reasonable and hang around people who can deal with you if things decide to go sour - but expect the best from the experience.

In the end the exact psychedelic to use is a very personal choice - you should decide on duration and intensity level. For serious introspection I recommend a medium-length psychoactive like oral DMT (ayahuasca), mushrooms or the 2C compounds - but some like longer/shorter experiences and some don't like these compounds. Smoked DMT is probably too short lasting to provide good integration of the experience into your life.
 
now you realize what most dont, we are nothing more than a soup of chemicals. Fucking them up will in turn radically alter who you are which is really just your unique makeup of neurotransmitters/receptors and how they interact mixed with personal experience which can alter neurotranmitters to a point, but nothing like drugs can.
 
While I don't doubt for a second that something inside you has drastically changed for the worse and that the medication and your use of it was likely a catalyst for it, your posts do not match the feeling of emptiness that you describe. If everything, everything, was truly gone there would not be the sense of urgency and despair that your posts convey. There is most certainly emotion in your posts, I can see it.

This state has persisted for 11 months, unchanging. I've literally spent the last 11 months in bed and have gained ridiculous amounts of weight.

In light of all this, sekio's advice is the absolute best you will ever receive from myself, this forum, or even a doctor. You are in a deep, depressive state and only a drastic re-engagement with the world can bring you out of it. We are social creatures, and curious ones at that, which thrive when we are around others and involved with the world around us. Once you do this you will feel like a full person again.
 
Think positive mate, i know, it's very easy to say, but difficult to do sometimes, but i think that this is the point from where you could start again, life is so complicated, you say"well, fuck, i feel so empty inside, no fuckin reason to live", and the next moment you see a girl(or a boy if you're a girl,i think you didn't say..)8) and you fall in love with her, you feel it with every cell of your body, you can almost hear your heart beating like a drum..this is just a case, but believe me,it really happens..(i can tell you for sure, cause this has happened to me?))...well, love,<3, the most powerful reason in life..:).Anyway, my brother took the wellbutrin for 3-4 months, he was sleeping ALL the time, and he was in a very depressive state: (.Then he went to an other Dr, he gave him effexor, and now he is like he always was: D.But i liked what Seico said, forget the medicines and do something else, from the really lot of things that he suggested.Don't give up, mate.You say that is nothing inside you, that's not true: |, search as deep as it has to be, i'm sure that finally you'll find yourself!:)Maybe you have lost some battles, but in the end,you'll win the war..All the goods with you



MartinFn
 
I was on meds for depression for nearly 20 years. Most of the SSRI's and Wellbutrin along with xanax. It took me a long time to come back after I tapered off them. My soul felt 'erased' as you say for nearly two years until I made a conscious decision to get better. I'll give you a few suggestions that WILL work if you religiously apply them daily in your life.

1) Exercise. Start simple. Walking is great. Gets you outside and breathing fresh air. I read a study which showed just exposing yourself to natural environments has an antidepressant action which is why I love walking through nature trails every chance I get. As you get in better shape consider joining a gym. If you would have told me 20 years ago that I'd be a gym rat in my late 30's/early 40's I'd say you were high. Truth is I love the endophin rush from weight training now. Exercise is the #1 tool to manage the symptoms of depression. You'll feel better in your skin. You'll sleep better. As an added benefit, you'll look better too.

2) Fish oils. Not just one or two a day, though any amount will help. There have been studies done with depression and mega-doses of fish oil. I personally take 12 per day. It's definately not going to hurt you though it does get expensive, no doubt. Some people seem to respond more dramatically to fish oils than others, it seems. Even if you don't notice amazing results, they're great for your heart and you'll notice your skin is softer and smoother.

3) Other supplements like 5-htp and sam-E. Those were the first I tried and it amazed me how well they worked for an OTC deperssion remedy. Adaptogens like Ashwagandha and Rhodiola Rosea are also very effective. Ashwagandha is best if you have an anxious, 'racing thoughts' kind of depression (I do). Rhodiola Rosea tends to work best for people with lethargic depression. I tend to prefer Ashwagandha but there are times I'll reach for the Rhodiola when I'm feeling sluggish and unmotivated. A good multivitamin is also a good idea.

I could probably write on this topic all night but these are the essentials. Your soul is not lost and you can reconnect with the person you used to be and still are. Psychedelics may be a good idea when you get back on your feet. I'd avoid them for now. A trip could go either way and it's best to err on the side of caution. I took a three year break from tripping and just started up again last October with a dose of mescaline in the form of San Pedro cactus. A very healing trip and I've starting tripping again regularly ever since. No matter what you decide, I wish you well and my heart goes out to you. Be gentle and kind to yourself. You deserve it. Things can get better and will if you apply yourself.

Embrace the monstrosity of yourself. Love and acceptance of yourself, even at your darkest hour will enable you to grow. Good vibes to you on your journey. <3
 
SSRI's are dangerous & can be disastrous, they should be outlawed!
 
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I've been on almost all of the SSRI's, SNRI's, as well as Welbutrin and have found that most (if not all, but interestingly enough, not Welbutrin) of these antidepressants made me feel not up or down. Just kinda empty or like a robot. I simply lived, breathed, worked and came home. I was neither happy or sad. Emotionally flat. You could always change antidepressants to see if that would work or perhaps work on yourself through cognitive behavioral therapy for whatever is ailing you.
 
Seiko hit the nail on the head. Putingrad is also on target it's obvious that you have feelings regarding events or the lack thereof. From reading your posts they sound like you're extremely depressed but definitely not devoid of feeling. I get patients who I talk with all the time about various problems they're having with their medications convinced it's drug x even though there is absolutely no correlation. Once people get stuck on something it can be really hard to change a mindset. 300mg is also a fairly average dose of buproprion. Your symptoms to me all sound like a mixture of bipolar and some sort of schizotypal disorder. Don't be so quick to discount psychiatry and drug therapy in the future. I apologize for the sentence structure spelling and grammar. I'm doing this on my phone at work. Hopefully the point comes across clear though.
 
Seiko hit the nail on the head. Putingrad is also on target it's obvious that you have feelings regarding events or the lack thereof. From reading your posts they sound like you're extremely depressed but definitely not devoid of feeling. I get patients who I talk with all the time about various problems they're having with their medications convinced it's drug x even though there is absolutely no correlation. Once people get stuck on something it can be really hard to change a mindset. 300mg is also a fairly average dose of buproprion. Your symptoms to me all sound like a mixture of bipolar and some sort of schizotypal disorder. Don't be so quick to discount psychiatry and drug therapy in the future. I apologize for the sentence structure spelling and grammar. I'm doing this on my phone at work. Hopefully the point comes across clear though.


Why shouldnt we discount psychiatric & drug therapy? Its not like people dont commit suicide on this shit. Its not like people walk around like robots w/o any emotions. Im not saying it doesnt help people because its been proven that it has helped people but it has also screwed up people.

Its the pharmaceutical companies that tell the doctors what to give out, which drugs to push alot of & how to "supposedly" distinguish who the patients are that should be taking these meds. A handbook for psychiatrists to read & follow to the "T". More of these drugs they give out, the more money made by these companies & the more money the doctors make.
 
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