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Terroir and Cannabis

There were different grades. Golden thai, Chcolate Thai that smelled like chocolate, buddah thai, mint chocolate thai. occasional thai sticks but that was a 70s thing more. This used to come through the bay area on freighter ships by the ton. I remember a huge ship bust in 87-88 and then no more thai bud. I would say that thai bud was one of the classic sativas. Juice fruit thai was another one I probably smoked but can't remeber it called as such. What were your experience with buds there. Did you try smoking Ya Ba. How about Cambodia, get a chance to make it over there. Sounds like there is a good scene there.

Man you really are spun... lol... GREAT thread

That is all definitely still around as I had some of the mint choc. earlier this year. Not "visually beautiful" like the premium of today but really smooth, satisfying, and... CHEAP!!! As cheap as dirt mid, as good as average KB / beast what have ya. Chocolate comes around every so often, specifically greater Boston / NE area (if this is sourcing sorry, I don't see how someone could use that info tho). Juicy fruit is always around but definitely not what you are remembering.

Someone I know actually just got back from that area, visited most of SE Asia, said the bud in India was the best (lots of indica, spec. Hindu Kush).

I'll try to add more to this thread when I can sit down for a while. One area that is often overlooked is East Coast, so much great stuff originated from our northern states.
 
Agreed with Outta here, I get plenty of thai strains around here like the chocolate ones you mentioned (East Coast New England) but that stuff doesn't really even compare to the KB you can find for ridiculously cheap around MA, and defiantly not the medical grade stuff that is in abundance. Juicy Fruit is always around here as well, i've come across the strain so many times without particularly looking.

India had some decent and very odd bud when I visited a few years back, and I think Outta is right, though I don't know what strains I smoked, they certainly felt indica 100%

J - Matanuska Valley Thunderfuck.... something I've always wanted to try, I hear that the original strain is dead and anything named "MV Thunderfuck" is just for sales pitching.
 
India had some decent and very odd bud when I visited a few years back, and I think Outta is right, though I don't know what strains I smoked, they certainly felt indica 100%

Please elaborate on the "odd" stuff you got...

Check out this icmag thread about the ChemDawg family, perfected in Mass. There would be no Diesel strains w/o Mass Super Skunk (recently had a nice batch of this, banginnn). Good ol' Pioneer Valley...

NSFW:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=188253


starts at post #39
 
Well, I was in India for about 3 weeks before I met a relative who smokes regularly and has dual citizenship with India and the US. He set me up to meet with his buddy who had bud (I must have been 16 or so at the time so this is hazy). The weed was odd in the fact that it didn't look like much, was darker in hue (though not bricked or anything of the sort) and more dense then the weed I was used too in the US. I'd reckon it looked a good bit like Hindu Kush, only a few shades darker and delivered a opiated high. I know for sure this stuff wasn't laced, and to make it more odd, I was given a ton of it for free. I obviously have no pictures of the stuff because I wasn't so into cannabis and strain information -- but if I were to guess, I'd say it was a very high Indica strain.

Wish I had more to say about it, but I really can't remember all to great, only that it was deceptive in it's looks.
 
Matanuska Valley Thunderfuck.....

Awesome name for a strain!

One thing I forgot to throw in was New Zealand strains. It seems like there are a lot of breeders over there. I have not visited but when I was in Amsterdam it seems like there were NZ strains popping up and a few years ago one of my friends grew something called "Tepuki Thunder" it was really dark, potent and heavy like it had some strong indica in it or something. Apparently it is from Tepuki New Zealand??? Any kiwis out there with stories....
 
There was a thread on MVTF a while back along with some debate. I researched it. Its been a while so I don't remember particulars like taste but some likened it to red grapes, and a few other descriptions. I also heard that it was the work or a group if hippies that had traveled to afghanistan during the 70s on the hippie trail, non of their sativas grew well but they had found an indica that was perfectly suitable for that environment. It was supposedly an outdoor strain (and between 1975-1990 people could grow cannabis on their personal property in the great state of Alaska without fear of prosecution. This was, incidentally the year before Holland decriminalized "soft drugs." So people wouldn't grow indoors for fear of the law.

Alaska possesses special problems for those trying to grow outdoors. The season is short and decreasing length of days which triggers darknes increases quickly in late summer. I happen to have relatives that live here but my in law grew up their. His brother is a hippie that lives in a alternative community. Anyway, what I have found was that more good strains come out of that state than is widely known (he lives near seward) so he's forced to grow indoors.

In laws lived in mat-su. Their griends in the valley grew indoors, that seemed to be mostly because the political climate was becoming less pot friendly. As far as the famous strain, it supposedly had purple or dark spots, tasted like grapes, and sadly was supposedly wiped out when a DEA raid in the 90s made a huge sweep of the area. Anyway, anyone with info, please contribute to my thread from way back:

Matanuska Valley Thunderfuck

The story goes that the plant was a female clone, but some were saved, bread with good males and some of this genetic material is saved, hense names in catalogues. One thing is for sure, depite the raids of 93, 94, 0r 95, Alaska buds are still super potent. Despite this being the strongest bud I ever smoked, the highest I ever got was from N CA kind bud at Circus Circus Reno after a soccer tournement when I was 17. Felt like I was underwatter. And finished Dragonslayer for the first time in my life.

Thanks all for post.

Out P: You can really get Thai in MA? you have my envey even if itss not the best stuff going around.

JSK: That's interesting to here what you say of pockets of bud scenes in Thailand (and SA for that matter). I think that there has been alot of propoganda regarding Ya Ba- kinda like the crack baby and PCP scare of the 80s in the US.

Last thing: Do you know which was the first place under US flag that legalized cannabis after a period of prohibition: The (former) US Panama Canal Zone. A committee was constituted and one of the tests they performed to assess its hazardness was they had several Canal Zone police officers smoke it in front of members of the commitee.=D If your interested, its somewhere on Blue Light. It was legalized because it was years before brainwashing had set in clouding otherwise reasonable, intelligent peoples, specifically scientists and policymakers judgement.
 
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Chainer 3K- The way that you describe the stuff you got in India: darker hued and dense and is a good approximation of what the Thai bud going around the Bay Area in the 80s.

JSK: NZ is one of the places I would someday like to visit. Its interesting how the worlds great strains make their way to the Dam and are grown or bred into something even more mind blowing.

I have a thing for using technology to bread better buds but also for the preservation of clasic landrace strains. I have a theory that over the years, farmers, through natural selection pick those strains that best go with the climate, growing conditions, and sights and sounds of a given area. This is the place were terroir and selective breading come together.

If you get a chance guys, check some of the picture links of classic buds and high time THMQ from the 70s. Cool stuff- to be preserved for posterity's sake.
 
Two great posts Jspun, thanks, I liked the background of the MVTF -- I have heard similar things before. I'm relatively sure that if it isn't a dead strain at this point, it's something I will never personally try.

Also, I can find Thai and African grown bud in MA, have had thai strains and durban poison among a few others. They were all good strains but I've certainly had better.
 
%)What about the finese of the high and taste, So in other ordes MVTF would have you seeing infrared or seriously the tinniest bong makes you feel high and pleasant and then all of a sudden hits you like a sledgehammer and just when you think you are as high as you are going to get hits you with a right hook , ect, ect... The good thing about it is the initial hit leaves you too stoned to even think of another and this is very much a creeper which makes you damn grateful you didn't smoke that second one.

So getting back to some of the tropical sativas- they don't have the mind blowing psychedelic type high potency, but the quality of the high is something else in particular. To use an example: Thunderbird will get you smashed, but an 88' Lafite is of extrordinary tasteand finese. Same with buds. Ed Rosenthal wrote an article of the demise of quality sativas. They seem to make people wired but I would get a relaxing laid back feelind from my favorites. May favorite was in 89' on senior trip in Waikiki when one of the locals smoked me out with some big Island (probably Puna)- he said it probably came from the big island. The taste was so sweet and the high, b/c I was used to mind blowing bud (growing up in the bay area) wasn't supper stoney, but the high was so laid back and perfectly tropical- one of the best nights of my life.

Years latter I met some surfers in Maui that I picked up hitchhicking. They were transplants from California. They turned me on to some purpulish bud grown in Maui that got me super stoned ( this did happen to be very potent bud) along with a great quality high. I had some decently good mexican (horrible dirtweed compared to what they got.) They laughed and told me to save it for the rest of my trip. This was 94'. Got smoked out by Haloe bodyborders the week before on the largest black sand beach on the big island during an epic surf sess during are rare time were it was offshore all morning and early afternoon. Not sledgehanner stony but good quality laid back high from small florescent light/dark green buds with orange hairs. My point is these buds have finese. My last trip (I think I right about it in this thread) I was on the North Shore for a wedding. The bride is one of our best friends and lived on the North Shore and worked at the TurtleBay Hotel for 5-6 years. Her brother was there for over 10 years. At any rate, they were well loved and dialed in with the locals- who are all surprisingly very nice. i got an 1/8 for $100.00 through the brother. I was shocked, but I figured, hey its Island bud. The bud got you high, but wouldn't last and was prety stoney. Mid quality bud. I was diappointed. Plus it didn't look like the small bud, distance b/w nodes Island bud I was used to. They were bigger.

Anyway, I was at a party for them at someones house on a small cliff north of Haleiwa. They had a BBQ. Talked to them about ice which they all thought was evil and had stories about how it destroyed so and so lives. Anyway, we got on the topic of buds. Apparently, the majority (april 07') was being imported for the mainland, either from CA, or BC. This made me very sad.

So in my humble opinion, its the quality and not the intensity of the high, and other stuff like taste, mouth feel, smoothness of the smoke, ect... For this reason, every effort should be made to save landrace strains.

If I forgot to mention it. India has a history with Cannabis that stretches back thousands of years. This is were the word Ganja comes from, and was brought by Indian indentured servants to Jamaica. Nepal, the place of hashish extrordinare is probably were sativas migrated from. Afghanistan, on the other hand, is the homeland of Indica. Kashmir, my favorite hash place (next to Nepalese which I never tried) has both indica and sativa and a hybrid of screened and hand harvested. But Redish Kashmiri. mmmmm. Talk about quality of high without getting hit over the head with a sledgehammer.%)
Whats your guys thoughts on this.

By the way, mex bud sucks. Nothing like the classics like Guerro Gold and Michocan Black. Heard its because the cartels west of the rockies have inferior seeds and don't take care of the plant. But its cheap as hell ( like $15-20 a 1/4 0z). This is suprisingly their biggest moneymaker inspite of good quality shards and tar that has improved significantly and decreased in price over the last 10 years.

Anyway, if your still with me (sorry for the long post) what did they lack in your opinion like Durban Poisson: potency, quality of high, ect... Which is ok- people have different tastes, thats why there are different wines, for instance: a Cabarnet lover might not like merlot.
 
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Loved reading all these posts. jspun, million thank-you's. i just wish prohibtion would end so these land-race wonders can continue to get another generation high and are not lost foreveeeeer!!
 
Thought I'd resurrect this thread with early outdoor harvest season comming up in the Northern Hemisphere. How does the outdoor crop look in California thus far?
 
Matanuska Valley Thunderfuck and Cannabis in Alaska

In researching this strain I found out some interesting stuff. First my experience with this. The strain that I smoked was from a friend that grew up in Alaska- jr high/ high school years were spent in a town called Palmer which is in the Matanuska Valley. Anyway, he brought some back to CA after a visit there and I got to smoke some- this was in 93'. This was the most potent gange I ever smoked (talked about this in a few other threads) and I grew up in the San Francisco Bay Area- so I had a familarity of a wide range of quality bud- strong, potent and otherwise. What was amazing is that one bong hit was all I took and could take. This was creeper so luckily I waited b/w bong hits- I just kept getting higher and higher. That one bong hit took me to the realm where cannabis begins to take on strong characteristics of a psychedelic drug. The other thing that I remember was that it was so full of crystals that it seemed to be dipped in sugar. From my research on the net I have heard others confirm this characteristic. For the life of me I can't remember the taste, though. There was a type of bud that was going around during the christmas season of 87' or 88'in the Bay Area that was supper crystalized and smelled and tasted like pine- a big bannana bud that we nick named "christmas tree bud" that gave a good soaring high but this was different. I have heard people describe the taste of MTF in various ways but mango and red grapes seems like the most popular.

As to the origin of this strain there has been alot of debate on the subject on the internet. The consensus seems to be that the Matanuska Valley Thunderfuck strain was a pure indica or mostly indica strain of extraordinary high potency from the late 70s through till the mid 90s by some acounts or disappearing after 01'-02' by others. Supposedly this was a clone that many feel is now extinct but had been crossed with other strains hence Matanuska Mist, Matanuska Tundra, ect...According to the Big Book of Buds which I was reading in my neighborhood headshop/bookstore Sagarmatha sells the original strain or something close to it renamed as Matanuska Tundra. People who claimed to have smoked it also reported the buds as having characteristic purple spots which I don't remember seeing. Another classic strain of Alaskan bud that was around iduring MTF's heyday was one called Yukon Gold that many people mentioned fondly as well.

As far as grow characteristics- I figured that all the MTF was indoor. Close to the solstice in the valley you have extra extra long daylight hours. The Matanuska Valley is known for growing super large produce in the summer. The hours of darkness increase rapidly around what would probably be flowering time- aug- early september if it was outdoor. Some say that this strain is optimized for growing outdoors in the region even requiring a good frost to perform well. One or two have gone as far as saying this is an indigenous strain (landsrace) which I highly doubt. Definiately alot of indica if not pure indica in this one I reckon.

In summary- I feel blessed that I got to try this phenomenal strain around its heyday. Really super stoney dipped in sugar one hit indica. Whether or not this strain is still around is a point of much conjecture and debate on the net.

This is a clasic pure Indica strain that was probably the most poyent pot I smoked. Although stories differ, these were grown outdoors in the Matsu Valley, a place near anchorage that has large light exposure in the summer but starts losing sunlight hours quick through August. Its taste has been described as red grape like by many. There is much cojecture if a pure example of this lives (the plants were clones) but its genes live on through seed catalogues having been bred with other varietals. MTF and Yukon Gold were the classic Alaskan strains until the mid 90s when the DEA raided the vallel!y if my info is correct. MTF is the most potent bud I smoked- psychedelic like. Supposedly the parents were from afganistan or pakistan, home of Indica and used to early flowering. Nice to get info on this strain (there is a thread). Out doors how is the harvest going. Will try to fill in generalities of the state of the scene in Maui-seems some growing is taking place on the Island- a portion for medical marijuana. Foe those of you true conoisseurs, take time to read this thread and please add info for posterity
 
I'd just like to go to Amsterdam to taste again some top Kashmiri hash, like the one I tasted back in '89... I'm drooling.
There was a war going on in Kashmir during all the nineties-beginning of 2000's and there was no Kashmiri hash to be found in Holland. But now...
 
Lou Lou. I consider kashmiri hash, at its best, to be one of the world greatest hash. It had gotten a bad reputation in the past due to a white mold that infects many hashes. Undoubtedly, the war between India and Pakastani backed elements had alot to do with decrease in quality. I came across a high times in a commic book collector store that described it as "redish rocket fuel."
What is interesting is that it is at the crossroads of the great Indica based sieved hash of Afganistan and Northern Pakistan on the one hand which are traditionally sieved and heavenly sativa hand rubbed hash of Nepal.

Anyway, I was in Maui recently. I spoke with someone in the hippieish town of Paia in the hemp store. The state of the scene on the island in terms of medical MJ is the feds swept through a couple of years ago and closed the dispensaries. Apparently, there is one open on Oahu but not the other Islands no longer. Apparently, some legal outdoor growing is going protected by the states laws that apply to the patient and caregiver, that specify the number of plants (don't know specifics). Like I said earlier in this thread the buds from Maui on a visit in 93' were some of the most potent and finest in terms of taste and quality of the high. What a beautiful island the locals get to live on from the lush Jungle on the road to Hana, to the dry, desert like coastine of the south shore, to the perfect beach weather of the west shore were warm sunny days are cooled off by the occasional 2 minute sprinkling downpoor of a passing cloud ( not to mention the beautiful people on the beach.) Lets not forget Mt Haleakela were the day we visited it was in the mid 50s @ 10,0000 feet elevation. This Island is full of outdoor microclimates. Will add more latter- got to go.
 
Maui Bud

At any rate, after my return from Maui, I thought I would post some info about Maui bud and how terroir is essential to engendering the magical charaecteristics of the various strains and sub strains that are associated traditionally from this Island. From CC Mag

By Micronug - Friday, January 1 1999
Tags: CC16,Budshots,GROWING,Indoor,Outdoor.
Hawaiian herb is among the world's best, despite low yields and a tricky climate.

Shaka budHawaiian marijuana has long been regarded as the best cannabis on earth. Are these legends true? In a word, yes! Most places claim to have the best herb (you know who you are), but the true connoisseur sees past these claims and seeks out the best. Good Hawaiian bud has a stone that is mind-warping, and tropical flavors that have to be tasted to be believed.
Helicopter harassment

Hawaii is the most isolated island chain in the world, existing 2500 miles from anything of significance. The tropics are ideal for growing marijuana ? even the air is nutrient rich here! However, pretty much everything else is going against us.

There are helicopters (Green Harvest) much like on the West Coast, but they are more intense here because there is much less land to cover. There are thieves that make a lifestyle of hunting out patches of pakalolo (crazy tobacco). Hunters train their dogs to smell the plant. We have mongooses to contend with, ganja loving pigs, goats, slugs, caterpillars, and much of the rest of the animal and insect kingdom.


Close-up of Maui WowieThe intensity of the helicopter patrols here in addition to all the other possible snags makes Hawaii one of the most difficult places on earth to pull off a crop. Despite this, as badly as they want our herb, we want it more!

AdvertisementSmaller is better

A typical harvest per plant outdoors in California is one pound of bud. In Hawaii, the average is a quarter ounce! This is mainly because we have four growing seasons a year here, making each season very short.

Most local plants are what we call 90 day wonders, finishing in under 90 days regardless of when they were planted. The harvest is small, but the quality is superb. The plants don't get very large before they flower, making them much less detectable than a 15 foot tall "California-style" plant. We do have one long season, but having your plants out twice as long makes them twice as likely to be taken. They get too large for their own good and are spotted from the sky with ease.


An assortment of Hawaiis best budsCosts & quality

The herb scene varies from island to island, with particular strains endemic to certain areas. Prices range from fair to ridiculous. I've heard of ounces selling for $800. I personally never pay more than $100 a quarter. The big island (Hawaii) usually has the best prices, a reflection of how much more usable land there is there.

Overall, I would have to say that Maui has the best quality (on the planet!) Names like Kauai Electric, Puna Butter, and Maui Wowie are plentiful, and some of them are actual stable strains that kick ass when grown in the Hawaiian climate. If you take a killer Californian strain however, and grow it in Hawaii, the first few generations usually don't do so well. After a while, the strain acclimatizes and will begin to produce da kine!


Shaka budMagical buds

There is something magic about Hawaiian bud. Just as a Hawaiian mango or papaya is the best you ever had, so is the herb. Most growers in Hawaii are growing completely organic, which is one reason the herb is so good.

There are plenty of pure indicas here, and pure sativas can be found as well. Amsterdam hybrids also abound, but they are seldom as good as a Hawaiian strain. Herb consciousness is very high here, and it is reflected in the quality of the bud.


Close-up of Maui WowieTechniques and tricks

Growers in Hawaii use every imaginable technique to grow marijuana, from treetops to lava tubes. Micro-climates are everywhere, and in some areas you are in a completely different climate every five minutes. The trick is to find an area that gets enough rain that you don't have to water your plants much, but not so much that your plants mold. This can be very tricky and frustrating, but as with anything, practice makes perfect.

The soil in Hawaii tends to be acidic, so growers that plant directly in the ground must often lime the soil months ahead of time to prepare it. I prefer the use of grow bags, so that the plants can be moved if necessary.


Close-up of Maui WowieAnother method that can be very effective is starting the plants inside under fluorescents, however even this has its drawbacks. Plants started inside look great and have very short internodal lengths, but often when they are put outside the top node shoots up to receive more light and all that beautiful tight growth at the bottom just dies off. This happens because all the surrounding vegetation blocks out the light to the lower growth of the plants. If growers could plant in open sunlight this wouldn't happen, but the plants would be spotted too easily. So each grower must experiment to find the best growing methods for their particular growing area. This can take years.

Worth the effort

By now I'm sure you understand why almost none of this extraordinary ganja gets exported. We can barely supply ourselves! Anyone that wants to sell their herb can get as much as they want for it right at home, without the need for smuggling or mailing it.

Of 100 seeds started this season, my total harvest was approximately three ounces. I'm forced to wonder if it was even worth it. Then I do a fat bong hit, and as the spicy tropical smoke exudes from my lungs, I think "Hell yeah, it was worth it!"

to see pix:

http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/1427.html

Free Marc!

Anyone have any more info on Maui or the Islands in general with there many classic strains and how the scene is like now please add.

Maui was cool- saw very few cops and was appraoched in one of the major towns on the west shore multiple times every evening. Don't believe in scoring on the street in general even if the laws for possession of Pako are lenient so I can't give a first hand review. On Oahu, in 2007 when I visited, sadly they were importing kind from the mainland- but it laked that tropical magic. Hopefully the trend is reversing in the current political climate and the feds are staying out of the Islands- An end to the facist operation green harvest that has been ongoing for decades.
 
Kaui Electric and more on Hawaiian Island Bu

Here's some omre info on buds from Hawaii and how important the covergence of microclimate, soil, growing techniques, sulight, ect... and DNA combine

by DJ Short

"Hawaiian

Hawaiian a true classic. There is something special about a good island herb, and Hawaiian is among the best. When properly grown outdoors it has a wonderful and unique bouquet of fruity spice, similar to the sweetness of the fine Thai, but with a kind of tangy taste.

Good Hawaiian herb has always been a devastatingly powerful experience for me. It is very psychedelic and internally focused, contemplative and overpoweringly meditative. A Walk with the King, a Dance with the Queen, and a sunset on the beach! Aah... Hawaiian!

I have tried to equal the Hawaiian experience outdoor on the mainland, and indoors, with no success. Everything I have grown from Hawaiian stock turned out to be nowhere near the quality of the parent stock. This is true for three generations of trials. The product from Hawaiian seed was equal to the best plants grown from mid-quality Colombian stock!

This led me to a hypothesis about Hawaii: that just about any stock grown in Hawaii will turn out to be of unique and relatively high quality. Hawaii just happens to be one of those special places, I suppose.

All breeding attempts with Hawaiian stock were dumped from my garden by 1983. It was a pretty and robust plant though, and also quite productive. Just not all that impressive when grown outside its homeland."

Not Kauai Electric but DJ Short is talking in gereralities I believe.

http://www.rollitup.org/seed-strain-reviews/158743-elusive-strain.html
.

by A Hawiian

Originally Posted by JITAMON
Aloha Kauai Electric is a VERY hard to find strain in original form. I doubt very many people did a breeding project with her. In the Islands not very many growers keep records, let alone keep a strain pure for generations. Lots of hybridization and labelization, just to make a much needed buck. Unless you have good friends here, most people will tell you what you want to hear regardless of truth or origin. Sad but true.

You are looking on the wrong island first off. Big I strains are different from Kauai, which is different from Maui, which is different than Oahu ect... Second off the Electric was an indoor strain, thus the name Electric. Most indoor growers worldwide keep their mouths shut, imagine an island Third off, the strain is dated, oldschool. Finding pure, well kept seeds or clones is like finding a buried treasure. Good luck. I live in Hawaii and believe me the "Kauai Electric" is oldschool. I have only run across 2 verified instances in the last 10 yrs. The bud was ok. Defiantly had the Kauai vibe though. I can see why you want to hunt this down. I wish you luck
P.S. There is way better strains than the Electric, try to source some of those, you stand a much better chance. Aloha"

.

Hen's Teeth

"not no haoles gonna be getting that good good"
^ Howzit bruddah? Why you say no Haoles? Talkin outta ur hole no truth. Pakalolo is hard to find cause of the BATU!!! People with da kine usually only sell Kama'aina yes, but it there and it good. Those tweaks try a rob everyone on island, and the cali bud come to fill supply. If you in know you can find it, if not won't happen- haole or not bruddah!!! You sound racist like KKK. I walk thru Waimanalo or Waianae white like cloud and have no problem bruddah. Only people who eva bother me is tweaks, and they only steal. It help to be 6'3" 255#. It took a lot of sour poi, ahi poke, and maunapua for me get this big. You won't see the electric off of Kauai. The strain and seed are very closely held by those that have it. It is harder to find than the waimanalo blueberry, or the molokai frost/green. It not like the south big island where the budda can be found easy. It is as hard to find as the redeye/red hair, or the Lahaina lime green citrus tasting buds.

according to another source (this goes back to 2006

My friends on island say that the short season Kauai Electric is almost perfectly cured now. The old Hanalei bay strain "puff the magic dragon" is also making a comeback as the guy who had held those seeds for ages finally was kind enough to give a few beans to some local growers.

Consequence of prohibition on terroir in Hawaii

Originally Posted by JITAMON
Aloha Kauai Electric is a VERY hard to find strain in original form. I doubt very many people did a breeding project with her. In the Islands not very many growers keep records, let alone keep a strain pure for generations. Lots of hybridization and labelization, just to make a much needed buck. Unless you have good friends here, most people will tell you what you want to hear regardless of truth or origin. Sad but true.

,
You are looking on the wrong island first off. Big I strains are different from Kauai, which is different from Maui, which is different than Oahu ect... Second off the Electric was an indoor strain, thus the name Electric. Most indoor growers worldwide keep their mouths shut, imagine an island Third off, the strain is dated, oldschool. Finding pure, well kept seeds or clones is like finding a buried treasure. Good luck. I live in Hawaii and believe me the "Kauai Electric" is oldschool. I have only run across 2 verified instances in the last 10 yrs. The bud was ok. Defiantly had the Kauai vibe though. I can see why you want to hunt this down. I wish you luck
P.S. There is way better strains than the Electric, try to source some of those, you stand a much better chance. Aloha

Id have to agree,, i get plenty friend and family around the island>> and i cannot even get hands on many of old strains. we used to have a very nice puna buddah x white widow... but not big island pure version..those who have lived in islands know how much of a siege has been waged against outdoor growers, forcing everyone indoors or importing commercial. It is sad that a place once heralded as one of epicenters of ganja growing, is now one of the most heavly imported scenes in cannabis cultures....

Man made booze God did not
God made pot man did not

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=86319

account of Hawaiian Acres would be complete without mention of the illicit marijuana business. Hawaiian Acres, like the rest of Puna, has been known to produce the legendary Puna Buds, one of the most potent strains of Cannabis Sativa and Cannabis Indica ever cultivated for recreational drug use. Despite its illegality, it is undisputable that the economic benefits to Hawaiian Acres, Puna, Hawaii County, and the state have been profound. At its peak, this trade has been estimated to approach a yearly production value of nearly 1 billion dollars statewide. Even though this industry continues to this day, it has been considerably reduced by law enforcement, thus making it a fraction of what is was in the 1980's. This industry will most likely flourish as long as it's illegal, simply because of the laws of supply and demand of its underground economy. Direct economic benefits include jobs for law enforcement, and related support groups ranging from prosecutors and judges to penal facilities and employees as well as the growers themselves with the money they spend on cars, land, building supplies, food, fertilizers, and their families. The county, state, and federal governments benefit also from the increased revenues through sales tax, land tax, fuel tax, and income taxes generated as this illegal money filters into legal commerce. The future of this industry does have one uncertainty-legalization. Legalization would break the back of the industry completely. But this prospect would be unlikely because of the magnitude of its current economic benefits. Also, dialogue has begun regarding the merits of industrial hemp, a non-drug strain of cannabis. This fiber producing plant is used elsewhere in the world for paper, clothing, essential oils, and other uses. Should industrial hemp studies prove to be a feasible, viable and a prudent agricultural venture, and if changes to the current laws allow, it could likely be a future crop for Hawaiian Acres, considering our ideal climate.

pragamatic view on cultivation in puna district by local community source
http://www.hawaiianacres.org/history.shtml
 
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Here's an article from CC about the "Strains of Yesteryear". I would recommend reading the first page of this thread for more info on these strains.
CANNABIS CULTURE - A retrospecive of the best marijuana varieties from the 70's and 80's



COLUMBIAN
Colombian Gold
Colombian Gold came from the highland Colombian valleys near the equator, as well as on the coast (the Caribbean and the Pacific).

This was specialty pot offered commercially in the mid-70's, for about $60 to $100 per ounce. It was seeded, but most of the seeds were undeveloped, white and useless. A few rare, viable seeds were found that were dark, small-sized and roundish. The buds were leafy and the most beautiful golden blond color. Legend has it that upon maturity the plants were girdled, then left standing to die and cure in the mountain sun and mist.

The color and cure were unique, and the aroma, flavor and high were equally so. The smell was that of sandalwood incense, almost like frankincense. The flavor was that of a peppery cedar. It was some of the most unique tasting herb in the world, and the high was just as exciting. It was truly psychedelic, powerful and long lasting.

First came the great flavor, then the stupefying awe of the shift in consciousness followed by a giddy excitement and bursts of joyous laughter. Smile-lock and red-eye made it painfully obvious who was under the influence of this great psychedelic herb.

The plants from the seeds of the Gold were primarily of Sativa origin. They grew a medium to tall size outdoors at 45?N (Seattle), and were mostly symmetrical. On occasion the symmetry was interrupted by one side outgrowing the other, causing a rounded and bulging tipped bush look. The leaves were long and slender.

AdvertisementWhen grown in Washington state, the finished product was a sweet, spicy Sativa bud that matured around mid-November. The high was adequate but not as good as the Oaxaca Highland grown at the same latitude. The plants were also slightly hermaphroditic.

Colombian Red

Colombian Red was the near polar opposite of Colombian Gold. This lowland jungle pot (possibly from Brazil) was made up of dark red, almost black, chunky little nuggets of what appeared to be hash, stems, leaf and seed. The aroma was that of cedar and hash.

In the early 1980's, the Red cost only $30 to $60 an ounce due to its appearance, making it one of the best deals going. This pot was a narcotic, knock-you-down-and-out, super munchie, red-eye express. The joints would only burn half way before drowning in their own resin! The smoke was very expansive in the lungs with a powerful pine/hash flavor.

Before subjecting its victim to fits of gorging and deep snoozing, the experience usually included ridiculously long spasms of uncontrollable laughter. The silliest little image could induce hilarity beyond belief. This was the main herb around when the Cheech and Chong movies first came out.

The plants from the Red were among the first grown out by Americans. There were many seeds, medium-sized and dark grey, that sprouted and grew easily into a finished product that was more than adequate. The plants grew low, dark, and bushy, with uneven and somewhat scraggly branches that were easily broken from wind damage. The locally grown varieties rarely budded very much, so it is not certain when they would have finished. It would have been relatively late in November at the earliest.




MEXICAN
Highland Oaxaca

Highland Gold, somewhat similar to the Colombian Gold, lacked bright gold color but sported purple and red calyx tips on its blondish-brownish-green buds. It had larger buds surrounded by long, skinny leaves.

I smoked this variety during brief periods in the early 70's and again in the late 70's, paying anywhere between $40 and $120 per ounce. It was some of my all-time favorite because the aroma and flavor were of a super-spicy cedar incense with a slight fermented berry taste, in a very comfortable yet powerfully psychedelic pot. This herb contributed to many great parties, concerts and events of the era because it produced a very socially-conscious experience and mixed well with other psychedelics.

With a long lasting, creeper high that kept coming on in waves over the hours, this stuff had no ceiling. One phenomenon consistently reported from the Highland Oaxaca experience was that of peripheral visual distortions of primarily cartoon color images. This tended to increase the visual distortions caused by other psychedelics such as mushrooms or LSD.

The Oaxaca Highland Gold was a nearly pure Sativa which grew tall at 45?N, outdoors. It was also one of the most symmetrical Sativas I have encountered. The plants grew long side branches toward the bottom, and the even growth made these productive beauties look like Christmas trees when mature.

The finished product was a very sweet and spicy herb of the highest quality, with a hint of fruity pine aroma. The seeds for this variety were small, dark and round, and the plants exhibited slight signs of hermaphroditism and required surveillance to maintain seedlessness.

Guerrero

This strain from Mexico's coastal mountains came in famed green, seeded spears and cost $60 to $120 per ounce in 1977. It had a spicy, almost wintergreen fragrance compared to the other Mexicans with a very clear head high and a most pleasant smoke. It was not as strong as most, but this herb still had a way of satisfying all its own.

There was a legend about a group of entrepreneurs who imported seed from Lebanon to Guerrero and grew the famed Lebanese Upper Mountain (LUM) from the late 1970's to 1980. The LUM was electric, psychedelic and slightly sedative as well. A unique herb that I wish there would have been more of.

The seeds from the Guerrero were medium to large in size and grey to green in color. The plants from these seeds grew similarly to other Mexican and Colombian strains: a medium to tall, bushy, productive plant. The Guerrero Green, however, is where some of the famed onion and garlic flavored bud of the Pacific Northwest originated.

Michoacan Brown Spears

From the high valleys of Michoacan, this strain was very similar in shape and texture to the Guerrero, but dark brown, and with a more peppery, spicy, woody aroma. $40 to $60 bought a seeded ounce in 1975. Although it was somewhat more bland tasting than the Guerrero , this semi-commercial pot was by far better than the commercial Mexican that was all too available. It had a more distinct, spicy flavor than the regular Mexican, as well as a brighter high that was not as susceptible to tolerance or burnout.

The plants from the Michoacan Spears were nothing great. They were thick and bushy and matured earlier than the Colombians. Some were ready in late October, but most were ready in early November. The seeds were medium grey and plentiful. Like the Guerrero, they produced some unique spicy flavors when grown outdoors in the Pacific Northwest.




THAI
Highland Thai

Highland Thai was among the absolute sweetest and fruitiest herb on the planet. The delicate, sticky Sativa buds so efficiently tied to the little sticks were among the finest of herb.

The Highland Thai, I believe, is at least partially where the Haze variety originated. It was one of the finest Sativa plants grown for its finished product at 45?N.

It is from this variety that Juicy Fruit Thai came. Juicy Fruit Thai was one of the original (and very successful) P1's of my breed stock. Juicy Fruit Thai grew fast, long and very unevenly. Every week or so another side branch would erupt in a growth spurt, compete with and conquer any existing meristem (main stem), and become the temporary meristem until another faster shoot overtook it. The leaves were very long and slender, containing as many as 13 leaflets, and deeply contoured.

The Juicy Fruit Thai took anywhere from one to 19 weeks in the indoor bud cycle to finish. Outdoors, the Juicy fruit was smokable, but undeveloped and leafy, by late September. Small buds developed during October and would ripen and swell during November. The longest I was ever capable of growing Juicy Fruit outdoors was until mid-December, in a greenhouse, and the plant could have gone on longer.

The primary drawback to growing the Highland Thai, after its leafiness, was its hermaphroditism. Though few seeds were found, and plants grown from the seeds produced only minor quantities of seed, all of the product was hermaphroditic. Also, many of the male flowers were sterile on some of the plants, or on certain parts of certain plants.

Out of all of the varieties that I have worked with at 45?N, this Thai produced some of the most powerful herb. This stuff was purely cerebral, yet mentally devastating in quantity, with absolutely no ceiling. Once, a seasoned smoker friend and I tested how far we could go with the homegrown Juicy Fruit. I recall making it to the 14th bong hit and being completely incapable of continuing. My coordination and depth perception were so skewed that I was unable to physically conquer the bong! The experience rivaled that of taking too much LSD, causing an incapacitation of the psychedelic kind. Yet, it was also uniquely enjoyable, entertaining and educational at the same time. I had sparkly eyes for a day or two afterward.

The aroma was a super-sweet fruity tropical punch and the flavor expressed itself both in the bud and the smoke.

Chocolate Thai

The Chocolate Thai was another being entirely. Chocolate Thai came in larger wrapped sticks of a deep, rich, roasted coffee color and a coffee-chocolate aroma that was heavenly. It is my uncertain estimation that the Chocolate Thai was a lowland variety.

The imported product itself was unique not only in its aroma and flavor but in its strength as well. This was a dreamy, sleepy, narcotic high that was long lasting and consistent. The aroma possessed a deep, rich chocolate, appeal.

The seeds, many of which were pure black, were extremely small and round. They were few in numbers and only a few would sprout. The plants that did survive were terribly difficult to grow, and all were hermaphroditic. The leaves were long, dark and slender, with most sprouting trichomes early on. This strain was successfully crossed with the Oaxaca Highland to create what came to be known as Purple Thai.

Vietnamese

There was a bit of the Vietnamese herb around in the 70's, primarily early harvest which was mostly badly-cured leaf. Nonetheless, it had a quality all its own with a spicy, tangy flavor and crisp high. It was great joint pot, but I never grew any.

I heard rumors that a Vietnamese strain was cultivated in the Emerald Triangle in the 70's and early 80's.

Opium Soaked Herb

An element was added to certain shipments of Thai herb in the 70's: "early water." A by-product of the heroin trade, early water was the leftover water used to create the heroin from the raw opium. It contained all of the constituents of opium except most of the heroin.

The curing Thai herb was soaked in the water and redried to absorb the opiate alkaloids. The result was a high that was sought out by some, but more than most bargained for. A good wash was an enjoyable thing, but some were over-laced, which caused a dilemma for those who would start spinning after a few hits on a joint.




SPECIALTY HERBS
Black Magic African

This herb is the strongest ever. Although I have only smoked the Black Magic a very limited number of times, and I've never had more than a joint of my own, I feel it needs mention. I did once get to see a bag of this herb that belonged to someone else. It looked like rotted, black leaf, some leaves intact but crumpled, plus a powdery black shake. It had no particular odor other than sweet spicy moldy hay, and rolled best into thin pinjoints.

The smoke was slightly harsh, but with a very deep, rich flavor. I also recall that it produced lots of white smoke. Anyhow, this stuff was dangerous! I often questioned if it was truly pure herb. I have, however, sampled the same product from different sources at different times, all with the same story.

It was equatorial Black African, the supposed herb of some tribe, Pygmy group, or another equally incredible origin! It was likely an indigenous Central African herb. One pinjoint between three or four people was more than adequate. This was truly the most devastating and consciously inebriating herb I have ever smoked.

I do not recall ever passing out or losing consciousness, but I did have to let go in order to come back . This stuff alone could cause one to reach 3.5 pluses on the Shulgin psychedelic rating scale!

I never was able to acquire seeds from the Black African, though I have tried. It is one of the few indigenous strains that I am interested in working with.

Durban Poison

Durban herb has reached semi-commercial levels in the past. All of the South African herb that has made it to market that I have tried has been a bit too powerful and speedy. I always get that heart racing effect similar to the Jamaican. There are, however, very many people who enjoy a good carnival ride herb, and Durban is a very powerful choice, indeed.

The seeds of Durban that I grew during the early to mid-80's produced medium/tall Sativas with spear shaped buds ? uniform plants in both structure and finished product. Although production was good, the flavor was a sharp, astringent, chemical odor that burned the nose and sinuses.

The high was intense and strong but not notably enjoyable, so the Durban was dropped from any further breeding work.

Venezuelan

There was some fine Venezuelan herb available briefly in the mid-1970's for between $50 to $70 an ounce. It was sort of like the better commercial Colombian or Mexican of the day, but it was a bright yellowish color and not as tightly bricked, making the buds fluffier than most other bricked shipments.

The smoke was sweet, then spicy on the exhale ? evidence of a good cure. The head was also a bit more pleasant than the more commercial varieties.

Unfortunately, I was never able to grow any of the many seeds available from the Venezuelan. I remain curious as to how they would fare both indoor and out.

Indian Elephant & Buddha Stick

There was a small supply of Indian tied stick pot available at the end of the 70's and the beginning of the 80's. These sticks were characterized by their large size compared to the smaller Thai Stick.

The Buddha stick was lighter colored and sweeter with a distinct juniper flavor. It was very stimulating to the palate. The Elephant stick was the largest tied sticks, some up to an ounce each, and darker. Of the two, I preferred the Buddha due to its being more cerebral and heady, but the Elephant stick was a fine and powerful product as well.

I was able to grow some of the seeds from the Buddha stick. It produced a pungent smelling herb of the juniper/licorice flavor. Most of the plants grew medium bushy, and most, but not all, were hermaphroditic. The harvest time was medium as well, 10 to 12 weeks indoors, very late October to November outdoors at 45?N.

I called the product Gin Blossom and grew a bit of her in the late 70's and early 80's. It was not until I replicated the flavor in the Blueberry lines that I retired the Gin Blossom strain.

Panama Red

From what I've gathered, Panama Red comes from any number of brash entrepreneurs who have damned the tides of oppression and grown copious amounts of primarily good old Colombian Red seeds in the wonderfully situated country of Panama, or any of her many isles.

Located a mere eight or nine degrees north of the equator, this tropical paradise has a coast on both the Pacific or the Caribbean Sea, without much distance between them, but a lot of elevation. The Panama Red that I am accustomed to was similar to the Colombian Red, but airier ? not as compressed. It had a unique island flavor to it, with a spicy/sweet Sativa rush. Some called it the Tequila of herb, as it produced a high that greatly lowered inhibitions, creating a desire to consume more until it was too late!

For some drinkers, the Panama Red did not mix too well with alcohol, but for most it was a pleasant party high.

I did grow some seeds of Panama Red on more than one occasion. The plants were of the medium bushy character of the Colombian Red, with a little more hermaphroditism, and very long flower cycle (12 weeks indoor, late November outdoors). Unfortunately, however, this was at the same time that I was also growing the famed Highland Thai and new Afghan plants that were so unique, new and powerful, and the Panama Red became neglected.




HASHISH
Moroccan

Moroccan hash is the North African staple. It appears anywhere from deep brown to golden yellow and has a spicy leather flavor to it. Almost all Moroccan hash is screened and pressed. Though lower in potency than most black hash, this commercial offering costs less and tends to be more readily available through the years.

Moroccan plants are shorter and designed to grow tightly together, producing a single hemp-like stalk and a fat and dense single cola at the top. It is an apparent Sativa/Indica cross.

Lebanese Red and Blonde

Lebanese is another Sativa/Indica cross of short stature and density. A bit shorter and bushier than the Moroccan, it had a dark reddish hue.

The legendary Red Lebanese hash holds its own place. Red Leb had the distinct pine/juniper flavor and aroma, with a tangy spice leather to the exhaled smoke. It was sharp on the sinuses and nasal passages.

Most Red Leb hash was screened and pressed, except for the legendary Red Lebanese Honey Oil. The famed oil, only available to me from 1973-77, was in a class all of its own. The oil had a sharp juniper/cedar smell to it. It was the most powerful, lung expansive cannabis product that I had ever encountered. We would buy these glass oil pipes simply to find them useless, as no one could hold even the smallest toke of this stuff.

The oil had to be smeared onto a rolling paper or the side of a cigarette, or it had to be chased into a pile of herb with a flame from below. It was truly some of the finest. The home-grown isomerized oils of the 80's were pale in comparison to the great Red Leb.

Lebanese Blonde, the "working person's hash," was a lower grade of hash than the Red, and quantities were less expensive as well. It was less dense, making grams appear larger and giving the illusion of economy. Good Blonde had character, a spicy/woody flavor and aroma, plus a clean, woody taste. The high was a bit more than the Red, furthering the appeal to working people.

Nepalese temple balls

The Buddhists have a saying: "May all beings be happy." They also have a hash to back it up with: black finger rubbings from high in the Himalayas. This was some of my all-time favorite.

Nepalese is among the most cerebral of hashish. A strong yet pleasant head journey packed in every puff. This is some of the happiest hash I have experienced. The taste is spicy/fruity/earthen and among the most enjoyable of hash flavors. Most Nepalese hash is from rubbings, although I have heard from travelers to the area that screened and pressed varieties are available.

Simply put: Nepalese Temple Ball is some of the happiest, fruitiest and most pleasantly flavorful, highest quality hash that I have ever experienced.

Afghanistan & Hindu Kush

Rolling off the great crest of the Himalayas to the west and to the north are an apex of mountainous zones that define the northern borders of Afghanistan and Pakistan. Squished among these is the little region of Kashmir and the Hindu Kush mountains. This area may well be the oldest hashish producing area in the world, perhaps the birthplace of hash!

The plants of the area, the Indica variety, have been manipulated and bred by humans since antiquity. Short, dense and stout, with wide, dark leaves, these plants make the best of their high mountain, short-seasoned environment. They were bred to produce large amounts of easily detachable glandular resin heads, ideal for hashish production. These areas incorporate both rubbed, screened and pressed methods of hashish production.

Afghan hash, and the Indica strain for that matter, possess a much more sedative, dreamy, narcotic effect compared to the Sativa. This is true of the Afghan and Hindu Kush plants grown in the Pacific Northwest since 1978.

I believe more Indicas should be made into hashish, which is where the finer qualities of the Indica appear.

A quantity of Afghan seed was smuggled to the Emerald Triangle in 1978. Commercial production of the strain began shortly after that. There may have been earlier trials with Afghan seed in the region prior to 1978, but none ever made it to commercial production quantities or to public market.




THE ISLANDS
Hawaiian

Hawaiian a true classic. There is something special about a good island herb, and Hawaiian is among the best. When properly grown outdoors it has a wonderful and unique bouquet of fruity spice, similar to the sweetness of the fine Thai, but with a kind of tangy taste.

Good Hawaiian herb has always been a devastatingly powerful experience for me. It is very psychedelic and internally focused, contemplative and overpoweringly meditative. A Walk with the King, a Dance with the Queen, and a sunset on the beach! Aah... Hawaiian!

I have tried to equal the Hawaiian experience outdoor on the mainland, and indoors, with no success. Everything I have grown from Hawaiian stock turned out to be nowhere near the quality of the parent stock. This is true for three generations of trials. The product from Hawaiian seed was equal to the best plants grown from mid-quality Colombian stock!

This led me to a hypothesis about Hawaii: that just about any stock grown in Hawaii will turn out to be of unique and relatively high quality. Hawaii just happens to be one of those special places, I suppose.

All breeding attempts with Hawaiian stock were dumped from my garden by 1983. It was a pretty and robust plant though, and also quite productive. Just not all that impressive when grown outside its homeland.

Jamaican Lion's Herb

It has been on rare occasion that I have sampled truly enjoyable Jamaican herb. These rare samples came directly from friends who knew growers there. It was similar to the Hawaiian experience, but with more of a take-your-breath-away feeling of excitement.

The problem I have encountered with the commercial Jamaican is that it is too damned strong and speedy! Jamaican is renowned for its lively herb, for which I can vouch. It is a heartlifting herb and I have a sensitive heart. So I am careful with the samples of the commercial Jamaican ganja that I try.

Much like Hawaiian, the Jamaican strains are perhaps best expressed in their homeland, because I have had little success in producing an adequate example. Both indoors and out, the Jamaican behaves and ends up much the same as mid-level Colombian. Perhaps all Island herb is unique in this fashion.

Philippine Thrilla from Manilla.

The Philippines are another Island chain renowned for producing great herb. I once possessed a small quantity of what was supposed to be Philippine herb in the late 1970's. It had a strong citrus aroma that produced a spicy smoke and a heady high. I never grew the strain, so I have nothing to report on the plants. The herb was a light green Sativa and seeded, so hopefully someone has had experience with this strain.

http://www.cannabisculture.com/v2/articles/4280.html

Yes on 19!
 
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