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    Research Chemical Opioids? 
    #1
    Are there any out there? All I can seem to find are the standard phenethylamines and tryptamines.
     

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    #2
    Bluelight Crew Too many doses's Avatar
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    Opiates are tightly controlled even noncommon ones. The analouge act and the fact that most opiates are controlled anyway adds the situation.
     

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    #3
    Bluelighter Geist89's Avatar
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    There's a lot of gray-area legal fentanyl analogs, but good luck finding them.
     

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    #4
    There's a lot of non-controlled opiate RCs. In fact there are several I know of that could in no way fall under the analog law (late for work so will name them in the future if req). From memory, one of these opiate RCs is a steroid (cf testosterone striucture)
    These are complex substances though. I doubt RC suppliers would stock these as IIRC the precursors are just too expensive.
     

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    #5
    Bluelighter rath's Avatar
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    Only legal fentanyl analogue I've had was 3-Allylfentanyl good luck finding it. I only got it by a very slim chance.
     

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    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by rath View Post
    Only legal fentanyl analogue I've had was 3-Allylfentanyl good luck finding it. I only got it by a very slim chance.
    That analogue is absolutely not legal under the analogue laws.

    FWIW, there are some legal ones, but the only way you are likely to get those is by synthing them yourself, which requires some pretty advanced chemistry knowledge as they are often fairly complex molecules. I've read some very interesting reports from chemists that have extracted pure 7-hydroxy-mitragynine from Kratom. Don't even think about buying it from one of the online vendors though. They are ALL bunk from everything I've seen. The real deal is an extremely potent opioid though.
     

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    #7
    Polydrug users and recreational drug users make up the bulk of the RC market, and they want stimulants and hallucinogens. Non-stimulant, non-hallucinogen drugs that have made the RC rounds didn't last long for the most part.

    An RC site that sold a physically addictive substance would be shut down and prosecuted much faster and harder than the Operation Webtryp guys IMHO. The stigma surrounding junk dealers is harsh in the US.

    Analogue Act only covors CI & CII analogues as defined by the ridiculously underdefined definitions of the Act. Of the opioids that are controlled below CI & CII in the US, there aren't many that don't have a catch all in CII (Example: Hydrocodone is CIII when used in a combination product, but it is CII by itself or in bulk, same with Codeine and others).

    A legal opioid RC would almost have to be a relative of a synthetic class; a Benzomorphan, Bemidone, etc. Some of the Buprenorphine relatives sound interesting; though without speculating, I don't foresee the day opioids hit the RC market.
     

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    #8
    It think its a number of factors really. Part of it is that many opiods require advanced synthesis skills and expensive and or obscure precursors. Further most of the uncontrolled opiods are extremely potent thus you must sell them as impure products for safety reasons. Because of this potency you increase the risk of OD. Further because of the higher risk of death associated with opiods versus hallucinogens and stimulants you have less individuals willing to gamble on a serious lawsuit or criminal charges when a junkie does over do it. Also many vendors are well aware that after several deaths the government would crack down with extreme force in a short amount of time, essentially ending the entire industry. These reasons all support why kratom is legal, very little OD risk, not horribly addictive as leaf, perceived as less dangerous because of its non synthetic nature, etc.

    Personally I think you would have to be fucking nuts to play with anything as potent as fentanyl in any form besides a professionally assembled controlled release dosage. Even then its rather sketchy for non-tolerant users.
    I think lack of demand as Tchort cited is most definitely not a factor, plenty of RC customers would love to get faded for cheap on novel drugs.
     

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    #9
    Bluelighter lenses's Avatar
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    If people are gonna synth an addictive drug , they're gonna synth something well known, not something EXTREMELY obscure, and almost unknown as how to use it, as well as dosages being so small you can barely see it...

    Shame. It seems people who like RC's with a passion tend to shun any addictive drugs IME.
     

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    #10
    Bluelight Crew Too many doses's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lenses View Post
    If people are gonna synth an addictive drug , they're gonna synth something well known, not something EXTREMELY obscure, and almost unknown as how to use it, as well as dosages being so small you can barely see it...

    Shame. It seems people who like RC's with a passion tend to shun any addictive drugs IME.
    This is basically was what I was saying. Even weird opiates that aren't common are in the CSA, most of these also require either serious chem knowledge and lab equipment, or the precursors are listed chemicals. An opiate that isn't scheduled probably is more complicated to synth as one never really see's designer opiates and everyone knows this is all we would see if it was easy to make.
     

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    #11
    I think lack of demand as Tchort cited is most definitely not a factor, plenty of RC customers would love to get faded for cheap on novel drugs.
    The demand for any opioid is very high among the general population. Any opioid, partial agonist full agonist, natural, semi-synthetic or synthetic, any family, analogue, etc.

    However, most people do not know a whole lot about drugs, even ones they use every day for extended periods. The odds of John Q Public stumbling onto a Piritramide/Metopon/Bemidone analogue on a Dutch/NZ/Chinese chemical distribution website (or random threads buried in sites like this one from the regular RC site groupies) are slim to nil. Even if you present someone with information about a drug that is completely accurate and verifiable, they are not very inclined to use it unless someone they know has done it, especially if it is obscure and even more so if it is a powder rather than a professionally produced tablet.

    This is why, during the Heroin shortages of the late '70s/early '80s in parts of the US, drugs like 3-MethylFentanyl, A-M-Fentanyl, MPPP, etc were sold as Heroin and not what they were- even though, if the information was known to the consumers, many would probably have liked these better than Diamorphine (given Americans' insatiable appetite for synthetics).

    If the chemical made it past the Pepsi challange of the RC-groupie community (made up of psychonauts, tweekers and ravers apparently), passed around at universities/colleges, and onto sites like this one, opiophile, Erowid, Lycaeum, etc, this last stage would be where it could potentially become popular among recreational users/chippers/teenagers, soon after this the first OD happens, John Q Publics parents and coach and teachers make an outcry about internet designer drugs, DdEeAa steps in to emergency schedule the chemical before it ever really takes off. European governments most likely follow suit. Drug is dead in the water before more than a few thousand people bought it.

    Has happened several times (and is in the process of happening with Mephedrone right now). Though this is assuming it ever gets that far.
     

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    #12
    Bluelighter Mr Blonde's Avatar
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    Herkinorin sounds like an interesting opioid chem to try.
     

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    Herkinorin 
    #13
    I would like to order some Herkinorin, sound too good.
     

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    #14
    Bluelighter QuasiStoned's Avatar
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    ^^^
    I agree!
     

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    #15
    Herkinorin is an opioid analgesic that is an analogue of the natural product Salvinorin A. It was discovered in 2005 during structure-activity relationship studies into neoclerodane diterpenes, the family of chemical compounds of which Salvinorin A is a member.[1]

    Unlike Salvinorin A which is a selective κ-opioid agonist with no significant μ-opioid receptor affinity, herkinorin is a μ-opioid agonist with more than 100x higher μ-opioid affinity and 50x lower κ-opioid affinity compared to Salvinorin A.[2][3] Herkinorin is a semi-synthetic compound, made from Salvinorin B, which is most conveniently made from Salvinorin A by deacetylation, as while both Salvinorin A and Salvinorin B are found in the plant Salvia divinorum, Salvinorin A is present in larger quantities.[4]

    Since it is highly selective for the mu opioid receptor, it is likely that herkinorin will be found to produce similar effects to other μ-opioid selective agonists in vivo, such as analgesia and sedation, along with side effects such as nausea, itching, vomiting and respiratory depression which may be harmful or fatal. However unlike most μ-opioid agonists, herkinorin does not promote the recruitment of β-arrestin-2 to the intracellular domain of the μ-opioid receptor, or induce receptor internalisation.[5] This means that herkinorin may not produce tolerance and dependence in the same way as other opioids, although some development of tolerance through other mechanisms has been observed.[6]
    i love you salvia divinorum
     

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    #16
    Bump I like this idea
     

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    #17
    Bluelighter AfterGlow's Avatar
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    it's not an rc, but if you're looking for an unconventional opiod that can be purchased online, try kratom. I think it sucks, but some people seem to like it.
     

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    #18
    yeah they are out there, stuff like herkinorin, dermorphin, methopholine, zipeprol, there are even mitragynine analogs.
     

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    #19
    Ex-Bluelighter Gaian Planes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LawnChairSkank View Post
    Are there any out there? All I can seem to find are the standard phenethylamines and tryptamines.
    what the hell are you talking about 'the standard phenethylamine and tryptamiens'?

    The market is flooded with new compounds, friend. You're just sucking at looking for them
     

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    #20
    I just ordered a sample of dermorphin, Ill lets you know.
     

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    #21
    Herkinorin is a salvia analog that is a mu opiod agonist, instead of being a K opiod agonist. It is not an illegal analog yet, and you can find it on 'certain' RC websites.
     

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    #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Paregoric Kid View Post
    yeah they are out there, stuff like herkinorin, dermorphin, methopholine, zipeprol, there are even mitragynine analogs.
    1) Too good to be true 2) I seriously doubt the recreational potential of exogenous opioid peptides 3) Codeine with more unpleasant side effects 4) Korea's version of DXM.

    Thumbs down on all counts.

    Mitragynine, 7-A-Mitragynine and 7-HM would be much more interesting if they were available as a synthesized final product rather than a crude extract of dubious quality (which will contain different amounts of other Kratom alkaloids). 7-HydroxyMitragynine has the biggest potential of any listed here, but even it has the shortcomings of not coming as a pure product. Given the highly diverse amounts given for its relative potency, and the subtle differences in the alcohol extracts themselves, and especially the differences between the 3 mu-agonist alkaloids listed in dosage, I would imagine several overdoses would occur before popularity on the scale of other popular RC's like 2-CI, Methylone, etc.
     

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    #23
    Bluelighter rachamim's Avatar
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    Well, you will love my announcement soon TChort hahahaha. By the way, the onyl viable Kratom alkaloid is 7-hydroxy, the rest are nonsense for any opiate/opioid enthusiast.
     

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    #24
    one of the isomers of methopholine is 3x the strength of codeine and an analog of methopholine called 4-nitromethopholine is 20x the strength of codeine. there are many other interesting opioids out there.
    another interesting legal opioid is azaprocine, supposedly 25 times stronger than morphine.
     

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    #25
    Bluelighter Binge Artist's Avatar
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    ^Wow, the real life Paregoric Kid. I'd bet that 95% of Americans who have ever done a CWE are familiar with the expression:

    "fucking evil that they put that much tylenol in it"
    Last edited by Binge Artist; 11-02-2009 at 23:18.
     

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