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[dexforfood]

three weeks clean! Been going to NA meetings and keeping a strict lifestyle. I know 21 days doesn't sound amazing to most of you, but its insane for me. Now gotta work on 21 years.

Anyone that needs help that doesn't want to go to a rehab center, go to Narcotics Anonymous. They have been helping me out tremendously. I am a long term Benzo and Opiate addict. I didn't think I would ever make 2 days clean. I feel clear headed and more energetic then ever. Give it a shot, seriously.

I have gotten clean previously, I hope I don't mess it up again. I tend to let these 'one time' celebrations turn into month long binges. Slipping up even once will kick you in the ass.

 

[edarrin]

I'd say more like "once a month or (preferably) less." Once a week won't get you addicted ... but how long will it be before you're doing it twice a week, then three times, etc.?

If you've been able to maintain a long-term schedule of weekly usage, you're a stronger user than I am. I'm not saying it's impossible, but I'd say you're getting uncomfortably close to using on a level where you will start to develop physical addiction, with little room for error should you slip off your schedule.

I'd agree with this. Even then it will be hard to stick to it.

I know I certainly started as a 'chipper' for a number of years. However, I was really addicted even though I didn't use daily. 3-4 times a week for years. Then one day I made that connection (never claimed to be quick) that those pesky cold symtoms I was getting were miraculously cured by opiates.

Been struggling off and on for quite some time now. Someone in the beginning said "no oone ever starts out wanting to be addicted' which I think is very true. But opiates are sneaky. They will creep up and get most who venture there IME.

 

[rolls]

I have gotten clean previously, I hope I don't mess it up again. I tend to let these 'one time' celebrations turn into month long binges. Slipping up even once will kick you in the ass.

Thats the problem, most people can't use drugs like those responsibly, its just not physically possible, hence the only solution is to go clean forever. Most people do the once a month thing for a while, then slip up and start doing it every week or two, then weekly, then a couple of times a week, it might take 6 months or 2 years for this to happen, but it will happen to the majority.

If you have the contacts for Narc Anonymous and want to post some links up I'd be happy to add them to the main post.

 

[sunset117]

I wish my life was consumed by constant fentanyl intoxication. I hate it, I hate the high, I get sick, I'm throwing up all day from smoking it, my throat hurts from it, but I can't stop. It pains me to say, but I doubt I'll live another year. I have too much pride to go to rehab, so this is it

 

[Kenaz]

*raises hand*

I made a conscious decision to become a junky. It was necessary at the time for me. It's probably not that common though and not always the wisest of plans. Worked for me, but I wouldn't advise it.

I've encountered plenty of people who thought it was cool and elite to become addicted to opiates. Generally they were white college-educated kids who decided they didn't just want to read William S. Burroughs, Jim Carroll, etc. -- they wanted the street cred which comes with being a junkie. 8)

 

[djsim]

we should make a sticky on how to quit all differnt kinds of stuff, as in , what to do to combat cravings or relapses.. everyone could pipe in with their experiences

That's it... let's get it started then

***

METHAMPHETAMINE

My favorite DOC. I love this stuff. I love the high and the confidence it gives me... the times I'd take it would almost always turn into memorable weekends where I'd do something crazy like fuck a stripped in a club bathroom then win $1000 playing poker at the casino. It went hand in hand with my lifestyle when I was DJing in clubs too (hence the name djsim). I could get fuckd up and DJ all weekend.

But these are the happy memories. My brain always seems to filter out the unhappy memories... the hours I wasted waiting to score meth, the people I hung around, the fact my family disowned me becaquse of my extreme violence for 2 years (all good now), and especially the fact that I was shooting up the shit whenever I had the money to do so.

Getting clean wasn't easy. I started with an expe3nsive rehab place which really did nothing except waste my parent's money. So I cut down my usage until I was so tired of being a fuck up, I just cut off or lost contact with everyone I knew who used. I quit DJing and got out of nightclubs. I moved back in with my parents... in short, I got away from it all. And slowly, I started rebuilding my life. Everything started improving in life, and once that ball started rolling, it was easy to see why meth was best left alone. I've slipped a few times since I quit, but never again will I use meth recreationally. It still makes it hard for me to go out clubbing and enoy myself without being high, but that';s the price you pay for getting clean. You gotta get rid of all the old cues and triggers: and fuck the people you think are your friends, cos they aren't. They're acquaintances. If they still wanna hang with you when you're out of the scene then choose wisely. Personally I wanted to start fresh... I can handle being alone.

Anyway, hope this help those hooked on methamphetamine. I've never met a successful meth addict, so dont ever think you'll be the exception. And people who think they are just recreational users may be in for a shock and find they are addicts more than they'd like to believe.

Good luck

 

[rolls]

I have too much pride to go to rehab, so this is it

Surely its worth trying, start by telling a friend or family about the problem, then move on to treatment after that. If you don't have anyone to help you it can be a very hard process, having mates that understand and push you are a great resource.

Thanks, thread. I'll sure as hell heed the warnings!

Thats good to hear, whilst this thread will certainly not help some people, there are a few that will take advantage of the advice and even if its a minority its worth having.

 

[Mr Blonde]

View Post
I have too much pride to go to rehab, so this is it

As rolls said, it's definitely worth at least trying.

I empathize with you; pride can indeed be a mortal sin and it took me a long time, too long, to finally talk to someone so I could start getting the help I needed. Getting over that first obstacle can be hard, but if you want to take control of your life back you need to do it. Things can seem hopeless, but there is usually a way to get back on top.

 

[johanneschimpo]

Rehab is a paradoxical situation in my opinion:

If you absolutely do not want to get clean, going to rehab will not help you one bit.

Conversely, if you do want to get clean, you do not need rehab. All you need is willpower.

 

[GenericMind]

I disagree with that. I think some people that want to quit lack the willpower and need the assistance to succeed.

 

[johanneschimpo]

Thats the beauty of opinions.

 

[SmokeEm]

Apologies in advance for what is going to be multiple posts, but I'm drunk (read on some more about this), and quoting multiple peeps in one post is too much to handle at the moment.... gotta love the "Quote" button at times like this.

...it can ruin lives, destroy careers....

First off, in my experience, the best guard against serious addiction, is to get a career/job, and be serious about it. Don't make time off work getting high a habit (granted, I did and still do this from time to time, but not regularly - if you are serious about getting by, and for that matter, having cash for your next score, you need to take work seriously). I know this saved me from going toooo far down the road.

Codeine

If you are already mildly addicted to something stronger, days off using codeine (being aware of the deadly properties of APAP/Paracetamol, and complications of Ibuprofen, and thus being sensible of course), will probably enforce the habit, but will also help to minimise the physical addiction, IMO. Probably not really worth my mentioning, to be honest (drunk, as I've mentioned...read on)

Methampehetamine - Crystal, Ice, speed

Sneaky one, that. In my experience, not too addictive nasally, but once done with a needle, it's best that you don't have a regular hookup.

Coke is the same, if you have a regular supply, don't shoot it - very addictive, need shots every 30 mins at least. Though it is mostly psychological, and less physical, its still a sneaky one...

Benzos:
Valium (diazepam)
Temazepam
Clonazepam
Lots more

I should just mention here, that Alprazolam (spelling?) better known as Xanax, is highly addictive, just do a search here on BL. Perhaps more "overtly" addictive than others, in that it happens quicker, is noticed quicker, and is shorter in terms of withdrawal than for example Diazepam.....

Diazepam is possibly the worst offender, but don't be fooled BENZO WITHDRAWAL CAN KILL YOU (if you are addicted enough) - one of the very few classes that can - opioid W/D is no doubt painful, but rarely deadly. Check out various threads by negrogesic on how extreme benzo wd can be. (Will try to dig up a link later, but they were terror stories)
Edit: Do a search for posts "started by: negrogesic" and "keywords: diazepam" for a bunch of stories - there's one in particular I'm trying to find, and will post it as soon as I find it, but they all give good reason to take care with benzos.....
Edit #2: This thread: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=183604
has some craziness from Benzo WD
....needless to say, I can't stop quoting this guy - his "fall from grace" (he was a moderator) has shown me a thing or twenty about benzo dangers..... as I reach for another valium... hmm
Edit #3 Looks like negrogesic is still on BL, at least this year - great to see man, for a while there I didn't know where you got to. Horror stories still haunt tho, and I'm gonna dig up what I thought was the worst, as I think it worthwhile 4 this thread...


....and my original post continues....
I just feel lucky that my access to benzos is limited (if I lived in Hong Kong or India, this would of course be a much different story)

suboxone or methadone.... they can be just as hard to break as you drug of choice.

From my own experience, and many other's BL posts, suboxone (buprenorphine or bupe) is not the hardest to kick, but (from other's anecdotes) methodone is. Chances are that if you are really having a hard time kicking bupe, it probably isnt holding you that well either, and methodone is the only thing that will.... though I wouldn't recommend it. Bupe is so long lasting, that you can taper gradually, for example taking 90% of your dose every second day for a month, then moving on to that steady dose, and so on. For me, I was even able to do this with a 25% reduction, without noticing too much. 'done on the other hand sounds like a bitch if you just reduce by 5%.

I also found that much of what I had ended up using heroin for (anxiety, depression, aside from addiction) was alleviated more by bupe than dope had done for me - rather than remove myself from these things (as dope did), it removed these things from me, and gave me time to sort them out while I slowly got off it. Not without setbacks, and the occasional W/Ding on purpose just so I could feel my next shot of dope, but nevertheless, for me, overall it worked.

I highly recommend you avoid opiates if you suffer from anxiety or depression as when you quit theres a very high likelihood you will worsen the depression making it far harder to quit.

100% on the money.

Now for two drugs I think were missed.

Alcohol!

Us junkies tend to dismiss this, or at leas think an alcoholic is an alcoholic, but a junkie is not. I have been fortunate enough to be able to take myself away from the opioid scene, by keeping a job long enough to move to another country, in which I have no contacts (though I occasionally try to make some). As a result, whenever I feel like a fix, which I cannot get, I turn to alcohol. And this has become more frequent of late (which is why this post has taken me thus far the better part of an hour to write).

And as with Benzos, its one of the few drugs that withdrawal from can kill you. And it is so socially accepted, that it is almost impossible to remove yourself from. Moving country will only help if you move somewhere its illegal, and even then I'm sure theres a trade for it. I cant help but think that if I still had access to opioids, perhaps I'd be more together than I am now....

The second one of note
- whilst addiction/dependance to it is not really that bad, is...
weed.

Whilst I think it is BullS**t that it is a "gateway drug" (soooo many people do it regularly and never touch anything stronger), if you are the sort of person who *is* going to experiment with heroin for example, then getting yourself in the habit of smoking weed daily/hourly/etc, is definitely setting you up for the dependant "attitude", which you can easily bring with you when you start taking heroin more than once a year.......

 

[SmokeEm]

I think a thread like this would have made me second guess myself before I decided to start using opiates. But I can't do shit about that now.

I disagree..... you'd already have second guessed yourself. This would have been your 3rd, 4uth or 11th guess...... my point being, that no-one ever does opioids without knowing their addictive properties. Chances are, you would have done it anyway, I certainly know I did. But perhaps you'd be better prepared for how to kick it when you decide to.

...which reminds me, about the Benzo W/D --> Death thing in my last post. Kicking it MUST be done carefully - if you are in reaaaaly deep, then whatever you do, dont be a hero and go cold-turkey. A serious benzo W/D needs a serious commitment to tapering

 

[SmokeEm]

Another thing that people should be aware of (and that I was not until it happened) is that even if you are considering that an addiction is something you are comfortable with (heh, I had that kind of mentality at first, I just didn't care I guess) the problem is that the euphoria will go away down the road. Then you're really fucked.

Which is when moving countries (if you are lucky enough to be able to), can help. I'd been clean of all opioids for 12 months until last time I went back home. Then, with the usual hookups, what I'd go through in three days lasted three weeks (of daily use), with much better highs.

The only way such an escape can be made, of course, is as per my first post - be serious about your job/carreer, even if only so you know you can afford the next fix. Of course it comes at a cost. Now I have to weigh up the pros of going home (I miss home, and I miss heroin), versus the cons of going home (I miss good heroin so much the first thing I'm going to do when I get there is score)....... such is the way of the addictive mind. What can I say, do as I say, not as I (will) do......but perhaps my "saving grace" (or unjustified justification) is that its better than being an alcoholic...hmmm

 

[JumboZoom]

Thanks Rolls, it sure can't hurt thats for sure! I think there are a certain group of users who could benifit from and avoid serious addiction just by educating them. Then you got others like me. My dad was a dope fiend so I for sure knew what was on the other end but nothing has been able to derail this shit for me. I shot heroin for about 15 years and have been on 120mg of methadone since 1993. Plus a ton of other things along the way!When I was released from prison my parole officer had me go straight on the meth maint. because I was dirty for H when I got out of the joint. Anyhoo, I think that different things work for different people and for some of us nothing works and we end up dead from the shit!!. My journey has been the same ol nightmare that most every serious junky goes thru but nothing has made me stop, yet. I been thru many treatment programs both in-patient and out-patient.... I just don't know, but one thing is certain. I would never knock you for trying to help someone from taking this path, even if it helps just one person then you have done a great thing man!! Keep doing what you are doing. Knowledge will never hurt anyone

 

[rolls]

The only way such an escape can be made, of course, is as per my first post - be serious about your job/carreer, even if only so you know you can afford the next fix.

This is a good point, I'm an engineering student and have had a few great job offers and still working at a place that lets me name my hours. Its a great distraction and very rewarding when I get things to work, gives you a natural buzz.

However it is also very stressful come exam time which can tempt you, but I think having something to aim for and achieve gives you the satisfaction you need, it also keeps you busy.

 

[Abilities]

Tips for staying clean
Get a decent job or go to university/college, if you find something you like (most people will) then stick with it and put as much effort as you can into it, its a great distraction and when you learn something you can get great satisfaction out of it, a great mood elevator and gives you a natural buzz.

Having a regular job also forces good habbits into you, eg not staying up to silly hours for no reason and you can't rock up to work with a bad hangover/comedown.

Yeah um actually none of that is true. Especially with opiates. I dont think you've been through much if you think addicts just need to get a job or go to school. Most people who are addicted are ALREADY in school or working. See the thing about opiates is theyre good to do ANYWHERE. They help u fall asleep, and they also wake u up. No other drug does that. Once you're addicted you use constantly throughout work or school.

Plus even if you dont, youre just telling some addict to up and go get a job or get into college?? LoL its not that easy.

 

[rolls]

No but I'm saying it does help some people, it helped me so just because it didn't help you think I should remove it?

Of course its not easy, but once you are clean it helps to have some goal or something to achieve, if you sit around at home all day on the dole its going to be even harder.

 

[Mr Blonde]

Yeah um actually none of that is true. Especially with opiates. I dont think you've been through much if you think addicts just need to get a job or go to school. Most people who are addicted are ALREADY in school or working. See the thing about opiates is theyre good to do ANYWHERE. They help u fall asleep, and they also wake u up. No other drug does that. Once you're addicted you use constantly throughout work or school.

Plus even if you dont, youre just telling some addict to up and go get a job or get into college?? LoL its not that easy.

He's giving tips for staying clean and personally I think having something to occupy your time and mind when dealing with the psychological WD symptoms is a great idea. I've only ever been through mild WD compared to what a lot of others on here have been through, but putting myself fully into music and working and reading helped me out.

 

[rolls]

I'd really appreciate it if someone from north america could post up some 'getting help in US' links as Australia is certainly a minority on this forum.