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Thread: dexedrine/adderall conversion

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    dexedrine/adderall conversion 
    #1
    Capsule
    Considering that adderall is dl-amphetamine and dexedrine is just d-amphetamine and since l-amphetamine is pretty much inactive i think, does that mean 10mg of adderall is equal to 5mg of dexedrine?
     

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    #2
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    good question...
    i would have to say no. d-amp is d-amp is d-amp is 2.5 in a 10mg pill. correct me if I'm wrong.
     

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    #3
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    In terms of the clinical pharmacology of it, I can't be of much help, but I know that dex is supposedly the strongest of the 3 ADD meds.
     

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    Bluelighter fairnymph's Avatar
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    A 5 mg pill of adderall contains 3.75 mg of dextroamphetamine and 1.25 mg of levoamphetamine (levoamphetamine is not recreational -- so if you took 10 mg of straight l-amphetamine you would not get fucked up at all).
    A 5 mg pill of dexedrine contains 5 mg dextroamphetamine.
    Thus, the ratio is 3.75:5. This means that you need to take 4 adderall to get the same effect as you would from 3 dexedrine (4*3.75=15 mg, 3*5=15 mg). And so on...
     

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    #5
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    what does l-amp do then?
    ebola
    np: coil

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    #6
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    nice math skillz there fairy
     

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    #7
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    ^ lol oops soree i meant to say "fairnymph". heh my bad, yeah no more typing while stoned for me
     

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    #8
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    no.
    each 5 mg pill contains 1.25 mg of d-amp
    from rxlist.com
    [quote]A single entity amphetamine product combining the neutral sulfate salts of dextroamphetamine and amphetamine, with the dextroisomer of amphetamine saccharate and 6, I-amphetamine aspartate.
    EACH TABLET CONTAINS 5mg 10mg 20mg 30mg
    Dextroamphetamine Saccharate 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
    Amphetamine Aspartate 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
    Dextroamphetamine Sulfate USP 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
    Amphetamine Sulfate USP 1.25 mg 2.5 mg 5 mg 7.5 mg
    Total amphetamine base equivalence 3.13 mg 6.3 mg 12.6 mg 18.8 mg

    5mg is the actual recreation dose(10mg pill), right? Then the amount of d-amp is 25% of the pill number.
    I'm kinda fucked up and really confused now...
    [ 31 May 2002: Message edited by: Dr_Rolls_MD[MA] ]
    [ 31 May 2002: Message edited by: Dr_Rolls_MD[MA] ]
     

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    #9
    Bluelighter fairnymph's Avatar
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    ebola! -- Good question. Well, while the l-amphetamine doesn't do much on its own (at least recreationally), it seems that there is a synergy between l and d amph, so that the combo of the two feels different subjectively from just straight d-amphetamine.
    Quoting myself from an earlier post in Other Drugs, here is an explanation of stereoisomers/chirality, using the example of ephedrine and pseudoephedrine:
    [quote]
    Ephedrine and pseudoephedrine have the same molecular forumula -- C10H15NO -- however they are stereoisomers of each other. In my favorite chemistry professor's terms, this means that ephedrine and pseudoephedrine are "non-superimposable mirror images of each other". Another analogy would be left and right hands -- stereoisomers are like left and right hands -- you can see they are very similar but not exactly the same.
    Ephedrine is the (+) or S isomer, and when exposed to polarized light, the molecule rotates counterclockwise.
    Pseudoephedrine is the (-) or R isomer, and when exposed to polarized light, the molecue rotates clockwise.
    Chirality is the term that describes this property of molecules to rotate in one way or the other when exposed to polarized light.
    Check out this this link to compare 3-D images of ephedrine and pseudoephedrine.
    Now, let's take a look at the l and d isomers of the aforementioned amphetamines (this applies to amphetamine, methamphetamine, and MDMA). In all cases, the d isomer is the more potent isomer (note: this is not the case with all chemicals, it just happens to be so for the amphetamines in question). The l isomer has no recreational value on its own. In the cases of amphetamine and methamphetamine, it is most desirable to have an enantiomerically pure product -- i.e., you just want the d-amph/meth, because the greater the percentage of your amph/meth that is d, the stronger your mixture will be. Most street amph/meth consists solely of the d isomer. If you get amph/meth that is not very strong, despite seeming pure and being crystalline, it is probably because some or all of the product is the l isomer. I know someone who once mistakenly made a batch of l isomer meth.
    In the case of MDMA, the situation is slightly more complicated. As with the other amphetamines, isolated l-MDMA is not at all recreational. However, pure d-MDMA on its own feels a helluva lot like MDA/methamphetamine. The racemate version of MDMA (racemate = a 50/50 mixture of the l and d isomers) is the type almost always seen on the street, and somehow, the l-isomer adds to the effects of the MDMA. There is a synergy created by the presence of the l-MDMA (even though as you recall it has no effect on its own) in combination with d-MDMA. In fact, it is the presence of the l-MDMA that creates the unique 'lovey' feeling of racemate MDMA.
    Adderall, being a combo of l and d amphetamine, is somewhere in between methamphetamine and MDMA in terms of how much is gained by the addition of some l-isomer. As with MDMA, there is some synergy with the addition of l-amphetamine, but the extra effects are not nearly as substantial. Adderall tends to be smoother (with a better, more gradual comedown) and lasts longer than dexedrine.
    Dr. Rolls -- You aren't thinking about the drug enantiomerically. You have to take isomers into account.
    For 5 mg of Adderall:
    Dextroamphetamine Saccharate 1.25 mg
    Amphetamine Aspartate 1.25 mg
    Dextroamphetamine Sulfate USP 1.25 mg
    Amphetamine Sulfate USP 1.25 mg
    d-amph sacc. contains 1.25 mg d-amph
    amph asp (racemate, so 50% d-amph and 50% l-amph) contains 0.625 mg d-amph and 0.625 l-amph
    d-amph sulf contains 1.25 mg d-amph
    amph sulf (again, a racemate) contains 0.625 d-amph and 0.625 l-amph
    So total d-amph in 5 mg Adderall = 1.25 + 1.25 + 0.625 + 0.625 = 3.75 mg
    [ 31 May 2002: Message edited by: fairnymph ]
     

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    #10
    Capsule
    Wow, I couldn't have asked for a better explanation than that! Thanx a lot!
     

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    #11
    Lightbulb
    I have to agree with fairnymph. Here is a background statement from a study on the efficacy of adderall.
    "We report on a controlled trial of a mixed amphetamine salts compound (Adderall, dextroamphetamine sulfate, dextro-, levoamphetamine sulfate, dextroamphetamine aspartate, levoamphetamine aspartate, and dextroamphetamine saceharate) in the treatment of adult attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD)."
    So for each listing that just says amphetamine (no dextro or levo), you have to assume it is racemic.
     

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    #12
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    fairnymph:
    you're good! I'm not suck'n up or anything, but that post ripped everyone up like shrapnel. well, that's all, I may be a bit overly kind right now. The adderall, hyro, valium buzz is blasting me. Rest assured, I'll come back tomorrow and say the same thing. hahaha. i'm sorry, i'm fucked right now. I'm very bad, for being a goddamn moderator setting a terrible example...sorry, but SEriOUSly.
    [ 01 June 2002: Message edited by: Dr_Rolls_MD[MA] ]
     

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    #13
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    Hmmm...
    Could differences in isomer ratios help explain why some MDMA pills seem "speedier" than others?
    ebola
    np: converge

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    #14
    Bluelighter fairnymph's Avatar
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    ebola! -- It's unlikely that different isomeric proportions explain how some pills are speedy/some are smacky etc. This is because all the commonly used routes of synthesis produce only racemate MDMA.
    A better explanation for differences across pills: not all pills are pure MDMA. Speedy pills -- MDA (or MDA + MDMA), MDMA + speed, MDMA +caffeine or ephedrine, BZP etc. Smacky pills -- MDE, DXM, K, MDMA + K, etc.
     

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