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Thread: Tramadol and Suboxone

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    Tramadol and Suboxone 
    #1
    Question
    I know there are many threads about Suboxone but I didn't know if this would pertain to Tramadol since it's an "atypical" opioid.

    I've been a daily Morphine user from quite a while now. I was recently prescribed Suboxone so I could get on the maintenance.

    Anyways, if I took 100 mg of Tramadol this morning at 10:00 AM, would I be ok taking my Suboxone tonight at say 8:00 PM? I just don't want to induce withdrawals or anything, which is why I'm asking.

    The guy in this report at Erowid said he has no problem taking Sub and Tramadol together.

    Thanks in advance for your replies.
    Last edited by Captain.Heroin; 19-02-2010 at 11:22. Reason: added prefix
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    #2
    Bluelighter Mr Blonde's Avatar
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    So you've stopped taking the morphine already and are waiting to dose your suboxone?
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    #3
    Yeah, I've stopped taking the Morphine. I just popped a couple Tramadol to hold me over until I can take my sub. But I guess I might as well just have taken Morphine if Tramadol cannot be taken with Bupe.
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    #4
    Trams with Subs are fine. I've done it before.

    RPG
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    #5
    Tramadol after suboxone and suboxone after tramadol are two completely different things, so people giving him advice, can you please specify? I'm not sure, to be honest with you, if it was precipitate withdrawals or not, but hopefully someone can answer. Because rpg could have taken tramadol after suboxone and be fine, but if she took suboxone after tramadol, it may be a completely different story, just want people to be more specific for you.
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    #6
    the precipitated wd's would have been from taking the sub while still taking the morphine.

    as for bupe and tramadol together, i am prescribed both and have taken them in vice versa order with no troubles.

    i am generally on one or both daily
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    #7
    ^ That's good to know. It doesn't make sense to me why you can take Tramadol and Suboxone together but not Suboxone and other opiates. I'd think anything that binds to the mu-receptors would be antagonized by the Sub.
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    #8
    Thumbs up
    Dude Tramdol and Suboxone together kick ass! Subs + Trams =nice
    Last edited by JahRed24x; 23-10-2009 at 20:44.
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    #9
    I've taken Subs and Trams both ways.. before and after subs, never had any problems. Sorry i didn't specify that. It is strange how subs don't affect Trams.

    RPG
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    #10
    Ive done this combo as well. Tramadol plus buprenorphine will knock me out. I dont understand how they both work together. Does tramadol convert bupe into a full opiod agonist or something?
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    #11
    Bluelight Crew BingeBoy's Avatar
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    ^
    the enzyme that converts bupe to norbuprenorphine is cyp2d6

    tramadol competes for it to be metabolzied into m1 so i doubt that it will influence bupe metabolization in a positive way


    note m1 and norbuprenorphine (which is a full mu agonist) are both beat by buprenorphine at the receptor binding contest , however i think we haven't found out everything about these substances and how they interact , just like with codeine and morphine how it was discovered that codeine-6-glucoronide a ctually plays a big role in the analgesia/opiate effects
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    #12
    Bluelighter sp0r's Avatar
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    Lets not forget that depending on your dose its not necessarily positive that all of your mu receptors are antagonized. Also tramadol is a very tricky drug, it isnt just mu opiod mechanism, it works on seratonin and noradrenalin. So im guessing the empty mu receptors are taken up by the ultram and its enough that a few receptors will be sufficient to fill the ultram. Then the other mechanisms add to the high. I had a bottle of tramadol for two days now and was afraid to take it on my 4 8mg subutex a day. I searched the internet all over and couldnt find anything. So me being the daredevil that I am, I shot 12mg's ive subutex (it was disgusting i destroyed every vein trying to find one, i was covered in blood and it looked like I murdered someone), then I ate 8 tramadol 50mg's which i dont think is a good idea because they say they are apt to give seizures. But I feel pretty good actually. I just came in from a cigarette and it tasted amazing, like when u just shoot a stamp bag or something. When I talked about experimenting with myself, In my early days of being on subutex, I had a serious injury so my doctor prescribed me 60 mgs of methadone a day (he generally gives me what i ask for if i ask right) for 2 weeks. After I was finished the next day I took a subutex sublingually. I cant even describe the horror. All the sudden everything gets really bright, my constipation turns into fierce running to the bathroom and throwing up, my bones feel like they are broken, and basically I felt like i was dying. I crawled in my bed and burried my face in my pillow for I dont know how long, I was too messed up to tell how long the withdrawl lasts. My point being: Please be careful when experementing with drugs on yourself. We are not alexander shulgin. Lets be sure to be responsible and ask our fellow psychonauts. Im new to this board and it seems like its the main purpose. I love it. I just wanna know how to start threads and navigate. Its a bit confusing. Ok the sub has me chatty Im going to go smoke. If you reply please aim me or yahoo me so I know i got a reply aim dag109 yahoo sp0r412 irc undernet #smack sp0r
    ez,
    sp0r
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    #13
    Bluelighter fistful_of_needles's Avatar
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    so I had a few boxes of Tramadol about from past attemps at rehab and I just wondered how that would feel in conjunction with the Subutex/Suboxone I'm taking daily for my H issues ... well my friends , let me tell you out of personal experience that the antagonist present in Suboxone does nothing whatsoever to block the effects of Tramadol ... very convenient really since I'm an addict and addicts tend to seek the buzz everywhere everytime so ... at the end I felt a nice buzz from such combo (quite different from the buzz you get from opiates such as Morphine ,Oxys and H but still quite satisfactory) which allowed me to enjoy my day at hand without the general discomfort I usually feel when clean/sober ... "lesser of two evils" ... sorry about my english ... <sorry about offering to sell drugs to fellow BLers too djsim>
    Last edited by djsim; 22-07-2009 at 22:01. Reason: read the rules; sending or receiving scheduled drugs is inappropriate
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    #14
    Bluelighter Colmes's Avatar
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    I agree with the general opinions of the poster's on this thread, i also am under the impression, even my pet dog says they synergize, as opposed to a typical narcotic pain reliever.
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    #15
    Bluelighter Drench's Avatar
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    Yeah I agree that it's a lovely combo, 2mg bupe + 2 x 100mg slow release tramdols and 2 x 50mg instant release capsules + bongs =
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    #16
    Bluelighter norco's Avatar
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    Yeah, you can take ultram and suboxone at the same time, sub is to get off opiates, and since tramadol isn't an opiate, you won't be taking steps backwards.

    But, be very careful taking too much tramadol. I was on it for a year and started growing a tolerance for it so I'd take more and more, so I got to the point where I was taking 3-4 at a time, and they were 50mg each I believe, and I'd take them about every 4 hours... well one night I started stuttering real bad after taking a 4 pill dosage and about an hour later I had a seizure.
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    #17
    Bluelighter Philoscybin's Avatar
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    I don't understand the great hype over tramadol, it's just like a weak body high for me... but yeah I've taken both several times before/afterwards/simultaneously and it's fine.
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    #18
    Bluelighter fistful_of_needles's Avatar
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    yeah dude , perhaps i wasn't clear enough in my post ... Tramadol on it's own does nothing whatsoever for me as well , coming from a 1 gram/day H habit my tolerance to pain medication in general is bound to be pretty high ... the thing is mixing Tramadol with Subutex/Suboxone ( the antagonist thing in it is but a myth btw , might apply to people who IV it but it certainly won't if taken sublingually or snorted ) and some green/solid works marvels for me ... to the point I've managed to stay away from my once obsessive H habit so ... if going from A to B requires a few steps and falls inbetween be it , as long as you eventually get there ...
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    #19
    Hey dont hate on tramadol, im one of those people that can get a tremendous high on trams.
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    #20
    Bluelighter Cookie1456's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tramaqueen View Post
    Hey dont hate on tramadol, im one of those people that can get a tremendous high on trams.
    It seems like some people love it and others hate it, I have to try it sometime.
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    #21
    nvm got it
    Last edited by jond2005; 28-06-2009 at 15:03. Reason: found it
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    #22
    When I came off OC using suboxone, I also took tramadol before the subs, after the subs, it doesnt matter, there is no precipitated w/d. Suboxone didnt act as a pain releiver at all, and Tramadol was prescribed by my Sub DR. for pain. Good luck. Remember to slowly taper your last couple weeks off Sub or you will still w/d.
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    #23
    Bluelighter fistful_of_needles's Avatar
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    Jond2005 , I got your message , the problem is : "Sorry, but you may only send Private Messages to members of staff until you reach Bluelighter status." ... so , given such inconvenience it would be best for you to submit your E-mail in here or simply send it to me in a PM so that we can talk on Msn or Skype for instance ...
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    #24
    Bluelighter jaguraguguru's Avatar
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    Tramadol is a very unique opioid in that in addition to its traditional u-opioid agonism (where it is a very weak agonist), it is an SNRI. Its pharmacological significance is manifested by its main metabolite, which is the CYP2D6 O-demethylated product called M1. M1 has about 200 times the u-opioid agonism of tramadol and so is still a rather weak opioid, with u-agonism of about 1/30 of morphine. Tramadol's analgesic (or more correctly, pain-killing) ability reside in a synergism between weak opioid receptor agonism, and weak serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake inhibition. Norepinephrine signalling has been implicated in relieving neuropathic pain and severe pain that is often unaffected by traditional u-opioid agonists. Tramadol's recreational use resides also in a synergism between these three systems. The SNRI activity of tramadol takes place very rapidly and can produce a mild euphoria, though more commonly a pleasantness or mildness of manner, a mood-brightening effect.
    The reason that tramadol can be used concommittantly with buprenorphine is that buprenorphine WILL antagonize tramadol's opioid activity, but will have no effect on its SNRI activity, except possibly to slow the degradation of M1 via enzymatic inhibition. Since little or at least only some of tramadol's pharmacological activity is in its opioid agonism, buprenorphine will only antagonize some or little of its effects and will unlikely cause precipitated withdrawal, especially because buprenorphine itself has far stronger u-agonism than tramadol or M1.
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    #25
    BL Ambassador Captain.Heroin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fistful_of_needles View Post
    might apply to people who IV it
    NOPE.

    It's just a myth all together, even if you IV it.
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