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The Big & Dandy 4-AcO-DALT Thread

Just for the sake of interesting dialogue, what is therapuetic about it? I could see it (both 4-AcO-DALT and 4-HO-DPT) being useful for cluster headaches, if one wants the benefits of a 5HT agonist without overt psychedelic action. Does it offer something that 2-4mg of psilocin, or 3-6mg of psilacetin, cannot offer (other than the benefit of not being controlled)? Maybe I missed something there.
 
It probably was a little bit like a slightly above threshold dose of psilacetin, but I can't confirm that because I've never bio-assayed that compound at such a low dose (excluding 1 milligram allergy tests).

What I find potentially "therapeutic" about 4-AcO-DALT at the tested dose/ROA (based on only one trial) is that it can gently open up channels of empathy and emotion, while leaving plenty of room for clear-headed introspection. It seems like this compound could be good for intimate conversation or to think.
 
I have tried this stuff recently, so thought I'd register as there didn't seem to be many reports.

I recently came across some 4-Aco-DALT through a friend who has tried most psychedelic RCs I can think of. He didn't tell me much, only that it was nothing like 5-MeO-DALT (which I haven't tried) and had more in common with mushrooms and other 4-substituted tryptamines. He also recommended snorting it, and said that he and friends found 80mg to be equivalent to approx. 2g dried mushrooms.

Anyway;

4-AcO-DALT Fumurate [100mg insufflated, no tolerance]

T+0:10 - some colour enhancement, faces seem to form out of anything circular, sounds seem distant

T+0:15 - mushroom like OEVs, a slightly nauseous feeling of constantly rotating or seasickness, definite 'tryptamine buzz' very much like 4-AcO-DMT, my hearing is slightly distorted, as if through a quiet ring modulator

T+0:30 - I decide to lie down as the nausea is getting a bit stronger. strong OEVs include waveforms flying out of the speakers and an anthropomorphisation of everything - clothes on the floor would form lions and panthers, and other animal faces would form from the junk in my room. I have only previously met psychedelic animals on Ayahuasca, though that was a less lighthearted affair.

T+1:00 - The trip finally starts to plateau. I lay down on my bed with my eyes shut watching the 'cosmic theatre' of various shadow-like entities, which was fascinating yet slightly intimidating. The entities did not really interact with me, as they might on mushrooms, and for this I was grateful as they did not seem particularly welcoming. There was more a feeling of observing things from a distance, not unlike a dissociative, unlike the more 'interactive' experience of other tryptamines I have tried, such as DMT.

T+1:20 - Coming down. The memories which seemed so clear only 10 minutes ago are already beginning to fade. My vision is still overlaid with incredible geometric patterns. I stand up, and the nausea returns a little for the first time since lying down, though nowhere near as badly. I sit down and drink some water.

T+1:35 The trip ends very suddenly and abruptly, though some tracers and mild CEVs remain. I feel a wonderful afterglow, not unlike DMT. I am surprised how alert and awake I feel mentally, though I still feel rather sluggish physically. Music sounds wonderful, and some weed an hour or so later brought back the CEVs a little.

Conclusion:

I would compare 100mg insufflated 4-AcO-DALT to approximately 3-3.5g dried mushrooms with a ~90 minute duration. The only other 4-substituted tryptamines I have tried are mushrooms and 4-AcO-DMT and it was very similar in character, moreso to 4-AcO-DMT than to mushrooms. This was also my first time snorting a tryptamine, so an oral experience may well be quite different. While not as 'spiritual' as mushrooms, it was none the less very introspective and philosophical in nature.

The nausea did put me off a little, and I think I would take mushrooms or 4-AcO-DMT over 4-AcO-DALT in future, though I would be willing to try it again orally if I ever came across any more. I think the best use of this compound is as a 'compressed' mushroom-like trip - by T+2:00 I was pretty much completely sober. However, I have not tried any other 4-substituted tryptamines so others may also have a similarly short duration when insufflated.
 
Anyone got any info or trip reports on 4-aco-dalt (4-Acetoxy-N,N-diallyltryptamine), this would be legal under UK law, as it is a dially just like 5-meo-dalt, correct?

I forgot to mention that this was given to me under the assumption that it is legal in the UK. It doesn't seem to fall under the catch-all tryptamine clause:

MoD Act 1971 said:
(b) any compound...structurally derived from tryptamine or from a ring-hydroxy tryptamine by substitution at the nitrogen atom of the sidechain with one or more alkyl substituents but with no other substituent.

5-MeO-DALT avoids this by being an alkenyl substituent, and F&B says that this applies to plain ol' DALT as well. It would make sense if 4-AcO-DALT was also unscheduled, and gives the UK one legal psilocin analogue. Awesome!
 
I assume that NALT's would also be uk legal (but not MALT's, EALT's, PALT's and IPALT's). I wonder how active these compounds would be.

I assume they have spent years sitting untasted in Shulgins lab.
 
I assume that NALT's would also be uk legal (but not MALT's, EALT's, PALT's and IPALT's). I wonder how active these compounds would be.

I assume they have spent years sitting untasted in Shulgins lab.

Relevant quote;

The Last Interview with Alexander Shulgin said:
There was a collection of round-bottomed flasks on the table, each containing a small scab of impure tryptamine crust. One flask was labeled 5-MeO-MALT, another 5-MeO-NALT. Shulgin began to explain, “DALT is the first one—it’s the diallyl—and the methylallyl is MALT. Then EALT and then,” he puckered his lips and pushed out a plosive, “PALT and iso-PALT and so forth. 5-MeO-DALT was an active compound, so I’m pursuing that line further. Usually they wait about four years after I get something out that becomes popular, and then they make it illegal. But I sent the synthesis for 5-MeO-DALT to a friend. He put it on the internet, and one month later it was synthesized in China and sent via Europe to this country. Now it’s available on the street!”

Out of interest, what would make the NALTs and DALTs legal but not the others? Aren't alkenyl substituents uncovered by the tryptamine clause or am I missing something?
 
I found that 80mg of 4-AcO-DALT (50mg bombed, 30mg insufflated) had pretty nice/reasonably strong effects - definitely similar to other 4-substituted tryptamines and not much in common with 5-MeO-DALT.

Classic tryptamine OEVs were present such as very enhanced colours and lines, warping of visual field (phone screen seemed to turn square, then elliptical etc), seeing faces everywhere in shadows. Also a nice rushy body high which brought on the horniness a bit, so I decided to, er, service myself...

This took quite a bit longer than I was expecting and resulted in my laptop running out of batteries (thankfully 2 mins after the dynamite), and bluescreening on restart. Although I knew the reason for this error (Windows not loving a new Antivirus update) instead of just going to earlier restore point, in my enebriated state I managed to totally format my whole computer. Hah. So I would conclude that the substance is not as clear headed as, say 4-HO-MET. It has a touch of that mushroomy/4-HO-DMT/4-PO-DMT headtrip madness (that I like sometimes and not others). All in all, great stuff, just not as potent as most of the other 4-subs. Will go for 100mg bombed if I can get my mitts on this stuff again.
 
I discuss this material in the 4-HO-DPT Big & Dandy thread.

Like others, I believe 80 to 90 mg is a reasonably strong oral dose, and that this compound is probably indifferantiable from 4-HO-DPT in terms of effects and dosage. Note however that 4-HO-DPT seems to have a dramatically steep dose-response curve over 100 mg, so be prepared.

The question of therapeutic potential of these materials is probably answered with ideas such as micro-dosing, as well as the fact that a 3 hour total activity possibly fits better a psychotherapy session than 8 hours of LSD or 20 minutes of DMT...
 
Is it worth 8 times the price of 5meo dalt?
How does it compare in terms of visuals and mood lift
And body rushes?
 
I hope this isn't off topic but is this compound unique enough that it wouldn't be illegal in the US?
(first post, I hope I didn't violate any rules lol im always so paranoid about that):\
 
Nope, no rules violated, welcome to BL and PD, I hope you decide to stay and participate more. :)
 
Thanks :) I have read posts and found the forum to be useful for years and finally made an account
 
I hope this isn't off topic but is this compound unique enough that it wouldn't be illegal in the US?
(first post, I hope I didn't violate any rules lol im always so paranoid about that):\
I'm no expert, and I don't even live in the US, but I'm pretty sure it's not illegal per se. But it being an analog of schedule one tryptamines it would be illegal to sell, buy and use as a drug.

So the answer is yes and no. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Edit: I see,You mean if its unique enough to not be an analog of something? I'm not sure about that, but with the US analog laws it's always a grey zone.
 
Ah I see what you mean, it really is pretty vague the way the laws are written. Thanks!
 
I assume that NALT's would also be uk legal (but not MALT's, EALT's, PALT's and IPALT's)

Actually, I would think all of them should be given the act states:

(b) any compound...structurally derived from tryptamine or from a ring-hydroxy tryptamine by substitution at the nitrogen atom of the sidechain with one or more alkyl substituents but with no other substituent.

So in theory the allyl substituent is an "other" substituent making MALT's, EALT's etc. all perfectly UK legal. Just how it looks to me.
 
Anyone have tried this compound lately?

I received some with 5-MeO-NiPT, 5-MeO-EiPT and 5-MeO-MALT :)

Thank you !
 
Bit late but did you try it Kishka? I thought I responded to this thread but maybe not;
4AcO-DALT is really pretty good; at least as good as some of the other 4 subs imo; unfortunately it is too weak to bother orally and would suggest smoking/vaping. I haven't tried vaping other 4 subs so can't compare but definately a milder easier ride than DPT/DMT/5Me0 type things. Really nice and unique; light easy grace; it's own style of OEV and more internally the CEV too - some life and delicacy with the CEVs which I could compare vaguely to shrooms although there imtensity look and colour is very different to shrooms. This over shrooms anyday since a few have made comparison > much lighter and enjoyable and a great body high but basically very different in most respects. Many would find this a very acceptable and pleasing drug but pityfully weak - I'd love a full on oral dose - think that would be just lovely but just not realistically feasable at it's strength; thad it been cheap or more potent I think this would have had much more interest.
 
Sir Ron Pib, I actually just posted a trip report about this the other day seeking discussion because I didn't know anyone else who has tried smoking 4-AcO-DALT. It was my first attempt with it period and it pretty much matched up with what you said. The most noticeable thing to me was that it was indeed more lighthearted than DMT and related molecules but no less powerful, though overall I actually found the visuals to be more comparable to LSD than to other 4-substituted tryptamines in many ways, but still with its own unique spin. Unfortunately I also suffer from its low potency compared to similar psychedelics; I would absolutely love to take a full oral dose, but if I did then I would basically have none left to use in any other way. If I may ask, about what dose would you normally smoke, and how far have you pushed it? 15 mg was actually surprisingly strong for me, and I would like to take it further but am concerned about the lack of information about dosing, side effects, etc. If I had some evidence that 4-AcO-DALT is as safe as the other psilocin analogues seem to be, I would definitely be interested in trying to find a breakthrough dose with it.
 
When it started to sweep across me I thought wow! I supose because of that style it was a bit DPT like but I am thinking wow it's colour and style seem so different so not really LSD like but more that synthetic tryptamine style than the natural ones - aware psilocybin and DMT are very different but you know what I mean. The internal the visual were mild but I had a feeling of life or activity of great delicacy like one can get during the onset of mushroom visuals so there is a point of comparison but as I said the style was totally distinct and the rest wasn't like like them at all - very smooth; I was enchanted to find another new space on this .I've had 25mg and it felt safe enough and very friendly but with something new we can't know - there was a little mild nausea and my heart was elevated.
Only thing I didn't like is the smoke it's self; DMT and all those are easy and "tastey" to smoke; there is no indole scent and it is a bit rough; could really feel I had inhaled this stuff - I know some have smoked AcO-DET and the like - wonder if they share this quality - about a breakthrough dose or how much you have I don't know; just move up slowly I guess
 
Thank you very much for sharing. :) I was very surprised by the color and style on the onset as well, though I have to say that honestly that was partially because of how LSD-like it was, haha. But don't get me wrong.... It was specific things about the visuals that reminded me so much of LSD, but the experience as a whole did not. And, specifically, it was things about the geometry and neon color flashes... not complex things, just sort of the basic foundation. Some very noticeably different things were, for one, the synthetic tryptamine vibe that you mentioned; I found it to be overall fairly similar to 4-HO-DET in the way my mind's eye imagery worked and passed over into perception at the peak, but there was also a distinctly different energy to it than I have experienced before which made it feel almost wild or untamed despite being easygoing and fun. Hard to describe exactly... but it does remind me of the trip report I read of it where someone described seeing animals in the visuals, I could definitely see that happening. Overall I did find it very unique, I definitely want to explore more. 25 mg is likely what I will try next, you're the second person I've heard of having an elevated heart rate at that dose now though so I will surely have to proceed cautiously.

Honestly, I had read that the smoke was harsh, but I didn't even notice it in between a bowl of cannabis. I normally taste DMT pretty strongly when I smoke it, but I have yet to notice anything significant with bufotenin, 4-AcO-MET, 4-AcO-DET, or 4-AcO-DALT. I may be in the minority here, so take that with a grain of salt. As for the breakthrough, I will definitely approach it carefully, but I have high hopes that it will not take enormous doses to reach, given how strong 15 mg already was for me. Thanks again, it's good to have more information on this!
 
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