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    Butrans - buprenorphine transdermal patches 
    #51
    Question
    Anyone hear about these? Just wondering why the doses are so low 5mcg, 10mcg and 20mcg... I think the 20mcg works out to be 480mcg a day (0.48mg of bupe a day). Which is a little less than 1/4 of a 2mg subutex pill....right?

    Is extremely low dose bupe considered a decent analgesic?

    I feel like I am missing something here....

    Last edited by enoughorangejuice?; 15-01-2011 at 04:30.
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    #52
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    Buprenorphine binds VERY strongly to opiate receptors, and in opiate naive people it's a decent painkiller. These patches aren't for opiate maintenance I think
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    #53
    yeah i guess you are right... i did a little reading and these patches are NOT for people who use percocet or vicodin... it's for people who only take tylenol or aspirin for their pain but those aren't strong enough...

    still they mention "abuse potential" on the website...
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    #54
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    The BA for transdermal buprenorphine is really low. These have only been approved for analgesia. Finally, we already have a thread for buprenorphine patches here.
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    #55
    haha wow, blast from the past. look how naive and stupid i was just 2 years ago now i'm a sr mod...

    there have been posts about these patches being introduced for maintenance that i've read from other posters over the years, whether they've been approved or not i'm not sure and haven't though about since. this was for the US, at least. i'm in australia. the search engine should help out.

    it's for people who only take tylenol or aspirin for their pain but those aren't strong enough...
    i can see some truth to that but it's not true 100%. i was on an opiate regime before using these, given that was only tramadol and codeine at the time but i had had experience with other opiates before being switched to this. it comes down to the doctor and patients discretion.

    still they mention "abuse potential" on the website...
    i definitely agree with that. i was able to get high abusing them. before i was switched to fent after my allergic reaction being identified i was able to perform a decent extraction on the bupe and get high, as well as using orally and SL at one stage. though i enjoy bupe in the rec sense. friends were also able to get high (spewing their guts on and off dor 24+ hours) from chewing a small amount of the patch and oral BA is only around 10%. tolerance definitely plays the part there.

    bupe is relative to my interests given my current situation...again.
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    #56
    Bluelighter Dr migi's Avatar
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    I was at 1.2mg Bupe sublingual a day ( 1mg pill + 0.2 and got some 0.4 temgesic ( sublingual bupe))

    Now he switched me to patch In Europe it's called Transtec it realease 35mcg an hour, contain 20mg bupe on it. And you have to wear it for 4 days before changing it ( 20/4 = 5mg/day)

    It is prescribed for chronic pain and fybromialgia. But I could feel better my old (1.2 / 2 mg bupe in pills than the patch ... wtf ?



    Im looking a way to get more out of it. ( I KNOW I KNOW you can't) , I mean, a better absorbsion. MAybe Clean hard your skin before appling patch ? appling patch on the veins, Heating the patch ? ( not recommended, but apparently if heated more than 25į it realease faster bupe)

    reply if you got an idea or if im wrong.
    thx
    Last edited by Dr migi; 12-02-2011 at 12:21.
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    #57
    Bluelighter Dr migi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftwing View Post
    normally now i would still be hazed as shit and barely functional to perform out of the way tasks
    love the way you said that. I do the same with bupe patch ( switzerland here ) I broke my feets and legs 6 onth ago.

    I recive brand: "transtec" deliver 20mg under 4 days = 35mcg/hours (smallest dose here on patch) have some usless tini 0,4 ammount of bupe fun to snort and then ALL THE FUCKING WORLD FEELS GREAT and when all arround you feels great you feel great too!

    awesome and thats when the addiction start: im on withdraw atm before I wait 4 days between using 2 x 20mg bupe
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    #58
    i know this sounds dumb.. but i dont knowho to ask ..i have been on sub strips off the street for 40 some days but i have tried injecting (with 8mg/2mg i dont know if this is the samwe patch as your 20mcg/hr one?) and it did not work out well for me.. but i didnt peel off any part of it.. i dissolved the whole thing lik an idiot.. but i just came across this..and whis id seen it sooner.. im lookin at one now and dont see how to peel it off.( i dont know what side is suppose to be on your skin.)i dissole them under my tongue.. im not sick or equipt with rig now so im not going to try . but mine just seems to strech not peel off. .. its a half of one maybe i need a fresh one idk..?..


    Quote Originally Posted by specneck View Post
    Okay, i just wanted to put my method down here because ive seen alot of crap about using ethanol, lemon juice and whatever else...
    My brief history is that I was on oxycontin 80mg, heroin and norspan for about a year and when i couldnt get either of the first 2 drugs, i'd use the norspan (not as good feeling, but longer lasting and cheaper - (from chemist) so i didnt have to go through withdrawals)

    This is how you extract it:

    I was using 20mcg/hr patches. Peel off the clear square (doesnt seem to really matter how quickly you pull this off, it is a matrix with the bupe infused in it)... but *make sure* you remember which side is supposed to be in contact with your skin if you were to use it as directed.

    Get a tablespoon, preferably a larger than normal one, place about 2ml of clean water (for injecting) in the spoon.

    Place the plastic square in a spoon facing DOWN so that the water is in contact with the SKIN CONTACT side.. you'll see where it makes contact.

    Let it sit for 30mins - 1 hr (depending on your tolerance and patch strength - but START LOW and work up.. you can always take more, but if you shoot too much you cant get it out of your system unless youve got some narcan handy - not a pleasant experience)..

    After it has soaked for the required amt of time, SWIM used to put the end of the needle into an ear cleaner (earbud) and place the earbud in the solution and draw through that. Not the most effective filter, but it would at least do something.

    AND THATS IT!!

    SWIM used to shoot an entire patch in 1 or 2 days, but the tolerance was massive...

    You usually need to soak it for at least half an hour, but SWIM would try to let it sit for at least 45-60 minutes, sometimes longer if SWIM had patience and wasnt in WD's already..

    No heating, no lemon juice.. nothing else is needed. this is the way SWIM was doing it for at least 10 months and it worked very well.

    The patch can be soaked more than once of course, but you'll need to soak it for longer each time as it gets used up. Also usually the sides of the patch would sometimes not touch the water which means the bupe isnt being taken from that area, so just move the patch around til it does.

    You may also need to use more water and a larger syringe than a fitpack needle/insulin syringe (1ml) as the bupe levels from the plastic get lower, either that or use more water and inject several times but this can be a bit annoying and cause more damage to veins.

    You can also do this with the patch stuck to the spoon and the skin contact side facing UP, but obviously you'll just need to put the water on the opposite side (on top of the patch instead of underneath) which also works just as well.

    Now, I dont condone this. I'm just trying to save the more adventurous peoples' veins from shooting whatever junk some other people say is needed in their experimental methods..

    I've been clean for almost a year now and my life has turned around and am fit and healthy..
    but i did lose alot including my wife and plenty of cash so if you need help, i encourage you to seek it from wherever you can - parents and family, close friends - anyone.. because any opiate addict is only happy when they've got the stuff coursing through the system but every 16-20 hours youve gotta make the calls, come up with the cash, wait until theyre ready and finally have that shot otherwise youre sick!! It's a struggle, it's extremely hard and it can be very depressing and that just isnt the way to live - YOU ARE WORTH IT!!

    Hope this helps more than hinders.
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    #59
    BL Ambassador Captain.Heroin's Avatar
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    A patch isn't a strip.

    The strips are meant for sublingual use.

    The patches are meant for transdermal use.
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    #60
    what is the law regarding Butrans and specifically prescribing it to someone who used to be addicted to opioids and has been off them for years with the help of Suboxone?

    Is it legal for a doctor to prescribe, to a person who has been taking Suboxone, a Butrans patch? I inquired with my Suboxone doc about this possibility and was berated for asking him to do something he thought would be illegal. I'm not sure if he realized Butrans = buprenorphine...but he got quite upset. Am I out of line for thinking it may be a nice alternative to taking 1/4 of a 2mg pill sublingually EVERY DAY, where with the Butrans I could take one 20mcg/hr patch once a week and get essentially the same daily dose of buprenorphine I was getting with the fractions of my Suboxone tablets? I get ~500mcg a day, and with the patch I would get 480mcg a day.

    My doctor yelled at me, called me a "drug-seeking junkie" and told me to find a new Suboxone doctor, which is fine by me.... I just didn't think asking for a slightly lower daily dose of buprenorphine in a much more difficult-to-abuse delivery form was "drug-seeking behavior" but I guess I learn something new every day!

    I have no desire to get high and thought it would be nice to be able to get Butrans from my primary care doctor for a $15 co-pay instead of paying a "Suboxone doctor" $300 a visit for the exact same fucking chemical....and in my mind Suboxone tablets are infinitely more abuseable than a fucking patch...(Suboxone tablets can be easily snorted/injected/plugged) but I guess this is why I'm just a stupid drug-seeking junkie and not a doctor


    I'd appreciate any response to this post letting me know I'm not crazy...not only did my Suboxone doctor quit on me but my normal psychiatrist is telling me that I need to understand why my Suboxone doctor would interpret my idea for switching from Suboxone to Butrans as a desire to get high, to which I replied I did not understand that interpretation seeing as I can easily abuse my Suboxone tablets and am asking for the same chemical just in a slightly lower dose and in a much less abuseable delivery system.... I could be wrong here, i mean i am the one seeing two fucking shrinks, but I have a hunch, since their combined age is at LEAST 155, that I'm not the one who's wrong here...

    And just so ya'll know... I don't care about not being able to get Butrans if it really is illegal...I just floated the idea out there when i learned there is a buprenorphine patch that happens to come in almost the same daily dose I take with my ridiculously low dose of Suboxone (I take 0.5mg a day and have for a number of years). How this can be viewed as drug-seeking behavior is absolutely beyond me...
    Last edited by enoughorangejuice?; 27-03-2011 at 06:46.
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    #61
    Bluelight Crew amapola's Avatar
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    ^You're not crazy. Well I can't say that for sure but in the above post you are reasonable and your doctor is ignorant. I wouldn't be surprised if your sub doc had been told countless times by his peers and colleagues, and thereby been convinced, that the naloxone in suboxone is the reason it isn't abusable. Hence when you asked for bupe alone he thought you were a drug seeker.

    Legal questions aren't really appropriate for OD (and you don't list your location), but there could be some policy in place whereby regular docs can prescribe subs for addiction management by taking a course and not sending you to a specialized addiction doctor. The course is probably presented by Reckitt Benckiser themselves and it very well may not be allowed for that doctor to prescribe anything other than subs for dependence management.
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    #62
    I live in the US. What I don't understand is that he said Subutex, Methadone and Suboxone are all OK to be Rx'd to me...but Butrans was totally out of the question...so it isn't even the Naloxone in Suboxone...I think he's just fucking crazy. And how asking for a patch version of Subutex is drug seeking is seriously out of the realm of ideas I am capable of understanding. oh well!

    too bad more doctors don't read BL...they might actually learn some real world knowledge....
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    #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by enoughorangejuice? View Post
    too bad more doctors don't read BL...they might actually learn some real world knowledge....
    Yep. The whole 'addiction specialist' tag many sub doctors/methadone doctors have is just a bunch of bullshit. Treating opiate addiction, overall, is a fucking sad state of affairs. Now, for sure there are good doctors out there, who know what they are talking about, just it is sad that the majority don't.

    You're definitely not crazy, man. You should have just said, "okay, well I'll just go buy some dope. Now what?"
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    #64
    haha, ya know when my now-fomer Sub doctor told me that i'm a junky and always will be and started to preach to me the first step of the 12-step program about being powerless and having an unmanageable life I replied, "if i am powerless, why am I not scoring heroin right now, and haven't for the past 2 years?" to which he replied (no joke), "that is the junky in you talking"

    how ridiculous! the junky in me is telling him how clean i have been...ya that's real junky talk! wtf? my life is completely manageable, i take the lowest suboxone dose of any human on earth who uses it for opioid maintenance (0.5mg a day) and i have a full time job and don't drink or smoke or abuse drugs and i work out daily and don't eat junk food or meat or soda or sweets EVER... ya my life is unmanageable...

    i can tell that all of my Suboxone doctors, with ONE exception, only have textbook knowledge regarding Suboxone and addiction. They have no concept of what really goes on and what drugs are abused and how they are abused (other than the obvious ones) and they have no idea how abuseable Suboxone really is and how the Naloxone has ABSOLUTELY NO EFFECT in stopping ANYBODY from snorting/plugging or injecting it.

    mod note: please use the edit button if you have something to add immediately after posting instead of posting again.
    Last edited by amapola; 27-03-2011 at 19:35.
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    #65
    i got put on these last week from my doctor, i have never and will never shoot up, no offense to anyone that does, and i am trying to figure out how to get high with them, without having to wear them
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    Norspan buprenorphine patches 5mg 
    #66
    I went to see a Dr for filling my OxyContin OC and the Dr I casually visit had a flue so there was another Dr who did not have any of those invidually numbered hologrammed RX templates for hard painkillers etc. we use here so he could not fill the script for me. Instead he scripted me a Norspan patch that contains 5mg of buprenorphine which is released during a week and told me to start using these.

    Luckily I have still OCs to cope until I see my regular Dr at monday so no in hell I am going to switch in to thing that releases few micrograms of buprenorphine in to my body as that would not be a nowhere near equal painkilling effect as 20mg of Oxycodone taken three times a day. Also taking buprenorphine while oxycodone in my body would lead to a hell of a bad withdrawals as even those few micrograms released from that patch would block my opiate receptors quite well and would be nowhere equal the amount of oxycodone.

    Where do these jerks actually come from?

    I just wonder if there are any recreational value for those patches and how should they be administered if some day I quit oxycodone and want to have a buprenorphine high?
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    #67
    that dosage patch releases only 5mcg/hr, nowhere near a blockade dose. i was prescribed 2 20mcg/hr patches for some time and had no qualms using oxy, codeine, etc on top for breakthrough pain.

    bupe is a potent drug and you will be surprised that it may be sufficient to hold you fine. i had a big opiate tolerance and low dose bupe such as these patches were more sufficient. the lockade effect ime seems to take place upwards of 2-4mg doses.

    merging into appropriaye thread
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    #68
    Bluelighter opiatekrzy's Avatar
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    i live in NEW YORK, my doc gave me BUTRANS 5mcg/hr..he knew i was an addict and WAS on suboxone, still gave me it, didnt help much, its a 7 day patch
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    #69
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    I found bupe to be good for pain. When I went to the PM doc who just wanted to give me $5000 cortisone injections in my neck (greedy piece of shit). I got an 8mg sub from a friend and divided it over 2 weeks I was almost pain free (not from the injection I spoke to a spinal surgeon who said they would do nothing for my pain and about shit when I told him the price).
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    #70
    ^this thread is about Buprenorphine Transdermal Patches and not Bupe Strips, Suboxone and Subutex.
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    #71
    I have been using these Norspan (10mics/h) patches for a few weeks now. I am using these for pain with several other medications. Now the problem is that the patches donít stay in contact with my skin for a whole week. If I tape those from the edges (as it should), it rises from the center where the bupe is. Does it make the patch useless if the area containing bupe is not in contact with my skin? Should I tape the whole patch to my body? I mean that there is like air or something under the patch.

    Can anyone compare Norspan (10mics/h) to any other analgesics? I am in pain and these are not helping much.

    Thanks!
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    #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skelu View Post
    I have been using these Norspan (10mics/h) patches for a few weeks now. I am using these for pain with several other medications. Now the problem is that the patches donít stay in contact with my skin for a whole week. If I tape those from the edges (as it should), it rises from the center where the bupe is. Does it make the patch useless if the area containing bupe is not in contact with my skin? Should I tape the whole patch to my body? I mean that there is like air or something under the patch.

    Can anyone compare Norspan (10mics/h) to any other analgesics? I am in pain and these are not helping much.

    Thanks!
    The problem with butrans is that the transdermal BA for buprenorphine is quite low.

    I don't know why they didn't increase the dosage at least by several times; apparently most people aren't sensitive enough to get anything out of these.
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    #73
    ^the dose might be low but it's a potent opioid. think of the dose you're on CH; you administer a similar amount daily to a 24hr period of a 1mcg/hr patch. the transdermal BA is around 30%, similar to sublingual. the max dosage that can be applied is 2 x 20mcg/hr patches for pain managment.

    i had problems with the adhesive myself using norspan. tape, saran wrap, glue and bandages never helped. in the end i had an allergic reaction to the silicon adhesive. perspiration was another factor. same problems i had with fentanyl patches.

    i've used oxy and morphine since with tramadol.

    talk to your doctor about the problem. mine was compassionate enough to change me to morphine after.
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    #74
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    i just find it ridicolous that my dose for Butrans is 5mcg/hr=5mg a week, my primary knew i was on 24mg suboxone a day for addiction, yet gave me these Butrans for Pain from my car accident..i cant imagine an opiate nieve person even achieving any effect from 5-20mcg/hr...
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    #75
    have you at least given them a chance? or spoken to your doctor about your concerns?

    bupe works amazingly efficient for myself. during my addiction to fentanyl (using up to 3-4 25mcg/hr patches bucally while wearing an extra patch or two a day) a small dose of only 1-2mg of subutex was able to hold me for 72 hours via IV route.
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