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Thread: Legality of ordering gbl wheel cleaner

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    Legality of ordering gbl wheel cleaner 
    #1
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    I am curious if anyone knows the legality of ordering an alloy wheel cleaner that is gbl? If anyone has any personal experience is aware of whether ordering this alloy wheel cleaner is legal in the US when purchased online from other countries?
     

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    #2
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    gbl... in wheel cleaner? *races to the garage* aww, none in mine. not sure i'd wanna be consuming wheel cleaner anyway, that definitely not biodegradable
     

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    #3
    The product is 99.9% gbl but is used for cleaning wheels according to the ad. Gbl is commonly used for cleaning although it is not commonly sold at places like target for such uses. I have been only able to find cleaning products consisting entirely of gbl for sale online.
     

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    #4
    Bluelighter burntserkits's Avatar
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    My chrome blings, yo! Why don't you just ask for a supplier directly on here and then we can all take bets on how quick this thread gets shut down...*hmmm*
     

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    #5
    GBL is illegal in the USA. A precursor of GHB so expect a knock early morning with warrant in hand. Erowid

    GBL (gamma butyrlactone) has become a List I Chemical federally and is scheduled in some states (California, Hawaii, New York, Oklahoma, Oregon). For information about the legal status of 1,4-butanediol, see the 1,4b Law Vault."
     

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    #6
    Bluelighter burntserkits's Avatar
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    *bets 5/20/07* hopefully....
     

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    #7
    Quote Originally Posted by MrMoss
    GBL is illegal in the USA. A precursor of GHB so expect a knock early morning with warrant in hand. Erowid
    Doubtful, lets just say getting busted is rare unless the DEA is running a operation.

    While some states have made GBL a schedule 1 substance not all have, you are required to file paperwork with the DEA to import or buy and sell GBL though.
     

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    #8
    Bluelighter burntserkits's Avatar
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    ^also, all UK suppliers are mandated to report all sales to the gov't. If your chrome is clean, somebody knows about it....
     

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    #9
    Is that a new regulation? Heh if you are in London there used to be delivery services to send a courier around in a few hours with a liter of cleaner , never saw that in any other city.
     

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    #10
    Bluelighter burntserkits's Avatar
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    ^a former US supplier that I am familiar with (but have not done business with them or anyone else) informed me of such records that HAD TO BE KEPT in order to operate as a supplier of such solvents...I know nothing else and have nothing else to say on the matter.
     

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    #11
    Sounds like a Myth ... GBL is completely uncontrolled in the UK. It's a completely non toxic solvent .. jeez I've heard about folks drinking it I'll give you this it won't be for long though.

    PS It wasn't Rabin was it?
     

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    #12
    It offers next day delivery for London and south bucks area so I think its out of London.
     

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    #13
    Bluelighter burntserkits's Avatar
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    ^Most U.K. suppliers won't ship to the U.S. anymore, either...
     

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    Gbl 
    #14
    Basically GBL is not forbidden. Almost all online supliers will ship to all countries except Canada, sweden and argentina, those are the only countries at this moment where GBL is forbidden. But when you try to import it to the US there are some formalities like filling out a bunch of forms with the DEA ....

    GBl is available in 2 versions ..... lactose & lactone, where the first one is synthetic and environment unfriendly and the second one is biologically degradeable.

    Most GBL is sold over the internet as chroom cleaner ... chewing gum remover ... grafity remover ... paint remover and so on. Clearly most online vendors do not advertise this product as an ingredient for making GHB .. (btw it indeed does a great job removing chewing, paint grafity etc.). Which is pretty logical and I dont feel like explaining why ....

    Using GBL gives the same experience and feeling as ghb, where gbl is twice as strong as ghb, basically you can say that your body transforms gbl into ghb ....

    The other main ingredient is NAOH ... also known as .... caustic soda .... which is often used as drain cleaner in powder form .... just make sure it contains > 99.9% NaoH.
     

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    #15
    Bluelighter The Young Geezer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dutchbert
    Basically GBL is not forbidden. Almost all online supliers will ship to all countries except Canada, sweden and argentina.
    Damn, and I was about t order 250ml, I must say back in 2002-2004 GBL was HUGE down here in Argentina, with the media talking about this new drug 'liquid ecstacy' and date rapes and all the usual bull. Well , I guess I'll have tp sticl to my benzos.
     

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    #16
    Quote Originally Posted by dutchbert

    GBl is available in 2 versions ..... lactose & lactone, where the first one is synthetic and environment unfriendly and the second one is biologically degradeable.
    Where did you hear this?

    I have never heard of gamma-butyrolactose, and all I can find with google is some DEA documents that appear to be a typo.

    Perhaps confusion with this?
    "GHB is normally present in the encephalon of mammals, while it is not quite clear whether GBL is present, since this is rapidly transformed into GHB by the gamma-lactose enzyme (22, 23)."
     

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    #17
    GBL IS CO VERED under the federal analogue law in the US.... somehow XYREM is sched III, but possessing homemade ghb or GBL is sched I.... nice huh

    oh i forgot xyrem is "sodium oxybate" LOL

    i would be very wary about any operation out of the US that claims to have GBL, either they are a fed front or they will get busted and will be one very soon.

    england on overseas is a whole nother ballgame, better hope the source packs creatively though.

    i have a friend who did at least a year in fed for a liter of GBL... so whoever said its ok in the US is dead wrong, trust me on that one.... i dont feel like digging up the legalities...

    but i do know there were only one or two guys who eventually beat their case in "operation webslinger" when they cracked down on the sources out of canada such as D. pelchat and all the US sources of GBL and 1'4....

    one of them i know very well and they actually tried to prosecute him with possession of 30 gallons of GBL for the 30 gallons of gasoline he had in his fridge, he left the country while his lawyer handled the shit. he and the guys who owned rejoov (who actually were locked up during their appeals) are the only ones that walked... the rejoov case was for 1'4 and the judge said that 1'4 chemically is not close enough to ghb or any analogue and the law was too vague.

    im sure every buck they made went to their defense.... i believe their attorney was rick collins if you want to do the googling
     

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    lactone/lactose 
    #18
    lactone is a biological product and lactose is the synthetical version .....

    Here are the details for the lactone:

    Organic gamma-Butyrolactone 99,9+% (VE6) gamma-Butyrolactone Synonyms: 4-Hydroxybutyric acid gamma-lactone; BLO; endo-cis-5-Norbornene-endo-2,3-dicarboxylic anhydride Molecular Formula: C4H6O2 Formula Weight: 86.09 Registry number: 96-48-0 MDL number: MFCD00005386 Density: 1.12 Melting point: -45 C Boiling point: 204-205 C

    The lactose version is the synthetical version of lactone but is not biological degradeable

    And regaring legality:

    The FDA issued a warning about Lactone on January 21, 1999 which asks manufacturers to voluntarily recall their lactone containing products. Our reading of this suggests that it is still legal to possess lactone federally, but it is becoming less clear whether it is legal to sell lactone for human consumption. But the DEA is currently 'watching' suppliers of the chemical.

    When importing gbl you need DEA permission, you need to handover documents stating that you are enduser and you dont use it as drugs or for the production of drugs and as a reseller your customers have to fill enduser agreements 2 ......
     

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    #19
    Quote Originally Posted by dutchbert
    lactone is a biological product and lactose is the synthetical version .....

    Here are the details for the lactone:

    Organic gamma-Butyrolactone 99,9+% (VE6) gamma-Butyrolactone Synonyms: 4-Hydroxybutyric acid gamma-lactone; BLO; endo-cis-5-Norbornene-endo-2,3-dicarboxylic anhydride Molecular Formula: C4H6O2 Formula Weight: 86.09 Registry number: 96-48-0 MDL number: MFCD00005386 Density: 1.12 Melting point: -45 °C Boiling point: 204-205 °C

    The lactose version is the synthetical version of lactone but is not biological degradeable

    And regaring legality:

    The FDA issued a warning about Lactone on January 21, 1999 which asks manufacturers to voluntarily recall their lactone containing products. Our reading of this suggests that it is still legal to possess lactone federally, but it is becoming less clear whether it is legal to sell lactone for human consumption. But the DEA is currently 'watching' suppliers of the chemical.

    When importing gbl you need DEA permission, you need to handover documents stating that you are enduser and you dont use it as drugs or for the production of drugs and as a reseller your customers have to fill enduser agreements 2 ......
    What if you're not importing the chemical directly from a lab but instead are ordering a small amount, around 250 mL of a cleaning product for your rims from Poland? I would think there is some small amount which may be overlooked especially if it's being transported via an ems carrier thereby lessening the risk that it is confiscated in the US postal system and is technically a cleaning product.
     

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    #20
    if your not worried about a potential controlled delivery... go for it... chances are they may just sieze 250ml for personal use and send a siezure letter..

    but dont get mad at me if that 250ml costs you 10k in lawyer fees and 3 yrs of probation at least
     

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    #21
    btw that lactone info is way outdated ie. '99.... do a search for operation webslinger, they even convicted all but a couple of guys with 1'4 even under the analogue law, when 1'4 is a fucking alcohol and not remotely an analogue under the letter of the law....

    one seller won their appeal in NY, god know how much it cost them in attorney fees tho
     

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    #22
    HI, sorry I'm a newbie here, jst lookin into GBL, so it's brought as an alloy cleaner?? How does that now burn the stomach!?
     

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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by MrMoss View Post
    GBL is illegal in the USA. A precursor of GHB so expect a knock early morning with warrant in hand. Erowid
    No, it isn't. You are wrong.

    GBL is a List I chemical, which means sales must be reported to the DEA by your supplier. It is completely legal in the USA except in California, afaik.

    You have every right to purchase List I/II watched precursors here in the USA. They are watched, not prohibited.
     

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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by garuda View Post
    Doubtful, lets just say getting busted is rare unless the DEA is running a operation.

    While some states have made GBL a schedule 1 substance not all have, you are required to file paperwork with the DEA to import or buy and sell GBL though.
    Your supplier is, not you as the customer.
     

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    #25
    This isn't allowed. -phrozen
    Last edited by phrozen; 17-05-2009 at 02:59.
     

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