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    Adderall -- minimizing the tolerance 
    #1
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    Man oh man, do amphetamines ever build up tolerance fast! And it lingers -- after doing 10mg adderall 3 times a week for 3 weeks, even a month without it showed much diminished effects.

    I read on the Lycaeum that taking magnesium supplements keeps one from building up tolerance to amphetamines. I have a bottle of pills that have 1000mg calcium and 400mg magnesium each. Taking one every day that I plan to use adderall has SLOWED the rate that I build up tolerance, but has by no means stopped it. This could be a placebo effect, though. Could the calcium be working against me?

    I just picked up another supplement: 500mg L-tyrosine, a chemical precursor to dopamine. What effect would this chemical have on my subjective experience of 10mg adderall? I ask because I know adderall is a dopamine agonist, but I know that dopamine levels are dangerous to fuck around with.

    I get the adderall by prescription -- the doctor wants me taking two doses of 10mg a day. But I don't want to do that, because I find much of the effectiveness of this drug for me is its ability to make me "fall in love with my schoolwork". It's the awesomest feeling in the world to be reading Organic Chemistry in complete rapture, and knowing that this excitement is totally practical -- I WILL remember that material for a test because at the time, I love it so much.

    PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong, but I get a strong sense this "wonderdrug" effect would be lost if I took 20mg adderall a day. I might score higher on psychological assessments of overall focus, but I subjectively wouldn't feel anything special, and thus I wouldn't be quite as "pumped" to learn. I don't want to get to the point where I can't rely on adderall to save my ass in an academic or work-related pinch anymore. Nor do I want to have to take large doses to achieve this effect.
     

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    #2
    I'm in the same situation, except I'm prescribed 30mg XR's. I just take them to study for tests. Usually not more often than once a week on average.
     

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    #3
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    If you are taking 10mg a day and are perfectly happy on that why would you take 20mg just because your doctor says to. Your doc is prescribing based on what he or she feels will work for the majority of people. If you don't need that much let him write the script form 20mg a day and take 10 and save the other 10 for a rainy day.
     

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    #4
    Bluelighter Sprinklervibes's Avatar
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    I get the adderall by prescription -- the doctor wants me taking two doses of 10mg a day. But I don't want to do that, because I find much of the effectiveness of this drug for me is its ability to make me "fall in love with my schoolwork". It's the awesomest feeling in the world to be reading Organic Chemistry in complete rapture, and knowing that this excitement is totally practical -- I WILL remember that material for a test because at the time, I love it so much.
    You are prescribed adderall for the wrong reason. It won't keep helping you like this if you use it daily. If you have motivational problems you should see a shrink or just get off your lazy ass. I had the same thing happen back in highschool. The drug won't keep studying for you. In the end you'll have to do an effort either way. And when you're used to a stimulant to help you in studying and then have to get motivated without it, studying will be even harder.
     

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    I agree, tolerance is a bitch 
    #5
    Anymore than 30-40mg a day and it loses that magic fast. You gotta back off from it. I also think XR is stronger, but more expensive than IR. Even though I was taking the same dose as the first few times I didnt feel anymore of the "i love to study thing" anymore.
     

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    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by MyDoorsAreOpen
    Mafter doing 10mg adderall 3 times a week for 3 weeks, even a month without it showed much diminished effects.
    Tolerance wise, do you think twice a week at 25mg orally would also induce tolerance?
     

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    #7
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    LaurenLive2Party, how very fitting that you should bump a 2 year old thread of mine, just as I've reached some different conclusions about Adderall.

    I used 10mg of adderall for the past 5 days, well, actually 15mg on the 4th day. Each time I preloaded with 500mg magnesium, 30mg DXM, and a large strong cup of coffee. Two weeks before that, I did roughly the same thing.

    I've discovered that when I preload with magnesium and DXM every time, tolerance doesn't really develop to the drug's main effect: stimulation. I had a hell of a time getting to sleep all of those nights, and was mentally sharp and quick and physically energetic all the time that I was on the drug.

    But what was not guaranteed was the euphoria and motivation. I now find that if I take amphetamine when I'm cranky or upset, I can't count on it to give me a mood lift. I CAN count on it to make me able to work hard IN SPITE OF my bad mood, which I guess is somewhat the same thing as motivation, though it's not the same as when I was new to this drug.

    That said, I notice a striking similarity to marijuana, which I'm guessing is a psychological property of a lot of drugs. When I first started smoking marijuana, I was swept off my feet by the effects. I couldn't think or act normal even if I wanted to, and I loved that about it. But as time went by, I found that this became less and less true. Until someone told me that now that I'm a seasoned toker, I have to consciously CHOOSE to let myself be 'taken' by the drug. And sure enough, I found that if I put myself in the right mindset, I could get back into the same silly, mildly hallucinogenic headspace that used to come automatically as a noobie smoker. Many people in Cannabis Discussion have reported the same thing.

    I now find the same thing to be true for Adderall. If I take it, sit myself down and say, 'I'm going to devour this book and learn it cold!' sure enough by the time the onset hits, I'm in a similar 'love to study' frame of mind that I remember from my early days on this drug. But I have to consciously try to hold onto this frame of mind -- the drug doesn't do it for me anymore.

    I think this has something to do with the psychology of familiarity. When some experience is completely novel, you're much taken by it. But once it becomes familiar and predictable, it becomes possible (nay, default!) to not pay it much mind. Giving it one's full attention and giving it power over you becomes optional.

    In conclusion, I'd say hard stimulants like amphetamine are only a long term solution for students and workers who can muster up a spark of motivation by willpower alone, but aren't that great at sustaining it. I would guess that it's a temporary and ultimately disappointing fix for anyone who can't even bring themselves to get started.
    All curious people are philosophers. All seekers of meaning are spiritual. P&S
     

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    #8
    im in the same boat, except i abused them really hard for a while.

    amp tolerance is INSANELY fast to build. 100mg adderall gives me a buzz.

    honestly i prefer dexedrine.

    i have heard, although im not POSITIVE, that DXM will somehow lower your tolerance to amps. this might be total bullshit, i havent tried it, but i remember reading it somewhere.

    has anyone tried this?
     

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    #9
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    ^^^ Yes. As I said, I take 30mg DXM (a sub-threshold dose), and 500mg chelated Magnesium before every adderall I take. It makes a big difference, and is frankly a lot healthier way to use amphetamine.

    Other things that have a similar effect on amp tolerance are memantine, the nootropics, ketamine, and a number of other substances.

    If you take a month or two off Adderall and take a magnesium every day, and get plenty of rest and nutrition, I guarantee you will not want to take anything close to 100mg the first time you use it again.
    All curious people are philosophers. All seekers of meaning are spiritual. P&S
     

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    #10
    Bumped to avoid the prune.
     

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    #11
    400mg of magnesium glycinate daily has helped me keep my tolerance down even after years of taking dexedrine.
     

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    #12
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    Lupus....what is your current tolerance at?

    And fuck you for having access to Dexedrine
     

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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Tomer View Post
    Lupus....what is your current tolerance at?

    And fuck you for having access to Dexedrine
    I can easily get lit from 25mg of dex for about 4 hours but then again im pretty conservative and gave up doing 24 hour runs quite a while back. When i did runs i'd usually space out 80mg - 100mg.
     

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    #14
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    Well played. Way to lower the dose, your body thanks you.
     

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    #15
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    I took 15mg intranasally my first time and it lasted 1.5-2hrs. Then the other half (15mg). I just took the whole 30mg intranasally for my second time ever and it is not even that strong.
     

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    #16
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    Thats because the high is more intense nasally, but doesn't last nearly as long orally. Just pop the pill and swallow.
     

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    #17
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    ^That is what I'm saying, the 30mg intranasally is not as intense as the 15mg was intransally last time I took it.
     

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    #18
    I am sure this topic continues to be beaten to death, but I have recently been prescribed 70 mg of vyvance (for ADHD) and, of course, have experienced that lovely initial lift of emotion. It has been all the more wonderful because I also suffer from depression, and this has been like a damn magic bullet. Alas, I know this feeling will not last (I have titrated up from 30 to 70 mg over the past month and a half), but have been reading on various forums that magnesium supplements, to an extent, can extend one's tolerance to the 'initial' affects of stimulants (i.e., improved mood, and motivation). While, I am sure I will appreciate the continued benefits of focus and task completion (the drug's actual purpose), the ability to enhance my mood/confidence has been, well....

    Anyway, is there any solid proof that taking magnesium supplements actually increases tolerance to the initial affects? I continue to read the same copy and pasted theory about its ability to do so on various forums but I am not sure if it is worth taking them if: (a) it does nothing (b) might be harmful (c) simply potentiates the affects (I'm quite fine with the way they have been working, and don't need to feel any more 'happy').

    If people suggest magnesium, when should it be taken, and at what dosages? I am quite sure that my ultimate answer will be to experiment with antidepressants (I have tried several in the past with little success, but I am interested in Wellbutrin), to tackle my depressive symptoms. I understand that the affects of an AD won't be in the same league as initial stimulant use, but I know it is really the only legit route to dealing with my depression. But, damn Vyvanse, why do you have to be so good!
     

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    #19
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    Magnesium has a few effects in regards to amphetamines. The main (tolerance reducing) efffects comes from the weak NMDA antagonist properties. Personally I think it's ineffective in that regard, because if the NMDA effects were anything to write home about , people would be taking magnesium recreationally.

    The other property of magnesium is somewhat fixing the balance in your body of calcium. I'm not very clear on exactly how it works, but I vaguely remember that AMP throws off the amount of calcium in your body , and in your brain to an extent. Magnesium , calcium, and sodium I believe control voltage-ion channels in your brain. It may have something to do with the general stimulant effects of AMP causes an increase of CA+ in your brain which would in theory increase general activity, and magnesium would lower it. I may be wrong though, it's possible I mixed up a few concepts.

    From personal experience I find magnesium (chelated is the best IMO) does have a noticeable chillout effect when taken on AMP. Taken at night it definitely does take some edge off...

    If you want a real NMDA antagonist , go with ketamine. DXM is pretty sloppy I think... and PCP is wild. Now that I think about it, I dosed K about a week ago for 2 days somewhat heavily, and I noticed a DEFINITE decrease in my (what I thought was permanent) AMP tolerance. To the point where the comedown is not at all as harsh as it used to be.

    -lenses
     

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    #20
    Quote Originally Posted by MyDoorsAreOpen View Post
    Man oh man, do amphetamines ever build up tolerance fast! And it lingers -- after doing 10mg adderall 3 times a week for 3 weeks, even a month without it showed much diminished effects.

    I read on the Lycaeum that taking magnesium supplements keeps one from building up tolerance to amphetamines. I have a bottle of pills that have 1000mg calcium and 400mg magnesium each. Taking one every day that I plan to use adderall has SLOWED the rate that I build up tolerance, but has by no means stopped it. This could be a placebo effect, though. Could the calcium be working against me?

    I just picked up another supplement: 500mg L-tyrosine, a chemical precursor to dopamine. What effect would this chemical have on my subjective experience of 10mg adderall? I ask because I know adderall is a dopamine agonist, but I know that dopamine levels are dangerous to fuck around with.

    I get the adderall by prescription -- the doctor wants me taking two doses of 10mg a day. But I don't want to do that, because I find much of the effectiveness of this drug for me is its ability to make me "fall in love with my schoolwork". It's the awesomest feeling in the world to be reading Organic Chemistry in complete rapture, and knowing that this excitement is totally practical -- I WILL remember that material for a test because at the time, I love it so much.

    PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong, but I get a strong sense this "wonderdrug" effect would be lost if I took 20mg adderall a day. I might score higher on psychological assessments of overall focus, but I subjectively wouldn't feel anything special, and thus I wouldn't be quite as "pumped" to learn. I don't want to get to the point where I can't rely on adderall to save my ass in an academic or work-related pinch anymore. Nor do I want to have to take large doses to achieve this effect.
    I have posted on here before and am in the exact same boat. Fred, my doctor, told me to try the l-tyrosine as well. After taking that, I wasn't satisfied. I read about other users experimenting with DXM treatment. I tried that and it made me feel strange and loopy. My brother is a bodybuilder and mentioned taking a supplement called ampheta-restore to help with tolerance he built up to ECA. I tried Ampheta-Restore and it definitely made a difference in feeling the effects of my medication again. It has l-tyrosine in it, as well as some other stuff. I hope this helps.
     

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    #21
    Someone I know if perscribed to SEVENTY FIVE mg of adderall a day!! I don't see how their heart hasnt shut down. They have been on it since the 4th grade and they are now a junior in college. If they don't take it they can't get out of bed. I personally HATE adderall. even if I eat with it my stomach and joints still kill me and the next day I feel like shit!
     

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    #22
    Bluelighter sense504's Avatar
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    theface ----

    where did you find ampheta-restore?
     

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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by sense504 View Post
    theface ----

    where did you find ampheta-restore?
    Through searching google about adrenal fatigue; amphetarestore.com
     

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    #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by MyDoorsAreOpen View Post
    That said, I notice a striking similarity to marijuana, which I'm guessing is a psychological property of a lot of drugs. When I first started smoking marijuana, I was swept off my feet by the effects. I couldn't think or act normal even if I wanted to, and I loved that about it. But as time went by, I found that this became less and less true. Until someone told me that now that I'm a seasoned toker, I have to consciously CHOOSE to let myself be 'taken' by the drug. And sure enough, I found that if I put myself in the right mindset, I could get back into the same silly, mildly hallucinogenic headspace that used to come automatically as a noobie smoker. Many people in Cannabis Discussion have reported the same thing.
    I still get fucked up from smoking bud. I used to smoke 10x more than I do now (back in the good ol' days I was going through 7g to 14g - dank/hetties - in a day. Now 7g would last me around a month), but still find the same positive effects every time I blaze.

    I think this has something to do with the psychology of familiarity. When some experience is completely novel, you're much taken by it. But once it becomes familiar and predictable, it becomes possible (nay, default!) to not pay it much mind. Giving it one's full attention and giving it power over you becomes optional.
    I think it's called tolerance (biochemical or environmental) and habituation, personally.

    My opinion of d,l-amp (adderall) is that it is very effective when taken sparingly.

    It is possible to take it twice a week without a tolerance increase, but not every week for a month. It could be possible to do that every week for a month for some people, but definitely not for most. Due to this, I only use d,l-amp around once a month, or less frequently than that.

    The medicinal efficacy of adderall tends to wane rather quickly with repetitive administration. With chronic administration (two or three or more times a day, every day, for a year or two), medicinal efficacy of adderall seems to disappear and tolerance seems to become a permanent phenomenon.
     

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    #25
    75 mg of Adderall isn't nothing! I take 50mg Vyvanse and #3 30mg fast acting Ads a day. I don't have a problem sleeping at all.... I've also been though all the add/adhd meds there was while going through school including my fav "Dexies" (fast acting). My tolerance has surged to the point where I can take #2 30mg Ads and my heart will only beat slightly faster. I proved this to my doctor which took my blood pressure every 5 mins for 30 mins and only marked a slight raise! Doctor don't question if I actually use the Ads anymore to say the least. Eyes poked out her head!

    Note:studies have been published that hyperactive children are prone to have a greater natural tolerance to amp the normal kids. I was hyperactive (still can't keep still unless I'm dosed up) It's a curse! My whole fams ADD/ADHD.

    Also as far as magnesium and tolerance is concerned It only works in some people and I believe that it's more or less a lack of that source of vitamin/mineral that contributes much to the finale outcome. I take magnesium eat greens and am on a pretty good diet/drink only bottled water and still have a high tolerance to amphetamine that hasn't reduced!
     

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