1-(3,4-methylenedioxy-phenyl)-2-pyrrolidin-1-yl-pentan-1-one

[Mojo26236]

I'm not requesting any sources, but I've used several popular search engines to find more detailed info on 1-(3,4-methylenedioxy-phenyl)-2-pyrrolidin-1-yl-pentan-1-one, MDPV & MDPK and can't find much more than what's on this forum & erowid. Is there a better search engine to use to find more detailed information on this chemical, or am I using the wrong search criteria?

 

[nanobrain]

there is a better search engine and you are using the wrong search criteria. as such, you - and others searching - should stop.

also, BTW, a case study surfaced where an individual presenting with total loss of spatial coordination admitted to consuming more than 1,000mg per session. the patient is still alive with no new obvious signs of neurological / cognitive impairment, ie those which were not there beforehand - save for the spatial thing.

 

[EN21]

Hugo:

Data is here.HPLC looks perfect,no impurity present,the UV spectra does not alter from peakend to peakstart.But the NMR shows an impurity present (about 10mol% ),I have a hard time guessing what it could be.Pyrrolidine is very possible but the patterns do not add up,although some peaks are probably hidden under the other stuff making it difficult to interpret.

The impurity lacks the aromat but has still something "aminic".I'm trying to do TLC now to at least rule out the pyrroldidine.

If you're interested in the spectras you can PM me your emailadress (I think pdf's don't work in the PM section)

Did anybody make a GC/MS of that batch? An other idea is to spray the TLC plate with bromocresole green solution. It colors basic compounds blue and acidic ones, yellow. So pyrrolidine should produce a blue spot, where nothing was visible just under the UV lamp. (pyrrolidine alone should not be visible at TLC with simple UV detection, I think) Additionally the smell of pyrrolidine is so characteristic and strong that I think one could smell 10mole%. BTW. The smell of pyrrolidine reminds a little of sperma. (No joke!)

 

[hugo24]

Agree on the smell,bahh Or a bit like mousecrap.Basification of the MDPV batch and smell on it could be of help,good idea.

So far,I'm awaiting for my reference Pyrrolidin.I used only Piperidin but it should run similar in TLC (and it does where I expected it).MDPV is rather lipophic,also matches exepctations.

How sensitive is this Bromocresol green method? I used the Chlorine chamber/ KI/starch spray method which is extremely sensitive to amines,plus often the Chlorine chamber alone makes UV negative compounds UV positive!I have a bit of a mess still because the solvent contains Ammonia,will look for an alternative here,but as of now,the impurity does not look like pyrrolidine.

The MS+ btw is only showing the right mass.

 

[EN21]

The bromocresole green method is pretty sensitive, if the reagent is prepared exactly and it is indeed breen ans not blue (pH adjustion in the reagent).
As far I think you use the HCl salts for TLC analysis. I'd suggest to extract a little freebase and use that for TLC analysis. As eluent I'd suggest CHCl3 / MeOH 9:1. This normally works fine. Now you can spray with bromocresole green. Ammonia addition makes amines run better but as you already mentioned, the problem with bromocresolegreen.

The MS+ btw is only showing the right mass

Do you also have a GCMS or only a MS?

 

[hugo24]

The plot thickens.CH2Cl2/MeOH 9:1 shows a pure Product at about Rf 0.5,at about 0.1 theres a Cl2/KI-Starch positive spot looking like reference Piperidine (still couldn't find my pyrrolidine refernce).

But the clearest sign comes from the smell test (good suggestion!),basification liberates the typical Pyrrolidine smell (can't be from the product).I know that smell so damned well that I would give it now a 80% chance that the impurity IS Pyrrolidin.

Would anyone agree that it is not toxic in these amounts?

 

[raybeez]

Pyrrolidine is found naturally in the leaves of tobacco and carrot.

Anyone have any hard numbers on the actual quantities of pyrrolidine present in carrots/tobacco/other things routinely consumed by people? I'm interested in how it compares to the % present in this mdpv...

 

[nuke]

http://www.scorecard.org/chemical-profiles/summary.tcl?edf_substance_id=123-75-1

in the minute amounts present (2-4 mg per 500mg), i doubt you would encounter any problems.

 

[Dondante]

PYRROLIDINE
LD50 250mg/kg in mammals

http://caligula.bcs.deakin.edu.au/bcs_admin/msds/msds_docs/Pyrrolidine.pdf

SIGNS AND SYMPTOMS OF EXPOSURE
Material is extremely destructive to tissue of the mucousmembranes and upper respiratory tract, eyes, and skin.Inhalation may result in spasm, inflammation and edema of thelarynxand bronchi, chemical pneumonitis, and pulmonary edema.Symptoms of exposure may include burning sensation, coughing,wheezing, laryngitis, shortness of breath, headache, nausea, andvomiting. Exposure can cause: Nausea, dizziness, and headache.

Maybe it can cause more damage when smoked? It doesn't look like a couple mg would be too toxic.

 

[djfriendly]

Remember, there is only the one report of acute toxicity, as far as I know. Not discounting that experience, but perhaps it was an anamoly, despite the reporter's previous experience with MDPV.

 

[Dondante]

Anyone know roughly the solubility of this compound in water?

Edit: Found answer .... Apparently F&B made a 10mg/mL solution.

 

[Helios.]

Improving MDPV

MDPV, carbonyl reduction -->

 

[Coolio]

edit: sorry Smyth! so hard not to discuss synth in this forum.

Is there anything in the literature about non-ketone versions of these compounds?

 

[Helios.]

Hal

Hg/Zn, HCl.

 

[Riemann Zeta]

Alright, without any direct synthesis information (I have never even inquired as to the synthesis of MDPV) and avoiding discussion of chemical reactions.

I believe the pyrrolidine impurity is little threat at mg to sub mg oder of magnitude levels. Larger levels of pyrrolidine are considered mutagenic, so it could be carcinogenic--especially when smoked (so why not just it orally)--but I don't think an acute exposure would be especially dangerous.

As for analogues, a priori, I would estimate the hydoxyl analogue to be inactive (perhaps in manifested peripheral side effects--any MDPV sides would be a little amplified).

I assume, based upon reasonably well-known SAR trends, that the alpha methylene analogue might be a tad stronger than the keto compound, as per ethylcathinone versus N-ethylamphetamine. However, I assume the methylene analogue also acts as a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, as per methylphenidate. One compound that would be interesting to assess is 3,4-methylenedioxy-N-pyrrolidyl-amphetamine (MDPA). It might be one hell of a DA reuptake inhibitor...for those into methylphenidate, this might be equivalent or better.

 

[yoyoman]

One thing i've noticed that i haven't seen mentioned - I get very mild visual effects, more related to higher doses (not THAT high though..even regular >10mg orally) mostly enhanced color perception.. and clearer vision.

Now once (week ago maybe?) I was in one of those moods where "i'm tired and don't know why, so i'm gonna do some dumb shit to wake me up!" so i popped some adderall, a lil dexedrine, then sniffed some MDPV..kinda before the amphets really kicked in, well of course they all kicked in heh.. and so i grabbed that phenibut jar and filled capsules and slammed those down along with a couple klonopin hehe.. felt kinda overly-dopaminergenic. I noticed this thing about my vision being *really clear*, also my eyes would focus from near to far very very fast, ultra clear eyesight, and walking around in a store (benzo's phenibut kicked in then) just my vision clarity was 'wide', peripheral vision and just looking down hallways in a store everything was just damn damn clear..

Well its been a week later i haven't had any more MDPV, notice its slowly going away but my eyes still focus real fast, actually reminds me of when I take DMT, sped up..some part of my brain having to do with vision + combined with when i come down from a high dose of DOC where everything looks ultra clear (but, with a slower framerate), but whereas DMT reduced the 'quality' (more basic geometry) and made up for it in fluidity/higher framerate, well its like..both, high framerate/high clarity. I'll notice it out and about doing normal things, just cause i'll be talking to whoever and focus my eyes elsewhere / the speed.. fluidity..

Long while back with the first batch i did the smoking thing, after enough puff's the colors would be god damn vivid.. suprised i havne't seen this kinda stuff mentioned.

 

[hugo24]

I would say about 3% +/-1% Pyrrolidine are in this MDPV batch.So in 500mg are 15mg-the bodys MAO can handle this easily.

 

[nanobrain]

and if you are coadministering selegeline...

 

[fastandbulbous]

Anyone know roughly the solubility of this compound in water?

Edit: Found answer .... Apparently F&B made a 10mg/mL solution.

Actually, it's not difficult to produce a 20mg/ml solutionm so the solubility in water is def greater than 1g in 50ml

 

[Dondante]

Thanks.

And especially thanks to Hugo for the analyses. I'll report back experience with this compound when I have a chance.