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The Big and Dandy Endogenous Psychedelics Thread (mega-merged)!

Ximot

Ximot

Bluelighter
Joined
Dec 5, 2003
Messages
3,446
by the pineal gland through spending several days in complete isolation in a dark room, where thus sensory input is drastically reduced to next to none. based on research done by mantak chia.

has anyone heard any first-hand experiences of such a "dark room retreat" or even done one?
 
And look at how much people trip out whenever they don't sleep for days on end without the aid of drugs.

This 5-meo-dmt thing is interesting though, i wonder if anyone on here has any experience with it.

Solitary confinment must be fucked up then.
 
This might be the reason sensory deprivation tanks have the effect they do.

They work in a way that's got more in common with ketamine and dissociatives, than a 5HT psychedelic. Both ketamine and sensory deprivation tanks work by reducing the amount of external info that reaches the brain, to the point where there is effectivly no external input, and all your brain has to work with is it's own internal rhythms and feedback loops.

With isolation tanks, it's a K-hole without the K!
 
So your more or less running around in your head racing through all your thoughts and memories, freak out.
 
Re: the body's own 5-meo-dmt production

Ximot said:
by the pineal gland through spending several days in complete isolation in a dark room, where thus sensory input is drastically reduced to next to none. based on research done by mantak chia.

has anyone heard any first-hand experiences of such a "dark room retreat" or even done one?
Click to expand...

I haven't had any first-hand experience of this. Here's a link though. Ananda makes some very interesting statements:

SELF PINOLINE-DMT PRODUCTION, THROUGH LIGHT ISSOLATION, Access Into Neo-Think:

7 years after the bicycle accident that propelled me into 5meoDMT interactivity online surfing into Neo Think, I sought to test what the Civilisation of the Universe had revealed in Integrated Thinking.

Beginning 6 years ago, I locked myself up, in absolute darkness for 14 days. This floods the brain with Melatonin, and forces the pineal gland to produce and be active.

Once there is a threshold of Melatonin, then Pinoline results. After some 4-7 days 5-meo-DMT awakens. One can see in 3 dimensional Holon pictures, as the thoughts behind language, exactly as in the Civilisation of the Universe lapses I had earlier.

After some 10-12 days one starts to see in infra red, and ultra violet, one can actually run accross the room and touch a person, by seeing their heat patterns. The Holon Images exteriorise and one is walking in a Virtual Reality, which appears to be the DNA language macro uploaded, and interactive.

We are in the process of conducting experiments, which may enable us to verify that in combination with sound and breath, the genetic code can become consciously reprogrammable. Now that is Non-Addictive Unified Self Power, Internal Technology, which could lead to major implications in value production in immortality etc (for some objective views on this, another posting is coming), as opposed to exterior technology such as nano-tech.
Click to expand...

Rest of article HERE.

Ananda also runs darkroom retreats. At least, he used to. Dunno if he still does tho.
 
After some 10-12 days one starts to see in infra red, and ultra violet, one can actually run accross the room and touch a person, by seeing their heat patterns. The Holon Images exteriorise and one is walking in a Virtual Reality, which appears to be the DNA language macro uploaded, and interactive
Click to expand...
Wow.. it's good to see that psychosis is still alive and well...

Now, yes, there is evidence that 5-MeO-DMT is produced in the brain, likewise DMT... but I don't see the connection. 5-MeO-DMT is a product of serotonin, which is produced during the day and for the first hour of darkness, then it's productions rapidly decreases... And even if you disagree with that, melatonin doesn't keep being produced in higher and higher levels in darkness... in an animal exposed to constant darkness (or blind people), melatonin production continues to cycle in a psuedo-circadian fashion, though not perfectly.
 
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5-Meo-DMT is also produced in the pineal... it is also probably produced in the Raphe Nuclei (where serotonin comes from)... and I wouldn't hold onto the Spirit Molecule too tightly... I'm under the impression Strassman claims that DMT is released during near-death expeirences, a claim that is in no way tested.
 
^^ didnt the unioversity of alabama or somewhere down south prove dmt is released at the moment of death
 
I strongly doubt it, but I'll change my tune if someone shows me a reference
 
BilZ0r said:
I'm under the impression Strassman claims that DMT is released during near-death expeirences, a claim that is in no way tested. [/B]
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He doesn't claim that it is, its one of the many speculations he makes about the possible functions of DMT in the brain. The similatities of NDEs and a DMT experience are striking, but as you said, this theory has not been tested.
 
^^As far as I've read, a NDE is much closer to a dissociative-like experience than a DMT trip. IV ketamine is said to reliably produce a NDE-like trip. Even Strassman acknowledges that only a few of his DMT volunteers experienced NDE-like trips.

Strassman's book is interesting, but as far as I could tell, its scientific value is pretty well near zero.
 
The similatities of NDEs and a DMT experience are striking
Not in my experience

I had a NDE at age 13 (started with memories generated from a POV well removed from where I was), right through to a return to 'normal' experiential memory in the A&E dept of a hospital, and it's remarkably close to a couple of experiences with ketamine (senses shut down in a certain order, the last one being hearing until you're a disembodied conciousness). Although things like the pace of onset with 5-methoxy DMT is similar, it didn't have much at all in common with what I remember of the NDE; 5-methoxy DMT doesn't have the opiate like sense of calm detachment that ketamine produces, which was the most pronounced aspect of the NDE.

In a roundabout way, it was that experience that got me interested in altered states of conciousness (and also why it took me so long to try ketamine, given its use in producing NDE's)
 
STrassamn isnt talking about 5-meo-dmt, hes talking about n,n dmt. i read the book a while ago and dont remeber everything he had to say on the subject, but the feeling of another concious entity is common to both experiences
 
I also would lean toward ketamine being more like a NDE, I found this:
https://bandura.sbs.arizona.edu/login/consciousness/report_web_detail.aspx?abs=465

Because we know how ketamine acts in the brain, this provides us with an understanding of how NDE’s arise. Ketamine blocks ion channels attached to NMDA receptors, and causes a blockage so that salts cannot enter the cell. The neurotransmitter glutamate crosses the gap between cells and binds to NMDA receptors, turning the chemical key which should allow ions to enter the cell. However, while the tunnel is blocked by ketamine, this is not possible.

NDE’s also involve blockade of NMDA receptors. A sudden fall in O2 or blood sugar, a rise in CO2 (e.g. during a heart attack), and other factors cause a flood release of glutamate. This over-excites cells which die. This is called ‘excito-toxicity’. The glutamate flood also activates apoptotic genes which trigger the cell to commit suicide. Ketamine can prevent this brain damage via the same mechanism which is important to its psychedelic effects: blockade of channels so that ‘the ion sea’ cannot rush into the cells. This led to the prediction that the brain would have its own, natural protective mechanisms against the glutamate flood (Jansen 2001). There would be a huge evolutionary advantage in the development of a protective mechanism involving a counter-flood of natural NMDA receptor-complex blockers, producing ketamine-like NDE effects. While a person is having an NDE at the psychological level, the brain is thus protecting itself from excito-toxic damage. Natural blockers include NAAG (N-acetyl-aspartyl-glutamate), magnesium and kynurenic acid, all of which protect cells from excito-toxic damage.
People deprived of oxygen for long periods, e.g. after a heart attack, and who report NDE’s, sometimes survive with unimpaired brains. This lack of damage may result from an inherited mechanism for blocking over-excitation. Thus people who can have an NDE may be less likely to suffer brain damage. These may be the same group who report psychedelic experiences with ketamine.
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DMT does have its own 'dissociative' effect, to me its like it allows the big network in your brain to 'split apart' yet ..somehow they are still connected in a way and sensory input isn't necessarily cut off.
 
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