Opioids How to use a Kratom FST? I googled and searched here, no help.

Number48 said:

You're taking too much. Too much FST and you won't feel anything, just sick. Try 15 drops. I know the company you ordered from and their products are very legitimate, and they always give "bonus" amounts, for whatever you order. The extra in the FST bottle really is more extract, not just more alcohol or filler.

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Ohhh thank you @Number48! From what you said you do know the company. So if you take too much, it doesnt bind properly to the receptors? ill try it youre way, but i just took a soma an hour ago with 2mg xanax, and im worried about the interactions. And also I took 50mg Vyvanse at 9:50AM. should i not try this now? or should i wait? ill do what you said with the 15 drops because i do believe you know the company. 0 shipping for me... but should i wait? My friend as you saw said mix it with water and take it like a shot... but i cant stand the alcohol taste. he just likes the convenience of the FST.

I had emailed the company and they apologized that i did not get he relaxing.. aroma that I desired so theyve shipped another 3mL tincture via USPS priority mail with tracking number to me for free. I wish they had let me try another product tho, but hey! Maybe I can get it to work and I just got another one FREE. so I cant complain at all.

IMO the best extracts won't be full spectrum, they'll be focused on certain alkaloids...

Pegasus said:

IMO the best extracts won't be full spectrum, they'll be focused on certain alkaloids...

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I can see that, Ive seen products focusing on 7-Hydroxy Mitragynine, Mitragyinine, acetyl mitragynine i think and more. from what ive read. the 7OHM is by far the most potent alkaloid when it comes to binding to opiate receptors. I have also read that taking all of the alkaloids; for example, mixing extracts with crushed leaves etc, give the best of both worlds. I have also read that the term "full spectrum" doesnt always mean "full spectrum" in many cases, its used only to identify a tincture. I am not saying that some do not have the full spectrum of alkaloids, but a lot of them dont. Also IMO I think it all depends on the person and what they like. ie my friend SWEARS on this FST i have where for me it has not done much. so who really knows? Im just glad I get the real stuff on the 15th.

I was told by to try 10 drops mixed with water in the cup and just chug it. (the FST that is) When I first did it, like i said, i dropped it in the cup and put it under my tongue until I could not stand that alcohol anymore and iwas decent for 20 or so minutes. but he told me how to do it like i said and i get another FST free, even though i wasnted the powder and such, but frees free.

If you don't feel anything from 100mg of oxycodone (I read your other thread) then Kratom tinctures are not for you. They are opioids indeed but the effects are nowhere near comparable to 100mg+ of oxycodone.

I think your tolerance is just too high to feel any effects.

But the weird thing is i dont do opiates anymore, the last time was a month ago and that was with the oxycodone. but i dont experience withdrawals. i just dont get it. and prior to that trial, it had been another couple of months without opiates.

Tolerance does not disappear entirely after a month. It can take many years for it to fully fall off.

People experience varuying levels of withdrawals - some more severe than others. You probably are just strong enough to wait them out and attribute the effects to a bad day or whatever.

I just thought this FST would do soemthing because the friend who told me about it does IV H and other things, and he says it works, thats the only reason i believed him. and i mentioned before that for some reason i associated euphoria with pain relief, so thats my bad. but still, thats why i asked about this mainly, and the closed methadone thread, i just worded things incorrectly. I had spinal surgery earlier this year and was weaned off and now theres scar tissues wrapping around my nerves along with my DDD. and since MRIs wont show that kind thing I cant get the strength of meds that I need.

I finally got the FST to work! and I would highly recommend (A specific site that I will not name on here nor in PM). It came as 3mL as I mentioned, I i put about 20 drops into a little cup and mixed with water and chugged. amazing.... sadly though, out of the two FST's I got, I had only 4 good doses. I just obtained Thai powder (no extract) 30 Grams from a local store, I took 15 grams, and am waiting to see how it goes. but as of monday.. I wont have to worry about messing around with Kratom anymore... I am going back on strong ass opiates.. 8mg Dilaudid every 4 hours and 40mg oxycontin every 8 hours. I had a microdiscectomy in feb of this year, but I had to go to the ER yesterday and I got a CT scan of my thoracic region. EVERY DISC in my thoracic is COLLAPSING... they IVed me in the ER with 4mg Dilaudid, and said that they could not prescribed anything higher than 10/320 percocet, but monday I see my other doctor who will get an MRI and prescribe me better meds. So I will not need to mess around with Kratom anymore.. But now I am EXTREMELY depressed because I spent so long GETTING OFF hardcore opiates and finally got to the point where i would just screw around with Kratom or whatever.... now I am told that I will be on opiates for the rest of my life... I am only 24... I see my last post mentioned that I was going to get an MRI, but the doc wouldnt order it, but now they will because of the preliminary CT report.. man.. years ago i would have LOVED the thought of just paying copays for oxycontin and dilaudid.. but now.. I dont want it.. but I can not function. UGH. I know this is off topic, I suppose this thread can be closed now, unless anyone has any kind of advice for me? I would greatly appreciate ANY advice..

sekio said:

If you don't feel anything from 100mg of oxycodone (I read your other thread) then Kratom tinctures are not for you. They are opioids indeed but the effects are nowhere near comparable to 100mg+ of oxycodone.

I think your tolerance is just too high to feel any effects.

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I was recently prescribed oxycodone IR 15mg again. And my tolerance has goen WAY down. Its true what you said about my old post, but when I took the new roxies, I took 3. so 45 mg. it almost made me sick, so now I can actually get relief at the proper dose. I also tried 15g of crushed thai leaves today to get that (full experience) that people talk about, and I def. prefer Kratom Extracts. the tinctures definitely work for me now, but its not worth the price. But i dont know if id rather pay money of risk becoming a full blown addict like I was. What are your thoughts?

If you prefer the more opioidergic tinctures and extracts over the leaf I would advise you to work out a suitable opiate-based pain control regime with your doctor.. long-term use of Kratom will lead to more severe dependence than restricted-dose opiate therapy, and of course it is more expensive and not covered by any insurance.

sekio said:

If you prefer the more opioidergic tinctures and extracts over the leaf I would advise you to work out a suitable opiate-based pain control regime with your doctor.. long-term use of Kratom will lead to more severe dependence than restricted-dose opiate therapy, and of course it is more expensive and not covered by any insurance.

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Very true. I dont know much about long term use of Kratom causing more of a dependence than the restricted dose opiate therapy. With my history of addiction, neither of these options are very good for me. But I know I am less likely to want to use an alternative ROA for Kratom. I actually just ordered an ounce of "Sumatra Red Vein Kratom" and from what Ive read about that type, its similar to bali powder, but the red vein supposedly has more sedating and pain relieving effects which I can use for my anxiety and pain. I dont really mind the powder, its just doing a toss n wash can be irritating at times. but this ounce of what i ordered was less than half the price of an FST. Plus it comes with a free sample. So i figured it would be worth a shot. I just dont want Thai ever again. I had 15g of crushed leaf thai today and it was ... less than I wanted. It didnt really relive my pain. I heard red vein types are more sedating than the white vein. I dont know much about Sumatra Kratom though, but from what I have read it has good reviews for not being an extract. I will be getting it Tuesday. so we will see. I see my pain doctor on wednesday after I see social security disability. As mentioned, he has me on 15mg oxy IR now, but next visit, he said we were going to talk long acting again. I think Id like the long acting again now that my tolerance has gone down. But I do not want duragesic again nor mscontin. And Oxycontin is cheaper than Opana ER, but he would rather prescribed the later. But I am going to try this new Kratom (and possibly perform an extract of it on my own). But maybe once he gets me stable on a, ER opiate I wont require the roxys as much as I need them now, and as you said, it would be cheaper to go this route. So we will see. I am just glad I see him wednesday. do you have any references in regards to long term kratom use creating a more sever dependence than dose restricted opiate therapy? I would be interested in reading it. as mentioned, I do not know the long term effects of Kratom use. Thank you for your responses btw

All I know is that most "pure" opiates are mostly restricted to activity at the mu/delta/kappa opiate receptors. Mitragynine &c and the other alkaloids in Kratom and tinctures are also known to interfere with adrenergic receptors (sometimes acting a s a stimulant due to a2A autoreceptor antagonism, sometimes as an anti-anxiety sedative due to a1 agonism, depending on alkaloid blend and dose) which are upregulated/flooded with (nor)epinephrine in mu-agonist withdrawal. In fact clonidine is a treatment for acute anxiety symptoms because it helps suppress the body's release of norepinephrine. (It's an a2a agonist.) So withdrawing from kratom would be doubly severe as plain opiate withdrawal - as would be expected from the 'added' sedative/stimulatory effect of kratom.

Perhaps you could look into low dose Fentanyl patches or even low dose buprenorphine/methadone. All 3 of those have relatively long half lives and should theoretically work for chronic pain. (I'm no doctor, though.)