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Misc Tobacco, usage in his sacred way

kingqueen1

kingqueen1

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 8, 2010
Messages
213
Since i have stopped chronically to smoke tobacco, i have some time, once or twice a week, the wish to roll a joint, its mostly pollen, hemp and some tobacco, i feel really in a different vibe everytime i am smoking now, i cannot say its psychedelic but it does put me in a weird state, tobacco does have something that i have been missing all these years when i was smoking all the time.

The tobacco i have is organic and free of additives but still i dont think it the same tobacco as was using native american but i guess it was binding as well on acetylcholine receptor ( the one that nicotine bind to )

I wonder if some other people experienced some weird effect from tobacco after cessation and on the other plan if there is some ressource on old use of tobacco.
 
Could you be more specific/clearer about what you're asking? Lots of people experience effects after they stop smoking - usually an intense and overwhelming need to start smoking again.
 
Smoking tobacco regardless of organic or lack of additives i believe still is possibly harmful and or fatal long term. .

I use tobacco too but i think its important to factor in how risky our behavior is.

I think the native americans had tobacco with higher nicotine.

Both tobaccos contain the main component nicotine which binds to mach and nach (acetylcholine) receptors and maoi inhibitors called beta carbolines like harmaline *

*However, there is exponentially more evidence for nicotine. Its unclear how these form from smoking or exactly that i could find how much is in tobacco only that in some studies smoking was correlated with slight maoi inhibition.

Also they consumed tobacco differently i believe i read of enemas(unsure how common) smoking large amounts ect esp for shamanic purposes.
 
If I remember right, wild/Native American tobacco (NOT American Spirit) has about 6% nicotine, whereas mainstream tobacco is more along the lines of 1%-2%. Might be off on this, though.
 
There are also few species that are similar to common tobacco plant, Nicotiana tabacum but there few more species that are most likely used by native americans, such as Nicotiana rustica which has about 2-14% nicotine and also has higher amount of beta-carbolines which might account for sacred purpose use.

There is also Nicotiana glauca which contains Anabasine, an alkaloid similar to Nicotine.

And there is also "Indian tobacco" which is similar to regular tobacco plant and is called Lobelia inflata which contains an interesting set of alkaloids, one of which is Lobeline that acts as a VMAT2 ligand, releasing the goodies like dopamine and serotonin, this herb, Indian tobacco, may be useful for opioid withdrawals as I heard.

As far as I know, native Americans also smoke Willow bark which contains Salycilic acid mostly and may be health beneficial in many cases.

I go to sweat lodge Inipi ceremonies a lot so the shaman would always bring some interesting traditional stuff. :D
 
Volsam have you found any research papers that specifically measure beta carbolines in regular dry tobacco? I tried endlessly and found nothing.
 
d1nach said:
Volsam have you found any research papers that specifically measure beta carbolines in regular dry tobacco? I tried endlessly and found nothing.
Click to expand...

I imagine it varies a lot depending on the quality of the crop and the method of preparation. Apparently the commercially available cigarettes show the least amount of MAOI, whereas loose leaf tobacco would show the highest levels of it.

There is a link - http://tobaccocontrol.bmj.com/content/early/2011/06/01/tc.2010.040287

Hope it helps! :)
 
A nice cigar or a pipe of fine tobacco is much preferable to the filth that is in cigarettes. Much more conducive to having a nice experience than something to habitually smoke.
 
sekio said:
A nice cigar or a pipe of fine tobacco is much preferable to the filth that is in cigarettes. Much more conducive to having a nice experience than something to habitually smoke.
Click to expand...

Indeed so! I used to be a ciggie smoker but gave that up years ago. Still enjoy occasional cigar and / or pipe tobacco though! %)
 
My brother has been vaping nicotine solution lately and he seems to be under the impression that it is overall far safer than regular cigarettes regarding risk of heart disease, lung cancer and other chronic health problems and I hope he's right but is he??

I mean is pure vaped nicotine solution without additives really THAT much safer than cigarettes?

It would seem that overall it would be less harmful what with all the other chemicals that they put in cigarettes, but I tend to still think that any nicotine inhaled in any form habitually would still have some of those same risks.
 
I believe Its not about all chemicals they put into cigarettes that just sells "organic" or native or whatever you wanna call it cigs.

Smoking tobacco is one of the leading causes of preventable death period. By overwhelming evidence.

Is nicotine habit forming yes. But thats a moral problem.

Its not about the nicotine its about smoking tobacco.
 
I mean is pure vaped nicotine solution without additives really THAT much safer than cigarettes?
Click to expand...


Nobody complains that nicotine gum, mints, or patches are carcinogenic or unduly toxic, so vaporized nicotine cannot be far off, as vaporized nicotine lacks any of the reactive stuff that is present in tobacco smoke (benzo[a]pyrene, cyanide, aldehydes, benzene, carbon monoxide, ammonia etc.)
 
I used to use tobacco in a weed pipe because i was broke in highschool.

Smoking tobacco in a pipe, bong, or peice of paper could kill you.
 
I've always wondered if Nicotiana Rustica is in any way more inebriating than other tobacco or psychedelics since it's been used as a visionary tool by Native Americans.

I know someone above said it has a lot of "beta carbolines" that could account for its sacred usage but I don't know what that means. What are beta-carbolines and why would they make the tobacco better for sacred purposes?

I'd assume it's not all that intoxicating as it's legal so everyone would probably be buying it and smoking it if it was and I've never heard of anyone doing that but who knows.

I smoked some ceremonial tobacco in a traditional Native American sweat lodge a few months ago and I guess it just added to the experience a little, but it was really the intense heat that put me into another state, both during and afterwards.
 
Beta carbolines may be the general structure of harmala alkaloids like harmine, harmane, ect.

These alkaloids could be monoamine oxidase inhibitors.

Probably the most common use of harmala alkaloids are to "activate" ayahausca.

These beta carbolines here are a hypothesis as to why is it so hard to stop smoking or why nicotine replacement might not be as reinforcing.

However, these may be formed during smoke.

Or they may be in the tobacco.

Smoking is associated with a slightly reduced mao activity

Without writting you a novel basically beta carbolines may or may not contribute the effects of tobacco. However, the evidence of nicotine being the primary drug psychoactive in tobacco is much much expodentially greater.
 
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