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www.drugwarfacts.org???

CuPillar

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 14, 2002
Messages
4,544
addiction

i just went on a site, www.drugwarfacts.org and it said that nicotine is more addictive than herion, and that it is harder to get off the addiction of alcohol, than herion
do these results look a bit shady to you??

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not at all. this really isn't that contentious. ask any user of heroin and they'll tell you the cigs are far harder to give up. ask any full blown alcoholic and they'll tell you that one of the hardest parts about that addiction is that all around you people are using it, in fact for many parts of society it is almost compulsory.
 
i can second what johnboy said, ive read in many places that nicotine is harder to quit than heroin. you might also be interested to read up on nicotine and brain receptors which are specifically stimulated by nicotine and a possible solution to nicotine addiction ?
 
Taken from http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/addiction/addiction_journal1.shtml:

Nicotine 100
Ice, Glass (Methamphetamine smoked) 99
Crack 98
Crystal Meth (Methamphetamine injected) 93
Valium (Diazepam) 85
Quaalude (Methaqualone) 83
Seconal (Secobarbital) 82
Alcohol 81
Heroin 80
Crank (Amphetamine taken nasally) 78
Cocaine 72
Caffeine 68
PCP (Phencyclidine) 57
Marijuana 21
Ecstasy (MDMA) 20
Psilocybin Mushrooms 18
LSD 18
Mescaline 18

Now these are "relative rankings, based on the experts' scores for each substance".

However, I can remember reading a physical addictiveness list where nicotine tops the list, followed by cocaine, and heroin appears around ninth on the list... I'm trying to find a link to it if I can, so take that info with a grain of salt for now. Gimme a few days and I'll see if I can get some more info ;)
 
I think what people sometimes get confused with is the difference between "addictiveness", and the "relative danger" of a drug. By relative danger, I mean the ratio between a threshold dose, and an overdose. This is partly because for such a long time we've had the "heroin is evil" line shoved down our throats that a lot of people still believe it. And to complicate matters further, the relative danger is also affected by the legality of a drug - nicotine is controlled and you know exactly how much you're having, whereas it's almost impossible to know how pure your heroin is.

No substance is more "evil" than another - evil is a qualitative term. Addictiveness is quantifiable, and so a comparison can be made.

I've probably gone off on a tangent slightly here, but I think my main point is to be careful about stats, and to always remember to check the sources and find out if they've been obtained scientifically, or if they're merely someone's opinion presented as fact.
 
Also a reminder that the word "addicition" isn't rarely used any more.

The hep term is "dependancy" and a distinction is made betweeen physical dependancy and psychological dependancy.
 
Excellent thread! I must say I'd personally put smoked glass WAY above nicotine in terms of compulsive cravings for additional doses in the short term. I was very surprised.

BigTrancer :)
 
BigTrancer said:
Excellent thread! I must say I'd personally put smoked glass WAY above nicotine in terms of compulsive cravings for additional doses in the short term. I was very surprised.

BigTrancer :)

Yes, and what about nitrous??
As soon as you come out of your 'little nitrous land', you want another, and another, and another.....
 
sorry bout being stupid, this is what highschool health has taught me
 
Common Sense for Drug Policy - the group behind the site, is one of the most organised and influential non-user law reform advocacy lobby & activism group in the world. Representative from CSDP often presented the law reform argument on the (US) PBS documentary series Drug Wars, which was screened by the ABC here at the start of the year. Another offshoot of CSDP is the Media Awareness Program www.mapinc.org , which monitors media comment- mostly print, but also websites, and transcripts of TV and radio - about drug issues right around the world, recently celebrated the posting of 100000 articles to the site.
That said, I think comparing "addictiveness" is a little pointless - although their sites are partially picked at middle-class academics etc, and making them realise that tere is really very litytle sense to drug policy, as some of the effects the establishment rail about in relation to illicti drugs can also be created by perfectly leagl substances like nicotine.
While it isn't a peer-based organisation, user input into their messages is a fundamental part of what they do.
Part of the problem with these sort of measurements is that, on many levels, comparing licit and illicti substances is a bit like apples and oranges. The fact is, we really can't tell a lot of the time what is an effect of frequent use of an illicit drug, and what is an effect of the circumstances users are forced to use in.
If you know you can always go to the shop for ciggies, does that make giving up easier or harder?
What impact does the fact that many opiate users only go through withdrawal because of the financial pressurews of expensive heroin. If you really love using - whether it be heroin, ice or even pot - but know you can't afford it, does that make the physical symptoms seem worse?
What about when we're coerced into it (parents have been known to padlock their using offspring to beds to force withdrawal), or when we go through it in prison?
Yes, its important to realise that many different substances can cause physical dependence and the devlopment of habitual behaviours, but only when a user has real choice about whether they will use or not will we really nbe able to compare the intensity of experiences.

Speaking personally, I find opiate withdrawal much harder than giving up cigarettes. As I have a compromised immune system anyway, the physical effects - runny nose, nightsweats, nausea & vomiting, runny poo, aches & pains - tend to hit me really hard. And I really like using, so often feel shitty because its a case of "can't afford it", not "i wouldn't mind taking a break for a while".

Now methadone withdrawal - that tops the chart. Intense symptoms can be experienced for a month (that's quite a common lngth of time actually), then symptoms of a lesser intensity for another couple of months after that. And when you're reducing, as soon as your dose drops below about 20mg, you tend to chew through your dose quickly, and experience mild withdrawal every morning. I find myself crying, having panic attacks, losing my ability to concentrate; an SSRI anti-depressant is often prescribed now as part of the withdrawal process.
The types of fits and hallucinations seen in the movie of Trainspotting (and described even better in the book) often accompany "jumping off"oses of methadone say, over 40mg daily.
It would take a huge heroin habit to create those sort of symptoms upon withdrawal.

While many users tell you exactly how difficult methadone withdrawal can be, you don't really know until you're in the middle of it, and so affordable opiates seem a very attractive option if you can't face a heroin withdrawal, or need to work or look after kids or sick family , and don't have the time to set aside to go through withdrawal.
 
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