Mental Health Rolling with ADD

First of all, I would like to thank everyone on bluelight for creating such a wonderful resource. This is the first question I have ever had that wasn't answered on another thread. I find that amazing. Now onto the query.

Recently I was diagnosed with very severe ADD after 19 years of life. Apparently I have gotten through high school on exemplary intelligence alone. I am happy and healthy with no long-term mental or physical health problems aside from the ADD. Since around 9th grade I have enjoyed smoking cannabis several times a month, as well as occasionally indulging in something stronger. I have always thoroughly researched any substance use, and taken (what were in my mind) adequate safety precautions. I have never been addicted, or even been close to addiction. My experience includes cannabis, alcohol, nicotine, psilocibin, LSD, tested pure crystal MDMA, codeine, oxycodone, hydrocodone, recreational amphetamine (60mg adderall), heroin, and methamphetamine. I have used MDMA 7 times once 200mg in two doses, every other time 100mg recreational amphetamine 3 times 60 mg, and meth once 5 months ago, tested pure, 30mg. I have never binged on any substance and have had access to very very pure substances. I have only re-dosed on a stimulant once(MDMA). After diagnosis I have found that I metabolize Vyvanse very quickly, and need large doses for help with focus. To start with I have been put on 60mg of Vyvanse per day, 30 when I wake, and 30 around noon. I will try to avoid the re-dose, however it is expected to be necessary 2-3days per week. I will try to stay off of the Vyvanse on weekends, however with my schedule I probably will end up needing it 4-6 days per week. I had suspicion about my natural tolerance to stimulants, as on the same dose my companions were always up longer, had much much more trouble sleeping, and much less self-control(in terms of actions while inebriated, not addiction). Apparently this is tied in with my ADD. I do not know if the tolerance to the stronger stimulants is happenstance or if it is tied to my ADD as well, I was nervous about asking my doctors .

I have only been on the Vyvanse for a little over a week, and the first thing on my mind as usual is safety. I have already been taking supplements to attempt to prevent, or at least slow down the development of tolerance. Currently I take 100% of the DV (I don't have the bottles in front of me, and i can't remember actual weights) of magnesium, calcium and zinc, as well as taking a multivitamin, and 6mg of melatonin between 7 and 8 at night. I try to get to sleep before 10 on most nights as my schedule demands rising at 6 in the morning. I additionally am looking into L-tyrosine, and 5-htp, and will be asking my doctor about both of these very soon. Any anecdotal evidence about the efficacy of these in maintaining a happy and healthy mental state (or the lack thereof) while using stimulants either therapeutically or recreationally would be very helpful. Also, I have heard that low doses of DXM have a tolerance reducing effect. Information on the safety and efficacy of this would be much appreciated. Would it be counter-productive to ask my doctor about this? The number one word in my mind is SAFETY.

After all that background (sorry if you are drooling on your keyboard), here is my main question . Can I still safely use recreational stimulants without endangering myself? I would assume I would have to take a holiday of perhaps 2-10 days on both sides of the experience, and I am fine with that, but is it practical in any way shape or form to go roll, or spend a day tweaking(one dose in the morning)? Also is there cross tolerance between anything besides stimulants and Vyvanse(cannabis, opioids, other things that affect dopamine systems)? I am not worried so much about hallucinogens, as I did not enjoy them and have no plans to use them again, however information on those could be useful as well.

dont know the chemical aspect ,but people that medicate mental illness ,shouldnt do drugs or alcohol..endangering your self to be a mess xD

^that's pretty much it. You should keep drug usage to the absolute minimum if you have a mental illness.

First I would like to thank you for replying

Having said that, the replies were not the most useful I've ever seen. I am sure they were well-meant, just not that informative. I would like to clarify a few points, as I think I might have been a bit confusing in my last post. For those of you who are not the most familiar with ADD, I would first like to state that it is not an illness, or disorder, at least in the sense of the words that most people conjure up when they hear them. I think of myself as more "outdated." While the near complete lack of a filter for distractions is the ideal thing in a different era for hunting, fighting, and other things humans used to do on a regular basis, it is a disadvantage in the modern classroom (especially in large college classrooms). I have never had a problem with depression, anxiety, other mental problems, or some of the symptoms of ADD such as impulsivity or hyperactivity. I am simply very very distractible. Additionally, I have never had any problems with addiction to anything. I have already used the most addictive substances I know of, and have walked away without the slightest inclination to use them again anytime soon. For instance, the time I tried heroin I woke up the next day thinking "well that was fun, perhaps I will do it again someday if the moment is right, although certainly not within the next three months, because that is the time frame I decided before-hand I would wait." It wasn't that I have abnormally strong self-control, it is simply that I have no desire to be messed up 24/7, and I ALWAYS follow my preset dosage and safety guidelines. The first time I tried cannabis I waited 4 months, just in case I had an incredibly addictive personality. I knew the day after that I wasn't going to have problems with addiction to cannabis, however I waited the 4 months because I said I was going to. I always follow my self-imposed rules, and I have never had a problem. I also have no reason to self medicate. I enjoy my life, and while the occasional experience is entertaining and thought provoking, I do not wish to fuck up my very satisfactory life. I realize this may sound fanciful to those among you who have struggled with addiction, but I am not concerned in the least with becoming an addict. Having said that, is there and chemists, pharmacists, psychologists, psychiatrists, neurobiologists or other professionals who could give me an in-depth complete answer? Honestly guys, my 9th grade health class was more enlightening, and that was taught by a 65yr old republican who told us, with the most serious look on his face, that every time you use MDMA, you lose a portion of your brain the size of an ice cream scoop.

Addiction is not something that can be avoided only with rational thinking, neuronic paths create a need for substance relief when you do use it sometime while being depressed or stressed out, it remembers and adapt to it.
Having ADD makes you even more at risk because of the troubling dopamine shortage.
The thought proces and rational thinking is your solution when addicted to reverse this proces.
Every human being, especially with AD(H)D is in risk of getting additcted, our brain is the cause and solution, don't take it lightly buddy.

PS. i have ADD myself, and i agree its not a full blown mental disease while being sober and happy, it will be though when you find yourself slipping.

I know what you mean,you was very clear in your post..just for me ,it is never good idea to take drugs,when you trying to give your brain a chemical balance by taking medication..if that makes sense,yes it is dangerous..other than that,we are not your parents,do whatever you wanna do,I dont think mixing your substances will cause physical problems
sorry feeling grumpy today

ty I didn't mean to sound so flippant about it i should have said "while it is a very real concern and I am very respectful of it I take very strong measures to ensure that it does not become a reality." I agree it is always a serious risk, and I have the utmost respect for it.

My friend's brother has ADD. He used to take MDMA/MDA; but he didn't overdo it or take it every weekend or more than once or twice a month. He also did not combine it with his ADD meds.

OP, while I am almost as old as your high school health teacher and neither a doctor nor a chemist I can appreciate that you are trying to get your question answered to the best of anyone's knowledge. Just be clear that any answer you get on here is going to be coming from an anonymous person that claims to have knowledge, but in fact may not (either because they don't actually have all the facts, are not trained as they say they are or the knowledge doesn't exist around a particular combination used by an adequately sized control group.) Everyone's body and constitution are different and I think that is why the members that have responded are giving you good advice in keeping with the harm reduction mission of the site: if you are on a stimulant daily it is probably not a good idea to use drugs to get high at the same time. Having said that, I can really empathize with your frustration at not simply being able to freely ask a pharmacist without repercussions. (Personally I would not trust a doctor to know--nurses seem to be better informed about dosages and interactions than doctors IME. A pharmacist is best.) The War on Drugs kills people by making information like this so hard to get.

I am thinking that maybe putting this thread out to the folks in Neuroscience and Pharmacology might give you a little more information. If you agree just send me a PM or answer here and I will move it for you. I am glad that you are concerned with your safety. There are a whole lot of names in the shrine here that represent people that thought they "knew how to be safe". There are so many variables to that. be careful, good luck in your search for more knowledge and keep exploring options for your ADD--I have severe ADD and am choosing to not medicate it. It's a pain, but then again so were the side effects of medication.

That's pretty much how I got through school, on intelligence alone. I've always thought I had adhd but I can't even make that judgement anymore. After going to a couple psychs and therapists I'm not even sure adhd (or depression) exists. I can't trust my own evaluation due to the fact that I like abusing the meds and am not sure anymore if i just want to get high or get help.

Anyway to your question, if you take vyvanse as prescribed for legitimate problems then abusing stimulants to any degree will probably wreck your tolerance. I would just stick to the occassional mdma adventure and leave meth and all other stimulants alone if you want your adhd meds to continue to work.

Ya, without the meds I waited usually 1-4mo between mdma experiences, and if I were to use meth again it would be over the summer when I am not planning on taking the meds. That gives me a month+ buffer on either side of the experience. I also take NMDA agonists (or is it antagonist?) like magnesium which are amazingly effective, and one 30mg dose of dxm on the weekends when I'm off the meds... not sure how much the dxm helps, but even a placebo is worth it, my tolerance goes up during the week, but so far it seems to completely reset with the supplements' help. Anyway in terms of recreational stims, I'm in limbo until I have more info. Thanks for the info and concern everyone who replied, I think this forum is being moved to the pharmacology forum pretty soon hopefully I will get in-depth answers; you guys have been great as expected ty soo much

Op,

id think MDMA would help adhd because it is a stimulant. Stimulants are the typical medication for adhd due to low arousal theory http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_arousal_theory

I have had very ADHD friends who stated MDMA made them feel more normal.

Well ya... theoretically I would assume it would help being an stim... but i would think it would be wayyy too powerful/habit forming/cause extensive neural adaptation to it. If someone were to try that I would think the effective dose would be around 20-40mg; much smaller than rec. dose. Also the duration of effect would be annoyingly short. You would have to redose 3-4 times a day, as it lasts only 4hrs on average, and I shudder to think what I would feel like after a week of that 8( Interesting idea... I would like to hear about results if someone tried it. despite my alias, I am not too inclined toward the noble profession of guinea pig tho

Would it be alright if I recreated the starting question in the neuroscience and pharm forum? Herbavore seems to have forgotten to move this thread there, and I would like some opinions from that esteemed intelligentsia. :D