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Eveleivibe
04-10-2013, 12:40
Hiya ,

I am currently on 8 mg suboxone after codeine addiction.
I thought n kidded myself that I love it, even went on an anti-sub n said this but truth is I hate it.
It's changed me. I never used to sleep in the day but now I do. I feeel stiff n achy like an old woman. I'm tired all the time. I have this headache like my head is way tol heavy. Aching, back n hips all stiff. And nausea whicj is awful. I'm so done with feeling sick. I want me back. How I was. Active with natural endorphines pumping through me, excited for each day so I could get up at 5 am n do my INSANITY p90x workouts. Now i try exercising n i feel so heavy. Suboxone has done this to me.

When i first took this stuff I thought I was in a bubble protecting me from such intense emotions. But no more.

I don't recognise ME anymore.

Of to ser key work in half hour n going to ask to reduce to 6mg so please wish me luck!

Evey xxx

Fuzati
04-10-2013, 13:12
I am currently on 8 mg suboxone after codeine addiction.
Isn't that a bit... excessive? O_o
IMHO bupre/methadone should only be prescribed to long-time potent opioids users, not people with a small codeine addiction (or just a very small dosage, 2mg or around). And sadly, this post is the typical result of people jumping on high dosage bupre after a "not-that-bad" codé addiction.
Sorry, off topic, I didn't mean to sound judgmental, I was just curious about how you jump from (at most) 500mg of codeine base a day (the ceiling dose, not point in taking more) to 8mg of bupre? Sounds a bit drastic and taking it to a new level of addiction.


I have this headache like my head is way tol heavy.
Can't you get on subutex? A lot of people complained about headaches on subuxone, and when they switched to subutex it disappeared.

Good luck.

Mr.Scagnattie
04-10-2013, 13:34
Those side effects sound like they are from taking way too much.. I'd never recommend suboxone, especially at those high levels, for a codeine addiction... I mean, even with the most serious codeine addiction.. taking more than like, 1mg of suboxone is way over kill.

Try taking your dose waayyy down and you'll most likely notice those side effects disappear.

missmeyet?
04-10-2013, 13:42
First, to address what Fuzati said, 2mg would not be a sufficient dose of bupe for most people. That typically is not enough to even cause the blocking effect which is part of what the point is for using bupe for an addiction to opiates/opioids. Generally if you go lower than 4mg you are most likely not going to get the blocking effects. Also, just because it is pointless to go above 500mg of codeine a day doesnt mean she wasnt at more than that dose. It may just sound like a "small codeine addiction" to you but that doesnt mean that someone might not need help to get off and stay off. 8mg of bupe is an average dose and not excessive...now people who are taking 32mg a day, that is excessive (and I see it all the time) but 8mg is by no means excessive.

For the OP, the above poster is correct in that the other ingredient in suboxone does have a tendency to cause headaches in some people but so can the buprenorphine. Im really not sure why it would be causing you aching and pain because buprenorphine is a VERY strong narcotic pain medication. It is currently one of my round the clock narcotic pain meds and if I am not mistaken it is around 40 times stronger than morphine. A lot of people do not like it for pain medication but it can be very effective. My point is I'm not sure why it would cause pain. The other thing that is a little different from what most people experience is you said you feel tired and heavy all the time. Most people say that they get an 'up" speedy feeling from it (similar to what some experience with tramadol). Because of this effect some people really like it, some don't. That doesn't mean that it might not effect you differently, it is just more common for it to have the opposite effect on most people.(Personally it gives me tons of energy and makes me want to clean everything and do all of those tedious things i don't like to do!!)

I think I agree with you and might ask your doctor if he can lower it just a little. But just beware, the lower you go with it the more likely you are to lose some of those opiate/opioid blocking effects. It is still effective for pain relief at VERY small doses but the blocking dose usually occur around 4mg and up.

Oh, and I was curious, you said you even went on "an anti-sub and said this"....what does that mean, what is that?

Good luck dear. Holler if you have any questions or comments of feel free to PM me.

T. Calderone
04-10-2013, 13:46
Hi Evey, How long have you been completely clean off codeine? I used them for a short while coming off a bad oxycodone habit. Suboxone helped me from being drug-sick but I still had cravings. You didn't say how long you've been on them. Talk with your doctor about a taper plan if you havn't already. I tend to agree with Fuzati, it does seem excessive using bupe to get yourself off codeine. Try not to stay on them too long.

Mr.Scagnattie
04-10-2013, 13:51
First, to address what Fuzati said, 2mg would not be a sufficient dose of bupe for most people. That typically is not enough to even cause the blocking effect which is part of what the point is for using bupe for an addiction to opiates/opioids. Generally if you go lower than 4mg you are most likely not going to get the blocking effects. Also, just because it is pointless to go above 500mg of codeine a day doesnt mean she wasnt at more than that dose. It may just sound like a "small codeine addiction" to you but that doesnt mean that someone might not need help to get off and stay off. 8mg of bupe is an average dose and not excessive...now people who are taking 32mg a day, that is excessive (and I see it all the time) but 8mg is by no means excessive.




You can't decide what an average dose is from what doctors are giving out.. as nuts as that sounds. Suboxone doctors have a history of giving out incredibly excessive doses of suboxone. After stabilization, I have seen hard core heroin addicts completely withdrawal free at 4mg's...

You're underestimating just how potent bupe really is. 8mg's is actually quite a lot, despite what the doctors hawking suboxone actually tell you. They only benefit from having you on a massive dose and most people report zero change from taking a dose like 24mg's to 8mg's.

For a codeine addiction (and I'm not saying codeine isn't serious, people love to get on me when I bring this shit up) but compared to other opiates and other addictions, it is pretty minor (again.. that's a good thing). So if doses well under 8mg's can stabilize people coming off of 500-600mg's of oxy, 2-3 bundle a day IV heroin habits, then I don't care how much codeine you take, 8mg's is overkill.

Wake up tomorrow OP and start with 2mg's and see if all of those side effects don't go away.

MartinFn
04-10-2013, 14:34
Well, Fuzati's right. It's rather strange to start subs to get off codeine..but anyway, IMO i think that you can taper the subs, 6mg, then 4mg etc.I don't think that it will be difficult..and the faster the better, but OK, of course not so fast to get in W/Ds...Workouts, jogging and exercises generally, always helps A LOT, while you're detoxing, so your endorphines will find their way to work again, as they used to..


I don't recognise ME anymore.
Well, come on, i don't wanna hear bullshits...You have not lost your world, either yourself of course, it's just the fuckin subs that makes you think this way, fuck them...
Stand up strong on your feet, focus well your goal, and think..The fact is that the things are not so difficult, as you're maybe thinking they are..Come on, other people have kicked meds more stronger than codeine, like oxycontin, hydromorphone, even fuckin heroin. Yeah, i know, you're thinking "oh, these people have done it cause they were strong, i'm so weak.."..
Fuck no, you're not weak, maybe the drugs make you feel like this, but IT'S NOT TRUTH...Stand up and fight..You'll win.Keep the faith (Bon Jovi,yeah!;))

I wish you all the luck, believe in yourself, i'm sure that you'll make it, cause you fuckin CAN...!!!:)



MartinFn

belfort
04-10-2013, 16:35
im also shocked that a doctor would scribe subuxone for a codeine addiction..then again i remember being at the methadone clinic and there were people there that had very light vicoden addictions that were taking methadone to get off..i was like wtf..

RTrain
04-10-2013, 17:54
^How can that shock you, everything I read and hear about seems like Dr's hardly take into account the addicts tolerance when Rxing Subs. Oh you shoot 2-3 g of H a day, take 16 mg and come back next week, same thing is told to the guy taking 60-90 mg of oxy a day.

There is no need to take 8 mg, that is for sure. I take 8 mg for maybe 3 days when I stop H and then I cut it down quick, preferring 2-3 mg a day after my body has adjusted to no H and just the Subs.

All that aside, I think the OPs issue is most likely the naloxone in the pill. Say what you want about it not being active, but its there and some of it is absorbed(this study says 0.9-2.0% orally http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22541841). If you can't get Subutex (and I know both Drs. I have seen refused to Rx it to me) my advice is spit the juice out after taking it and see if that goes away after a few days. I swear its helped me, I don't get the vague nausea, throbbing tension headaches, blocked ears, etc. if I do that. The one downside is swallowing the spit seems to help keep me quite regular on a daily basis.

highhooked
04-10-2013, 18:30
I just want to chime in and add that 8mg is definitely an excessive dose. I have a heroin addiction going on about a year and a half and i am completely withdrawal free at doses of 1mg or less.

RTrain
04-10-2013, 19:17
I just want to chime in and add that 8mg is definitely an excessive dose. I have a heroin addiction going on about a year and a half and i am completely withdrawal free at doses of 1mg or less.

Is that sub-lingual or another ROA?

I know I can get to that point, too, but it takes at least a week after the initial phase of acute heroin w/d subsides, which is just being made bearable by the suboxone masking the majority of the symptoms.

Eveleivibe
04-10-2013, 20:37
Look, no offence but I am NOT here to discuss whether or not I should be taking suboxone. I choose to take suboxone n I am here to discuss coming off the drug. My addiction was 800+ mg codeine NOT 500mg and would people have preferred me to die of liver failure due to paracetamol toximitry? Do you know how easy n how quickly that can happen? As well as that I have prevented addictions to drugs such as heroin as we all know that people progress to higher opiates.
When I FIRST started taking suboxone I felt completed normal - not high - just normal. These symptoms started over last few months.
So while I appreciate your support n advice I'd appreciate it if any judgemental comments as to whether or not I should have taken buprenorphine were kept to yourselves. This was my choice in how to deal with my recovery so please be respectful of this.
I only want to discuss coming OFF the drug. I have been given a 4-week script of 8 mg I am seeing my doctor on the 11 December n I will be asking to reduce to 6 mg. I WANT OFF THIS DRUGAS IT HAS DONE FOR ME WHAT I NEEDED n now I wish to be drug-free. Completely drug free. Including cooming off my antidepressants which is 40 mg citralopram (celexa).

Take care everyone n hope I never came across as harsh then as that's not my intention :)

Evey xxxc

Eveleivibe
04-10-2013, 21:14
Well, Fuzati's right. It's rather strange to start subs to get off codeine..but anyway, IMO i think that you can taper the subs, 6mg, then 4mg etc.I don't think that it will be difficult..and the faster the better, but OK, of course not so fast to get in W/Ds...Workouts, jogging and exercises generally, always helps A LOT, while you're detoxing, so your endorphines will find their way to work again, as they used to..


Well, come on, i don't wanna hear bullshits...You have not lost your world, either yourself of course, it's just the fuckin subs that makes you think this way, fuck them...
Stand up strong on your feet, focus well your goal, and think..The fact is that the things are not so difficult, as you're maybe thinking they are..Come on, other people have kicked meds more stronger than codeine, like oxycontin, hydromorphone, even fuckin heroin. Yeah, i know, you're thinking "oh, these people have done it cause they were strong, i'm so weak.."..
Fuck no, you're not weak, maybe the drugs make you feel like this, but IT'S NOT TRUTH...Stand up and fight..You'll win.Keep the faith (Bon Jovi,yeah!;))

I wish you all the luck, believe in yourself, i'm sure that you'll make it, cause you fuckin CAN...!!!:)



MartinFn

Ok. I had a bit of a chuckle at this. But good points.

Eveleivibe
04-10-2013, 21:18
^How can that shock you, everything I read and hear about seems like Dr's hardly take into account the addicts tolerance when Rxing Subs. Oh you shoot 2-3 g of H a day, take 16 mg and come back next week, same thing is told to the guy taking 60-90 mg of oxy a day.

There is no need to take 8 mg, that is for sure. I take 8 mg for maybe 3 days when I stop H and then I cut it down quick, preferring 2-3 mg a day after my body has adjusted to no H and just the Subs.

All that aside, I think the OPs issue is most likely the naloxone in the pill. Say what you want about it not being active, but its there and some of it is absorbed(this study says 0.9-2.0% orally http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22541841). If you can't get Subutex (and I know both Drs. I have seen refused to Rx it to me) my advice is spit the juice out after taking it and see if that goes away after a few days. I swear its helped me, I don't get the vague nausea, throbbing tension headaches, blocked ears, etc. if I do that. The one downside is swallowing the spit seems to help keep me quite regular on a daily basis.

Tbh, the main affects have happened since I stopped swollowing the juice as some1 said that its important to keep the juice for 30 mins.

Mr.Scagnattie
04-10-2013, 21:48
^^

Please don't double and triple post. Use the edit function.

There are tons of threads on here about tapering off of suboxone. There are many ways it can be done depending on how fast or slow you want to come off.

Beachcat
05-10-2013, 00:25
Well, honestly, if you hate suboxone so much and it is causing these problems, the way to get off of it is to just taper off. There is no quick and easy way...your body will feel like shit for a while until you are able to produce natural endorphins again.

Trust me, I tapered off a 320+mg oxy and 240 mg of morphine per day habit. It sucked. It was painful both physically and emotionally. I hated every single minute of it. But I hated being a slave to the drugs more....

Fresco
05-10-2013, 00:41
What kind of doctor in his right mind prescribes subs for codeine addiction?!

Salute my shorts
05-10-2013, 01:20
Yea you're on way to high a dose. When I was on 20-30mgs of oxy a day and doing a few bags a week, 2-4mg of bupe got me high, not just block. Subs are really unenjoyable when you take to high a dose, scale your dose down to about 2mgs.

downfallin
05-10-2013, 04:16
Get off the stuff. How long have you been on it? And 8mgs is alot for a codeine addiction no matter how much syrup you was sippin.

oldirtybizza
05-10-2013, 04:54
FFS, can't we get these people a straight codeine script that gets tapered down instead of going on subs. 8mg is crazy talk, 2-4mg max bupe would be sufficient and whats the bloody point of throwing the naloxone in there for non IV users.
I know peeps say subjectively subutex and suboxone are the same but I get all types of sides when there's naloxone in the mix.
seriously can't believe people are taking that much code in combo with apap, if you can't get decent drugs at least learn how to CWE and do a bit of HR.

highhooked
05-10-2013, 08:25
Is that sub-lingual or another ROA?

I know I can get to that point, too, but it takes at least a week after the initial phase of acute heroin w/d subsides, which is just being made bearable by the suboxone masking the majority of the symptoms.

Yeah its sublingual with the strips. Sometimes an energy boost and moodlift comes along with it! :) Low dose sub FTW try it peeps

dopemegently
05-10-2013, 10:07
Giving the OP suboxone for a codeine habit sounds overkill; I can't believe how keen some treatment providers are to prescribe it. I knew somebody who was taking 120mgs of dhc, and was prescribed bupe, a far more powerful drug-it's reckless imo.

oldirtybizza
05-10-2013, 11:31
^ 120mg oral DHC is about 3.5mg sublingual pure bupe for me. subjective effects wise. I've had a lot of exp with both. I don't see why a doc would even change since the DHR SR has a pretty decent half life .

DHC is a nicer high IMO.

Eveleivibe
05-10-2013, 12:23
Did anyone put weight on when on subsux???? I've put a ruckload on n its depressing me. I am thinking of maybe cold turkeying off it. A friend cold turkeyed off 12 mg.

dopemegently
05-10-2013, 13:36
I have put weight on, but I've been exercising less; I don't think the drugs totally to blame. Then again, it slows me down and makes me less active, though. Personally, I've been on it for 8 years and feel trapped by it, coming off is scary to me after such a long time.

Lately I've been thinking cold turkey is the way to go as well, for the simple reason that sub blocks all my useful detox drugs I've been stockpiling: kratom, loperamide, tramadol etc

Eveleivibe
05-10-2013, 14:15
Woe you guys a passionate over this. Look I did do cold water extraction. Got bored as it took an hour to do that plus codeine is very sensitive to heat n light so I lost some of it. As you know when you're addicted you want as much as much so I thought f in had it straight. I bought 112 of 60 mg codeine tabs per fortnight plus the 15 mg plus codeine linctus cough syrup which contained 600 mg codeine n I'd easily have two of those plus other stuff in one day.
I used to binge on the 60 mg tabs like they were sweets.

I tried many times to quit and I tried many times to taper but I did not work. I had suicidal thoughts n was a completr mess. Plus my parents expected me to go there every time I need a tablet so which causing problems in my relationship with them.

There's a lot of judgement with this n no disrespect but non of you here no me or my situation. I chose the method. I am not asking for your ipinions as to whether or not codeine addicts should be prescribed suboxone or not n as to whether non IV users should be prescribed nalaxone or not. My area only does suboxone. It's that simple.
I ASKED for suboxone because I needed out of that situation plus I have a four year old who needs me to be.well to look after her n to be there for her. Withdtawal so hell for me n I had no motivation n wasn't responding to my little one as I should have done.
I am simply asking for SUPPORT in coming OFF suboxone WITHOUT this judgement. Not too much to ask is it?

Anyway off to an indoor play area with my little one.

Evey xxx

Mr scagnat I've only just seen your post - sorry for triple posting. I will use the 'edit' button in futue.

Beachcat thank you for you response. It was non-judgemental n what I was after x

Mr.Scagnattie
05-10-2013, 15:36
If you really want off, you mine as well taper. Going cold turkey is just causing yourself unnecessary discomfort. Start weening down a little bit each day, or each week, however slow you want to taper.

purplehaze147
05-10-2013, 16:01
Do people really do 3g of heroin a day? That would be 120 bags of heroin per day in New Jersey wtf lol. One bag will get a normal person high here. The stamp bags are always sealed with the stamp over the tape (excuse me, I just looked at my collection. Most of the bags have the stamp over it. Ruins the image but nice to kno there not fucked with) A bag here weighs 20-30mg.

For tapering off I'd do 8mg every other day for 5 days, then 4mg everyday for 4 days, then 2mg everyday for a week, then 1mg for 5 days, then .5mg for another 5 days and then quit.

I'm prescribed 8mg a day too. I can go 48hrs without it with no serious withdraws. It's all in ur head.

SC_NowLiving
05-10-2013, 16:17
I agree with cold turkey, it's worst, but also the best because it's fastest way..if you attempt sub I use to cut mine down 8mg into 4s and I was good for 2-3 days. I only used sub when I couldn't find any thing else, downfall you can't feel opiates for at least 24-36 hours after taking subs. There's a lot of great info on BL about subs.

Edit: Life exp is also long so it stays in your system for quite a while and in works. As Mr scagnat said no point to start high dose,because during the end of the process you will probably develop tolerance and encounter another WDs of subs and THEY ARE ALOT WORSE than opiate WDs.
Sorry for caps, just wanted to really point out the side effect of subs

Best of luck to you and before you know it, it's over. By reding your posts your life will provide more support thru PAWS.
Edit: if you tamper off be careful, because most likely will require some kind of combination of meds, at lease in most cases. Imodium worked great and it's a opiate,but dose not cross BBB of course you don't want to take 20mgs :) it will help the belly 100% 2mg a day was plants for me. When I attempted my cold turkey I used small doses of adderall instead of sub, and low dose of Benz to stay asleep.

tukabirdy
05-10-2013, 21:44
I have learned thru experiences with people tapering that feeling reductions when you are taking over 2mgs can be more of a mental mindfuck than feeling true physical feelings. The brain is a mysterious powerful organ.

People that have tapered tell me that in order to feel control over their taper...they pick a day to hold off taking there dose as long as they can and they ignore any physical sensations for 24-48 hours...they get as close to real withdrawal as they can....it's to seee just how long you can go and exactly what the true w/d's start to feel like. They do this many times and they said their brain gets used to not having it and it calms them down to know they can go a long time before the truew/d's really start to happen.

Because of this advice when I started to taper I tried it and found I could go 40 hours before I started feeling bigtime w/d's. I was able to dose every 36 hours and my brain was happy with that....I was in control of the taper after that.....it wasn't until I got real low that I started feeling crappy.

Hope this helps.

stray cat
05-10-2013, 22:05
Hi. Here is my suggestion for getting off of the subs.

Immediately drop your daily dosage to 4 mgs. Stay at this dosage for 1 week.
Next week, drop your daily dosage to 2 mgs for one week.
The following week, drop your daily dosage to 1 mgs for one week.
The following week, drop your daily dosage to .5 mgs. Stay at this dosage until you stabilize. In my experience, you probably won't really notice the drops too badly until you get down to around 1 mgs, but it should not be too terrible; you can adjust the timeframes i've suggested to accommodate your personal experience. Essentially you want to remain at each dose until you stabilize on it. It will not be completely pain free, but it should be doable.
The week after you drop to .5, I would alternate days of .5 and .25 for a week or 2. Then drop to .25 every day for a week or 2. Then stay at .25, but begin dosing less frequently, i.e., .25 every 36-48 hrs. Then try to do something like .25 every 2-3 days. Then make the jump.

Like i said, this will not be pain free, but it should be relatively easy to reduce amounts until you get down to less than 2 mgs. Then just take it slow and continue reducing regularly. Be strong. You can get through this. As others have said, when you get down low, you may wish to throw some other substances in the mix. Loperamide is very helpful. The occasional benzo, etc. can be helpful in moderation. There are numerous threads on this, so just do some research, and you will be able to get off the sub without going through absolute hell anyway. Good luck!

Fuzati
05-10-2013, 22:13
I bought 112 of 60 mg codeine tabs per fortnight plus the 15 mg plus codeine linctus cough syrup which contained 600 mg codeine n I'd easily have two of those plus other stuff in one day.
I used to binge on the 60 mg tabs like they were sweets.
Ok I understand better, the codeine in cough syrups are never codeine base. No way a bottle of cough syrup contains 600mg of codeine base So don't worry, you were not doing 800mg of codeine a day, make the conversion (of whatever form of codeine was in you syrup/pills) and you'll happily find out that your daily dose was closer to 500mg (the ceiling dose, from 450 to 550 from individual to individual).

I also feel that with bupe, "more is less".

regfairfield
05-10-2013, 22:41
as long as your not suicidal, cold turkey....I don't know your willpower....I don't know your life situation.....but I do know cold turkey is light years ahead of replacement therapy in success rate

Morphling
05-10-2013, 22:46
as long as your not suicidal, cold turkey....I don't know your willpower....I don't know your life situation.....but I do know cold turkey is light years ahead of replacement therapy in success rate

Pardon, but just...what?

regfairfield
05-10-2013, 23:37
Pardon, but just...what?

Yea let me rephrase.....cold turkey = shorter and shittier as opposed to replacement therapy which is a crutch people then can become addicted to....

Eveleivibe
06-10-2013, 01:00
If you really want off, you mine as well taper. Going cold turkey is just causing yourself unnecessary discomfort. Start weening down a little bit each day, or each week, however slow you want to taper.


Do people really do 3g of heroin a day? That would be 120 bags of heroin per day in New Jersey wtf lol. One bag will get a normal person high here. The stamp bags are always sealed with the stamp over the tape (excuse me, I just looked at my collection. Most of the bags have the stamp over it. Ruins the image but nice to kno there not fucked with) A bag here weighs 20-30mg.

For tapering off I'd do 8mg every other day for 5 days, then 4mg everyday for 4 days, then 2mg everyday for a week, then 1mg for 5 days, then .5mg for another 5 days and then quit.

I'm prescribed 8mg a day too. I can go 48hrs without it with no serious withdraws. It's all in ur head.


Ok I understand better, the codeine in cough syrups are never codeine base. No way a bottle of cough syrup contains 600mg of codeine base So don't worry, you were not doing 800mg of codeine a day, make the conversion (of whatever form of codeine was in you syrup/pills) and you'll happily find out that your daily dose was closer to 500mg (the ceiling dose, from 450 to 550 from individual to individual).

I also feel that with bupe, "more is less".

Excuse me I WAS taking 800mg+ codeine a day. No offence but you did not live my life or see the the amount of codeine I was taken, the concoction of tablets etc. whilst I really appreciate n am thankful to those of you who have given me advice re getting off suboxone, I am starting to get extremely annoyed at the judgement n assumption from some posters. I think I will take some time- out from reading this thread, ok.
A codeine addiction is just as serious as heroin etc i have been through hell n it's affected my life.

Like I said thank you to those of you who have given me advice. I will take a screen shot with my iPhone n take time to read them.

T. Calderone
06-10-2013, 01:18
I believe you Evey because my grandpa was severely addicted to codeine tablets because he had a bad spinal condition. Into his 70's and I'm not sure what his doctors prescribed him (they lived in Michigan and I'm in Florida) Gramps would send my aunts and uncles to Toronto to buy bottles of Tylenol 2. I do not know how he lived to be 87 see he was in lots of pain, no doubt. But he was easily consuming 40 pills a day sometimes more from what I was told.

Fuzati
06-10-2013, 01:31
Excuse me I WAS taking 800mg+ codeine a day. No offence but you did not live my life or see the the amount of codeine I was taken, the concoction of tablets etc.
No offence taken, but no cough syrup contains 600mg of codeine base by bottle.


A codeine addiction is just as serious as heroin
Well, that's just like, your opinion man. I doubt it is shared by the majority of heroin addicts though.

T. Calderone
06-10-2013, 01:46
I don't think it makes too much difference, whether a person is hooked on heroin, oxy, codeine or whatever. They end up in the same place of needing xx amount of drug in order to get buzzed/function every day. I read a story a while back with a lady who was prescribed suboxone because she had gotten addicted to loperamide, of all things. This doctor had her taking 16 mg a day and instead of tapering, he suggested that she may need it for maybe 2 years! Some of the things I read on forums and think, wow how do these things happen?

Morphling
06-10-2013, 02:04
A portion of codeine is metabolized to morphine, so...

Yeah.

Eveleivibe
06-10-2013, 02:46
No offence taken, but no cough syrup contains 600mg of codeine base by bottle.


Well, that's just like, your opinion man. I doubt it is shared by the majority of heroin addicts though.

I do not give a flying f*** who shares my opinion. It is MY opinion. And I am NOT HAPPY with the way I am being treated here. Tell me how quick a person can get liver failure due to paracetamol / iboprufen. I find a lot of people very arrogant. I have ask nicely not to receive this judgement.
Do not tell me how much codeine is in cough syrup in the UK. Quite frankly I am extremely offended over this thread n will no longer be viewing it. How DARE people belittle my addiction n what I have been through because it's not heroin. I
am disgusted with this thread.

Evey

DrinksWithEvil
06-10-2013, 03:23
Everyone is just saying that 8mg a day is way to much,even for a heroin addiction....drug addicts are very opinionated and outspoken. dont mind us =p

Mr.Scagnattie
06-10-2013, 03:50
Okay lets everyone cool it and get back on point.

OP, if you want real help with getting off of suboxone, we can do that and come up with a taper plan or something.. there are also multiple threads you can do a search and find, that go into detail about coming off of suboxone.

But, this thread will be closed if it keeps escalating into a big fight because it's not helping any of the potential viewers who would need help.

oldirtybizza
06-10-2013, 04:05
Damn you science, I don't want to hear you.

Kinda wasting my time here , but I thought i'd chip in.

Codeine at ceiling dose 600mg = +/- 60mg oral morphine
60mg Morphine PO = roughly 1.5mg Bupe sublingual

Fact ; ORT therapy started at higher than required dose , replaced an addiction to one drug at a stronger equianalgesic dose (addiction to any opiate can be debilitating, only the person experiencing it can subjectively say how debilitating it is) .
My advice to anyone starting ORT would be to make sure they are taking equianalgesic dose, question your doc if needs be.
advice to OP would be taper down to the 2mg, stabilise at that level and then taper off the bupe entirely.

regfairfield
06-10-2013, 05:19
Yea I mean the fact you got addicted is because there is an issue somewhere else...I'm sure bupe + therapy would be alot more beneficial

Eveleivibe
06-10-2013, 15:48
Damn you science, I don't want to hear you.

Kinda wasting my time here , but I thought i'd chip in.

Codeine at ceiling dose 600mg = +/- 60mg oral morphine
60mg Morphine PO = roughly 1.5mg Bupe sublingual

Fact ; ORT therapy started at higher than required dose , replaced an addiction to one drug at a stronger equianalgesic dose (addiction to any opiate can be debilitating, only the person experiencing it can subjectively say how debilitating it is) .
My advice to anyone starting ORT would be to make sure they are taking equianalgesic dose, question your doc if needs be.
advice to OP would be taper down to the 2mg, stabilise at that level and then taper off the bupe entirely.

Thank you - that's what I'm doing suboxone n therapy.


I don't think it makes too much difference, whether a person is hooked on heroin, oxy, codeine or whatever. They end up in the same place of needing xx amount of drug in order to get buzzed/function every day. I read a story a while back with a lady who was prescribed suboxone because she had gotten addicted to loperamide, of all things. This doctor had her taking 16 mg a day and instead of tapering, he suggested that she may need it for maybe 2 years! Some of the things I read on forums and think, wow how do these things happen?


Okay lets everyone cool it and get back on point.

OP, if you want real help with getting off of suboxone, we can do that and come up with a taper plan or something.. there are also multiple threads you can do a search and find, that go into detail about coming off of suboxone.

But, this thread will be closed if it keeps escalating into a big fight because it's not helping any of the potential viewers who would need help.

Thank you. I really appreciate that :)
Would you please close the thread? I
Think I will do as you suggested n do a search I feel that if potential new posters see some of the judgemental comments it may put the off posting. Thank you so very much for your help x

RTrain
06-10-2013, 16:23
Damn you science, I don't want to hear you.

Kinda wasting my time here , but I thought i'd chip in.

Codeine at ceiling dose 600mg = +/- 60mg oral morphine
60mg Morphine PO = roughly 1.5mg Bupe sublingual

Fact ; ORT therapy started at higher than required dose , replaced an addiction to one drug at a stronger equianalgesic dose (addiction to any opiate can be debilitating, only the person experiencing it can subjectively say how debilitating it is) .
My advice to anyone starting ORT would be to make sure they are taking equianalgesic dose, question your doc if needs be.
advice to OP would be taper down to the 2mg, stabilise at that level and then taper off the bupe entirely.

More like 60 mg oxycodone and 90 mg morphine (both PO), but whatever.

Also, that is a irrelevant fact concerning Bupe RT because the ceiling effect of bupe is higher than the tolerance of most people who use it for ORT. I know I feel like crap for a day, and its takes around 4 days before I am feeling fine. Basically I am masking w/d from heroin with Bupe, as best possible. Most people with regardless of tolerance can taper quickly following the acute phase of their DOC's w/d. and maintain at low doses, with less side effects and an easier time transitioning off the if they desire. Its not even possible to achieve an equianalgesic dose of Bupe to many addictions. Sure you can throw the ceiling effect out the window and give people 16-32 mg even though its not making a damn difference compared to 4-8 mg, but its pointless.

Mr.Scagnattie
06-10-2013, 16:42
Thank you - that's what I'm doing suboxone n therapy.





Thank you. I really appreciate that :)
Would you please close the thread? I
Think I will do as you suggested n do a search I feel that if potential new posters see some of the judgemental comments it may put the off posting. Thank you so very much for your help x

Yeah I'll close it. If after your search you still have questions and want help making a specific taper plan, make a post in the suboxone megathread (http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/694364-Suboxone-Buprenorphine-Mega-Thread-and-FAQ-v16-0) and we'll help you out.

Closed