Opioids The Kratom Mega Thread v3

want to be free said:

Hi there!

Can anyone tell me how long it's safe to user kratom for opiate withdrawals without ending up with a kratom problem? What's the best way to do it without ending up having to wean off of kratom? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

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It took me around a month of once daily dosing to notice dependance issues but I'm assuming your going to be dosing kratom several times per day so I think 2 weeks is enough to get past the rough part of opiate withdrawal without becoming dependant on kratom, maybe you can get away with three weeks but that's kind of pushing it.

Thanks for the input!

Mu opioid receptors are Mu opioid receptors....kratoms active constituents hit these just like other opioids do, so you will have to taper your Kratom even with just two weeks use. Otherwise you are just substituting one opioid for another and delaying withdrawals. Kratom is very helpful but no magic bullet.....you still have to pay the piper, there are no free rides, etc etc. Good luck!

liftedgift said:

Well day 4, I caved in. Took 1.5 g of plain leaf. Guess I couldn't handle the boredom and shitty mental feeling. All physical pains left after 3 days for me. But the mental withdrawal felt like it was going strong. Now I am tapering phenibut so I'm sure that adds to the recipe, maybe too fast as I didn't sleep well last night which kind of made me want to take kratom so I'm not so pissed off at work.

My tolerance is back to 0 just after 3 and a half days. 1.5gs feels awesome.

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So, it’s been ten days since your last post, liftedgift. How is it now? How are you feeling? And if you decide not to continue with the taper off did you end up back on the kratom? Let us know how you’re doing, if you can.



As for myself… I have been using about 20-30g a day. I absolutely LOVE this stuff… it’s amazing. I can stay awake, my vision doesn’t get fucked up (which REALLY sucks to me, since all I normally do is readreadread). I feel FANTASTIC.

It’s only MILDLY similar to opiates, in my opinion, in my body, with my body's own pharmacology, in that I feel so warm and happy. I still dose it the same way as I did the first time when I got my first 25g sample in the mail (green malay… wonderful strain); i.e. I will put a mug in the microwave, heat it until the water bubbles and drop 10-15g in, put an estimated teaspoon of agave nectar in, and just drink it like tea. (yes, I know… it’s a lot. I love the high doses. I usually take high doses of most things anyway). It tastes fantastic. I’m weird, I guess, eh?

On the up-side! I haven’t used a single opiate (not even my fentanyl patches for pain… No heroin, no Dilaudid [this is weird to me…], nothing but kratom) since I posted in this thread last month.

Go figure, eh? Wasn’t even a hard switch. It was overnight. Haven’t bought anything else, don’t have anything else, except about a kg of green malay. I’m so happy about this.

@CaptainKratom
Would you mind answering a question or two? What would you say is the best strain for complete relaxation? No stimulation, maybe even something that WILL make me “blurry” in the vision or fall asleep? That’s nice at the end of a long day. I still use MDPV daily too, and, while kratom makes the body load next to nothing, I’d also like a more relaxed sleep if possible. I’d rather not go back to buying heroin or vials of Dilaudid to inject as-per-usual. I’ve completely kicked them; I have no need to go back if there’s a strain that might do that for me. Thanks!

I’m definitely not worried about developing a dependence to kratom. I’m perfectly fine taking it the way I do, and I will likely always use drugs for as long as I live. I like them. I live life perfectly fine, I’m very successful and they don’t hinder me. So, there’s that, in case you’re possibly worried about the all-important HR aspect we all care so much about.

CaptainKratom said:

The one thing that gives me hope is kratoms community. Kratom has one of the strongest and most vocal communities of any plant that I know of. They won't hesitate to contact lawmakers and express their opinion. They have saved a few states from banishment…

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I couldn’t agree more, from what I’ve been reading, and how close you guys seem to be. Almost like the hippies of old. But that’s not saying it’s a bad thing, of course. You guys are similar to the cannabis folk, except they’re about 9001× more populace than you guys (and far more well known). But, comparatively, you’re just as vocal and smart, with just as much knowledge and information about your beautiful, beautiful plant.

CaptainKratom said:

…but if indonesia bans exports and growth completely expect to see a massive shortage and an incredible raise in price, I dont think it will dissapear though it will likely be grown locally instead.

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Indonesia is planning to ban the export of kratom…? Shit… *buys multiple kg…*

Once you tell me what the best stimulant + relaxation strains are, of course. You seem incredible well-versed in everything kratom. Props!

(P.S. Woooo~ 100th post! Only took forever + a day. )

Lycopene said:

What would you say is the best strain for complete relaxation?

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Hey Lyco, sorry for barging in like this (since you were asking CaptainKratom), but I just wanted to dime in my 2 cents. I've been using this wonderful plant for over 10 years now and find the red vein borneo strain the most relaxing/sedating so far (from the ones that I've tried). The red vein indonesian strains are all pretty relaxing (sumatra for example). I also like the red riau strain (and even the green riau is not really stimulating). I agree with you that green malay is also a great strain, very euphoric. Hope it helps.

@lycopene sure I'll answer any and all of your questions if you got any. The most sedating and euphoric strains are without a doubt bali and red vein borneo, those will put you to sleep in euphoric peace. If you like when your vision gets "shakey" then the more stimulating strains are what you want, mang da, thai, and kalimantan white vein tend to give me eyewiggles. I personally don't like eyewiggles so I tend to shy away from stimulating strains. Like I said in a previous post, after a while no strain gets me stimulated so when I take a stimmy strain I'm left with blurry vision, higher bodyload, and less euphoria than something like bali, my personal strain of choice. As a loose rule of thumb greens
tend to be stimulating, reds are the most sedating and euphoric strains, and whites are somewhere in the middle but this doesn't always apply, each strain has its own flavor. Typically kratom users tend to stick with one strain when they find their favorite strain.

Regarding the indonesian ban, LiftedGift posted the article a page or two back so give it a read if your interested. While indonesia may ban kratom I read that thailand is gonna make the sell and use of kratom legal again so I guess it's a trade off. I'm more worried about the government banning kratom then any international affairs. If you got any more questions lemme know, I love sharing my info about this fantastic medicine that is kratom.

Ive never used kratom but thinking about it. I found a site that sells teabags, would that be a good idea?

DocGonzo said:

Hey Lyco, sorry for barging in like this (since you were asking CaptainKratom), but I just wanted to dime in my 2 cents. I've been using this wonderful plant for over 10 years now and find the red vein borneo strain the most relaxing/sedating so far (from the ones that I've tried). The red vein indonesian strains are all pretty relaxing (sumatra for example). I also like the red riau strain (and even the green riau is not really stimulating). I agree with you that green malay is also a great strain, very euphoric. Hope it helps.

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Hey, Doc! I was merely directing the question at the Cap’n; if you have input too, I’m MORE than happy to hear it. If it was for his-eyes-only, then I would’ve simply PMed him. Thank you!

And yes, it definitely did help. Thanks!

CaptainKratom said:

@lycopene sure I'll answer any and all of your questions if you got any. The most sedating and euphoric strains are without a doubt bali and red vein borneo, those will put you to sleep in euphoric peace. If you like when your vision gets "shakey" then the more stimulating strains are what you want, mang da, thai, and kalimantan white vein tend to give me eyewiggles. I personally don't like eyewiggles so I tend to shy away from stimulating strains. Like I said in a previous post, after a while no strain gets me stimulated so when I take a stimmy strain I'm left with blurry vision, higher bodyload, and less euphoria than something like bali, my personal strain of choice. As a loose rule of thumb greens
tend to be stimulating, reds are the most sedating and euphoric strains, and whites are somewhere in the middle but this doesn't always apply, each strain has its own flavor. Typically kratom users tend to stick with one strain when they find their favorite strain.

Regarding the indonesian ban, LiftedGift posted the article a page or two back so give it a read if your interested. While indonesia may ban kratom I read that thailand is gonna make the sell and use of kratom legal again so I guess it's a trade off. I'm more worried about the government banning kratom then any international affairs. If you got any more questions lemme know, I love sharing my info about this fantastic medicine that is kratom.

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You’re awesome, thank you for that. I read it. Good to know. I think I’ll end up trying to source a 25g sample of bali and red vein borneo and then source out a kg or two of the one I like best. Heh. You guys are wonderfully helpful. Thanks so much for all the info.

You sound as passionate about kratom as I do about cannabis. That’s so great to see. Cheers, friend!

CaptainKratom, I read your stance on kratom bought at headshops and agree but do you feel they are at least effective?

Kittycat5 said:

CaptainKratom, I read your stance on kratom bought at headshops and agree but do you feel they are at least effective?

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I bought headshop kratom a couple times when my orders were late and the quality was at least 30% less potent and 4x as expensive, i'd say avoid unless this is your first time and want to but a bag to test it out before placing an online order.

Just wanna add my 2 cents to this...I have used Kratom daily for 7 years. 10gr once a day. Have had days where I must go to Thailand (I live near) so I go without with no issues to mention more than that'd mention with no coffee or buds. I had a 25 point complete medical check up recently. They did it all from top to bottom and they said I was in great health. Did ask me to quit smoking tobacco tho...

Captainkratom- how much or kratom do you do a day? How much at a time? How long has your habit lasted?

I only ask because contemplating whether I want to transfer to kratom only. I have some fear that if I do it'll be scheduled and then I'll have to go back on subs. However, I did prove last month that I could painlessly switch. That is, I managed to go nine days without the subs. With some friends I ordered an ounce of Gold Reserve and 5 grams of full spectrum red extract. I split the ounce and kept the 5 grams for myself, so 9.3g of GR.

Extract is too expensive to sustain a habit with, however- unless you were down to a quarter gram a day.

10g of plain leaf a day would be pretty good, but last time, to hold withdrawal at bay, I was doing more like 28. I think it might be easier to get down to 10g would be to take it during the day, at work, where the stimulating effects would be more desirable. I'd need to get my bed time routine changed though, which would be tough. I currently always use right before bed, I love the opiate-y feeling as I drift off, the weird disjointed dreams and thought patterns.

Perhaps I could take 5g of maeng da during the day and take 10g of Bali at bed. I prefer to drink it as a tea, though.

Would I be able to use less if I ate it instead of making a tea?

Lycopene said:

So, it’s been ten days since your last post, liftedgift. How is it now? How are you feeling? And if you decide not to continue with the taper off did you end up back on the kratom? Let us know how you’re doing, if you can.

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Well I am back taking kratom daily. It was a good tolerance break though. The positives outweigh the negatives of daily kratom usage at this point in my life so I decided to continue on. It wasn't so bad, 4 days of feeling like I had a cold, but it was the boredom that got to me. Although the fact that I'm tapering off phenibut could have played a part as I still wasn't right even after ingesting kratom. Dug myself into another hole with that but anyway. The only time I could see myself getting off kratom is when I can start smoking weed again.

Hammilton said:

Captainkratom- how much or kratom do you do a day? How much at a time? How long has your habit lasted?

I only ask because contemplating whether I want to transfer to kratom only. I have some fear that if I do it'll be scheduled and then I'll have to go back on subs. However, I did prove last month that I could painlessly switch. That is, I managed to go nine days without the subs. With some friends I ordered an ounce of Gold Reserve and 5 grams of full spectrum red extract. I split the ounce and kept the 5 grams for myself, so 9.3g of GR.

Extract is too expensive to sustain a habit with, however- unless you were down to a quarter gram a day.

10g of plain leaf a day would be pretty good, but last time, to hold withdrawal at bay, I was doing more like 28. I think it might be easier to get down to 10g would be to take it during the day, at work, where the stimulating effects would be more desirable. I'd need to get my bed time routine changed though, which would be tough. I currently always use right before bed, I love the opiate-y feeling as I drift off, the weird disjointed dreams and thought patterns.

Perhaps I could take 5g of maeng da during the day and take 10g of Bali at bed. I prefer to drink it as a tea, though.

Would I be able to use less if I ate it instead of making a tea?

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A bit over 3 years at around 24 grams per day, sometimes more, sometimes less. I would say kratom is a very sustainable habit. My dose hasn't risen that much, only the amount of times per day that I dose. Your right, extracts are far too expensive to make a habit of and if you use enough extracts plain leaf will lose it's effectiveness, however every once in A while I reward myself with some UEI when I want some memories of the good ol' days. Typically once a week I will smoke/plug some H or have some extracts or pharms and this hasn't really put a dent in my tolerance. I'd say make the switch, if it gets banned (which I don't see in the short term) just switch back to subs. Your tolerance should be dropped a bit so the amount of sub that you would need should be lower than what your taking now. As for tea vs TnW, tea definately lasts a shorter time by maybe 45mins or so(but also peaks 20-30mins quicker) but I find the dose for both around the same, maybe half a gram more. I choose to make the tea as the effects feel alot cleaner and I don't have to worry about what all that hydrophobic powder is doing to my ulcers...

Will I have withdrawal from using 10 grams a day (10 grams gets me fucked up) for 8 days?

All right so green and white strains are stimulating and red strains are sedating?

What strains do you guys recommend that are the most stimulating+euphoric and also sedating+euphoric? I am no opiate addict but I do have very bad anxiety and have been abusing benzos for a while. Totally quit it all. I also have very bad hypertension. Just need something for relaxing/recreational use.

Recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

the Green Vein Thai is more stimulating imo than say the plain Bali. And yes I've found for me in my experience that the red veined are more sedating. Be vary careful man. I found kratom in the deepest part of my depression and it blew me right out of it. I LOVED it. Taking it all day every day for weeks. I had found a bulk supplier who sells by the pound cheap. By my second pound I was hooked, i.e. W/D's. That went on for 9 months, and I stopped getting the euphoria at about the 3 month mark along with the help it gave with my anxiety.

It was just there holding the W/D's off and not helping with my anxiety or giving euphoria. I've been on and off over the past year, (in W/D right now, hopefully last time). So be careful man, very very very careful. :/

You might be a tad bit irritated or find it hard to get to sleep, but I doubt you'd even get any of those. I think the rule of thumb is 2 weeks of using everyday. Of course dosages and amount of times taken per day also weigh in on how fast you'll get W/D's. Every person is different.

Thanks. I'm currently in a way better mental health and state than before so I feel confident that I won't abuse kratom. I plan to use it occasionally. Maybe a couppe times a week at most.

Any specific red veined strain for recommendation? Also any other green and white vein strain recommendations?

Thanks

gingerbaker said:

It's hard to recommend anything since there it's against the rules to even mention a vendor (bullshit fucking rules). If you don't have a good vendor, it won't matter what we recommend since so many "popular" or easily accessible vendors sell just shit leaf and possibly adulterated.

In the interest of HR, vendor names should be allowed to be mentioned for that reason exactly. Last thing we need is a bunch of people using Kratom with O-Desmethyltramadol and getting seizures and dying. Yeah, that would be great for Kratom and HR....

/rant

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The poster above yours was simply asking for strain reccomendations, that's not against the rules at all and has very little to do with vendorism. It would be like someone getting in trouble for reccomending a certain strain of cannabis. Also the whole 'krypton' O-DT laced kratom is way overblown and is pretty much nothing but scaremongering now. That stuff has been off the market for quite some time and AKAIK there have been no recent instances involving O-DT laced kratom. Mitragynine oxindole or Mitragynine-Pseudoindoxyl is supposably what popular vendors are putting into their extracts, UEI included. Mitragynine oxindole is a semi-synthetic chem derived from mitragynine that is apparently incredibly easy to synth (process is only three steps, requiring 4 easily accessable reagents) and quite a bit more potent than it's parent, again this is more likely what kratom would be laced with if it in fact was which is very unlikely. This info is from whom I would consider one of the most ethical and legit vendors of kratom. I'd like to post a thread where the vendor discusses this but the vendor is an advertiser on said forum therefor may be seen as sourcing, PM me for info.

As for strain reccomendations there's so many that it's hard to figure out which flavor you would enjoy most. For the most part though they're all just slight variations from each other, kind of like different strains of cannabis. This opens up a bit of room for those who like to be connoiseurs but also means that the differences may be so subtle that the inexperienced may not even notice a difference besides potency. Since you provided no info on what your looking for as far as sedation/euphoria/energy all I can do is give you the names of the strains I like the most out of each vein color. For red veins which is the majority of what I use, bali AKA red vein borneo is the strain of choice for many kratom users but if you can find red vein thai that's grown right I find it a far superior red vein, probably my favorite. Kalimantan red vein is also another great strain. My favorite white veins are kali white and white vein borneo, they're both similar in that they are pretty much smack dab in the middle of the kratom spectrum, as equally sedating and euphoric as it is stimulating and motivational. Green veins are what I use least but for stimulation green malay and green sumatra are good at providing the stimulating profile of kratom. With green veins I tend to prett much only mix them with red or white veins as I find the mitragynine content a bit too low for my liking and increasing the dose only leads to nausea and eyewiggles.