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View Full Version : Nicotine vs drugs like Adderall, can smokers quit and take speed instead?



etasu
04-01-2013, 01:49
Hi. I use e-cigarettes sometimes, but I'm not addicted to nicotine. I have ADHD and I take Vyvanse. Personally, I have wondered if my ADHD medication doesn't increase my resilience to nicotine addiction, despite the fact that I enjoy it and find it helpful. It does seem different fundamentally from speed, so I'm not sure if a nicotine addict could replace it with speed-- perhaps, wellbutrin, (I also take wellbutrin) since it is actually used to treat cigarette addicts? I am interested in anyone who has something to say about the flexibility of nicotine addicts when it comes to replacing nicotine with other drugs.

Subsequently, I have wondered if the rise of ADHD as a diagnosis doesn't have something to do with declining cigarette use. Does any nicotine addict have any experience with turning to other stimulants (or even other kinds of drugs aside from stimulants) as an alternative? I imagine that while it couldn't replace nicotine, it would help lessen long-term depression from missing cigarettes even after the actual withdraw is over. That is just a guess.

In reverse, I can't imagine replacing Vyvanse with nicotine. Maybe that would help me do without Vyvanse, but nicotine seems like a high maintenance drug, and as such I think I would have a lot of trouble with an addiction to cigarettes, trouble with it making me irritable when I have to go smoke again.

Edit: I know there's a thread about the interaction between speed and cigarettes while taking them both, but I am interested in comparing the mutually exclusive experiences of self-medicating with these drugs separately.

bronson
04-01-2013, 08:05
From what I've seen at least, usually when someone gets clean off of any given drug they still will smoke cigarettes. Probably even more so than before. Rather than what you suggest, where other drugs replace smoking, the smoking fills the void.

Nicotine is nefarious like that, while physical addiction to it is rather mild compared to most things, its addictive nature in a mental sense is off the charts. Thus when one feels down (depression from stopping stimulant use for example) smoking becomes highly desirable, despite the fact it doesn't do all that much to make the person feel any better.

baooozs
04-01-2013, 20:48
You'd be substituting one dopamine releaser for another more potent one. Nonetheless nicotine addiction has a more complex addictive profile than amphetamines. Even though they both operate on the reward circuit.

Swimmingdancer
05-01-2013, 01:15
It's kind of complicated, because tobacco contains more than just nicotine, so despite the popular belief, people with smoking addictions are dependent on more than just nicotine. I really think cigarettes (especially factory cigarettes) are more addictive than e-cigarettes. And then of course there is the mental addiction to smoking, which is not relieved by switching to a pill. Out of the things you mentioned Wellbutrin tends to be the most helpful in general. Other stimulants like caffeine or amphetamines seem to make a lot of people want to smoke more (see this thread (http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/658546-What-is-it-with-stimulants-and-cigarettes) for example). But personally I find amphetamines to make me smoke less, probably because part of why I smoke it to self-medicate for ADD. When I take amps I tend to be more energetic and busier instead of just sitting on the computer chain-smoking, so it makes it easier for me to not smoke. I don't know about the average person using a Vyvanse taper to get off cigarettes though.

blight12
06-01-2013, 06:22
It's kind of complicated, because tobacco contains more than just nicotine, so despite the popular belief, people with smoking addictions are dependent on more than just nicotine. I really think cigarettes (especially factory cigarettes) are more addictive than e-cigarettes. And then of course there is the mental addiction to smoking, which is not relieved by switching to a pill. Out of the things you mentioned Wellbutrin tends to be the most helpful in general. Other stimulants like caffeine or amphetamines seem to make a lot of people want to smoke more (see this thread (http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/658546-What-is-it-with-stimulants-and-cigarettes) for example). But personally I find amphetamines to make me smoke less, probably because part of why I smoke it to self-medicate for ADD. When I take amps I tend to be more energetic and busier instead of just sitting on the computer chain-smoking, so it makes it easier for me to not smoke. I don't know about the average person using a Vyvanse taper to get off cigarettes though.

IMO quitting smoking is like a billion times harder then quitting meth because for me it provides a daily need and i cant really find any tangible short term reason quit.

Yeah amps make me forget to smoke and everything pretty much everything else. Though i made a point to remember and now chain smoke on them.
I however need to sit still and chain smoke at the pc. Anything else seems like far to much effort. Even performing basic needs. It is odd.
Oh and smoking really brings on the vasoconstriction for me just FYI

bit_pattern
06-01-2013, 06:36
Considering how much I used to smoke on meth I would say the answer is: no.

baooozs
07-01-2013, 22:21
You can also find with amphetamines that they amplify habituations, addictions, fixations and force you to act on instinctive behaviors.

Eg. You see porn, you masturbate for an abnormally long time.

Chances are you'll smoke more on amphetamines then you did before. Especially with an electronic cigarette where you can indulge and reinforce yourself without the limitation of a cigarette (tobacco) finishing, continuously increasing the release of dopamine, norepinephrine, in turn raising your heart rate and blood pressure providing a boost to your high.

synthetix
08-01-2013, 01:30
Well for me I find that amphetamines make my cigarette consumption surge. The same goes for most drugs really apart from benzos and MDMA.

I suffer from ADHD and am prescribed dexedrine daily - on the days when I don't take my dose I find myself smoking a lot more cigarettes. I've read that many people that suffer from ADHD start on cigarettes and are habitual users as niccotine provides a stimulatory effect which keeps them going. However, there are lots of other mechanisms of action within smoking tobacco and it's not limited to just stimulatory effects. It's also an MAO-B inhibitor which acts in a synergetic way with the nicotine to provide more dopamine to the brain. Hence why smoking cigarettes on dopamine producing drugs is so much more reward in my opinion - it stops the breakdown of dopamine as rapidly.

When you smoke an E-cig you're not smoking a cigarette. Nicotine in itself is not an MAO-B inhibitor and is simply just a mild stimulant. The other crap in the chemicals of cigarette smoke effects the brain together with the nicotine.

But - essentially what you're asking is, what is the lesser of the two evils?

Well, honestly, if you truly suffer from ADHD and you don't smoke but take the vynase, stick to that. Smoking in my opinion anyway is the more evil action. I think that a smoker who wanted to quit and took speed would actually suffer more and crave cigarettes further as you produce a lot more dopamine on speed. I think an effective alternative to smoking would be an MAO-B inhibitor with nicotine patches. Does the same job but just doesn't give you cancer.

specialrelativity
08-01-2013, 01:34
i think they go together. -i