14th Issue Heroin Discussion v. Hey white boy, what you doin' uptown?

jeebis said:

also, has anyone else seen a significant spike in heroin use? its almost become acceptable in the pill circles i know of, which is concerning since alot of people dont realize that heroin is no fucking joke.

Click to expand...

I forgot what thread exactly, but we had a long conversation about this topic. My take on it is that heroin use hasn't suddenly spiked like many think. It's just about who you know at the time. 5 years ago I knew a ton of heroin users since I was more involved in the game, partially because of what I said in my reply to the quote below this one. Now I only know a few heroin users since I don't really associate with many users outside of the 2 people I will sometimes cop with when I don't use my dealer (who isn't a user) so I wouldn't really know if there was a spike in use or not since I don't hang out with users.

I know that most of the people that I used to get high with 5 years ago when I started are still involved with dope. Some are worse now than ever, some have balanced out using and leading a somewhat normal life, others rarely use, and there are 1 or 2 who actually stopped. Back when we were all getting high together it seemed like everyone was doing dope, and we would see people we never would have though would be doing dope while meeting up with our dealer.

I'm sure that the reformulation of some prescription opioids cause a little spike in heroin use, but you also have to consider that most of those people were probably going to make the switch to heroin sooner or later, but the reformulation just made it happen sooner. I mean people have been getting hooked on prescription pain killers and then moving onto heroin for a while now, so that's nothing new. Now I'm wondering if less people are going to become addiction to prescription pain killers if they are harder to get or are the shitty reformulated ones, and what effect that will have on the amount of heroin users. But perhaps heroin will just be so acceptable that people won't need to get hooked on pills before trying it. Who knows, kids are crazy these days.

RedLeader said:

This might be getting slightly off-topic, but what do you guys think is the reason Suboxone is so over-prescribed? They had me on 24mg, offered me 28mg, and that did more harm than good because I just *turned most of it into heroin* and kept the habit going. Doctors might not know the ins and outs of it, but they aren't total morons. They have to know that they are giving people way more than they need. Is it really just that they want people on so much Suboxone that there's no way to bounce back and forth? And they keep the patient with a heavy Suboxone habit to keep getting his/her appointment money? I mean that would kinda make sense, but at the same time they have to realise that most people are just going to turn the extra Suboxone into more heroin...

Click to expand...

I was prescribed 32mg/day and I had told the doctor that I had a vicodin habit and was messing with oxycodone occasionally. He knew I wasn't even dependent at the time and just wanted it for the cravings, so started me on 16mg/day and worked me up to 32mg since I told him I still had cravings.

I think it's over-prescribed because so many people want to get more so they can sell them or stash them away for if/when insurance is up, so they tell the doctor that their dose isn't holding them so they get more.

cabrona said:

woah 24mg?!! who needs that much goddamn bupe?

that's nuts. thanks for the input everyone. i'm not looking for a buzz as much as a way to not have to cop on the fuckin' west side all the time and to not feel like my obsession with control is out of hand. i'm still debating though.

Click to expand...

trust me if you start taking bupe you wont really get the cravings, plus you will have this new found energy...ive always said thaty with bupe im pretty sure it has an antidepressant qualtiess with it..like when i take it i get a total mood lift and it kind of makes me felll ike i never really have a habit at all or like never started..like when i take it, i actually want to go out an do things with my friends and go to the mall and just do whatever..unlike when imn using dope all i care about is myself and litera;;y weeks can go by cause i only live for everyother day and yeah i dunno when im like that time just flys...like i will get high on monday and with no job i dont go to bed til 3-4am everyday and i wake up at like 1-2..those days that i use,im not your typical dope fiends who needs his morning shot to even function, i start using at like 530-6pm as rule no matter how sick i am cause i dont want to be that person who needs it when i wake up(i have never got high in the morning, in the 3-4years of using dope and the 5-6 years before that using pills) and when im not planning on gettting high (i never use 2days in a row) i might do a liine or smoke a few lines and just sut around and watch tv or movies to kill time to the next day when i do get high..when you sleep til 1-3pm you literally can loose weeks in no time.

if you really want to gicve yourself a break and not just getting bupe so you can use it in bwtween usses it, it will do alot for you..it will actually make you want to get up and find a job and stay clean and have motivation to call some friends you havent seen in a while to go ge some beer and pick up some chicks(guys in your situation) the bupe will bring back a sex drive that heroin completly kills..

ill tell a quick story about myt last extended bupe use which was about 13days cause eeverytime before that i used tit just to get clean for my drug tests and that was just 3-4days..as you know im on probation and i knew i had my last drop comin up but i couldnt remeber when i last used weed...so i took my subs and after 4days the weeknd came about and i was starting to get restless so i called up my friends and was like "yo lets go get laid"..well at this point i prolly havent had sex in 3years or so and its not that i didnt get head or anything like that between that i just didnt have motiovation to go out and meet some girls and try to get laid..well that first night me and a few buddies went out and met some girls and we went back to the one girls place and me and my buddy both got it in..i couldnt belive how easy it was to gdo that and that i was such a loser wrapped up in a stupid drug that kills my sex drive(like during that time i might have beat off 2-3x a month max..i really didnt care about it at all)..well a few days later the girl calls me and wants to know if we want to hang out again..i was like shit why not, so again we go over to her place, instead of the bar and we both get it in again, me and my dude where just klaughing about this and him tellin me we need to get out more and shit $cause this is just bringing back the old myspace days lol...now 2days later i took my drug test and got back using dope and the girl has called me twice since then and i didnt pick up either time and thus she stoipped calling and thats cause i really didnt want anything real to happen but also i was high and just didnt care...i recently have talked to my ex who i didnt talk to for a few years and now has a 2 1/2yr old kid by the guy she dumped to go out with me the first time around..but ive been kickin it with her and doin our thing cause i dunno i dont have to go out and spit game, its just easy with her..but that extended almost 2 week use of bupe got me out of a funk that i had for a good 3years lol

sorry for the tldr but yeah im high and felt like tellin a story about the power of bupe and how it has great motivation/antidepressant qualities lol

^ When I was prescribed suboxone I told the doctor it made me feel better and he said that it had antidepressant qualities so he said I could stop taking the antidepressant I was on at the time. It's one of the off-label uses of it, and it's pretty well known.

i never went to my doc for it , i just got it off the street so for me it was an unexpected quality to it..thats why i recommnend it so much more over done cause done gets you high for a while when you first start using it so your not really getting clean IMO, your just trading one opiate for another..now i know subs are considered in opiate too but it doesnt get you high and to me thats the important part

i have a feeling that alot of the massive over-prescribing is the fact that doctors know its going to the streets. more heads on subs = less heroin use...

yeah those lil orange fuckers tatse like ass esp while it jus sit there under your tongue...

^ I could never handle the taste without adding a bit of vodka or mouthwash under my tongue. It increases the bioavailability of bupe as well. IIRC it makes it equivalent to snorting.

does snorting or shooting bupe get you high as opposed to taking it as recommended?

ps i hope this isn't a dumb question, i've looked into it and i really don't get why you'd snort or shoot subs if it doesn't get you high

^ I wouldn't advise shooting bupe unless you have access to micron filters. There's a thread in Other Drugs all about injecting bupe, just search for it.

Don't challenge my on this, but there's no dumb question when it comes to harm reduction.

When I was on bupe maintenance, I would snort my bupe if I wanted to feel a little euphoria.

hey wiggi, i have no interest in using subs except for their intended, prescribed purpose. i have a problem, not trying to create more problems. i saw a thread on other drugs (i think) about IVing suboxone causing shit like gangrene, et cetera in some case studies posted by a member.

i moreso didn't mean my question was stupid, i just didn't want to annoy everyone in case it had been covered on here a billion times. i searched for info on snorting/shooting subs in terms of euphoria, but i was still a little unsure.

thanks for giving me some insight. anyone else's input would be of interest to me.

Most opiate/opioid dependent people will not experience a high from bupe period. It's not quite a sober feeling either but, you will most likely not feel any warmth or strong euphoria from it if you're at all tolerant.

People snort and IV bupe because they're either chasing a high that they won't get or trying to make the drug more effective. Suboxone unlike Subutex contains naloxone which was added in an attempt, albeit a lame one to prevent this kind of abuse. It was thought that especially when IV'ing the drug that the user would be sent into precipitated WDbecause of the bupe/naloxone combo. Most bluelighters that have tried this will tell you that this doesn't happen although that is mostly anecdotal and it's never recommended to IV pills especially without a proper wheel/micron filter.

Some use the drug snorted or IV because of the higher bioavailability (BA) of both. Of course IV use is 100% BA where as snorting is around 65% (me thinks) compared to maybe 35% sublingual. I'm not positve on those numbers but, the point is that snorting is typically more effective. I mean really the best course is to not abuse the drug and take it as directed but, I like many, get my subs off the street and snorting allows me to use less.

Bupe is a weird opioid. It does have definite antidepressant properties which tend to work better at lower doses oddly enough. This is a very potent drug. This discussion has been done to death all over this site. Many people think that doctors over prescribe the drug but, there's something to be said for the drug's better ability to kill cravings at higher doses. The whole point of legit bupe treatment is not just to keep you out of WD but, to kill the cravings and in combination with therapy help the user establish their new sober life without the cravings and start their new routines. A lot of us (myself included) use just enough to keep wd at bay but, I will admit that at a low dose I do still crave and often use full agonists because of those cravings.

Jb, did your supply of party supplies hold you through the hurricane? How long did you have to wait to cop more. I'm just curious.

Years ago when we had the big blackout I had an rx with refills for pain pills. Of course the refill was ready but I didn't call it in yet I took my bottle to the pharmacy and they gave me a handful to last me a few days till the power was back up. They said they logged it and my next rx would be that many short. It wasn't short at all. They must have forgot or something. I am just glad there was a pharmacist there with no power to help us out.

Ya man. We barely got hit out here. Didn't even end up losing power. I'm hearing that some people in Jersey/NY are still without power. In my area though the storm wasn't too bad at all.

Lately I've been getting powder again. I was getting "raw" for the longest time but, the quality really went down the shitter and fast. Started to seem like the dude me and my buddy were getting the raw from was pinching out of the bags too. I hear he just had a kid and I assume that money became tight so he started getting cheap shit and selling it for the same. Now I got a new connect. This younger chick who has pretty good product especially for powder which around my way is usually the kiss of death. She's super convenient too. Always around and will do whatever size bag you want really.

Glad the storm wasn't bad for you. I feel bad for those that got hit hard. The raw dealer could have just upped the prices instead of selling bunk shit. At least you could understand that a little and only buy from him as last resort.

You could start banging the new chick if she is bangable. Maybe get a better deal.

thanks for the input, johnny. perhaps part of the reason they prescribe such high doses is the low sublingual absorption rate? also, what you said got me thinking of the real reasons i want to perhaps give suboxone or subutex a shot, and that is the cravings. withdrawal i can handle, but the psychological part will forever haunt me.

i've never had raw, still. what do you guys think of it versus powder? why do you prefer it or not prefer it?

lptrax said:

Also the west is pharms since tar is trash. I'd cop powder on the east coast. What is the terminology for coping certain amounts. I've gathered
Bag is .1
Bundle is ten bags
Not really sure what a brick jab or finger is though.

Click to expand...

A finger in the Northeast is 10 grams of what I guess you'd call raw in other places. All "raw" means where I come from is that the dopes supposedly good.

A finger usually comes as one solid chunk of dope. Most dealers will sell you broken down grams all day, but to get a real finger, you gotta know someone a little higher up. Most dealers seem to cop a few fingers and step on em and turn 10 grams into 15. Providence is a smaller city but it's flooded with dope, always has been. More dope there than Boston, better too. You can still go to the old dope spots in p and if someone sees you out there, you can usually cop, but it's mostly phone connects now, all grams and halfs....

I live out here now and I've been jonesin like crazy lately, I have no car atm, so it's been rough....

I thought chi town is mostly tar? But if you get it powder, then it is never rocked up? Idk since i started in bmore/dc, its rocked up raw and i just happned to get in with the peopl that get it by the gram although when i got outta jail last week i got new dope cntact 5 minutes up th estreet that does 20 bags and shit. Still havnt tried, gotta see how probation goes for a few weeks. I read and saw heroin stays in your piss only for 2-4 days so i could prob get high once in a while, idk,maybe

In the last five years a lot of dealers have switched from bundles and bricks to grams, half grams and fingers, because the charges are worse for havin it in all those baggies...
I think it's almost identical in Baltimore to what it is where I'm from....

five years ago a brick was ridiculously cheap, but the bags were tiny, then all of the sudden it seems like almost everyone switched over to grams....You get more weight for the money, but the dope isn't as good most of the time....Havin it rocked up really doesn't mean shit

Chicago is mostly powder for some reason.

Ya raw is supposed to be good. Usually sold in solid chunks or the ten gram fingers

I got some 'raw' today. It's decent stuff, but nothing special.



The first two pics are what it looked like in the chunk it came in, and the last pic is what it broke down to after I crushed it up and broke it into lines so I had a better idea of how much I was doing. That's half the amount I originally got, so the chunk was 2x that size before I got around to taking the picture of it.